Return of the Jedi

[Guest Dmann2000]

...I love the final part of the first trilogy for one reason...

 

The Emporer

 

All his dialogue rules, especially his tete-a-tete with Luke, I quote him all the time.

 

"Your overconfidence is your weakness"

"Your faith in your friends is yours"

[Guest El Satanico]

Well I liked the Ewoks...I even had the ewok village playset.

[Guest Grand Slam]

I agree. To this day, I have no idea where all the hate for this movie (or the prequels for that matter) comes from. How could you not like the final duel between father and son or the rescue of Han Solo? How about the obvious sadness in Luke's face when Yoda, yet another Master (Father-figure), passes away. Or how about the quiet scene of Luke standing in front of a huge bonfire watching the armor his father wore burn away?

 

Damn fine stuff.

[Guest Fook_Hing_Ho]

I like all that stuff.

 

It's just that the Ewoks piss me off.

They're like the 80's version of Jar Jar.

[Guest Dmann2000]

I like all that stuff.

 

It's just that the Ewoks piss me off.

They're like the 80's version of Jar Jar.

Are you sure it's the Ewoks alone in Jedi or their later TV movies and cutesy Cartoon that you hate?

[Guest Lethargic]

Jedi was always my favorite of the originals. It was until the internet came along that I found out it wasn't cool to like Jedi and that if you're a real fan you must list Empire as your favorite cause it's darker.

[Guest Kahran Ramsus]

The entire middle part of the movie from when Luke leaves Dagobah until he meets up with Vader is terrible.

 

I actually like the prequels more.

[Guest starvenger]

The Ewoks were fine upon the initial viewing, but they got more annoying on subsequent viewings. As such, I carry less hate for them than I do for Jar Jar.

 

Fun (and/or scary) fact: The Ewoks were never named as such during RotJ. Yub yub.

[Guest Dmann2000]

The entire middle part of the movie from when Luke leaves Dagobah until he meets up with Vader is terrible.

 

I actually like the prequels more.

All the stuff with the Emporer > than any bad stuff

[Guest Spaceman Spiff]

All his dialogue rules, especially his tete-a-tete with Luke, I quote him all the time.

 

"Your overconfidence is your weakness"

"Your faith in your friends is yours"

I personally like his "So be it, Jedi". He just spits it out w/ such disdain. Beautiful.

[Guest SP-1]

ROTJ is my favorite. The Ewoks don't bother me but then neither did Jar Jar. They just don't really register on my radar for some reason.

 

The scene with Luke by the bonfire is my favorite part of the whole movie. The music swells perfectly, the shot is great . . . just a good film moment all around. I also like the moment in A NEW HOPE when Luke stands on the dunes as the twin Tattoine suns set in the distance.

[Guest Crucifixio Jones]

I don't think anyone hates Jedi it's just inferior to the other two movies. I also don't think anyone hates the Ewoks, but it was the Ewoks and Return of the Jedi in general that mark a blatant turn in the series to cater to children which pisses off a lot of net people. It's the same reason they hate Jar Jar (and he's annoying as hell). But he's just a device to get little kids in the theaters while most hardcore SW fans prefer something with a darker tone, not silly humor just for the sake of selling a few million more toys. Geez, it's not like Lucas doesn't have enough money already. Now people just despise the greedy bastard for tampering with a great franchise to milk out even MORE money. When you consider all this, it's hard NOT to hate the guy and the movie that started it all.

[Guest WhenDanSaysJump]

I always laugh at that bit where the Ewok attemps to rouse his dead friend. My girlfriend thinks I'm a shithead for this.

[Guest Mole]

Jedi has always been my favorite out of the three.

 

How can you hate the Ewoks?? They are so damn cute.

[The Dames 0]

I'll probably get crucified for this one, but I always found the original Star Wars to be mindnumbingly boring. I loved Empire and Jedi though.

 

Dames

[Guest Dmann2000]

I'll probably get crucified for this one, but I always found the original Star Wars to be mindnumbingly boring. I loved Empire and Jedi though.

 

Dames

Whenever someone says how bad the dialogue/acting in the first two prequels are, I say to them "You must not have watched A New Hope recently"

 

Oh man there is some really cheezy lines/moments in that film. But it's okay, which is why I'm not too hard on the prequels

 

"But I was going to Toshi station to pick up some power converters (spoken with a whiny tone)"

 

Oh, I don't know if anyone else noticed this, but you realize the Empire was only in power about 20 years. That's what happens to military dictatorships I guess, short life span.

