One And Only TNA 12/17/03 Thread

[Guest vicvenomjr]

Oh my god, thats what his DAD said!

*****Um yeah. Good point. Yeah.

 

If you continue to compare Pillman to Annis, he'd be spinning in his grave, to the point where he's crawl out and kill himslef again.

*****Why they both worked you?

 

Foley-Orton was the start of what, potentially, could be a killer again.

*****He spit in the face of the ultimate legend and also in the face of every Attitude era fan.

 

I bet it kills you that Orton is getting the push from the Gods,

*****nope, it kills me everyone on the roster has the same look.

 

while Hart pisses off every promoter he works for.

*****MLW or WWE, where he'll be a champ in 5 years.

 

As for TNA, the compnay will be dead in a year, so stop promoting it

*****So why cheer anything on? Why cheer the Pirates in baseball? Or the Cardinals in foorball? The ultimate is when the underdog wins. I just got on the bandwagon now. I appreciate it when my intelligence isn't insulted. As a result this is my way to flick off VKM.

[Guest Dave O'Neill, Journalist]

Despite never having seen Northcutt wrestle, I can safely say that Taker, Kane and Albert could WRESTLE circles around him.

*****The 55 year old Taker or the Albert who almsot killed Benoit at SD! only PPV in Oct.

 

A-Train botched a spot. He apologised, and everyone got on with their lives. Unlike Teddy Hart, who nearly killed himself and several others in ROH a few months ago, and refuses to accept responsibility. As for Taker, he's 43, and will still be a better wrestler than Northcutt in ten years.

 

Hell, Genichiro Tenryu is 58, and could take Northcutt in seconds.

 

Why don't you provide facts befpre coming out with dumbshit like that.

*****easy on the language, tough guy. Look at the crowds last year.

 

1500 people in a barn in an unsafe are of Nashville.?? What crowds? It's the same people everyweek.

 

*****Watch the TNA stars evolve or be pissed that Benoit gets buried. Angle plays a goof. Lesnar is overrated when he should be the ultimate superstar or Eddie is getting treatment worst than RVD.

 

Evolve? By letting Jarrrett push them into a fucking trapeze act????? At least Benoit, Angle and Eddie can go to work knowing that their boss isn't gonna tell them to do something as stupid as Ultimate X.

[Corey_Lazarus 0]

Northcutt is worse than Kane, Undertaker, Big Show, and Albert. So, what big guy IS he better than?

*****Better than all but Kane.

Undertaker has had several matches in the ***1/2-****1/2 range. Northcutt's best match has been a ** brawl.

Big Show, despite not having much wrestling ability at all, has a shitload of charisma (his comedic face run in 2000 proved this), and has stepped up as a worker since coming to SmackDown in late 2002. He has put on several solid, **1/2-*** bouts with Brock Lesnar.

A-Train has a basic sense of timing that Northcutt does not have, but everything else Northcutt does is better than A-Train.

Kane is perhaps one of the more agile big men in the business, and is pulling off the "mentally scarred psycopath" gimmick to near perfection. Losing the mask is, IMO, the best thing to happen to the Kane character, as Kane can now show his usually very good facial expressions instead of having to just grunt and whine. Northcutt has two facial expressions: hurt and constipated.

And Legend is mediocre. M-E-D-I-O-C-R-E.

*****not last night.

Aside from the bump off the top of the cage, what did he do last night to make him stand out? I actually think he's a fairly good brawler, but he's been pretty shit in TNA.

Seeing as how the "average fan" clearly isn't WATCHING this product, you might want to listen to what the IWC is saying.

*****like I said if only the iwc watched they'd have 100 fans at most, instead of the up to 10,000 they have right now.

You realize that more than 100 people have the internet, and that not everybody that orders TNA comes to TSM, right? Fuck, nearly everybody at the TotalNonStop forum orders the shows weekly (all but maybe kikrusher99 and VoltageXX), and I think only one or two of them actually make it a habit to come to TSM. Just because somebody doesn't come to TSM, or isn't in the OAO TNA thread to comment on what happens, doesn't mean that they don't have the internet and aren't ordering. TNA's core fanbase has, and will be for a long time, the IWC. To deny this is ludicrous.

Then you're completely delusional.

*****While I appreciate smallish single rasslers, I like heavyweight tag teams.

Then you also have poor taste in wrestlers.

Except Jericho and Hardy.

*****Said Y2J and definately including Hardy. Hardy is a ll gimmick, nothing in the ring.

Matt Hardy is a complete worker. While not the best wrestler, he is very good, and shows wisdom in the ring beyond his years (even though he has been working professionally for just under a decade). Jeff Jarrett could take lessons from Matt in how to work a crowd, a match, and the mic.

The same kind of heat that translates to an inability to sell out the arena after a year and no real increase in PPV buys?

*****Both falsehoods I guarantee both increased.

Nope. TNA live attendance only increased during the SEX/TNA feud, which was a very well-booked angle that many of US liked while it was going (Sports Entertainment vs. Tradition, that is), and began to decrease during Jarrett's face World title run after the match with Raven and the SEX angle came to a close. PPV buyrates have remained steady since late 2002.

The only heat is the pen writing down figures in the debits column, while the pen writnig figures in the credits column is doodling right now.

******Which is fine, if the money is available. If they go to WGN and it pays off then all is great and the money spent is worth it. If not well, hey it provided many people with an outlet away from the WWE.

Having a show with mostly jobber matches airing in only half of the nation on a channel few people have heard of in a timeslot where nobody will watch is NOT good exposure, and is NOT money well spent.

Sucked.

*****Both matches were very good. That's just my opinion.

I digged the Styles/Jarrett matches...well, wait, no I didn't. They were both Jarrett completely dominating Styles in elements where Styles should have either the advantage or an equal playing field in.

