Guest Man Of 1,004 Modes Report post Posted March 2, 2004 Ew..Main Event is ***, HHH/Angle is disapointing, Cage Match is pretty good, and everything else is Bad-Decent. Plus RAVEN RETURNED! Err, you know that buyrates are not reflective of the actual quality of the finished event, right? HHH-Angle was built like a mother, disappointing end aside I know, but when you actually look at how good the show was overall, it wasn't in anyway great. HHH/Angle was the only feud I was looking forward to ending, and E&C/Hardyz to an extent. Main Event was booked horribly, because 4 ways suck. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chaosrage 0 Report post Posted March 2, 2004 It should be noted that of the ten worst buyrates ever, Shawn Michaels main evented half of them. The guy really couldn't draw at all. Hmmm at least next time some idiots say "HBK drew like a Mo fo for WWE", I have proof he's even WORSE of a draw than Diesel, who only Main Evented 1 of the 10. Plz look up WM14's buyrate and then tell me how much HBK can't draw. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Slayer 0 Report post Posted March 2, 2004 It should be noted that of the ten worst buyrates ever, Shawn Michaels main evented half of them. The guy really couldn't draw at all. Hmmm at least next time some idiots say "HBK drew like a Mo fo for WWE", I have proof he's even WORSE of a draw than Diesel, who only Main Evented 1 of the 10. Plz look up WM14's buyrate and then tell me how much HBK can't draw. Who was on the other side of that ME? Yeah, exactly Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kahran Ramsus 0 Report post Posted March 2, 2004 It should be noted that of the ten worst buyrates ever, Shawn Michaels main evented half of them. The guy really couldn't draw at all. Hmmm at least next time some idiots say "HBK drew like a Mo fo for WWE", I have proof he's even WORSE of a draw than Diesel, who only Main Evented 1 of the 10. Plz look up WM14's buyrate and then tell me how much HBK can't draw. Austin would have drawn that if he was fighting the Brooklyn Brawler in the main event. Two people involved in the main event drew that buyrate, and neither was the champion. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chaosrage 0 Report post Posted March 2, 2004 It should be noted that of the ten worst buyrates ever, Shawn Michaels main evented half of them. The guy really couldn't draw at all. Hmmm at least next time some idiots say "HBK drew like a Mo fo for WWE", I have proof he's even WORSE of a draw than Diesel, who only Main Evented 1 of the 10. Plz look up WM14's buyrate and then tell me how much HBK can't draw. Who was on the other side of that ME? Yeah, exactly Who was on the other side with Shawn in 96? Yeah, exactly. I love the bias around here. Also HBK vs Diesel got a better buyrate in April 96 than Stone Cold vs Dude Love at Over the Edge. Oh shit. That must mean they're bigger draws. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Slayer 0 Report post Posted March 2, 2004 Who was on the other side with Shawn in 96? Yeah, exactly. So Shawn is only as good a draw as who he's facing? That only strengthens my argument I love the bias around here. Not biased, just pointing out who he was facing at WMXIV. Austin was mega-over by this point and his solid draw status was firmly in place And like Hakran said, that's not even counting the other guy Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest BionicRedneck Report post Posted March 2, 2004 So, Shawn's ONE great buy-rate had the WrestleMania name, Steve Austin (one of the biggest draws ever) and Mike Tyson (one of the biggest draws in sport) to sell it? Wow...Shawn MUST be a great draw. Except of course, that he helped draw 5 of the top 10 worst PPV buy-rates in company history. The lowest buy-rate in SummerSlam history. The lowest buy-rate in Royal Rumble history (and couldn't even draw a sell-out crowd in his hometown). The lowest buy-rate in WrestleMania history (until Sid-Taker broke it a year later). And many crappy, horrible buy-rates elsewhere. P.S, And (I think) the lowest buy-rate in a few years when he was in the main event of Armegeddon (right?). Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Anglesault Report post Posted March 2, 2004 (edited) P.S, And (I think) the lowest buy-rate in a few years when he was in the main event of Armegeddon (right?). yeah, it had the worst buyrate since DX (Another Shawn show) or something like that. Edited March 2, 2004 by Anglesault Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chaosrage 0 Report post Posted March 2, 2004 So Shawn is only as good a draw as who he's facing? That only strengthens my argument. .....The same thing goes for every single wrestler. Tell me, why do you think Austin got a .5 buyrate or whatever against Foley in the middle of his mega-over title run? Austin was mega-over by this point and his solid draw status was firmly in place And Shawn was all by himself fighting midcarders every month. Either being in the main event is the only thing that matters, or it isn't and you have to look at who they're facing, the rest of the card, interest in the company, etc. You can't give Shawn no credit for WM14 and then turn around and put all the blame on Shawn in 96. That doesn't make any sense. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JoeDirt 0 Report post Posted March 3, 2004 So Shawn is only as good a draw as who he's facing? That only strengthens my argument. .....The same thing goes for every single wrestler. Tell me, why do you think Austin got a .5 buyrate or whatever against Foley in the middle of his mega-over title run? Austin was mega-over by this point and his solid draw status was firmly in place And Shawn was all by himself fighting midcarders every month. Either being in the main event is the only thing that matters, or it isn't and you have to look at who they're facing, the rest of the card, interest in the company, etc. You can't give Shawn no credit for WM14 and then turn around and put all the blame on Shawn in 96. That doesn't make any sense. I was wondering why Over the Edge 98 got such a bad buyrate, too. I guess because the Austin/Mcmahon angle was the only drawing point. But keep in mind that that's only one PPV in Austin's whole big babyface run...and all the rest did good => great. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Man Of 1,004 Modes Report post Posted March 3, 2004 The buildup for OTE 98 sucked ass. Austin/Dude wasn't even booked good besides evil McMahon as ref. Faarooq/Rock no one wanted. Vader/Kane? HA! In a MASK v. MASK match?! Double Ha! DX/NOD feud still sucking strong... Mike Tyson & Steve Austin sold WM XIV, not cripple-HBK. SSeries 96....BRET HARTS IN RING RETURN VS STONE COLD. Nuff Said. April 1996...thats a mystery. I ordered to see...(gulp) Ultimate Warrior. Damn I was a dumbass 11 year old. WWE's great 2000-2001 buyrates were SHOCKINGLY HBK-less. WWE's WORST 1995-97 buyrates...FEATURED HBK. I smell a pattern. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JoeDirt 0 Report post Posted March 3, 2004 The buildup for OTE 98 sucked ass. Austin/Dude wasn't even booked good besides evil McMahon as ref. Faarooq/Rock no one wanted. Vader/Kane? HA! In a MASK v. MASK match?! Double Ha! DX/NOD feud still sucking strong... Mike Tyson & Steve Austin sold WM XIV, not cripple-HBK. SSeries 96....BRET HARTS IN RING RETURN VS STONE COLD. Nuff Said. April 1996...thats a mystery. I ordered to see...(gulp) Ultimate Warrior. Damn I was a dumbass 11 year old. WWE's great 2000-2001 buyrates were SHOCKINGLY HBK-less. WWE's WORST 1995-97 buyrates...FEATURED HBK. I smell a pattern. Good points. Sure, it's not all HBK's fault that the WWF had shitty buyrates at that time...but he didn't prove that he alone could sell PPV buys. So this brings up a question: Besides Hogan, Austin, and Rock...who else in WWF history has been a major PPV draw? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Man Of 1,004 Modes Report post Posted March 3, 2004 The buildup for OTE 98 sucked ass. Austin/Dude wasn't even booked good besides evil McMahon as ref. Faarooq/Rock no one wanted. Vader/Kane? HA! In a MASK v. MASK match?! Double Ha! DX/NOD feud still sucking strong... Mike Tyson & Steve Austin sold WM XIV, not cripple-HBK. SSeries 96....BRET HARTS IN RING RETURN VS STONE COLD. Nuff Said. April 1996...thats a mystery. I ordered to see...(gulp) Ultimate Warrior. Damn I was a dumbass 11 year old. WWE's great 2000-2001 buyrates were SHOCKINGLY HBK-less. WWE's WORST 1995-97 buyrates...FEATURED HBK. I smell a pattern. Good points. Sure, it's not all HBK's fault that the WWF had shitty buyrates at that time...but he didn't prove that he alone could sell PPV buys. So this brings up a question: Besides Hogan, Austin, and Rock...who else in WWF history has been a major PPV draw? I honeslty can't think of anyone... Maybe Ric Flair but he was only around 18 months, but he sold out arenas for NWA even when he fought non-contenders like Jimmy Garvin and Road Warrior Hawk. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kahran Ramsus 0 Report post Posted March 3, 2004 Bret Hart was a reasonably good draw during the dark ages. Certainly not as good as the big 3, but his PPVs from 1994-1996 (with the exception of Dec IYH 1995) easily outdrew the ones headed by Diesel or Shawn Michaels. Randy Savage drew really good gates from 1986-1989, but he never headed a PPV without Hogan. It is reasonable to assume that based on his other numbers, that he could have, but it was a different era. As far as top draws of the post-Hulkmania era go, Savage was probably #4. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chaosrage 0 Report post Posted March 3, 2004 I was wondering why Over the Edge 98 got such a bad buyrate, too. I guess because the Austin/Mcmahon angle was the only drawing point. But keep in mind that that's only one PPV in Austin's whole big babyface run...and all the rest did good => great. Foley wasn't much of a draw in the middle of 98. But keep in mind that that's only one PPV in Austin's whole big babyface run...and all the rest did good => great. No Way Out sucked too. But look, we all know he had a better run than Shawn. I'm not saying Shawn was a better draw than Austin. I'm saying the idea that even Austin could fight anybody and get a huge buyrate from it is plain bullshit. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chaosrage 0 Report post Posted March 3, 2004 The buildup for OTE 98 sucked ass. Austin/Dude wasn't even booked good besides evil McMahon as ref. Faarooq/Rock no one wanted. Vader/Kane? HA! In a MASK v. MASK match?! Double Ha! DX/NOD feud still sucking strong... Which is my point...... Mike Tyson & Steve Austin sold WM XIV, not cripple-HBK. All 3 sold WM XIV. WWE's great 2000-2001 buyrates were SHOCKINGLY HBK-less. WWE's WORST 1995-97 buyrates...FEATURED HBK. I smell a pattern. When I read this, I almost fell out of my chair laughing. Do you really think buyrates in 2000 being better than 96 had something to do with HBK not being there? I mean, were you watching in 2000? Or was that some kind of joke? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chaosrage 0 Report post Posted March 3, 2004 Bret Hart was a reasonably good draw during the dark ages. Certainly not as good as the big 3, but his PPVs from 1994-1996 (with the exception of Dec IYH 1995) easily outdrew the ones headed by Diesel or Shawn Michaels. Yeah, Bret was such a good draw he got the two worst buyrates EVER. But it IS bret hart, nm. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
iliketurtles 0 Report post Posted March 3, 2004 I can't help but laugh when I see how HBK seems to be main eventing - upper mid card on ALL OF THESE SHOWS. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Man Of 1,004 Modes Report post Posted March 4, 2004 Uh-Oh. Time to bash HHH for drawing in 2000-2001 as the only top heel in the company because HBK can't draw dick. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest J0bber Report post Posted March 4, 2004 I believe the worst wrestling pay per view buyrate ever was (correct me if I'm wrong) WCW Superbrawl 2000, which drew a 0.10 buyrate. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Man Of 1,004 Modes Report post Posted March 4, 2004 I believe the worst wrestling pay per view buyrate ever was (correct me if I'm wrong) WCW Superbrawl 2000, which drew a 0.10 buyrate. I'm pretty sure 2 or 3 WCW PPV's in 2000-01 drew 0.10 or 0.11, which is beyond horrible. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chaosrage 0 Report post Posted March 4, 2004 Here's the next 10 for wwf shows, the .5's. 2/97 - Final Four - Bret vs Taker vs Vader vs Austin .5 4/97 - Revenge of the Taker - Undertaker vs Mankind, Austin vs Bret .5 6/97 - King of the Ring97 - Undertaker vs Farooq, Austin vs Shawn .5 10/03 - No Mercy03 - Brock Lesnar vs Undertaker .5 12/02 - Armageddon02 - Triple H vs Shawn .5 2/98 - No Way Out98 .- Austin, Foley, Funk, & Owen vs HHH, NAO, and Savio Vega .52 11/95 - Survivor Series95 - Diesel vs Bret .57 5/97 - Cold Day in Hell - Austin vs Undertaker .57 8/96 - Summerslam96 - Shawn vs Vader .58 5/98 - Over the Edge98 - Austin vs Foley .58 OMG Austin is in 6 of the 10! Hilarious! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chaosrage 0 Report post Posted March 4, 2004 Uh-Oh. Time to bash HHH for drawing in 2000-2001 as the only top heel in the company because HBK can't draw dick. What? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JoeDirt 0 Report post Posted March 4, 2004 Here's the next 10 for wwf shows, the .5's. 2/97 - Final Four - Bret vs Taker vs Vader vs Austin .5 4/97 - Revenge of the Taker - Undertaker vs Mankind, Austin vs Bret .5 6/97 - King of the Ring97 - Undertaker vs Farooq, Austin vs Shawn .5 10/03 - No Mercy03 - Brock Lesnar vs Undertaker .5 12/02 - Armageddon02 - Triple H vs Shawn .5 2/98 - No Way Out98 .