Guest Mulatto Heat Report post Posted March 12, 2003 Ugh, don't remind me. That's a big part of the reason why I've liked Brock less since the Rumble. I'm sure Benoit is heartbroken he wasn't wrenched out of an over tag team so he can be fed to Brock. Damn that Angle. Andrew speaks the truth again (even though I'm not a big fan of Rhyno). Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest The Hamburglar Report post Posted March 12, 2003 Not many heels constantly get clean wins over talent, and Angle has been doing that for quite some time now. He beat Benoit clean at the Rumble, but we can't add that into the equation, right? Don't forget Angle making Hogan tap out clean. Everyone forgets Angle making Hogan his personal bitch. Or Angle making Edge tap about a few hundred times. Or the way Angle beats Rey every time he faces him. Or how Angle made Austin tap semi-clean and was booked as his superior. Or the undefeated streak. Or the best rookie year ever. Gee, that Kurt Angle, what a midcard doormat, eh? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Mulatto Heat Report post Posted March 12, 2003 True. Angle is definitely NOT the midcard doormat certain people like to portray him as. He's done very memorable things that many people could only dream of doing. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest HartFan86 Report post Posted March 12, 2003 I hope this is the right for Kurt Angle because I've got a feeling it's not. Hopefully I'm wrong. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Anglesault Report post Posted March 12, 2003 Not many heels constantly get clean wins over talent, and Angle has been doing that for quite some time now. He beat Benoit clean at the Rumble, but we can't add that into the equation, right? Don't forget Angle making Hogan tap out clean. Everyone forgets Angle making Hogan his personal bitch. Because they capitalized on that for all of three minutes. And then they gave him that lousy summer run where he didn't win another match until Summerslam. They're calculating. Or Angle making Edge tap about a few hundred times. And Edge beat him even more. So? Or the way Angle beats Rey every time he faces him. EVERYONE beats Rey in every match. The WWF has done a great job of keeping Rey over despite never actually letting the poor guy win. Or how Angle made Austin tap semi-clean and was booked as his superior. And was then immediately shunted down into the midcard with a seventh string title. Or the undefeated streak. Or the best rookie year ever Two years and about 20 depushes ago. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest RedJed Report post Posted March 12, 2003 Not many heels constantly get clean wins over talent, and Angle has been doing that for quite some time now. He beat Benoit clean at the Rumble, but we can't add that into the equation, right? Don't forget Angle making Hogan tap out clean. Everyone forgets Angle making Hogan his personal bitch. Or Angle making Edge tap about a few hundred times. Or the way Angle beats Rey every time he faces him. Or how Angle made Austin tap semi-clean and was booked as his superior. Or the undefeated streak. Or the best rookie year ever. Gee, that Kurt Angle, what a midcard doormat, eh? Exactly, thats why this exaggeration of Angle being the costant fodder of bad booking and unprotection of his character is ridiculous. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest The Hamburglar Report post Posted March 12, 2003 I merely state the facts, Anglesault. Your idea of a depush is very clearly an opinion. Angle is a WWE boy, one of their golden projects. The facts point towards Angle's career being full of credibility gaining incidents. He's pretty much always been kept safe and relevant. And Edge beat Angle more then Angle beat Edge? Are you on crack? Edge was always losing in the tag matches, and Angle beat him in that four-way for no.1 contender. Beat him at Backlash as well, didn't he? And don't give me your "Edge GOT THE UPPER HAND BLAAAAAHHHH!" stuff. Happens with all face-heel confrontations. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest RedJed Report post Posted March 12, 2003 Not many heels constantly get clean wins over talent, and Angle has been doing that for quite some time now. He beat Benoit clean at the Rumble, but we can't add that into the equation, right? Don't forget Angle making Hogan tap out clean. Everyone forgets Angle making Hogan his personal bitch. Because they capitalized on that for all of three minutes. And then they gave him that lousy summer run where he didn't win another match until Summerslam. They're calculating. Or Angle making Edge tap about a few hundred times. And Edge beat him even more. So? Or the way Angle beats Rey every time he faces him. EVERYONE beats Rey in every match. The WWF has done a great job of keeping Rey over despite never actually letting the poor guy win. Or how Angle made Austin tap semi-clean and was booked as his superior. And was then immediately shunted down into the midcard with a seventh string title. Or the undefeated streak. Or the best rookie year ever Two years and about 20 depushes ago. Why do you refuse to look any any other perspective than the ultimate cynical Angle smart mark? First