Of course, you call them "rasslers", so how worthwhile your opinion is is already a debate in and of itself.

*****It's not a critical word, just an old fashioned term.

One that insults us all, as the term is a Northern way of parodying the way Southerners speak. Using this term reinforces the stereotype of professional wrestling fans as "dumb hicks."

A sub-par worker with limited heat burying everybody on the show (Jarrett).

*****The most recognizable heavyweight

...is Raven. Raven has sold more merchandise, PPVs, and brought in higher ratings than Jarrett could ever hope for. Hell, TNA really didn't have anything going for it outside of the X-Division before Raven entered the company.

Titles being given to people with no real reason behind it and with MUCH better choices available (Shane).

******Simon and Swinger, 3LK, Styles. Great stroy's in regards to the chase.

Unfortunately, these "great stories" were held off for too long, and the delivery (if there has been any) was poor, and thus were not "great stories" after all.

A stale tag team division.

******A lot better than the Bashmans and Bautista and flair.

Picking two teams that resemble the worse side is fun, ain't it? So let's pick some bad TNA teams...oh wait, there's only three: AMW, Simon/Swinger, 3 Live Kru. I'd rather have multiple teams in a division with some of them being shit than having only three teams, with only one being more than "bland."

Illogical and pointless booking.

*****Really, where? Raven's chase. A Daniels title win, possibly. XXX reuniting. Punk/Dinero's turn. JJ showing Crips how a ego maniac should be played. Every week at least 1 great, great match. Gang feuds. D'lo getting a solid push.

Raven's chase has been the only consistent angle in TNA since Dutch took over. Daniels will probably not win the X-Division title, as it's PAINFULLY obvious that Sabin will get the belt. XXX will likely not reunite, at least not in full, and Elix seems as if he might have lost a step. Punk should have turned weeks ago, and Dinero turning makes very little sense. JJ the character is good, but as a wrestler he's on par with HHH, and has more backstage pull as he is the head booker. A "great, great match" is one that will almost unanimously be regarded as such, which has not happened since September (when the vast majority of the TNA fanbase creamed themselves for Sabin/Juvi). Gang feuds are only as good as the man booking the feuds, and Dutch has proven he has little sense when it comes to much else besides the main event. D'Lo just returned two shows ago after a nearly three month absence, and such cannot be considered a "solid push."

Really bad production values.

*****ah, no.

Then explain why the crowd seems to be moving, but no noise can be heard.

Shall I go on?

*****you really ahven't proven anything besides the fact you refuse to be happy.

And you haven't proven anything besides that you refuse to listen to logic.

TNA doesn't DO backstage skits and promos well --- so maybe, just maybe, THEY SHOULD AVOID THEM.

*****Hudson best backstage interviewer in the biz. On a level better than most sports side line or on field reporters. And Goldy was darn good before him.

Goldy sucked, but yes, Hudson is AMAZING as a backstage interviewer. The short promo with 3LK was humorous, and his natural delivery of every line (including the subtle shilling of the new calendar) made me smile. Doesn't make up for the fact that most of their backstage skits are rather crap.

This week, yes.

*****No, every week.

Every week is one decent match, one decent angle, and a load of crappy filler that makes me ashamed to be a TNA supporter.

An AMW title run is hardly something the world anxiously awaits.They are a boring tag team. The Dudley Boys without the table gimmick.

*****To you but not to the Nashville fans, believe me it all about the chase. They're doing it perfect with AMW.

When the Nashville fans, for the most part, do not pay to see the product live, but the at-home fans do, who should you really be worried about pleasing? By large, the at-home fans (again, mostly the IWC) are not happy with the fact that AMW are booked as the center of the tag division when they're painful to listen to on the mic and have not mastered basic tag team wrestling. So, explain to me how Dutch is doing it "perfect" with AMW when most of the fanbase does not want AMW to have the belts?

No offense but jeez most of all appreciate being able to see some of the best rasslers in the world every week in Lo-ki, Daniels, AJ and Sabin.

Ki has bouts of greatness, but usually resorts to the same spots. Fun worker, one of my favorites, but lacks a lot of substance.

Daniels, yes, is one of the best wrestlers in the world.

Styles has a long way to go to become one of the best in the world, and has "Kurt Angle Syndrome" (where the worker becomes limited due to their opponents' styles, and thus cannot advance their own abilities).

Sabin is not even in the top 50% of the best wrestlers in the world.

[Guest vicvenomjr]

A-Train botched a spot. He apologised, and everyone got on with their lives.

*****He's been a heat sucker since he started. Never been over, ever.

 

Unlike Teddy Hart, who nearly killed himself and several others in ROH a few months ago, and refuses to accept responsibility.

*****But everyone on the IWC knows him now, he's the focal pint of MLW.

 

As for Taker, he's 43, and will still be a better wrestler than Northcutt in ten years.

*****Northcutt's more athletic, he also trained Bob Sapp so that's all i need to appreciate his knowledge more than the tweener.

 

Hell, Genichiro Tenryu is 58, and could take Northcutt in seconds.

*****great.

 

1500 people in a barn in an unsafe are of Nashville.?? What crowds? It's the same people everyweek.

*****Lot more than last year when SEX started.

 

Evolve? By letting Jarrrett push them into a fucking trapeze act?????

*****No being the NWA workld champ at 23. What did you do at 23. Personally I covered the biggest catastrophy of this year. But that's me.

 

At least Benoit, Angle and Eddie can go to work knowing that their boss isn't gonna tell them to do something as stupid as Ultimate X.

*****How about feuding with the FBI or spraying shit on a giant. Think.

[Guest Dave O'Neill, Journalist]

while Hart pisses off every promoter he works for.

