Starting a new indy promotion

[Tully316 0]

Guys,

 

I'm close to finishing up my MBA and have a multitude of consulting jobs that are going to provide me with some disposable income in the next several years.

 

I've been a lifelong wrestling fan and am seriously interested in the behind the scenes work of running a promotion.

 

I would really like it if you guys would chime in with opinions or advice as to what you think makes a good promotion:

 

types of wrestlers you want to see

types of booking (sports ent., southern style, hardcore, etc.)

Types of matches

things that you like/hate about current and past products

ideas on merchandising, music, distribution.

 

hell, any opinion is a good one to me. thanks and looking forward to your opinions.

 

Geoff

[Guest kingkamala]

I want to see a bit of everything. Some high flyers, some technical stuff and some solid heavyweights. WCW had a bit of everything during it's golden age, I think the theory of making everyone happy always works. Never cater yourself towards just the puro-marks or just the old school marks, try and give everybody in the crowd at least one match they can sit back and enjoy.

 

 

In my humble opinion it's hard to screw up a ladder match. Even the worst ones are still in the *-** range. I'd also do a steel cage match once a year (http://www.highspots.com/www/stores_app/Browse_Item_Details.asp?Shopper_id=11563101752331156&Store_id=125&page_id=23&Item_ID=2261 , a link for a good looking cheap cage), a card with a steel cage match main eventing with nobodies in the underrcard or the main event usually draws better then a card with a say Buff Bagwell headlining it. There's still mystique surrounding a steel cage match on the indy scene. I'd rather spend $1500 on a solid steel cage then a guy like Buff Bagwell.

 

I'd bring in a former WWF, WCW or ECW guy two or three times a year. It doesn't how matter how big of a star the guy is. Indy marks will always mark out for the guys who've made it in the big leagues, despite there denile about it. Here's an example a indy show headlined by CW Anderson drew just as well as an indy show featuring Jerry Lawler and Brian Christopher. Unless your strapped for cash, hiring a former big leaguer is almost always a good idea for a start-up promotion.

[Guest JHawk]

This is coming from someone who appreciates most aspects of professional wrestling as long as it isn't boring:

 

1. Book angles logically.

 

2. Try to include as many different styles of wrestling as possible. It's like the circus: If you don't like the clowns, you'll like the trapeze artist.

 

3. If you must choose a booking "style", I'd say Southern style or even Memphis. Everything that happens builds up to the next show.

 

4. BLOW FEUDS OFF! Don't have a squashy match that seemingly ends a feud and then continue the feud the next week. Dudleys vs. Morley, anybody?

 

Um...that's all I have for now.

[Guest The Last Free Voice]

I would run strait wrestling. Market it as the anti-backyard fed, have real finishes and stuff, not nessicarily gimmickless like ROH is supposed to be, but more like an actuall sport than some larger than life show. Where are u planning on running?

[Guest Nevermortal]

Try and score the big names of the Indies these days (Low Ki, Red, Am-Drag, Daniels, Samoa Joe, etc.).

[Guest CoreyLazarus416]

If you run in Massachusetts or Rhode Island, allow Corey Lazarus to participate on at least one show to take a couple of back bumps.

[Guest HollywoodSpikeJenkins]

Hire me.

[Guest KanadianKrusty]

1-Not too much interviews/angles/screwjobs, sports entertainment is fun, but only when it is well-booked and in small doses.

 

2-Don't try to please the smarks, the marks are going to hate every second of it.

 

3-Try to bring one of the former ECW guys a couple of times a year, they're cheaper than the former WWE guys and will probably draw just as much.

[Guest snuffbox]

Ill be the main event heel.

[Guest The Hollywood Fashion Plate]

1-Have a hardcore division, but never let garbage wrestling be your sole focus...keep it lower on the card as a sort of sideshow.

 

2- Promote the hell out of your company any way you can...hire people to post adverts all over the area (and not just before big events, either...posters with just your company's name and logo will get you recognized and are crucial to drawing in fans for an actual event). Get a memorable website address too: ANYTHING.com beats geocities.com/yourwrestlingfed/ywf/index.html

 

3-Treat your company like a) it's the best wrestling company in the world and b) like its the ONLY wrestling company in the world. There should be very little reference to other organizations or wrestlers...after all, you want the fans to be watching YOU, right?

 

(I feel sorry for the marks in the OVW area who know that their guys are outclassed every week on TV and are reminded of it at every show since they're WWE's developmental territory.)

 

4- Like any business tries to do, give your shows (and your company in general) as professional an appearance as you can, as this makes you look more respectable in the public eye.

[Guest Retro Rob]

I hate repeating other people, so here are a few of my own personal tidbits.

