Confused and afraid

[Guest The Masked Yodeler]

I used to read comics really heavily, but I stopped around 1996, when I was around 14.  The last saga I was into heavily was the Age of Apocolypse, and I stopped all together about the time of the Onslaught saga.  I stopped due to many reasons, but mostly because the only places in my tiny home town that sold comics stopped selling them, as well as comic prices going up with no corresponding increase in my funds.

 

Fast forward to now:  For the last couple of years, things would trigger my interest in super-heroes (X-Men: the Movie, a Superman themed short film I shot with some friends, Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back, and most recently, the upcoming super hero games, Freedom Force and City of Heroes, as well as Spiderman: The Movie) and I would decide to get back into comics, but never really did.

 

I've got some leads on stuff to buy, (some tpb's, the new Superman stuff, Muties), but I have some questions on where some books went.

 

Could somebody explain what happened with Marvel Comics?  Right as I was leaving comics, The Fantastic Four and The Avengers related books were restarted and put in a new universe due to Onslaught, as well as the darker superheroes (Punisher, Dardevil).  But now I come back, and there are a bunch of new X-Men and Spiderman comics, and the old ones aren't there.  

 

Why were "Spiderman" "Spectacular Spiderman" "Sensational Spiderman" and "The Web of Spiderman" canned and replaced with "Peter Parker" and "The Tangeled Web", with only "Amazing" still around.

 

Why were "X-Men", "X-Factor", "Generation-X", "X-Man" and "Excalibur" canned, with only "Uncanny", "X-Force", "Wolverine", and "Cable" kept and "X-Treme X-Men", and "The New X-Men" added.

 

I know I sound lost, but I am.  I mostly read Spiderman and X-Men stuff, and all the changes made me confused and afraid.

[Guest Judas14]

Why were "Spiderman" "Spectacular Spiderman" "Sensational Spiderman" and "The Web of Spiderman" canned and replaced with "Peter Parker" and "The Tangeled Web", with only "Amazing" still around.

 

Web of Spiderman was cancelled do to low sales in 1995 and replaced with Sensational Spiderman (which was to be written by Dan Jurgans). In 1998 Marvel cancelled Sensational and Spectacular Spiderman as part of an attempt to streamline the Spiderman books and Amazing and PP:SM rebooted with all new #1s. Amazing survived the cut because it was the flagship book and PP:SM survived because it was Howard Mackie's Spiderman book.

 

Along with the rebooted ASM and PP:SM, Marvel launched a third Spiderman title called Webspinners. Webspinners was an anthology series that told various "secret tales" of Spiderman set throughout the character's history with a revolving door of writers writing the book. The book didn't catch on and did horribly in saleswise and was cancelled. A bunch of the stories that were planned for the series before it's cancellation (such as the Return of the Green Goblin, Lifeline and the Mysterio Manifesto) ended up getting released in mini-series formats and did well enough saleswise ironically that Marvel decided to try again. Tangled Web, like Webspinners was an anthology series written by a revolving door of writers and artists but set in the present day Marvel Universe.

 

Why were "X-Men", "X-Factor", "Generation-X", "X-Man" and "Excalibur" canned, with only "Uncanny", "X-Force", "Wolverine", and "Cable" kept and "X-Treme X-Men", and "The New X-Men" added.

 

New X-Men and adjectiveless X-Men are the same book. The name was changed because Marvel wanted to distance the book from it's past when Grant Morrison was hired to write the book. X-Factor was cancelled to make way for the abortion that was Mutant X, Excalibur was cancelled so as to bring Shadowcat, Colossus, and Nightcrawler back into the X-Men, X-Man was cancelled by lack of interest, Generation X was cancelled as part of the "quote unquote" scaling back of the X-Men line, and Xtreme X-Men was launched by JQ to get Chris Claremont off the core X-Men books and to keep the money coming in from fans who migh be offended by Joe Casey and Grant Morrison's revamps of UXM and New X-Men....

[Guest areacode212]

let me just add that Tangled Web doesn't really focus on Spider-Man himself, but more on the everyday people who are affected by his actions. It takes place in the present, but it has nothing to do with what's going on in the other titles. So, if you're concerned about having to collect Tangled so you can follow what's going on, don't worry, it can be safely ignored.

 

That said, it might be worth picking up because you get to read Spider-Man stories by writers who don't usually write Spidey, like Peter Milligan, Greg Rucka, Peter Bagge, etc.

[Guest The Masked Yodeler]

Thanks a ton guys.  Could you tell me a little bit about the quality of the current books?  How are the various Spidy, X-Men and Supes books?  The new story arc with Luthor know Supes secret identity sounds pretty cool, but how's the overall quality?  Also, how's the Punisher doing these days?  He was one of my faves back in the 4-5th grades.

[Guest areacode212]

It's too bad the Comic Book folder on the old board has been wiped out cause it had some decent responses from when Mighty Damaramu came over & asked something similar.