*****MLW or WWE, where he'll be a champ in 5 years.

 

He got kicked out of the WWE, TWICE. Mlw is a bigger joke than TNA, so lets just leave that one.

 

 

Foley-Orton was the start of what, potentially, could be a killer again.

*****He spit in the face of the ultimate legend and also in the face of every Attitude era fan.

 

Because thats his character!!!!!!!!!!!! A drwing one, btw, who has the IC belt.

 

I bet it kills you that Orton is getting the push from the Gods,

*****nope, it kills me everyone on the roster has the same look.

 

Unlike, say, Hart, who looks like a clown.

 

*****So why cheer anything on? Why cheer the Pirates in baseball? Or the Cardinals in foorball? The ultimate is when the underdog wins. I just got on the bandwagon now. I appreciate it when my intelligence isn't insulted. As a result this is my way to flick off VKM

 

For a start, your football references are lost on me, because I'm Irish. Second of all, TNA is not an underdog. It's a bunch of bitter hacks trying to get revenge on Vince for shutting them out

[Guest vicvenomjr]

He got kicked out of the WWE, TWICE. Mlw is a bigger joke than TNA, so lets just leave that one.

*****Not really, enetrtianing.

 

Because thats his character!!!!!!!!!!!! A drwing one, btw, who has the IC belt.

*****Drawing one, huh. Has anyone paid to watch Orton rassle anyone at all.

 

Unlike, say, Hart, who looks like a clown.

*****But it's unique.

 

 

For a start, your football references are lost on me, because I'm Irish. Second of all, TNA is not an underdog. It's a bunch of bitter hacks trying to get revenge on Vince for shutting them out

*****Nah, it's a bunch of dedicated people who don't sell out.

 

 

Undertaker has had several matches in the ***1/2-****1/2 range. Northcutt's best match has been a ** brawl.

Big Show, despite not having much wrestling ability at all, has a shitload of charisma (his comedic face run in 2000 proved this), and has stepped up as a worker since coming to SmackDown in late 2002. He has put on several solid, **1/2-*** bouts with Brock Lesnar.

A-Train has a basic sense of timing that Northcutt does not have, but everything else Northcutt does is better than A-Train.

Kane is perhaps one of the more agile big men in the business, and is pulling off the "mentally scarred psycopath" gimmick to near perfection. Losing the mask is, IMO, the best thing to happen to the Kane character, as Kane can now show his usually very good facial expressions instead of having to just grunt and whine. Northcutt has two facial expressions: hurt and constipated.

QUOTE

And Legend is mediocre. M-E-D-I-O-C-R-E.

*****not last night.

 

Aside from the bump off the top of the cage, what did he do last night to make him stand out? I actually think he's a fairly good brawler, but he's been pretty shit in TNA.

QUOTE

Seeing as how the "average fan" clearly isn't WATCHING this product, you might want to listen to what the IWC is saying.

*****like I said if only the iwc watched they'd have 100 fans at most, instead of the up to 10,000 they have right now.

 

You realize that more than 100 people have the internet, and that not everybody that orders TNA comes to TSM, right? Fuck, nearly everybody at the TotalNonStop forum orders the shows weekly (all but maybe kikrusher99 and VoltageXX), and I think only one or two of them actually make it a habit to come to TSM. Just because somebody doesn't come to TSM, or isn't in the OAO TNA thread to comment on what happens, doesn't mean that they don't have the internet and aren't ordering. TNA's core fanbase has, and will be for a long time, the IWC. To deny this is ludicrous.

QUOTE

Then you're completely delusional.

*****While I appreciate smallish single rasslers, I like heavyweight tag teams.

 

Then you also have poor taste in wrestlers.

QUOTE

Except Jericho and Hardy.

*****Said Y2J and definately including Hardy. Hardy is a ll gimmick, nothing in the ring.

 

Matt Hardy is a complete worker. While not the best wrestler, he is very good, and shows wisdom in the ring beyond his years (even though he has been working professionally for just under a decade). Jeff Jarrett could take lessons from Matt in how to work a crowd, a match, and the mic.

QUOTE

The same kind of heat that translates to an inability to sell out the arena after a year and no real increase in PPV buys?

*****Both falsehoods I guarantee both increased.

 

Nope. TNA live attendance only increased during the SEX/TNA feud, which was a very well-booked angle that many of US liked while it was going (Sports Entertainment vs. Tradition, that is), and began to decrease during Jarrett's face World title run after the match with Raven and the SEX angle came to a close. PPV buyrates have remained steady since late 2002.

QUOTE

The only heat is the pen writing down figures in the debits column, while the pen writnig figures in the credits column is doodling right now.

******Which is fine, if the money is available. If they go to WGN and it pays off then all is great and the money spent is worth it. If not well, hey it provided many people with an outlet away from the WWE.

 

Having a show with mostly jobber matches airing in only half of the nation on a channel few people have heard of in a timeslot where nobody will watch is NOT good exposure, and is NOT money well spent.

QUOTE

Sucked.

*****Both matches were very good. That's just my opinion.

 

I digged the Styles/Jarrett matches...well, wait, no I didn't. They were both Jarrett completely dominating Styles in elements where Styles should have either the advantage or an equal playing field in.

QUOTE

Of course, you call them "rasslers", so how worthwhile your opinion is is already a debate in and of itself.

*****It's not a critical word, just an old fashioned term.

 

One that insults us all, as the term is a Northern way of parodying the way Southerners speak. Using this term reinforces the stereotype of professional wrestling fans as "dumb hicks."

QUOTE

A sub-par worker with limited heat burying everybody on the show (Jarrett).

