Jamie Knoble

[Guest Brian]

I don't think you can make the argument that Knoble's work isn't crisper and his selling isn't better. Angle's selling has always been shoddy, and his work has always been a little wild. Angle's big strength has always been that glamour with his bumping, and the energy he bring as a result of those two issues.

 

I don't think you'll find two guys who match up better than Benoit and Knoble. Watch his HWA work and tell me he isn't straight out of the Dynamite lineage. He had the swagger, the moveset with his own little imprints, the selling line for line, and the exact way of attacking matches and building them from that. *I* think that if he had more time to develop in HWA, he would have legitimately been a top ten worker in the world which is more than I can say of just about any other WWE worker, sans Benoit, Eddy, and Rey.

 

Kahran, are you saying HHH is better at putting together matches than Eddy? Rey?

[Lt. Al Giardello 0]

HHH can work a good match, but still... In his prime he was capable of ***** matches. Nowadays, we are lucky to see ****1/4 HHH match(Don't give me the Triple threat matches, because that was againest 2 of the best workers in 2 eras)

5 star matches? You have to be kidding. The HHH of today is much like the HHH of 2000, except HHH in 2000 was quicker in the ring.

****1/2 or above matches(atleast in my opinion) with HHH from 2000-till his injury in 2001.

 

Vs. Cactus Jack, RR00

Vs. Cactus Jack, No Way Out 2000

Vs. The Rock, Backlash 00

Vs. The Rock, Judgement 00

Vs. Y2J, Fully Loaded 00

Vs. Benoit, No Mercy 00

Vs. Austin, No Way Out 01

w/ Austin Vs. Benoit & Y2J, RAW 01

 

 

And since returning from his injury....

 

Vs. HBK, Summerslam 02

Vs. HBK, RAW 03

Vs. Benoit Vs. HBK, WMXX

Vs. Benoit Vs. HBK, Backlash 04

[Guest Markingout]

I know in the past that he was better in the ring, now that he is slowed down, and is lazy, but I was debating the fact that HHH never had 5 star matches in 2000- 2001. Also, I would say about 3 of those matches at **** 1/2.

[Guest wildpegasus]

For one, when was the last time Noble got 20 minutes in the ring like Kurt Angle has multiple times? Noble is better because he's a better seller, his work is crisper, his moveset is better, he builds offense better, and he is smarter in the ring. If Knoble got the same types of opportunities Angle has, he would be putting out endless great matches too. God knows Noble vs. Eddy for 20 minutes would have been better than Angle-Eddy was. Further, I guess your point about Angle's endless **** matches in WWE is debatable, because I can only think of one that I might consider near that level.

Moveset better is debatable. One thing that Angle has/had was a great moveset and I think it's better than Knoble's reportoire. Crisper is debatable too. Angle's really crisp in there with what he does. Moreso than Knoble.

 

If Knoble got the same types of opportunities Angle has, he would be putting out endless great matches too.

 

No doubt though it would be tough for Knoble to wrestle the heavyweights because of his size. Angle may have an advantage there. I can't remember any heavyweights Noble's gone up against so I don't know how well he does against them. Has anyone seem him do so in the WWE?

 

he builds offense better

 

Knoble's good at this, no doubt.

 

because he's a better seller

 

I'm going to keep a closer eye on Knoble the next few times I watch him to see how he sells on impact and fatigue during a match. The one thing I know is that he's never done selling which I thought was noticeably bad so that's good.

 

Further, I guess your point about Angle's endless **** matches in WWE is debatable, because I can only think of one that I might consider near that level.

 

It looks like EvanderHolyfieldsMissingEar rates matches easier than you so what's 4 1/2 to him may be 3 1/2 to you. Both of you still might think a match is the same quality when compared to another match. May as well get that point out before controversy starts.

 

I'm going to have to have take note and watch some more Knoble in the future so I can see how good he truly is. I haven't been seeing him working too much ever since Benoit left Smackdown.

