So whats the big deal about RVD?

[Guest Brian]

It's RVD's fault because he had no idea how to work the match. I'm not going to get into it a whole lot, but Benoit leaves openings in his offense that a competant babyface can seize and work towards, and start building comebacks around. RVD couldn't. End of story.

[Guest What?]

Lance Storm overrated? Why do you say that? At SummerSlam '01, he actually carried pre-"some skill" Edge to a good match, and, IMO, the 2nd best match of the night (#1 being Angle/Austin...minus the dumb ending). Plus, his matches in ECW and WCW are pretty good. Now, if Storm was allowed to work with guys he can work off of, I would say he could impress even you, Zsasz.

 

And RVD carrying the RAW brand? I dunno. He's more over then Trips, but something about him just rubs me the wrong way. His promos are lackluster at best, and that coupled with ringwork is what helps a make a main eventer a main eventer. If he got a manager that could speak for him, like Fonzie (YEAH BABAY! RVD, DADDY!) or even Stacy Keibler, he'd be ready to carry RAW. But for right now? I dunno.

 

 

Not like it's being carried by a guy thats able to carry it now or anything....

[Guest TheZsaszHorsemen]

Lance Storm overrated? Why do you say that? At SummerSlam '01, he actually carried pre-"some skill" Edge to a good match, and, IMO, the 2nd best match of the night (#1 being Angle/Austin...minus the dumb ending). Plus, his matches in ECW and WCW are pretty good. Now, if Storm was allowed to work with guys he can work off of, I would say he could impress even you, Zsasz.

 

And RVD carrying the RAW brand? I dunno. He's more over then Trips, but something about him just rubs me the wrong way. His promos are lackluster at best, and that coupled with ringwork is what helps a make a main eventer a main eventer. If he got a manager that could speak for him, like Fonzie (YEAH BABAY! RVD, DADDY!) or even Stacy Keibler, he'd be ready to carry RAW. But for right now? I dunno.

 

 

Not like it's being carried by a guy thats able to carry it now or anything....

The Edge/Storm match worked IN SPITE of Storm. Edge was trying to keep it fast-paced and livly, and everytime it looked exciting, storm used a resthold.

 

I haven't seen a really good Storm match outside of WAR.

 

Oh and RVD is great on the mic. Everything he says is funny in a part stoner part David Spade kinda way.

 

Brian: What you described was a FORMULA MATCH. Everyone can work one of those.

[Guest What?]

The fast pace Killing on Storm's part was just used to put himself over as a heel. I dunno though...I got to see it live, and I'm happy.

 

 

 

RVD is pretty funny on the mic, but coupled with Fonzie? (F: "RVD DADDY! YOU'RE GONNA BLOW THE ROOF OFF THE JOINT, DADDY!"...RVD: "That's right, Fonzie..Cuz nobody can blow up more joints than Rob...Van...Dam...") or Coupled with a reluctant Stacy Keibler? (Hell, anyone he can work off of) That would make his promos hilarious....and insightful....

 

*clutches chin and ponders RVD carrying RAW*

[Guest TheZsaszHorsemen]

The fast pace Killing on Storm's part was just used to put himself over as a heel. I dunno though...I got to see it live, and I'm happy.

 

 

 

RVD is pretty funny on the mic, but coupled with Fonzie? (F: "RVD DADDY! YOU'RE GONNA BLOW THE ROOF OFF THE JOINT, DADDY!"...RVD: "That's right, Fonzie..Cuz nobody can blow up more joints than Rob...Van...Dam...") or Coupled with a reluctant Stacy Keibler? (Hell, anyone he can work off of) That would make his promos hilarious....and insightful....

 

*clutches chin and ponders RVD carrying RAW*

No, what he needs to be is what WE would say if we were there. If someone says something he jumps with a sarcastic quip, a pithy comeback if you will.

 

Basically a better version of what he is now.

[Guest Olympic Slam]

The Edge/Storm match worked IN SPITE of Storm. Edge was trying to keep it fast-paced and livly, and everytime it looked exciting, storm used a resthold.

Storm did all in his power to make that match boring. As soon as some action would pick up, he'd go right back to using the knees or some resthold that ended up not going anywhere.

 

Storm hasn't had a good match since as he's been in nothing but 2 minute filler matches, tag matches, or been relegated to "bump" duty" for a supposed up and coming face. He's definitely a more than competent worker that would have made a good obstacle in the I.C division.

[Guest Brian]

RVD couldn't make his comebacks properly is formula?

[Guest NoCalMike]

RVD is the epitome of what Vince does NOT WANT carrying his company. RVD does not appear to have a roids habit. He isn't 6'10" he is not a hoss. He is just fine on the mic actually. If you have seen some promos he cut in ECW, it easily eclipises the tired catchphrase style of most of WWE's so-called, "great mic workers"

 

His matches in WWE come off looking not as good obviously because he is working against guys 10x his size and he has to slow down in order to not make his opponent look inept. If Vince just decided to push, RVD/Angle/Benoit/Guererro/Rey/Edge/Tajiri/Jericho etc....then you would not see the same repetative matches as you have now. RVD does not need to be a great worker when you throw him in the ring with the others in my list, and that is percisely my point. Benoit vs. RVD would be much better than Benoit vs. Brock, or Benoit vs. Big Show. So instead of wasting RVD on Raw where we have a bunch of giant roids freaks, why not put him on Smackdown where he can have better matches.