*****The most recognizable heavyweight

 

...is Raven. Raven has sold more merchandise, PPVs, and brought in higher ratings than Jarrett could ever hope for. Hell, TNA really didn't have anything going for it outside of the X-Division before Raven entered the company.

QUOTE

Titles being given to people with no real reason behind it and with MUCH better choices available (Shane).

******Simon and Swinger, 3LK, Styles. Great stroy's in regards to the chase.

 

Unfortunately, these "great stories" were held off for too long, and the delivery (if there has been any) was poor, and thus were not "great stories" after all.

QUOTE

A stale tag team division.

******A lot better than the Bashmans and Bautista and flair.

 

Picking two teams that resemble the worse side is fun, ain't it? So let's pick some bad TNA teams...oh wait, there's only three: AMW, Simon/Swinger, 3 Live Kru. I'd rather have multiple teams in a division with some of them being shit than having only three teams, with only one being more than "bland."

QUOTE

Illogical and pointless booking.

*****Really, where? Raven's chase. A Daniels title win, possibly. XXX reuniting. Punk/Dinero's turn. JJ showing Crips how a ego maniac should be played. Every week at least 1 great, great match. Gang feuds. D'lo getting a solid push.

 

Raven's chase has been the only consistent angle in TNA since Dutch took over. Daniels will probably not win the X-Division title, as it's PAINFULLY obvious that Sabin will get the belt. XXX will likely not reunite, at least not in full, and Elix seems as if he might have lost a step. Punk should have turned weeks ago, and Dinero turning makes very little sense. JJ the character is good, but as a wrestler he's on par with HHH, and has more backstage pull as he is the head booker. A "great, great match" is one that will almost unanimously be regarded as such, which has not happened since September (when the vast majority of the TNA fanbase creamed themselves for Sabin/Juvi). Gang feuds are only as good as the man booking the feuds, and Dutch has proven he has little sense when it comes to much else besides the main event. D'Lo just returned two shows ago after a nearly three month absence, and such cannot be considered a "solid push."

QUOTE

Really bad production values.

*****ah, no.

 

Then explain why the crowd seems to be moving, but no noise can be heard.

QUOTE

Shall I go on?

*****you really ahven't proven anything besides the fact you refuse to be happy.

 

And you haven't proven anything besides that you refuse to listen to logic.

QUOTE

TNA doesn't DO backstage skits and promos well --- so maybe, just maybe, THEY SHOULD AVOID THEM.

*****Hudson best backstage interviewer in the biz. On a level better than most sports side line or on field reporters. And Goldy was darn good before him.

 

Goldy sucked, but yes, Hudson is AMAZING as a backstage interviewer. The short promo with 3LK was humorous, and his natural delivery of every line (including the subtle shilling of the new calendar) made me smile. Doesn't make up for the fact that most of their backstage skits are rather crap.

QUOTE

This week, yes.

*****No, every week.

 

Every week is one decent match, one decent angle, and a load of crappy filler that makes me ashamed to be a TNA supporter.

QUOTE

An AMW title run is hardly something the world anxiously awaits.They are a boring tag team. The Dudley Boys without the table gimmick.

*****To you but not to the Nashville fans, believe me it all about the chase. They're doing it perfect with AMW.

 

When the Nashville fans, for the most part, do not pay to see the product live, but the at-home fans do, who should you really be worried about pleasing? By large, the at-home fans (again, mostly the IWC) are not happy with the fact that AMW are booked as the center of the tag division when they're painful to listen to on the mic and have not mastered basic tag team wrestling. So, explain to me how Dutch is doing it "perfect" with AMW when most of the fanbase does not want AMW to have the belts?

QUOTE

No offense but jeez most of all appreciate being able to see some of the best rasslers in the world every week in Lo-ki, Daniels, AJ and Sabin.

 

Ki has bouts of greatness, but usually resorts to the same spots. Fun worker, one of my favorites, but lacks a lot of substance.

Daniels, yes, is one of the best wrestlers in the world.

Styles has a long way to go to become one of the best in the world, and has "Kurt Angle Syndrome" (where the worker becomes limited due to their opponents' styles, and thus cannot advance their own abilities).

Sabin is not even in the top 50% of the best wrestlers in the world.

*****These were some awesome/not awesome points in this.

 

Again thank you for your time.

[Guest Dave O'Neill, Journalist]

A-Train botched a spot. He apologised, and everyone got on with their lives.

*****He's been a heat sucker since he started. Never been over, ever.

 

Unlike Teddy Hart, who nearly killed himself and several others in ROH a few months ago, and refuses to accept responsibility.

*****But everyone on the IWC knows him now, he's the focal pint of MLW.

 

As for Taker, he's 43, and will still be a better wrestler than Northcutt in ten years.

*****Northcutt's more athletic, he also trained Bob Sapp so that's all i need to appreciate his knowledge more than the tweener.

 

Hell, Genichiro Tenryu is 58, and could take Northcutt in seconds.

*****great.

 

1500 people in a barn in an unsafe are of Nashville.?? What crowds? It's the same people everyweek.

*****Lot more than last year when SEX started.

 

Evolve? By letting Jarrrett push them into a fucking trapeze act?????

*****No being the NWA workld champ at 23. What did you do at 23. Personally I covered the biggest catastrophy of this year. But that's me.

 

At least Benoit, Angle and Eddie can go to work knowing that their boss isn't gonna tell them to do something as stupid as Ultimate X.

*****How about feuding with the FBI or spraying shit on a giant. Think.

This is getting old, and I now appreciate what I put Slapnuts through.

 

*****He's been a heat sucker since he started. Never been over, ever.

 

-The X-Factor angle and subsequent IC Title run drew heat.

-The Hip-Hop Hippo was (admittedly shockingly) over. His heat sank when he turned senselessly.