[Guest Ray]

I've seen Noble bust out some really unique moves. He'll pull out all kinds of swank holds on Velocity. I can't recall Angle doing the same. Not saying Angle's offense is bad, just that it generally follows the same formula.

 

The amount of time and freedom to work is THE key factor here. Guys like Angle get plenty of time and are allowed to do things guys like Noble can't do. Angle can get great near falls by kicking out of finishers, etc... No one believes Noble would kick out of a main-eventers finisher, so he can't get the same suspense from the same situations.

[Lt. Al Giardello 0]

but I was debating the fact that HHH never had 5 star matches in 2000- 2001. Also, I would say about 3 of those matches at **** 1/2.

Well honestly, the only ones I consider ***** out of that is the Ironmatch with the Rock and the 2/3 Falls.

 

I'm still debating the Ironman Match because of the B.S. finish.

[Guest Ray]

Danielson, as it would rock bells. Even their short velocity match was swank.

They wrestled on Velocity??!?!

 

Noble may have better a match with Eddy then Angle(Maybe considered Angle-Eddy ****+) but that's because Noble and Eddy styles a similar.

There's no huge gap in styles. If Noble would have a better match with Eddy, it wouldn't be due to any style differences.

 

HHH is underrated here because people hate him so much and he had a bad run for a year or so after coming back from injury. He still knows how to work a match better than practically anybody else in the company besides Benoit, despite a rather poor moveset (which knocks him below Eddy, Rey Rey & Jericho).

Yeah, when he wants to. He's often lazy and doesn't want to.

 

5 star matches? You have to be kidding.

You have to consider perspective when looking at other peoples star ratings. Some people haven't seen much beyond WWE, therefore it's not too ridiculous to rate the best WWE matches that high, and HHH was involved in most of the best WWF matches of 2000.

 

I'm still debating the Ironman Match because of the B.S. finish.

Actually the finish wasn't BS and had a clear purpose. I'll defend it if necessary.

[Guest wildpegasus]

Danielson, as it would rock bells. Even their short velocity match was swank.

They wrestled on Velocity??!?!

 

It was a "short" but fun match. You don't have to worry about acquiring it or anything.

[Spaceman Spiff 0]

It was sometime in mid-2003. Like WP said, short & fun, but nothing near his 1st against London or last against Rey on Velocity.

[Spaceman Spiff 0]

Watch his HWA work and tell me he isn't straight out of the Dynamite lineage.

Anyone have any idea where I could get a tape of his HWA work without having to buy a bunch of HWA tapes?

[Guest Real F'n Show]

Good things come to those who tape Velocity...

 

I think the Am Drag vs. Noble match was in early 2003, around the Rumble.

 

I was just watching the Starrcade 2000 ladder match. Sick fucking match.

[Guest Markingout]

Watch his HWA work and tell me he isn't straight out of the Dynamite lineage.

Anyone have any idea where I could get a tape of his HWA work without having to buy a bunch of HWA tapes?

Crazymax.org

 

This is where all the best tape traders and people who make comps post at, so maybe you could ask for a comp of, the best of Jaime Knoble in HWA.

[Kahran Ramsus 0]

Between Eddy & HHH it is close. Eddy is a better worker for other reasons, but they are pretty close in terms of psychology and bringing the crowd into a match. Occasionally you will see Eddy make a mental gaff out there though, which I really don't see HHH do. HHH is much better than Misterio at this, but that is Misterio's weakest aspect as a wrestler. Misterio is a better wrestler, he's more talented, but HHH is a smarter one. I am merely stating that HHH is underrated around here, because people hate him and he isn't a very flashy wrestler.

 

HHH is not nearly at the level of Benoit, Eddy, Rey Rey, Jericho or a healthy Angle, but there is a HUGE dropoff in talent after those five and HHH has enough plusses that I would put him as the top guy of the next big group of wrestlers. Noble has the potential to join the top group, but he needs more experience with longer matches, preferably against those guys. Noble/Eddy is a match that I would love to see.