off, he won matches from June to August at SummerSlam, man. Go look back at the Smackdown results from week to week. Thats ridiculous to claim just because he lost the match at the July ppv that he was being made to look like shit there. Fact of the mattter with the Hogan thing is that IT HAPPENED, and it actually was mentioned and praised in detail the weeks after on Smackdown......last year about this same time was when the announcers started to really praise Angle as a serious threat and more than just the typcial goofball heel type. I'd be inclined to think that if you really wanted to get particular, Edge probably didn't beat Angle as much as he did, and even if Edge did, that means NOTHING to the overall detail of the matches that Angle won, which IIRC were done mostly clean and very consicely. Again this is something you aren't willing to accept due for some reason. The nature of the the business is to keep a feud running, you exchange victories, its like you wouldnt have been happy unless Angle won every meeting they had? Angle beat Rey for Rey's first WWE loss. He also beat him for his second in Minneapolis in Sept. Before those two matches, in between them, and after, Rey was being pushed really strongly, which should be obvious to anyone who watched those shows. He's not losing constantly, what are you talking about? Dont you get tired of beating that horse thats been dead months ago??? Open your eyes man, you're not looking objectively at how things are in respect to Angle. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Anglesault Report post Posted March 12, 2003 Right. He won that cena match where he looked like the idiot who almost couldn't beat the rookie. That about covers it. I'd be inclined to think that if you really wanted to get particular, Edge probably didn't beat Angle as much as he did, and even if Edge did, that means NOTHING to the overall detail of the matches that Angle won, which IIRC were done mostly clean and very consicely. Again this is something you aren't willing to accept due for some reason. The nature of the the business is to keep a feud running, you exchange victories, its like you wouldnt have been happy unless Angle won every meeting they had? You said Angle won alot, so I said Edge won alot as well. End of story. Angle beat Rey for Rey's first WWE loss. He also beat him for his second in Minneapolis in Sept. He also gave him his first big win. He's not losing constantly, what are you talking about? He loses in every PPV match he's in, and he only beats cruisers. Dont you get tired of beating that horse thats been dead months ago??? Open your eyes man, you're not looking objectively at how things are in respect to Angle. Then tell me how they are. Is there some other way to view getting your ass kicked every week and being made to look like you have no chance in your match? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest RedJed Report post Posted March 12, 2003 People try telling you the reality and facts of things, but you refuse to acknowledge them. Instead you counterpoint with opinions of yours that dont even make sense half the time, and very rarely are they logical. Saying he "loses every PPV match, and only he beats cruisers" for example is so absurd of a statement its funny. Also "you said Angle won alot, so I said Edge won alot as well. End of story" LOL.......you totally missed the entire point of what I was trying to say pertaining to those two. So in your mind Angle wasn't given a fair shake in the Edge feud because "Edge won alot as well." Now what is YOUR point? I'm failing to miss it. Edge won alot of those matches as well as did Angle, so that means what to you exactly? Oh yeah thats right, that Angle was made to look like a bitch in that feud, I forgot *note sarcasm* I wish Angle himself would come read some of the stuff you write pertaining to him. I think even he would bitch slap you for being so damn ignorant on the reality of things. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Anglesault Report post Posted March 12, 2003 Also "you said Angle won alot, so I said Edge won alot as well. End of story" LOL.......you totally missed the entire point of what I was trying to say pertaining to those two. So in your mind Angle wasn't given a fair shake in the Edge feud because "Edge won alot as well Oh, no, I didn't mean it like that. I've long since gotten over that edge feud. It all evened out in the Fall. I thought the first post was trying to say that Angle dominated that feud. I was saying that Edge won more. loses every PPV match, and only he beats cruisers" Rey? Tell me the PPV match he won. Or the high number of non cruisers he beat. And I'm still looking for some positive spin on this feud now.. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Brian Report post Posted March 12, 2003 Benoit at Royal Rumble 2003. Big Show at Armaggedon. Gets submission at No Mercy tag on Edge. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Anglesault Report post Posted March 12, 2003 Benoit at Royal Rumble 2003. Big Show at Armaggedon. Gets submission at No Mercy tag on Edge. What does that apply to? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Brian Report post Posted March 12, 2003 Matches he's won at pay per views. You said he only beats cruiserweights. Those matches are three of six since the Mysterio win. There's also the match with Benoit, where Benoit had to cheat to beat him, and the match where his team lost to Brock and Benoit where he wasn't pinned or submitted. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest RedJed Report post Posted March 12, 2003 If we took a look back at Angle's ppv record, I think we would notice the only shows he likely EVER took on a CW was at SummerSlam. And furthermore, if we took a look back at his ppv record, I would bet his wins are higher than his losses, AND those wins were given more importance THAN the losses. The guy is protected pretty strong and has been damn near constantly since he came in late 99. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Anglesault Report post Posted March 12, 2003 Matches he's won at pay per views. You said he only beats cruiserweights. Those matches are three of six since the Mysterio win. There's also the match with Benoit, where Benoit had to cheat to beat him, and the match where his team lost to Brock and Benoit where he wasn't pinned or submitted. No, I said REY never wins at PPVs and only beats some of the cruisers. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest RedJed Report post Posted March 12, 2003 Matches he's won at pay per views. You said he only beats cruiserweights. Those matches are three of six since the Mysterio win. There's also the match with Benoit, where Benoit had to cheat to beat him, and the match where his team lost to Brock and Benoit where he wasn't pinned or submitted. No, I said REY never wins at PPVs and only beats some of the cruisers. Well Rey has only been on what, 3 ppvs or something like that? Can't make a judgment call like that from that short of time. So whats your point about Rey, he has always been booked as nothing more than "just another cruiserweight" that holds no credibility? Give me a f'n break. Maybe now he does currently since he returned from the injury, but before he left, he was holding his own with the Benoits (defeated him twice at least), Angles, hell he even dominated a very short match with Lesnar on Smackdown in October. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Brian Report post Posted March 12, 2003 OK. I get that part. But Angle's still one of the most protected guys on the roster up until the Brock feud. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Mulatto Heat Report post Posted March 13, 2003 No, I said REY never wins at PPVs and only beats some of the cruisers. He's beaten Benoit three times. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Anglesault Report post Posted March 13, 2003 OK. I get that part. But Angle's still one of the most protected guys on the roster up until the Brock feud. He was still shunted down to the midcard an AWFUL lot. There is no denying that. And 2002 was a pretty bad year for him. He was made to look like an absolute idiot buffoon in the spring and fall. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Anglesault Report post Posted March 13, 2003 No, I said REY never wins at PPVs and only beats some of the cruisers. He's beaten Benoit three times. I can remember one. Three? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest RedJed Report post Posted March 13, 2003 No, I said REY never wins at PPVs and only beats some of the cruisers. He's beaten Benoit three times. I can remember one. Three? Beat him in a three way w/ Angle.........beat him in a singles (I believe the next week?) and then pinned Benoit as well during one of the tag matches they had, I think too. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Mulatto Heat Report post Posted March 13, 2003 Yes, three. 1) The triple threat in Rey's hometown right after Unforgiven. 2) The singles match the following week. (But you were too busy complaining about Angle falling to the spear earlier that night) 3) The first fall in the 2/3 falls match where Edge and Rey won the titles. (But you were too busy complaining about Angle getting pinned twice in the third fall) Pay attention! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest RedJed Report post Posted March 13, 2003 OK. I get that part. But Angle's still one of the most protected guys on the roster up until the Brock feud. He was still shunted down to the midcard an AWFUL lot. There is no denying that. And 2002 was a pretty bad year for him. He was made to look like an absolute idiot buffoon in the spring and fall. Ok so how was he made to look like a buffoon exactly? Because of the hair thing I would assume, and then what in the fall, I'm missing it. Even if he was dropped down to the midcard an awful lot (which is VERY debatable other than perhaps Mania last year, but with both Edge and Rey, they were both upper midcard feuds with the point being to have Edge and Rey look like something special being in there with Angle) he was given tons of momentum leading towards the title match with Show (made to look great in the process in that process of the buildup with clean wins over guys like Edge, Benoit, Eddy) and even when they pulled a blunder (IMO) by doing the Heyman thing, right after that began his character change dramatically into a VERY serious competitor. And he continued to back his shit up in the ring at the same time. What you're failing to see is the difference between just the Brock-Angle buildup and Angle in itself as a character and his credibility. I'm not debating that the buildup for Angle-Lesnar could have been much better, but it doesn't mean Angle is going into the match looking like a complete pile of shit. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Anglesault Report post Posted March 13, 2003 OK. I get that part. But Angle's still one of the most protected guys on the roster up until the Brock feud. He was still shunted down to the midcard an AWFUL lot. There is no denying that. And 2002 was a pretty bad year for him. He was made to look like an absolute idiot buffoon in the spring and fall. Ok so how was he made to look like a buffoon exactly? Because of the hair thing I would assume, and then what in the fall, I'm missing it. He and Benoit were booked to be VERY stupid in that Fall feud. Plus their awesome game of one upsmanship consisted of "I Can lose this match better than you can lose yours!" Plus they were in this bitter feud for no valid reason (THE STINKFACE?) And then the hugging started. made to look great in the process in that process of the buildup with clean wins over guys like Edge, Benoit, Eddy) and even when they pulled a blunder (IMO) by doing the Heyman thing, right after that began his character change dramatically into a VERY serious competitor. And he continued to back his shit up in the ring at the same time. And then came Brock. And all that was rendered useless. And in 2002 they had him in main event feuds easily three times before a demotion. Plus at least two in 01. It happens ALOT. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Anglesault Report post Posted March 13, 2003 What you're failing to see is the difference between just the Brock-Angle buildup and Angle in itself as a character and his credibility. I'm not debating that the buildup for Angle-Lesnar could have been much better, but it doesn't mean Angle is going into the match looking like a complete pile of shit. Angle, right now, against anyone else in the world except Brock is easily, easily the favorite. I credit the awesome January 03 booking. Angle going into Mania is an overwhelming underdog and doesn't look like he could last 2 minutes. They fucked the whole roster with this. EVERYONE but Brock looks bad. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Coffey Report post Posted March 13, 2003 What you're failing to see is the difference between just the Brock-Angle buildup and Angle in itself as a character and his credibility. I'm not debating that the buildup for Angle-Lesnar could have been much better, but it doesn't mean Angle is going into the match looking like a complete pile of shit. Angle, right now, against anyone else in the world except Brock is easily, easily the favorite. I credit the awesome January 03 booking. Angle going into Mania is an overwhelming underdog and doesn't look like he could last 2 minutes. They fucked the whole roster with this. EVERYONE but Brock looks bad. Looks bad to who? Not the marks...and who cares what smarks think? Not the WWE. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Anglesault Report post Posted March 13, 2003 What you're failing to see is the difference between just the Brock-Angle buildup and Angle in itself as a character and his credibility. I'm not debating that the buildup for Angle-Lesnar could have been much better, but it doesn't mean Angle is going into the match looking like a complete pile of shit. Angle, right now, against anyone else in the world except Brock is easily, easily the favorite. I credit the awesome January 03 booking. Angle going into Mania is an overwhelming underdog and doesn't look like he could last 2 minutes. They fucked the whole roster with this. EVERYONE but Brock looks bad. Looks bad to who? Not the marks...and who cares what smarks think? Not the WWE. I think they look real bad Spoiler (Highlight to Read): SO THERE! ::Does The Anglesault Jig:: Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest RedJed Report post Posted March 13, 2003 What you're failing to see is the difference between just the Brock-Angle buildup and Angle in itself as a character and his credibility. I'm not debating that the buildup for Angle-Lesnar could have been much better, but it doesn't mean Angle is going into the match looking like a complete pile of shit. Angle, right now, against anyone else in the world except Brock is easily, easily the favorite. I credit the awesome January 03 booking. Angle going into Mania is an overwhelming underdog and doesn't look like he could last 2 minutes. They fucked the whole roster with this. EVERYONE but Brock looks bad. Looks bad to who? Not the marks...and who cares what smarks think? Not the WWE. I think they look real bad Spoiler (Highlight to Read): SO THERE! ::Does The Anglesault Jig:: And I think you're the only one too Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Anglesault Report post Posted March 13, 2003 Spoiler (Highlight to Read): That post was only to play with the spoiler tag. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