 

*****But everyone on the IWC knows him now, he's the focal pint of MLW.

 

I think Steve Corino, the MLW Champ, and Terry Funk, his adversary, are the focal point of MLW

 

*****Northcutt's more athletic, he also trained Bob Sapp so that's all i need to appreciate his knowledge more than the tweener.

 

If Bob Sapp was trained by Northcutt, then I dread to see Northcutt. Sapp makes Nathan Jones look like Lou Thesz.

 

How about feuding with the FBI or spraying shit on a giant. Think.

 

Personally, If i was Benoit, I'd love to work with a great worker like Guido, or hel two rookies like Stamboli or Chucky P along. As for the shit spraying, I thought it was funny, and it helped advance an angle, deal with it

[Guest Dave O'Neill, Journalist]

Forget it, just his stupidity when it comes to quote tags

Edited December 19, 2003 by Dave O'Neill, Journalist

[Guest Man Of 1,004 Modes]

I have one thing to say to vicvenomjr....

 

Go fuck Yourself.

 

 

when Dave O'Neill becomes one of my favorite poster sin this thread, that means your really pissing me and everyone else off.

[Michrome 0]

I think its funny that you can brag about TNA's 1000 live fans when it's a FACT that 75% are comped nearly EVERY WEEK. It's a miracle anyone buys tickets with that comp rate.

 

The buyrates have not been going up at all lately either, not that facts matter, or anything.

[Guest MikeSC]

Northcutt is worse than Kane, Undertaker, Big Show, and Albert. So, what big guy IS he better than?

*****Better than all but Kane.

Albert, Taker, Kane, and Show have churned out more decent matches than Northcutt has WATCHED, much less participated in.

And Legend is mediocre. M-E-D-I-O-C-R-E.

*****not last night.

He was slightly less than that, you're correct.

Seeing as how the "average fan" clearly isn't WATCHING this product, you might want to listen to what the IWC is saying.

*****like I said if only the iwc watched they'd have 100 fans at most, instead of the up to 10,000 they have right now.

That's right, the internet isn't a fairly large entity. NOBODY has the internet. Nope, not a soul.

Then you're completely delusional.

*****While I appreciate smallish single rasslers, I like heavyweight tag teams.

And I think anybody who uses the term rassler is utterly delusional.

Except Jericho and Hardy.

*****Said Y2J and definately including Hardy. Hardy is a ll gimmick, nothing in the ring.

He's had more good matches than the VAST majority of the TNA roster.

The same kind of heat that translates to an inability to sell out the arena after a year and no real increase in PPV buys?

*****Both falsehoods I guarantee both increased.

What, they have SOLD OUT the arena? News to, well, EVERYBODY. And their buyrates tend to stay in a very small, consistent range. That range, of course, is about where WCW was at its nadir.

The only heat is the pen writing down figures in the debits column, while the pen writnig figures in the credits column is doodling right now.

******Which is fine, if the money is available. If they go to WGN and it pays off then all is great and the money spent is worth it. If not well, hey it provided many people with an outlet away from the WWE.

It doesn't work. They eventually will need to make a little money.

Sucked.

*****Both matches were very good. That's just my opinion.

Stress the phrase "Just your opinion".

Of course, you call them "rasslers", so how worthwhile your opinion is is already a debate in and of itself.

*****It's not a critical word, just an old fashioned term.

No, it's a friggin' moronic term.

A sub-par worker with limited heat burying everybody on the show (Jarrett).

*****The most recognizable heavyweight

That's more of a condemnation of TNA than anything else.

Titles being given to people with no real reason behind it and with MUCH better choices available (Shane).

******Simon and Swinger, 3LK, Styles. Great stroy's in regards to the chase.

Amazingly, only one of the ones mentioned HAVE titles -- and the title they hold is KILLING one of the members of the team.

A stale tag team division.

******A lot better than the Bashmans and Bautista and flair.

Actually, it's about as bad --- if not worse. WWE at least has a much improved La Resistance, Cade & Jindrak, Venis & Storm, WGTT, Spanky & London, and FBI.

Illogical and pointless booking.

*****Really, where?

And inch in front of your face.

Raven's chase. A Daniels title win, possibly.

Daniels' title win "possibly" is good booking? OK.

XXX reuniting.

Because bringing back gimmicks that didn't really draw is ALWAYS a great idea.

Punk/Dinero's turn. JJ showing Crips how a ego maniac should be played.

And he churns out matches about as poor in quality.

Every week at least 1 great, great match.

Really? I guess I missed all of those.

Gang feuds.

BWA HA HA HA

D'lo getting a solid push.

A match is a solid push?

Really bad production values.

*****ah, no.

Ah, yes. VERY much yes. Sub-ECW quality.

Shall I go on?

*****you really ahven't proven anything besides the fact you refuse to be happy.

Well, I did prove that you are delusional.

TNA doesn't DO backstage skits and promos well --- so maybe, just maybe, THEY SHOULD AVOID THEM.

*****Hudson best backstage interviewer in the biz.

BWA HA HA HA

On a level better than most sports side line or on field reporters.

You're killing me here.

And Goldy was darn good before him.

I won't comment on her earlier work, but lately, she just looks like a two-dollar whore with no real purpose whatsoever.

This week, yes.

*****No, every week.

You just refuse to be happy with RAW.

An AMW title run is hardly something the world anxiously awaits.They are a boring tag team. The Dudley Boys without the table gimmick.

*****To you but not to the Nashville fans, believe me it all about the chase. They're doing it perfect with AMW.

How 'bout this --- when they stop having to heavily paper their audience every single week --- you MIGHT have a case.

No offense but jeez most of all appreciate being able to see some of the best rasslers in the world every week in Lo-ki, Daniels, AJ and Sabin.