 

I don't read the Superman titles (but I'll be keeping an eye on them for the Luthor stuff), nor most of the Spidey titles. I buy Tangled Web because I like some of the writers/artists who work on it. Supposedly, a lot of people really enjoyed the latest issue of Amazing, with a few reviewers giving it "Best of the Week" honors, which, in a week that also saw excellent issues of X-Force, Stray Bullets, and Alias, is pretty fucking high praise. I may pick it up the next time I hit the comic shop.

 

Which reminds me, I never got around to doing those reviews...

 

Anyway, as I often like to say when people ask these questions, you should try looking through some recent TPBs. These days, Marvel & DC are generally pretty good about releasing TPBs that cover newly-finished story arcs, to make it easier for people to catch up on what they've missed. Also, try looking through the Ultimate books. Some people love 'em, others don't...If you didn't know, they're basically a new universe where they're restarted Spider-Man and the X-Men from scratch.

[Guest Judas14]

Thanks a ton guys.  Could you tell me a little bit about the quality of the current books?  How are the various Spidy, X-Men and Supes books?  The new story arc with Luthor know Supes secret identity sounds pretty cool, but how's the overall quality?  Also, how's the Punisher doing these days?  He was one of my faves back in the 4-5th grades.

The Superman books are so-so but are such a clusterfuck continuitywise that jumping into the book at the moment is not a good idea. Basically you still have to read four books in order to understand what's going on PLUS the past two and a half years worth of storylines (like Emperor Joker, Our World At War, the Brainiac 13 arc, and Luthor the President arcs) in order to get your footing. The only redeeming factor for the book is that Kelly and Loeb are actually moving the book forward despite heavy handed doses of regression the book has endured during their tenure.....

 

Spiderman books have FINALLY started to get better: Paul Jenkins has gotten his book PP:SM declared the franchise book and has arcs lined up dealing with the return of Dr Octopus, Green Goblin, and Mary Jane coming up while JMS has finally started producing quality work in the form of his "Aunt May finally learns Peter's secret ID" arc that has just started in the book.

 

As for X-Men: New X-Men and X-Force are the best books out there. Wolverine and Uncanny X-Men are acquired tastes and Xtreme X-Men is a headache and a half to read. Don't know about Cable, but I've read that the character is now a freelance mercenary type character fighting warlords in Central America and Bosnia...

 

As for Punisher, it's great though if you like the old angst ridden Punisher you're out of luck since the current book features Frank as a pure psychopath who just happens to kill criminals and doesn't think twice about his dead family. Just don't buy Punisher #8, a horrible fill-in issue that has Frank hijacking a time machine in order to kill Al Capone...

[Guest areacode212]

Yeah, pick up the "Welcome Back, Frank" Punisher TPB, and the first 6 issues of the current series. For the most part, it's typical Ennis humor/violence (without the heart of Hitman), but it's good, easily-digestible entertainment.

 

That fill-in issue is horrible. I read it in the store and nearly put it down several times because it was so ridiculous, but I just couldn't (and so I got to read the "it was just a dream" ending). It was like a car wreck.

[Guest Sassquatch]

Spider-Man:  Get Amzaing Spider-Man.  It is the best Spidey title out of the bunch.  And you can come on right now, because there is a new story starting up and will be easy to follow.  The other titles are "eh" when compared to Amazing.  Peter Parker is okay but nothing you should go out of your way to buy.

 

X-Men:  The only title out of the whole X-Men series that you should buy is New X-Men.  Uncanny has too much baggage and has been pretty bad over the last year.  X-Treme X-Men is something that I would skip.  Chris Claremont has lost a few steps and it shows.  X-Force is a pretty good book.  You can pretty much come on whenever you want.  No continuity to worry about (yet).

 

Superman: This is something you'll have to see for yourself.  A lot of people like the books and a lot of people hate the book (myself).  It can also be hard to follow.  The Superman books cross over into the other Superman books when DC promised they wouldn't.  The recent DC cross-over "Our Worlds at War" made Superman "darker" and less light hearted.  DC is TRYING to make Superman more real by having Supes see a shrink because of the events in OWAW.  Superman is a hit or miss depending on your taste's.  Do not listen to me, Judas, or whoever.  This is one of those things you'll have to read for yourself.

 

Punisher: Frank's back and kickin ass.  Good book.

 

The stuff you REALLY need to go out and buy is Ulitmate Spider-Man, Ultimate X-Men (if you're an X-Men fan you'll love it), and the Ultimates (quasi Avengers line up).

 

It's like a retelling of the characters except it's been given a modern update to their origins.  Pete's back in high school and MJ know's he's Spidey, Wolverine has already joined the X-Men after 6 issues, and the Ultimates is like a more darker version of the Avengers yet still sticking to their roots closely.  In the first issue, Captain America fight's Nazi's in a flash back tale and is put into suspended animation.  ALL IN THE FIRST ISSUE!!  It look's like a sleeper hit.  It's by the same writer, Mark Millar, who writes Ultimate X-Men.