[Guest Rob Edwards]

I have no desire to see RVD on Smackdown where he could ruin the great matches that are being put on at the moment with his crappy psychology, I mean I expect people to slip up but Cartwheels on an arm thats been battered for 10 minutes or so? Even I'd have the common sense not to do that

[Guest Agent of Oblivion]

I don't understand why RVD has so much trouble pretending that something hurts. He'll sell his own offense, like cringing after the 5*, but his match with Benoit sucked the meat missile because he completely ignored all of the arm work. He's guilty of that in a lot of his matches. I also think his mic work is sub par as well. Almost anyone is better than HHH at this point, but there are people I would prefer to be in that position more than Rob.

[Guest MixxMaster]

Rob Van Dam should never be above the Intercontinental level. Sucks for him that they got rid of the Intercontinental Heavyweight Title. He lacks promo skills. You have to be able to work a crowd using a microphone to be in the main event in the WWE. It's obvious that the Entertainment aspect is far superior to the wrestling aspect.

So then I guess that means that Benoit should be forever stuck in the mid-card...

Actaully, he DOES have good mic skills, he's proven it in ECW. The WWE doesn't exactly give him many opportunities...

And he has shown that he can sell better than many others. Pretty much everyone will seem hurt, then use the hurt body part to complete a move. Ring psychology is a matter of preparation, and taking the opponent into the formula.

Face it, he is VERY over, even moreso than BookerT, who the crowd mainly marks out for the freakin' spinaroonie, and waiting to chant along and say, "SUCKAAAA!"

And we've still only seen a small part of his moves, and in ring skills yet in the WWE...

And yes, I AM an RVD mark...so sue me.

[Guest Special K]

I fuckin' Love RVD from his ECW days, but the lack of real selling in most matches IS a detriment to being a babyface. If they're cheering R-V-D for a babyface getting his ass beat and then he pops up for a crazy move without making it SEEM big. (I'm definitely not holding RVD to AJPW standards) Fans feel a bit cheated.

 

RVD can carry almost anybody to a decent match. But it's hard to carry HIM to a really good match.

 

Still, he's the most over worker on RAW. The only better alternative is Booker T, and he's been buried so bad, I don't even know why he's in the match.

[Guest humongous2002]

RVD could carry RAW if he is booked properly, if being a main eventer was all about workrate in the ring then Essa Rios would've been WWE champion years ago. The fans adore RVD, is just as simple as that, lately it seems that he has been very unmotivated thats why his matches haven't been to the standard he had a year ago, but it seems that he's got his "smile" back last monday night on RAW when he was wrestling in that tag team match, and if you guys want to call RVD's matches repetitive then how about Austin's kicking, punching, Lou Thez press, middle finger, kick,wham, stunner matches?He does the same shit all the time but the fans still love the guy.

[Guest Cataclysm911]

He is just fine on the mic actually. If you have seen some promos he cut in ECW, it easily eclipises the tired catchphrase style of most of WWE's so-called, "great mic workers"

Yeah, except in ECW his promo's were about nothing but vulgar language and illegal drug use.

[Guest bps "The Truth" 21]

Don't make me type it up again!!!!

 

The RVD promo that gave a storyline it's direction for over a year!!!!

 

Don't make me do it!

 

 

Aside from that, all this bitching is stupid.

 

The WWE doesn't push based on ability to sell an arm. They never have.

 

The people that say he shouldn't get pushed for that reason are the bitterest of all us smarks.

 

As far as the mic work goes...

 

It's a sad commentary on current wrestling when we need the champion to talk for 20 minutes a night.

 

The point of those promos is to get fans interested in the match.

 

Well...let's see...what were fans more into?

 

RVD vs. Tommy Dreamer with no build up...

 

or KAne vs. HHH with all that talking and angle work?

 

Come on people.

[Guest Cataclysm911]

I'm just answering the question that was brought forth. It's my opinion. Can RVD carry RAW? No. What's the big deal about RVD? He's not Triple H.

 

Both my personal opinions.

 

How can you be the big dog when you show no emotion?

 

scenerio 1:

 

Dude: "Hey RVD, you just won the world title!"

 

Rob: "That's cool."

 

scenerio 2:

 

Dude: "Hey RVD, I just murdered your entire family.."

 

Rob: "That's cool."

 

====

 

In worked in ECW because he was constantly baked and always talked about being baked. Then he would throw in a couple "fucks" and call it a promo. That won't work in WWE. ECW didn't have a bunch of "marks" and children watching. WWE does.

[Guest Rob Edwards]

Yeah but if the build up is crap it's obv gonna kill the match bps. If you get two good mic workers promoing a match up then you can go in with unbelievable heat, Rock v Angle for example

[Guest goodhelmet]

Don't make me type it up again!!!!