I like them just fine. But having to suffer through Shane, JJ, Red Shirt Security, Erik Watts' slaughtering the English language, anything involving Shane Douglas, etc. tend to HURT.

-=Mike

[Guest PowerPB13]

Quite frankly, let's face it...the state of nationally-televised wrestling sucks right now.

 

Maybe a new year's resolution is in order here...

 

-Patrick

[Guest vicvenomjr]

have one thing to say to vicvenomjr....

 

Go fuck Yourself.

 

 

when Dave O'Neill becomes one of my favorite poster sin this thread, that means your really pissing me and everyone else off.

*****Fellas, you guys are pathetic if your getting all riled up like this. I mean seriously review the posts I don't get mad, because it's a TNA message board. IT DOESN'T MATTER. If you don't like what I say don't respond, but don't show your age and your intelligence by trying to get an edge or seem like your with it by swearing. I'm 24, I haven't sworn in ages. Try to be as cool as me.

 

Watched SD!

So let's review the feuds.....

Cena v.BS (yawn)

Holly v. Lesnar (yawn)

APA v.Rhyno (yawn)

Benoit v.FBI (yawn)

Bashman v. whoever (yawn)

Morgan v. Moore (yawn)

VKM v. Cat (come on)

 

 

Or TNA which will give you an Ultimate X match soon, a solid Punk push, Raven continuing his quest, Simon and Swinger, a heel champ who sounds intelligent on the mic, Dlo as a maineventer, a legit top face in AJ, the best tag team in the world (AMW), great announcers, pie in the sky, Daniels, Low-Ki, Skypper, Sabin and Shane (whose performed better than HBK this year).

 

Come on get all angry now and show your hand.....

[Guest Man Of 1,004 Modes]

I'd rather take Jushin Liger & Random Partner any day over Americas Least Wanted tag champs.

 

 

I highly doubt anyone 24 has this kind of intelligence..or lack there of.

 

 

 

Posted on Dec 18 2003, 11:36 PM

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

have one thing to say to vicvenomjr....

 

Go fuck Yourself.

 

 

when Dave O'Neill becomes one of my favorite poster sin this thread, that means your really pissing me and everyone else off.

*****Fellas, you guys are pathetic if your getting all riled up like this. I mean seriously review the posts I don't get mad, because it's a TNA message board. IT DOESN'T MATTER. If you don't like what I say don't respond, but don't show your age and your intelligence by trying to get an edge or seem like your with it by swearing. I'm 24, I haven't sworn in ages. Try to be as cool as me.

 

Watched SD!

So let's review the feuds.....

Cena v.BS (yawn)

Holly v. Lesnar (yawn)

APA v.Rhyno (yawn)

Benoit v.FBI (yawn)

Bashman v. whoever (yawn)

Morgan v. Moore (yawn)

VKM v. Cat (come on)

 

 

TNA which will give you an Ultimate X match soon

 

Ultimate X 1 sucked more dick than a $10 hooker.

 

a solid Punk push,

 

HA! Theres no titles for him. World Title he won't even breath on, and X-Division isn't his style.

 

Raven continuing his quest

 

so does my quest to bang the hottest chick I know, doesn't make it special.

 

a heel champ who sounds intelligent on the mic

 

Mr. Hillbilly is INTELLIGENT? Color me surprised. He's basically done the same promo 20x over, just switching words around now and then. He doesn't look intimidating at all, and I could probably kick his ass. Brock Lesnar looks like a bad ass no one would want to mess with, so he's a better champ...barely.

 

Dlo as a maineventer

 

Since when!?

 

a legit top face in AJ

 

Thats why he's in the Tag Team scene again and Mantell makes him look like crap.

 

the best tag team in the world (AMW)

 

HA!

 

pie in the sky

 

What?

 

Daniels, Low-Ki, Skypper, Sabin and Shane (whose performed better than HBK this year).

 

Sadly, Low-Ki will be in Japan more than half a year, Michael Shane couldn't wrestle a *** match if his life depended on it, Chris Sabins been in a bad dry streak, and Daniels is jobbing to everyone.

 

And it's Elix SKIPPER. For someone 24, you really can't spell or use grammar well.

 

 

 

I admit, I'm not the best at using grammar, but ahem....

 

Act your age, not your ring size.

[Guest Man Of 1,004 Modes]

Fucking Site Error.

 

Double Post

[Michrome 0]

--Once again, the fact that Smackdown sucks doesn't mean TNA is good. There isn't some sort of inverse relationship between the two. TNA sucked, and Smackdown sucked WAY MORE.

 

--I don't want another Ultimate X circus match. The first one was fucking horrible, why must we be forced to endure another?

 

--A solid Punk push? BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA....I'll believe it when I see it. Knowing TNA, Don Callis will become his official spokesman and we'll never get a Punk promo.

 

--Calling AMW the best team in the world just completely destroys any credibility you have. Here is a list of U.S. indy tag teams that are better. THIS IS JUST US INDIES:

 

Dirty Rotten Scoundrels

Havana Pitbulls

Ballards

Simon and Swinger

Hell...Dlo and AJ, if they count

Daniels/Maff

Punk/Cabana

Punk/Dinero

New Church

Aerial Express

Thomasellis

Briscoe Brothers

Backseat Boys

Shelley/Jacobs

....that was off the top of my head in about a minute. I'm SURE there are some I'm missing. It's truly amazing that the best tag team in the world can't work a hot tag. What a sad day for wrestling.

 

--AJ Styles is a legit top face? Let's look at his build in TNA: Heel champ that can't win without Russo that loses as soon as he doesn't have Russo anymore. Holy shit, WHAT A LEGIT TOP FACE.