 

And again, you will have to go out on your own and determine if you like Superman.  It's no use to ask us.  We all have different opinions on it and it would be in your best interest to look at it for yourself and see if you like it.

 

Happy hunting!

[Guest The Masked Yodeler]

Yeah, I plan on picking up some tpb's.  The only comics I've bought in the last year were tpb's of Watchmen and Kevin Smith's Chasing Dogma (the comic prequel to Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back).  TPB's are cheaper, and you don't have to wait until next month to find out what happens, and as I don't plan on doing any comic speculation, I really don't care about the worth of the books, so I'll probably be mostly buying TPB's of good story arcs.  

 

I know what the Ultimate books are, in fact, I got a free reprint of Ultimate Spiderman #1 at Kay-Bee toys the other day, which was another cue for me to read more comics.  I may check out some of them.

[Guest Zack Malibu]

Daredevil and Incredible Hulk are two books that are going to be getting REALLY good.

 

I've always been a fan of both (you could call me a HULK mark), but the recent twist in the way the story of the Hulk is told is that nowadays, the Hulk is affected by whatever happens to Banner.  If Banner shaves his head, Hulk is bald too.  If Banner loses an arm, well, our green skinned friend is an ass kicking amputee.

 

Daredevil's storyline is centered around a new character, a wiseguy named Sammy Silke, attempting to overthrow Kingpin.  I suggest both of these titles.  And for a non-Marvel title, I give a strong recommendation to Rising Stars.  Awesome, awesome series.

[Guest gthureson]

Yeah, but Hulk has been thrown back onto the road and chased by authorities in a throwback to the 70s Bill Bixby series, just so the current comic will be similar to the Ang Lee movie, whenever it does happen to come out.

 

But for my money Ang Lee + Incredible Hulk = Arty, nice looking but boring action movie.

 

Flying Tiger, Wired Dragon didn't really do anything for me.

[Guest areacode212]

I'm sure the producers of the movie will try and get Lee to tone down his pretensions a little and give the movie as much mass-appeal as possible. But still, after years of crappy comic-book movies like Spawn and Tank Girl, an arty, character-driven superhero movie isn't completely unwelcome.

[Guest gthureson]

If it fits the character, then sure.

 

I'd love an arty, character driven Daredevil.   Or Batman. (A Batman movie where the title character got as much screen time as the villains would be nice).

 

But for a Hulk movie?  Doesn't seem like a fit to me.   We'll see when it comes out though.  Dunno even know if they have a screenplay.   I've just heard Ang Lee's name attached to a 'Savage' Hulk movie project.

[Guest areacode212]

Yeah, but I'm guessing (and sort of hoping) he'll focus on the concept of the brilliant, but tortured Bruce Banner and his struggle with the awful curse of the Hulk, which I think does lend itself to a more introspective kind of comic-book movie.

 

As for info on the project, I pulled this from The Guardian:

from http://film.guardian.co.uk/Print/0,3858,4323677,00.html (12/20/01)

Nick Nolte is the latest signing for the much talked about adaptation of the Marvel comic book The Hulk.

 

Sam Elliott, and Jennifer Connelly are are already on board, and director Ang Lee will begin filming in the spring. The picture is scheduled for a 2003 release.

 

Australian Eric Bana will play Bruce Banner, the scientist who when provoked becomes the Hulk. It is unclear whether Nolte will play Banner's father or his father in law General Ross, the Hulk's enemy.

 

The film is written by X-Men writer David Hayter and Lee's long-time collaborator James Schamus. Connelly says the film won't follow formulas. "I used to watch the old TV series when I was a kid, but this is going to be very different than that. It's Ang Lee. I would be shocked if it's like any comic book movie I've ever seen."

 

Bana, who starred in last year's Australian crime movie Chopper, say's he's glad to have been chosen. "We're in the very early stages of pre-production at the moment, and I'm really, really excited to be doing it. And just thrilled that Ang chose me. You'd have to ask him why. I don't know."

[Guest Sassquatch]

Who's gonna play the Hulk?

 

Or is he going to be CGI?

[Guest super sayan jericho]

isn't David Hayter the guy who plays Solid Snake?

[Guest areacode212]

I came across a website called Upcomingmovies.com that has some interesting notes on the Hulk movie.

 

According to their Hulk page, one of the movie's proposed villains (other than General Ross) will be Crusher Creel, the Absorbing Man. And Creel would be played by none other than...(cue Gladiator-style music) Goooooldberg. Did any of you see that Universal Soldier movie and if so, was Goldberg good in it? I wonder if Creel's foxy wife will appear in the movie.

[Guest raptor]

Goldberg was amusing in Universal Soldier. I believe he actually speared someone, and basically walked around acting like...well, Goldberg for the duration. If you like to laugh, rent it.

[Guest raptor]

Goldberg was amusing in Universal Soldier. I believe he actually speared someone, and basically walked around acting like...well, Goldberg for the duration. If you like to laugh, rent it.