[The Dames 0]

"But I was going to Toshi station to pick up some power converters (spoken with a whiny tone)"

Oh, some of my closest friends ALWAYS make fun of that specific line and I mark out for it when I hear it now.

 

Dames

[Guest TheZsaszHorsemen]

YUB YUB!

 

Hee saw YUB YUB!

 

I-yah YUB YUB YUBBBBBBBBB!

[Guest starvenger]

I'll probably get crucified for this one, but I always found the original Star Wars to be mindnumbingly boring.  I loved Empire and Jedi though. 

 

Dames

Whenever someone says how bad the dialogue/acting in the first two prequels are, I say to them "You must not have watched A New Hope recently"

 

Oh man there is some really cheezy lines/moments in that film. But it's okay, which is why I'm not too hard on the prequels

 

"But I was going to Toshi station to pick up some power converters (spoken with a whiny tone)"

My guess is that since ANH was the original, it gets some leeway. People figured that the prequels would be dialogued better, what with Lucas having had some previous experience.

 

That being said, if ANH was made today Luke would probably have been bitchslapped every time he whined about something. That's a lot of bitchslappage.

 

Oh, I don't know if anyone else noticed this, but you realize the Empire was only in power about 20 years.  That's what happens to military dictatorships I guess, short life span.

Well, the Emperor was only in power for about 20 years, but the Empire didn't die right then and there. It's still alive (but much, much smaller) some 25+ years later in the expanded universe novels.

[Guest SP-1]

:;smacks Zsasz::

 

[Guest Vern Gagne]

No doubt the Ewoks where created for the young kids, but they where tough little sob's and were not afraid to mix it up with the Stormtroopers.

[Guest TheZsaszHorsemen]

The first one has a sense of innocence that none of others have. It was probobly a revelation in '77 and is still refreshing today.

[Guest SP-1]

If I'm not mistaken, Lucas goes after a more stage kind of directing that film really. I think I read that somewhere. That makes a whole lot of sense if you apply it to the kind of acting in all the Star Wars films.

[Guest TheZsaszHorsemen]

If I'm not mistaken, Lucas goes after a more stage kind of directing that film really. I think I read that somewhere. That makes a whole lot of sense if you apply it to the kind of acting in all the Star Wars films.

I always assumed the bad acting in ANH was a tribute to the camp of the serials from which Star Wars is based.

[Guest Madmartigan21]

I don't think anyone hates Jedi it's just inferior to the other two movies.  I also don't think anyone hates the Ewoks, but it was the Ewoks and Return of the Jedi in general that mark a blatant turn in the series to cater to children which pisses off a lot of net people.  It's the same reason they hate Jar Jar (and he's annoying as hell).  But he's just a device to get little kids in the theaters while most hardcore SW fans prefer something with a darker tone, not silly humor just for the sake of selling a few million more toys.  Geez, it's not like Lucas doesn't have enough money already.  Now people just despise the greedy bastard for tampering with a great franchise to milk out even MORE money.  When you consider all this, it's hard NOT to hate the guy and the movie that started it all.

I think you're intrepreting this all wrong. What most people fail to realize about George Lucas is that he has a child-like mentality. This is different than haveing a child-like imagination or sense of wonder, or even just being a big kid. He flat out makes movies as though he was a 12 year-old.

 

I don't think the Ewoks were an attempt to draw in more kids. Kids were the original target audience for the first two movies as well, and they did awfully well without Ewoks. I also thought the Ewoks were used to create an ironic ending for the Empire. Here you have this big bad powerful TECHNOLOGICALLY SOPHISTICATED galactic empire and they're taken down in the final battle in no small part due to small, physically weak creatures that use things like ROCKS as weapons. How poetic.

 

But let's get back to my original point how about Lucas for a moment. I don't think I can write this in a logical order, so I'm just going to stream-of-consciousness them.

 

In The Phatnom Menace there's that whole race scene, that when I see it I can't help but think, "WHAT THE HELL IS THAT?" He can't be serious. Why is it totally like a 1950's drag race or something. Both prequels have all sorts of anachronisms that bug the hell out of me. They destroy the unique feel of the Star Was universe.

 

When the Special Editions of the original trilogy were hitting the theater, I remember him saying that he always thought it would be funny to have a big musical number in the middle of a Star Wars movie. Oh yeah, that scene he digitally added to Jedi was FUCKING HILARIOUS. It wasn't at all, uh you know, BORING AS HELL.