 

--Shane has performed better this year than HBK? Shane will never, EVER be able to pull off what Shawn did at Survivor Series. He will never, EVER have a great pure wrestling match like Shawn did at WM. His only good match was a complete London carry job.

[Guest Peter_Griffin]

I'm guessing I'm the only person that thought Ultimate X 1 was actually an okay match. There were fuck ups, but with that kind of match, it could be expected. I DO think TNA will be ready to pull the trigger on CM Punk sometime soon.

 

As for AMW being the top tag team in the world, that may be a true in a world were AMW are the only tag team in it.

 

Micheal Shane, don't even COMPARE him to HBK. HBK is about 80% of what he was before his injury I reckon, and that makes him about 16 times better than Micheal Shane. I will always say that Micheal Shane is good. I don't have too many problems with Micheal Shane, but he is not GREAT. HBK is.

[Guest MikeSC]

Watched SD!

So let's review the feuds.....

Cena v.BS (yawn)

Holly v. Lesnar (yawn)

APA v.Rhyno (yawn)

Benoit v.FBI (yawn)

Bashman v. whoever (yawn)

Morgan v. Moore (yawn)

VKM v. Cat (come on)

Cena v BS has potential. Morgan v Moore isn't a feud, hate to break it to you. Nor is Basham v --- and I quote here, whoever.

Or TNA which will give you an Ultimate X match soon

Joy. Same crap, more people.

a solid Punk push

A poorly booked heel turn is a "solid push"? Heck, I have a question --- if Punk and Dinero were going to turn on Raven --- WHY GO THROUGH A LONG MATCH OF GETTING HAMMERED ON? Why not just turn on him and have him lose quickly?

 

Illogical booking.

Raven continuing his quest

His quest?

Simon and Swinger

A decent tag team to be sure.

a heel champ who sounds intelligent on the mic

Who Jarrett? He sounds like an inbred yokel.

Dlo as a maineventer

Doesn't D-Lo need to actually BE in a main event?

a legit top face in AJ

A "legit top face" who has never beaten JJ clean?

the best tag team in the world (AMW),

You're still delusional.

great announcers, pie in the sky

You're insane --- and making less sense than usual.

, Daniels, Low-Ki, Skypper, Sabin and Shane (whose performed better than HBK this year).

Michael Shane has outperformed Shawn Michaels?

 

In what alternate universe has this occurred? Heck, I wasn't a big fan of the RAW SSeries match --- but Shawn's work in that match ALONE trumps anything I've ever seen out of Shane.

Come on get all angry now and show your hand.....

For a troll? I don't think so.

-=Mike

[Guest Max Peter David]

To whoever the nimrod was that said Michael Shane out performed Shawn Michaels, and that AMW is the "Best Team in the World" please shut up, and stop making an ass out of yourself. Haas and Benjamin smoke AMW anyday of the week, and Michael Shane > Shawn Michaels? Have you seen Survivor Series? Wrestlemania? The carry job at Armageddon? Now look back on Shane's shitty resthold marathons in the X-Division.

[Guest vicvenomjr]

To whoever the nimrod was that said Michael Shane out performed Shawn Michaels, and that AMW is the "Best Team in the World" please shut up, and stop making an ass out of yourself.

*****Shane was the champ for half a year and in doing so consistently looked strong and always had good matches as well as continuously improved on the mic. What did HBK do this year? He was an attraction, not an everyday wrestler. Shane had the better year because he evolved, while HBK was made out to be portrayed as an old timer. Shane got the job done week in week out, when HBK, until recently, had a month between matches. HBK wasn't in any really great matches (outside of Y2J), while Shane was in at least a 3 star match every week.

 

If Hass/Benjamin are so good why are they getting buried and have no real role on SD! until recently. They are zero on the mic, while AMW constantly improves in that area. AMW is constantly praised by the rest of the IWC as the top tag team in N. America (Martin's column today). But besides that every week, AMW is in a title or top tag match of the night. Every week they compete and every week there match is very good. Couldn't say the same about Haas/Benjamin as of late.

 

Haas and Benjamin smoke AMW anyday of the week, and Michael Shane > Shawn Michaels? Have you seen Survivor Series? Wrestlemania? The carry job at Armageddon? Now look back on Shane's shitty resthold marathons in the X-Division

*****The Bautista match was not good, the Orton match was fair and the Y2J match was great. Shane every week puts in a solid performance, he's not scattered.

[Guest vicvenomjr]

Ultimate X 1 sucked more dick than a $10 hooker.

*****then why was it praised by everyone on the net from SK to Meltzer

 

HA! Theres no titles for him. World Title he won't even breath on, and X-Division isn't his style.

*****doesn't have to be he'll get over just in his upcoming feud.

 

so does my quest to bang the hottest chick I know, doesn't make it special.

*****typical response, it makes for good TV and when he wins it will be worth it.

 

Mr. Hillbilly is INTELLIGENT? Color me surprised. He's basically done the same promo 20x over, just switching words around now and then. He doesn't look intimidating at all, and I could probably kick his ass. Brock Lesnar looks like a bad ass no one would want to mess with, so he's a better champ...barely.

*****better than Brock and Crips, who give the same tough guy recitalt hat was used by every rassler in the past 5 decades.

 

Since when!?

*****since he's being used as one of their top guys.

 

Thats why he's in the Tag Team scene again and Mantell makes him look like crap.

*****one week, doesn't he always win.

 

QUOTE

pie in the sky

*****better than the ripped and the shredded

 

Sadly, Low-Ki will be in Japan more than half a year,

*****is he there now?

 

Michael Shane couldn't wrestle a *** match if his life depended on it,

*****he basically only does it every week

 

Chris Sabins been in a bad dry streak,

*****ah no

 

and Daniels is jobbing to everyone.