- Austin, Foley, Funk, & Owen vs HHH, NAO, and Savio Vega .52 11/95 - Survivor Series95 - Diesel vs Bret .57 5/97 - Cold Day in Hell - Austin vs Undertaker .57 8/96 - Summerslam96 - Shawn vs Vader .58 5/98 - Over the Edge98 - Austin vs Foley .58 OMG Austin is in 6 of the 10! Hilarious! True - but only one of them is post Wrestlemania 14. And No Way Out in February may be one of the worst hyped PPVs in history. When Austin had the title and was the man, he drew...maybe it wasn't all him, maybe he just was champ when the fed took off and was hot, and HBK was champ during a shitty booking time. But when Austin won that title, the buyrates went up. Simple as that. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chaosrage 0 Report post Posted March 4, 2004 True - but only one of them is post Wrestlemania 14. And No Way Out in February may be one of the worst hyped PPVs in history. When Austin had the title and was the man, he drew...maybe it wasn't all him, maybe he just was champ when the fed took off and was hot, and HBK was champ during a shitty booking time. But when Austin won that title, the buyrates went up. Simple as that. Yep. Also WWF was getting a lot of exposure at that point with Montreal, Tyson, and the whole Attitude Era taking off. Plenty of people just tuned in to see what everybody was talking about. Then they saw something they thought was cool and got hooked on it. That's what happened with me. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Ray Report post Posted March 4, 2004 Shawn marks are so funny....always trying to convince the world that their hero wasn't a shitty draw. Trying to credit Shawn for the Mania 14 buyrate is laughable. So, Shawn's ONE great buy-rate had the WrestleMania name, Steve Austin (one of the biggest draws ever) and Mike Tyson (one of the biggest draws in sport) to sell it? Wow...Shawn MUST be a great draw. Amen for this post ^. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kahran Ramsus 0 Report post Posted March 4, 2004 Bret Hart's main events. Both Bret & HBK were main eventing at basically the same time so they are a fair comparison. Bringing Austin in isn't. I'm sure he would crush them both anyways. Summerslam 1992 - 1.5 Survivor Series 1992 - 1.4 Royal Rumble 1993 - 1.25 Wrestlemania IX - 2.0 Wrestlemania X - 1.68 King of the Ring 1994 - 0.85 Summerslam 1994 - 1.3 Survivor Series 1994 - 0.9 Royal Rumble 1995 - 1.0 Survivor Series 1995 - 0.57 (Boy Diesel sure did a lot in that year he had the belt.) In Your House 5 - 0.3 Royal Rumble 1996 - 1.1 In Your House 6 - 0.77 (Notice how Bret has brought the buyrates back up.) Wrestlemania XII - 1.2 It's Time - 0.35 Final Four - 0.5 Summerslam 1997 - 0.8 Survivor Series 1997 - 0.89 AVG BUYRATE: 1.02 MEDIAN BUYRATE: 1.1 Shawn Michaels Survivor Series 1992 - 1.5 Wrestlemania XI - 1.3 In Your House 3 - 0.7 Wrestlemania XII - 1.2 GFBE - 0.65 Beware of Dog - 0.45 King of the Ring 1996 - 0.6 International Incident - 0.37 Summerslam - 0.58 (Worst Summerslam ever. Diesel/Mabel did better.) Mind Games - 0.48 Survivor Series 1996 - 1.3 (The 0.58 number given by prowrestlinghistory.com seems more likely, but I'll give Shawn the benefit of a doubt.) Royal Rumble 1997 - 0.7 Ground Zero - 0.45 Badd Blood - 0.6 Survivor Series 1997 - 0.89 D-Generation X - 0.44 Royal Rumble 1998 - 0.97 Wrestlemania XIV - 2.3 Survivor Series 2002 - 0.86 Armageddon 2002 - 0.87 Summerslam 2003 - 0.94 AVG BUYRATE (SS 96 = 1.3): 0.825 AVG BUYRATE (SS 96 = 0.58): 0.79 MEDIAN BUYRATE: 0.7 Either way he is significantly lower than Bret Hart. Plus Shawn's good buyrates can be explained more easily for the most part, especially Royal Rumble 1998 & Wrestlemania XIV where the real draws were Austin/Tyson (compare them to DX in Dec 1997, where it was basically Shawn's show) and Summerslam 2003 where he was not an integral part of a multi-man match (HHH/Goldberg was the issue). Using the medians, which are probably better for skewered data sets such as this Bret Hart outdrew Shawn Michaels by about 64%. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Slayer 0 Report post Posted March 4, 2004 Way to put that math degree to good use Kahran Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Caliban 0 Report post Posted March 4, 2004 A Power Slam magazine I have from 1997 lists the Survivor Series buyrate for 1996 as 0.58... they didn't have a hope in hell of doing a 1.3 in 1996 even with Bret's return... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chaosrage 0 Report post Posted March 4, 2004 Trying to credit Shawn for the Mania 14 buyrate is laughable. It's laughable to credit any one guy for a buyrate, that's the whole point. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