 

Another thing that bothered me was all the new CGI that was used during the Cloud City sequence in Empire. All the background action was added outside the windows. There was constantly something buzzing about. I always liked the emptyness. It gave me this ominous feeling. But that was ruined, since Lucas decide if he COULD do something, that he SHOULD do something. Which is very childish. It's like when I was in school, there was that group of kids that the first day they were allowed to where shorts to school each year, they always did. It didn't matter if it was freezing out that morning. They were going to where shorts and let their cold legs BE DAMNED!

 

This is how Lucas thinks. That's why the prequels have looked like total cartoons to me. The screen is so filled with images that don't look real AT ALL. Since he doesn't HAVE to use anything resembling conventional SFX, he doesn't. I think the results have been less than scintilating. For now I still think the way to go is traditional SFX ENHANCED by CGI NOT replaced entirely by CGI.

 

I was recently watching the new "The Day the Earth Stood Still" DVD commentary track. Robert Wise, the director, made what I thought was a very astute point. The SFX can be relatively poor and they audience WON'T care about that if they're engrossed in the story and the characters. The FX should be in the background, metaphorically speaking, while the story and the characters should be in the foreground. This obviously is not a philosophy that Lucas feels is valid. He's like those people that refer to a song that was big five years ago as an "old" song. If it's newer it's better, and if it's the latest it's the best. He's got new toys and he wants to play with them. It doesn't matter if there's nothing wrong with the old ones.

 

It's like his obsession with digital projection. Newsflash, digital is NOT of better quality than celluloid yet. It probably will be one day, but it sure as hell ain't yet. Roger Ebert has seen side by side comparisons of digital and Maxi-Vision. Maxi-Vision wins hands down. Maxi-Vision uses the old technology, but improves on in it. It uses a newer projecter that doesn't vibrate has much, and film that has less space between each frame, and the result is a superior picture. It would also be cheaper to upgrade theaters to Maxi-Vision than it would to digital. But digital is a newer technology altogther, so it MUST be better right? Well that's what Lucas thinks.

 

I hope all this made a bit of sense. To sum up:

 

I always have, do now, and always will like the Ewoks. So THERE!

[Rendclaw 0]

Empire was my favorite all the way around. Jedi always seemed like it was rushed, a lot of things slapped together... not given a slow build like Empire was, and few resting stops like ANH had.

 

The CGI additions to the movies added to the experience, except for the dreaded "Greedo short first".. Props to Jay Spree for directing me to the petition website to get that scene removed... doubtful that Lucas is going to do that, but that was a ridiculous scene.

[Guest Fook_Hing_Ho]

I like all that stuff.

 

It's just that the Ewoks piss me off.

They're like the 80's version of Jar Jar.

Are you sure it's the Ewoks alone in Jedi or their later TV movies and cutesy Cartoon that you hate?

I never saw the TV movies or the cartoon.

 

The hatred i spawn is influenced directly by the film.

[Guest DVD Spree]

The CGI additions to the movies added to the experience, except for the dreaded "Greedo short first".. Props to Jay Spree for directing me to the petition website to get that scene removed... doubtful that Lucas is going to do that, but that was a ridiculous scene.

 

Holy shit! Someone gave me props!

 

Fuck Lucas. And while we're at it, fuck HGH, too. And Michael Jordan.

[Guest Dmann2000]

I don't think the Ewoks were an attempt to draw in more kids. Kids were the original target audience for the first two movies as well, and they did awfully well without Ewoks. I also thought the Ewoks were used to create an ironic ending for the Empire. Here you have this big bad powerful TECHNOLOGICALLY SOPHISTICATED galactic empire and they're taken down in the final battle in no small part due to small, physically weak creatures that use things like ROCKS as weapons. How poetic.

Star Wars (OT) and Jedi specifically are an allegory for the Vietnam War. The Ewoks (Vietnamese) defeat are technicologically superior and larger force, the Empire (United States). Also Darth Vader represents the old man who supports a strong military and the son refuses to fight him and wants peace instead.

 

And the Emporer is Richard Nixon.

[Guest eiker_ir]

Jedi was always my favorite of the originals. It was until the internet came along that I found out it wasn't cool to like Jedi and that if you're a real fan you must list Empire as your favorite cause it's darker.

 

same here, i mean is so dark and deep.....and stuff u know