*****looks strong still and will win the X title

 

And it's Elix SKIPPER. For someone 24, you really can't spell or use grammar well.

*****does it matter.

 

 

I admit, I'm not the best at using grammar, but ahem....

 

Act your age, not your ring size.

*****cute....next

[Guest vicvenomjr]

I'm guessing I'm the only person that thought Ultimate X 1 was actually an okay match.

*****it was evolution at its finest

 

There were fuck ups, but with that kind of match, it could be expected. I DO think TNA will be ready to pull the trigger on CM Punk sometime soon.

 

As for AMW being the top tag team in the world, that may be a true in a world were AMW are the only tag team in it.

****that's why they won pwtorch tag team of the year awrad last year, Apter's this year and was second in Martin's released today. But there all idiots anyway.

 

Micheal Shane, don't even COMPARE him to HBK. HBK is about 80% of what he was before his injury I reckon, and that makes him about 16 times better than Micheal Shane. I will always say that Micheal Shane is good. I don't have too many problems with Micheal Shane, but he is not GREAT. HBK is.

*****HBK five years ago, yes. HBK now is very overrated. Keep in mind his best match back was with Y2J, who made Hogan look good.

[Guest MikeSC]

To whoever the nimrod was that said Michael Shane out performed Shawn Michaels, and that AMW is the "Best Team in the World" please shut up, and stop making an ass out of yourself.

*****Shane was the champ for half a year and in doing so consistently looked strong and always had good matches as well as continuously improved on the mic.

He "always" had good matches? Care to name ... ANY?

 

And "continuously improving"?

 

Well, when a team is down by 70 points, there really is no way to go but up.

What did HBK do this year? He was an attraction, not an everyday wrestler.

Worked more matches than Michael, most likely. And better ones, to boot.

Shane had the better year because he evolved, while HBK was made out to be portrayed as an old timer. Shane got the job done week in week out, when HBK, until recently, had a month between matches. HBK wasn't in any really great matches (outside of Y2J), while Shane was in at least a 3 star match every week.

HBK v Jericho schools anything Shane did. HBK v Orton was better than anything Shane did. Heck, HBK v Batista blows Shane's work out of the water.

 

I can't name a 3 star shane match.

If Hass/Benjamin are so good why are they getting buried and have no real role on SD! until recently. They are zero on the mic, while AMW constantly improves in that area.

Well, Benjamin did have an injury for a while there. And while both teams are weak on the mic, WGTT have the goods in the ring to make up for it.

AMW is constantly praised by the rest of the IWC as the top tag team in N. America (Martin's column today).

Who the heck is Martin?

But besides that every week, AMW is in a title or top tag match of the night. Every week they compete and every week there match is very good. Couldn't say the same about Haas/Benjamin as of late.

You can't say that about AMW, either.

Haas and Benjamin smoke AMW anyday of the week, and Michael Shane >

Shawn Michaels? Have you seen Survivor Series? Wrestlemania? The carry job at Armageddon? Now look back on Shane's shitty resthold marathons in the X-Division

*****The Bautista match was not good, the Orton match was fair and the Y2J match was great. Shane every week puts in a solid performance, he's not scattered.

He needs better work to be "scattered".

-=Mike

[OldSchoolWrestling 0]

Who the heck is Martin?

[Michrome 0]

Todd Martin's column has been ridiculed all over the net. Guerrera vs. Sabin is the third best match this year? Maybe the third best match that month, if you're being generous.

 

Once again, AMW CAN'T WORK A HOT TAG, THEY SUCK. My brother and I could work a better hot tag than these clowns.

 

Michael Shane has worked a three star match every week if your star system starts at 4.

[Guest Peter_Griffin]

Pick a Micheal Shane performance better than the HBK one at Survivor Series.

[Guest Man Of 1,004 Modes]

AMW suck at working the crowd, especially with hot tags.

 

 

Some team needs to watch a few tapes of Rock N' Roll Express from the 80's before they became crap. Best. Hot Tags. Ever.

 

 

They are sub-par wrestlers, which makes Randy Orton ahead of them on my favorite worker lists.

 

 

They can't cut a promo outside the Hillbilly redneck style. Making them look even worse. Atleast A.J Styles can work good matches and have a bad accent, while these guys suck.

 

They haven't had a *** match since maybe earlier this yer where they weren't given a carry job. (Cage match vs. Daniels/Skipper. Lord knows Daniels carried most of that match, and Skipper is better than both of them too).

 

The crowd seemingly couldn't care less about their matches, and their Quest to win the tag titles for the 4,045,594,490th time.

[Guest The Last Free Voice]

The crowd seemingly couldn't care less about their matches, and their Quest to win the tag titles for the 4,045,594,490th time.

 

I'm sorry, but to me AMW seem to be two of the most over guys there. It's most likely the redneck marks who cheer them, but that's most of TNA's live crowd anyways, so I really can't see your point here. I think their matches are bland recently, but not bad, just uninovative.

[Guest Man Of 1,004 Modes]

The crowd seemingly couldn't care less about their matches, and their Quest to win the tag titles for the 4,045,594,490th time.

 

I'm sorry, but to me AMW seem to be two of the most over guys there. It's most likely the redneck marks who cheer them, but that's most of TNA's live crowd anyways, so I really can't see your point here. I think their matches are bland recently, but not bad, just uninovative.

I guess the random few hillbillies who chant chill the cowboy (Which one it is) kills the fact only hillbillies like them. LOL

 

 

I use to think they were good, but after their feud with the Dicyples (Slash/Brian Lee), they just haven't done anything worthy of being called the best team in the world.

[Guest The Last Free Voice]

so u didn't like their feud with XXX or their matches with SImon and Swinger?