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Something I don't get

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Why is it, that when people who are exposed to a hyped-up promotion for the first time, expect every single match to be great? I see this all the time with ROH, and I recently saw it with NOAH too. I see people complaining about a card-opening comedy match or a mid-card indy spotfest, and that supposedly means the promotion isn't great. What kind of logic is this, especially considering I don't see anyone claiming that ROH or NOAH produces great matches up and down the card. It's just not possible for any promotion to consistently have cards with mostly great matches, or even mostly very good matches. AJW in the early-mid 90's certainly had cards with multiple MOTYCs, and where the large majority of the matches were at least good, but that's about the only example I can think of, and not every show they produced was up to those standards. Even the promotion that many consider to be the best ever (early 90's AJPW) usually had an unbelievably great main event, and a good-very good undercard match, but the rest mostly forgettable stuff.

 

So here's a tip for people who are watching these hyped-up promotions for the first time. Compare the number of MOTYCs these promotions produce over the course of a year, compared to say, WWE. Then look at how consistent the shows are in at least having 2 or 3 good-very good matches per card. That's why those promotions are hyped up as being great, not because every match they produce is necessarily great, or even average. Every promotion has their stinkers. Every single one. Just some have more or less than others.

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Put it down to most people having zero patience, and wanting all the good stuff immediately. They want immediate or near-immediate gratification from a promotion, and when they don't get it they label the promotion as crap and walk away.

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To be honest I've not really seen anyone do that. I've seen people on various boards comment about how a particular match sucks but I really can't think of any time that I've seen someone say "oh my god, that opening match was crap, what an awful promotion".

 

I think most people will usually bash the workers involved, or some kind of aesthetic or stipulation of the match itself, for stinking, not the entire promotion on the basis of one match.

 

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To be honest I've not really seen anyone do that. I've seen people on various boards comment about how a particular match sucks but I really can't think of any time that I've seen someone say "oh my god, that opening match was crap, what an awful promotion".

 

I think most people will usually bash the workers involved, or some kind of aesthetic or stipulation of the match itself, for stinking, not the entire promotion on the basis of one match.

 

It's more a matter of people thinking the promotion is overrated, rather than thinking it's awful. I only know of one person who's watched very little of a given promotion and proclaimed it to be awful (although that guy is one of the biggest dregs you could ever meet, so he's a bad example). I guess the point I wanted to make was that a promotion shouldn't be judged on its crap, it should be judged on its best stuff. If someone compares NOAH's crap to WWE's crap, they'd never understand why people think NOAH destroys WWE in wrestling quality. But if one compares the best (and even middling) stuff, the difference in quality becomes quite apparent.

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I'm a diehard WCW fan so I can understand taht completely wink.gif

 

If I'd judged them on their crap I really would have thought they sucked balls, but their great stuff for me always outweighed the WWE's best.

 

And to be honest, at many times throughout the 90's, and beyond, I'd have taken some of WCW's worst shows over the product that Vinnie Mac's promoted to the masses.

 

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Fuck, I couldn't agree with you more. I can't believe how many people hear me hype up ROH, then they grab a DVD or tune in on The Fight Network, see a Ring Crew Express vs Jobbers match and say "wtf is so good about this?"

 

One of these days I'm gonna take the time to rip maybe a half dozen ROH matches and put them up on PWT as "The Best Matches to Introduce Someone to ROH With." Joebashi should be one of them, but I still need to decide on the other 5...

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Maybe something like AmDrag vs. Low Ki from the 3/30/02 show.

Daniels vs. Williams from 3/22/03.

AmDrag vs. Joe from 10/2/04

AmDrag vs. Gibson from 9/17/05

 

Good somewhat standalone matches that might be good for introducing someone to ROH.

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This has been my "intro to ROH" when showing someone ROH, these aren't the top 15 ROH matches but I think these give a full round offering of different styles and workers.

 

Danielson Vs Ki Vs Daniels (EHOB)

Paul London Vs Michael Shane(Unscripted)

AJ Styles Vs Bryan Danielson (MES)

Samoa Joe Vs Jay Briscoe (AOB)

SCS Vs Prophecy (DBD2P2)

Samoa Joe Vs Bryan Danielson(MXR)

Samoa Joe Vs CM Punk (ASII)

Samoa Joe Vs Austin Aries (FB04)

Spanky Vs Danielson (BOASP)

Jack Evans Vs Ebessan Vs Joe Vs Delirious (Final Showdown)

CM Punk Vs Jimmy Rave (N2R)

Danielson Vs Gibson (GB4)

Samoa Joe Vs Kobashi (Joe Vs Kobashi)

Gen Next Vs Embassy(Steel Cage Warfare)

KENTA Vs Low Ki(FB05)

 

I'll probably take off a couple of those matches and add one of the DG matches from the WM weekend trio of shows since that completely stands out and by all reports were insanely great. I try to mix quality pure wrestling with some good brawls, a comedy match and a couple epic-like matches. I would love to place any of the Strong/Danielson matches on here but I think you get the same effect with the Gibson match.

 

I put JvP III instead due to time constraits, if you are trying to get a fan into a promotion, he won't get into a 60 minute draw that builds. However, a intense 30 minute war will, I'd keep the pre-match package of highlights from the first two matches to emphasize the match.

 

I used Punk/Rave because it was such a good blow off and Punk really shines as a babyface there. I would like to have a 6/8 man tag of Gen Next on there as I might replace the SCW match with one.

 

Maybe the list is too Joe/Danielson/Punk heavy?

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