 

1. Don't feel the need to pack 80 wrestlers and 20 matches on to your shows like some promoters do. Jim Cornette had great success with SMW and his logic was that quantity is always better than quantity. Whether you have 20 or 80 indy wrestlers on a show, your crowd size probably will not flucuate. Also, by not wasting your money on so much talent, you'll be able to bring in more big names.

 

2. Try and find a core group of local wrestlers. Have them work with the veterans that you bring in for your shows. Audiences always tend to get behind "home grown" talent.

 

3. Don't put your titles on the big names on the indy circiut because you never know when they will have other obligations. Also, I think it's dumb to put your title on someone who works for TNA, because it will look bad if they job on TV.

 

4. Don't try to get too big too fast. Let it develop naturally.

 

5. Video tape all of your shows. Even if it is just some guy sitting around with a camcorder. The footage may come in handy one day.

 

That's all I have right now. BTW, where will you be running the company out of?

[Guest JHawk]

5. Video tape all of your shows. Even if it is just some guy sitting around with a camcorder. The footage may come in handy one day.

 

In fact, depending on where you're running and what kind of talent you have, selling those tapes could be an additional source of income for the promotion.

 

You MIGHT want to consider TV, but unless you're settling for public access cable (which doesn't guarantee a regular time slot) the cost of even putting a show on a local station might be astronomical. Programmers think of pro wrestling to be along the lines of a Tony Little infomercial and my try to squeeze any penny they can get out of you. See what you can get before trying it.

[FigureFourTapes 0]

Don't book like the show I went to on Thursday.

[Guest The Hollywood Fashion Plate]

I agree wholeheartedly with JHawk on videotaping shows, as those tapes could be used for video packages/filler if you got a TV show.

[FigureFourTapes 0]

I agree with Slickster, guys like me will buy them all.

[Guest HollywoodSpikeJenkins]

Hire me.

 

 

 

My EWR Stats =

 

Charisma: 100

 

BAH BAM!

[Guest CoreyLazarus416]

It's been asked before, but not loud enough:

What territory are you opening in?

 

The East Coast would be more profitable, simply because of the two "big" indies on it (RoH and CZW), as well occasional XPW shows, and TNA being closer to the East Coast than the West. However, don't try to the Philly scene. Aside from RoH and CZW, it's pretty cutthroat.

 

If you're trying New England, you better make the fed GOOD. RoH runs shows here a bit, but the only other indies we have are pretty crap.

[Guest ShooterJay]

From a serious perspective, and from someone who is EXPERIENCED with the behind the scenes work in indy wrestling.

 

1. Run territories that are wrestling starved. For example, NorCal has no indies other than Roland Alexander's APW, and every indy in New England sucks ass- the best we get is an ROH show once every four months.

 

2. Run frugally, find a venue like an armory (although with the war soon, that won't happen.) Or a YMCA/high school gym.

 

3. Talent-wise, stick with local trainees and workers, they'll work cheap. Hire ONE semi-well known indy worker who's good (ex. Amazing Red, Divine Storm, Michael Shane) and and ONE old-school/minor WWE/WCW name (ex. a Tough Enough kid, King Kong Bundy) as your "draws." Sticking with locals helps make the locals themselves into draws, and builds a loyal fanbase as well-look at CZW for the best example of this.

 

3. Find alternative ways to make money and gain exposure other than straight ticket sales and print ads- inexpensive merchandise, tape distribution, a public access or regional TV deal. Only do this if you're sure you can pull a profit.

 

4. The boys in the back will appreciate taping their matches- it'll help them with future bookings. If you know any guys in TV with free time or kids looking for some money, hire them and get decent digital cameras.

 

The best model is Ring of Honor, but RF started out with a good deal of cash to begin with, so following their example might not be possible, depending on the capital you start out with.

[FigureFourTapes 0]

I want a GOOD fed here, Wildside is too far for me to see, so please be opening here.

[Guest razazteca]

I think it would be more profitable to start out as a wrestling school, and putting out shows with your talent.

 

Use indy talent from your region that people might of heard of.

 

I mark out for southern style tag team wrestling and spotfest. I suggest that you stay away from hardcore or ladder matches until your 1st anniversary show as the big payoff for the year end angles.

 

As for merchandise, go with 8 x 10 pictures, T Shirts, and Videos.

 

You would also need a good ring announcer to get the crowd hot, now I not saying go hire "Mr Lets Get Ready to Rumble" Buffer but somebody of his caliber is a big plus.

 

Advertise on local radio and tv or even public access to get word out about your business.

[Guest bigdunn20]

1. Don't expect to make money.

 

2. Don't run armorys. If you go that route it will take years to get a following decent enough to earn a profit. Find sold shows at bars or casinos.

 

3. "Name" free agents seldom draw enough money to justify what they ask for. Be careful.