 

Well...let's see...what were fans more into?

 

RVD vs. Tommy Dreamer with no build up...

 

or KAne vs. HHH with all that talking and angle work?

 

Come on people.

silly rabbit, bps! don't yu know the fans were digging tommy's i eat crap character!

[Guest bps "The Truth" 21]

RVD can't carry a show.

 

But NO ONE ELSE CAN EITHER.

 

No one has done it alone since Austin and we're a long way out of that.

 

Can Edge carry a show?

 

No.

 

Can Brock carry a show?

 

No.

 

No one can.

 

This is the dumbest topic ever.

[Guest cabbageboy]

Hey, there were a lot of hilarious RVD promos in ECW that didn't involve drug use and cussing. Heh, they mostly involved tormenting Sabu or Lynn. Lord that stuff was funny.

 

"Jerry you didn't beat me, the fans know you didn't beat me. In fact I beat your ass so bad on the PPV that fans are now calling me Mr. P-P-V. Say it with me Jerry, Mr. P-P-V, R-V-D."

 

And here is news: Raw did a 3.1 rating this week so I think it's obvious that HHH is killing the audience as champ. Therefore the idea of RVD not being able to carry Raw is idiotic. Do you think with RVD as champ fans would tune out at this kind of rate?

[Guest Cataclysm911]

RVD can't carry a show.

 

But NO ONE ELSE CAN EITHER.

 

No one has done it alone since Austin and we're a long way out of that.

 

Can Edge carry a show?

 

No.

 

Can Brock carry a show?

 

No.

 

No one can.

 

This is the dumbest topic ever.

Agreed. I didn't say that anyone else could though..

 

The WWE shouldn't have one flagship guy per show. They should develop characters and storylines for the entire card not just the current Triple H opponent.

 

If RAW's midcard had storylines, the shows wouldn't be so bland. Instead we have to wait until a match is announced the commercial break prior to it happening to know what match is going down.

 

As for this being the "dumbest topic ever" I've seen worse..

[Guest Cataclysm911]

Hey, there were a lot of hilarious RVD promos in ECW that didn't involve drug use and cussing.

 

Yeah.. tons..

 

For example:

 

"Jerry you didn't beat me, the fans know you didn't beat me.  In fact I beat your ass..."

[Guest Rob Edwards]

RVD can't carry a show.

 

But NO ONE ELSE CAN EITHER.

 

No one has done it alone since Austin and we're a long way out of that.

 

Can Edge carry a show?

 

No.

 

Can Brock carry a show?

 

No.

 

No one can.

 

This is the dumbest topic ever.

OK I didn't phrase the topic very well by carrying the show I mean keep people watching to see his main events, obviously if the rest of the show is great then that wouldn't be needed, Noone has ever carried a whole show for an extended period unless they are on screen all the time (I guess you could argue HGH has had a go!) maybe it should have been more along the lines of would he be out of his depth in the main event?

[Guest bps "The Truth" 21]

If that's what you mean than my answer is:

 

as good as, if not better than anyone else on the show.

[Guest Cataclysm911]

Well, that's a completely different topic then. People pay to see RVD. I just don't know if they want to see him at the end of the show.

 

The WWE really shouldn't have gotten rid of the Intercontinental Heavyweight Title. People like Lance Storm, The Hurricane & Rob Van Dam NEED that belt. The people at the bottom of the mid-card, and the people at the very top of the mid-card need something to compete for..

[Guest Rob Edwards]

If that's what you mean than my answer is:

 

as good as, if not better than anyone else on the show.

better than Booker or Jericho? I mean sure both have been buried but they are at least capable of adapting the style of matches they work to suit whoever they are working with and can also deliver topnotch promos giving them crossover potential. Can you seriously see RVD representing the company on Leno? ( I know thats delving into petty territory but still it's a valid point as crossover superstars bring ratings)

[Guest goodhelmet]

Can you seriously see RVD representing the company on Leno? ( I know thats delving into petty territory but still it's a valid point as crossover superstars bring ratings)

i take it you didn;'t see booker t on the weakest link

[Guest bps "The Truth" 21]

Better than Jericho now that they've killed him, and better than Booker for sure.

 

Unless Booker's main event run is going to be no actual matches, just promos with Goldust followed by the spinaroonie.

[Guest Rob Edwards]

Can you seriously see RVD representing the company on Leno? ( I know thats delving into petty territory but still it's a valid point as crossover superstars bring ratings)

i take it you didn;'t see booker t on the weakest link

but that was at least funny and he (or someone) had the prescence of mind to work it into an angle (almost) making the shampoo angle bearable

[Guest Rob Edwards]

Better than Jericho now that they've killed him, and better than Booker for sure.

 

Unless Booker's main event run is going to be no actual matches, just promos with Goldust followed by the spinaroonie.

Booker is a far superior worker to RVD IMO. He certainly has a far better idea of how to build a story into a match rather than RVD's style which leaves the crowd a little pop..silence...pop..silence etc

 

Jericho sure he's being buried but Hunter allowing someone with that kind of charisma wouldn't take long to rebuild