 

4. Don't run all cruiserweights (fans aged 30+ plus come from an era where they aren't used to seeing guys that they could legit beat up).

 

5. Don't relay on the internet exclusively for marketing. Don't forget posters all over in the community.

 

6. Look professional. Put the ring announcer in a suit, get a decent ring, bell, sound system, etc.

[Guest subliminal_animal]

(I feel sorry for the marks in the OVW area who know that their guys are outclassed every week on TV and are reminded of it at every show since they're WWE's developmental territory.)

Well, on the other side of the coin, they get to see guys they know are going to be in the WWE and can say, "I saw him when he was nothing." Look at Lesnar. Plus they get a lot of visits from established guys.

 

Don't put your titles on the big names on the indy circiut because you never know when they will have other obligations.  Also, I think it's dumb to put your title on someone who works for TNA, because it will look bad if they job on TV.

Or because they won't want to lose to Joe Nobody and Big Poppa Phony or whoever. Don't hire those two guys, by the way. They stink.

 

But, again, on the other side of things ... he's in TNA!

 

And I don't think Jeff Jarrett ever jobs on TNA. Have the belt put on him and have him come out with the NWA Title every show and spit on it and invite the crowd to spit on it as well. Then he'll say your belt is the only belt that matters! The payoff can be him melting the belt down into a necklace at your anniversary show. Also, pay him double to make sure he never says anything good about the NWA belt on TNA, and that he sneaks in comments like, "AJ Styles, you want this belt, this beautiful ... pieceofshit ... gold ...fakegold ... belt?! Ha-ha[i/]! I'm Double-J, Jeff Jarrett! So come on and go ahead, and slap it to me, slappy."

 

And if you go to the 411wrestling.com indy report, a couple weeks back they had info on some promotion selling off all it's stuff. They never got started, so I think it was unused. Get some info there and maybe think about that if it's at your price and near you.

[Guest What?]

Basically, everyone has said what needs to be said, but:

 

If you rely on technical/straight-shooter wrestlers, after a few months, bring in a guy that looks like a dirtbag. Spiky hair, Sex Pistols shirt, tight jeans, spiked wrist band, leather jacket. Make him the ultimate asshole that picks out the loudest guy in the audience and makes fun of him (ala Dudley Boyz in ECW... loved that segment). Then (if he's any good) push him as the big heel that nobody likes. This'll go over huge, swear to god.

 

or if you can't find someone that is the caliber of your already ME heel, make that guy "go crazy" and become Jonny Rotten 2.0

 

It'll be uber cool...and base this fed in San Jose, dammit! Please!

[Guest j.o.b. squad]

one more thing

 

be prepared to lose money very few promotions make any money.

[Guest The Metal Maniac]

The best advice: Find someone who knows how to run a promotion, and get them to help you.

 

Most any decent worker will realize you have no idea what you're doing in a matter of minutes, I'd say. The LAST thing you need to do is look like an idiot in front of the boys.

[Guest J*ingus]

The two main points have been stated already, but having worked in several indies, they're both VERY important:

 

1. Where are you located?

 

and

 

2. Don't expect to make money, or even not to lose money sometimes.

[Guest snuffbox]

Bring it to the Midwest. Ill work cheap. Just hire some female 'talent'.

[Mecha Mummy 0]

Hold events in Washington State. I swear to god, we have almost nothing, and if you can get even a remotely known name to come once in a while the WA indy fans will go nuts..

[Guest bigdunn20]

Metal Maniac had a very good point. Find someone who has been around the business a while to do booking and run the locker room. If try to do everything yourself..

 

A) the boys will have no respect for you. They will see you as just a money mark who wants to play with "real life action figures."

 

B) you won't be able to handle the politicking that workers oftentimes like to do. And don't say there won't be politics. Politics, glass ceilings, and bullshit exist in all indys, from the ones in bars in rural Wisconsin drawing 20 people, all the way up to ROH.

 

and finally, and perhaps most importantly...

 

C) the boys will walk all over you. Since you don't have their respect for reasons identified in A, you don't have control, either. With this can come problems of certain people refusing to job, and certain people wanting others to not be booked or pushed.

 

And one more thing: if you promise someone $20, you give them $20. If you promise someone $100, you give them $100, regardless of the loss you have to take. If word gets around that you are shitty when it comes to payoffs, it will be difficult to find anyone decent to work for you.

 

Remember, no business makes money right off the bat. And you should always try to run it as a business, and this goes back to the respect thing. If you are just running a promotion because you have "money laying around," it will be hard for the boys to get excited about making a decent product with growth potential if you aren't already trying to get the product to reach its potential.

[Guest Mad Dog]

Run a wrestling school with it. That way your getting money from the students and they won't be as likely to walk all over you later b/c you trained them.

 

Get someone the wrestlers will respect.