UseTheSledgehammerUh

Orton's had shitty workers to build his worth against. The one's that he has wrestled that are decent, take The Hurricane, he goes over and everyone bitches because "Hurricane should be pushed, not Randy!" Even though Hurricane has less of a box-office future. The "smarks" seem to forget that pro wrestling is a business sometimes...and that it isn't always about who's best being pushed. It's about pushing talent that is 1)marketable (Orton's got the look), 2)believeable (he's a ripped guy that has some of the best character movements on RAW, and believably can hurt people) and 3)can draw (Orton's moveset and skill is developing, and he's becoming a bigger star, and able to work bigger matches...you'll see).

Two things: Orton has not been getting his character over for a year. He was hurt immediately after he joined Evolution (as was Batista) in a house show tag Vs. the Dudleyz. His character started the Raw following Bad Blood (or at Bad Blood, when his interference established him). That's July to November. 4 Fucking Months. In that time, he has worked with: Maven (ugh...), Goldberg (squashed on the road to Unforgiven), Shawn Michaels (in a decent match), Booker T (in a 1 minute spot where T kicked his ass), and was used as fodder in the Elimination Chamber to hide HHH's weakness. "we all said Orton would have a breakthrough at Summerslam and Unforgiven..." BULLSHIT! He was NOT going to shine at SummerSlam in a six-way fucking cage match where he was the least exposed on TV of the 6. Unforgiven...hey, he worked a decent match. He's on his way. And my 2nd point: The "Internet Match" thing was simply a plea for you "holier than thou" supersmark posters to view The Smackdown tag as Benoit/Angle Vs. The Hosses....a plea for you to enjoy their struggle, and hopefully, their victory. It reflects (once the dead weight on their team is gone) the two top mat-workers Vs. The Slugs. You people will never, ever be happy unless a new star is perfect from day one. Fuck that. Stunning Steve sucked his first WCW year. I found Mankind lame his first year. Michaels was a chubby, awful singles wrestler (take HBK/El Matador, WM 8....zzz...) until Oct 92... Give Orton a fucking break and notice positive changes, not negatives. Or don't, and keep bitching. At least some of us can see the state of wrestling for what it is now: Rebuilding and Establishing New Faces.

Give Orton time, jeez. He's been doing alright for a new character (as of what, Feb. 2003, was when his Evolution ran began) placed next side to HHH and Flair. His character hasn't really had that much time to grow. He's good on the mic, and his in-ring skills, while not great, are improving. My reasoning for Orton adding heat to the match is that his heel character truly stands as an individual, not as "the skinny guy" when HHH and Flair are out there. At SSeries, he's on a tea representing himself. Less stubborn fans who can enjoy the product will not like him as a character, so that works. And if you want to talk about crickets, Anglesault, I suggest you watch Angle/Stasiak.....Angle/Blackman, etc...a character needs times to grow, as Angle did. It didnt hurt that Angle was also booked with great talents afterwards, like Jericho and Benoit. Angle was always booked as a comedic doofus at first, so he got clown heat after his debut. Orton is booked as a cocky asshole...it takes time to take him seriously. Even more time to take him seriously when he's always surrounded by the essential "cocky" heels, HHH and Flair. I think SSeries will be a breakthrough for him, or if nothing, a chance to see how he does away from Evolution for the night. Give the show a chance.

Choken, agreed. Argument is not to his quality of matches, but to how he claimed his U.S. notoriety.

Whatever man, go watch the most overrated talent of the 90's, Vader then. He's a good worker, yes, but most of his U.S. fame came from a monster push in a bush league and ALWAYS being booked in programs with superior talents (Michaels, Flair, Sting, Cactus, etc.). And if you wanna bash the "Hoss" Team for being UNSAFE....then look at VADER, goddamnit, his record isn't very clean. I'm not gonna rip Vader, 'cause its just my opinion that he's overrated, so I shouldn't be flamed. He's still a great talent. But for you to automatically judge a PPV before the full lineup's out as being crap and calling all the people that posted here and have some anticipation for the show "dumb", well then I guess you're the type of pessimist who is happy with berating others and watching your slow Japanese wrestlers of equal stature mount each other for 35 minutes and tell a "story". Sorry man, but I'll take an uphill battle that hasn't even happened yet over a "Rocky Mountain Monster" that doesn't wash his tights.

You gotta relax. The Smackdown Survivor Series Match isn't advertised to be a "scientific" wrestling clinic. It is a story between Smackdown's 5 Monster Heels Vs. Smackdown Faces. The dead weight will be gone early. It'll be Angle/Benoit left in with Brock and Show at some point. Say what you will about The Big Show, but he can be carried to good matches and is an opposing force. If two small at wrestlers against all odds facing 5 colossal giants, in a "survivor" match isn't appealing to you, then I suggest you use your time to fish out some tapes of matches that appeal to you instead of ripping my comments. You make yourself look pretty foolish when you blatantly make NEGATIVE comments about EVERY match. Perhaps you're right, and some of these bouts won't be super...but for you to rip EVERY match is ridiculous. The WWE PPVs of late have given us at least a FEW watchable contests...and this card potentially has a bunch of them, too. My apoligies that a potential turn in the RAW Tag, a screwjob, or kickass match doesn't interest you...and that Smackdown has booked moreorless an "internet" match between everyone's darlings Benoit and Angle against everyone's hated Hoss Connection...I find this bout intriguing, as well.

Hey...ah... Do the people posting ridiculous threads like these ever give credit to where they "hear" stuff...such as, "Goldberg has contract that won't let him wrestle Lesnar." Do you know how God damn stupid that sounds? This reminds me of two 8-year olds discussing how many Ultimate Warriors there were, and how many died. "No, Hulk won't wrestle Warrior again cuz he has a contract that says he can't!" As far as Goldberg's contract, I think he'll be kept around after XX. He's done reasonably well as World Champion, the problem being we, as fans, haven't seen him in a match where we actually believe he'll lose the belt b/c we know the rematch with HHH with coming. Survivor Series will be a crucial point in BG's career as far as future plans to keep him as a credible champion or fade him away. I predict Goldberg retains. BG's selling to guys like Batista and Mark Henry is only helping them, so good job Bill. They may be hosses, but at least their value to the marks improves, and thus, the quality of the overall product is seen as more credible when the green hosses are involved in main events.

Anyone think the annual SS "screwing" will occur? I predict Austin's team loses. Coach gets to do his interview, blah blah, with a dejected Stone Cold, who'll "step down, tomorrow night on RAW bah gawd the rattlesnake no!" But Austin'd have nothing to lose anyway, so he'd have to be taken out by someone... For that to occur, I think someone's gotta turn. I had two theories. 1)Booker T. They're pimpin' "he was the first man to step up!" thing a little much...plus, T's return interview hinted at his desire to chase the IC Title. He's been kinda bland (IMO), although has popped crowds nicely. Still, I don't think he's a big enough character in the WWE World to be a catalyst for screwing over Austin. He'd only get beat up in a grocery store afterwards. Leading to...2)Shawn Michaels. I do NOT see Mark Henry eliminating Michaels. Nor Orton, who got to do that at Unforgiven. Christian ain't pinning Michaels, nor will Steiner. Leaving Jericho. Jericho would be the man who eliminates HBK, and that could happen. Or Michaels takes out Jericho. I just really think Michaels, with the return of Booker T as a top face, would A)produce shock value by screwing Austin and would B)make a better heel than a face right now. There's a lotta intrique going into this PPV. A turn in the RAW Tag...Will Hosses R Us doinate...Benoit pushed...Cena pushed...The "big bump" with Kane/Shane...Evolution and the World Title Match... Could also be the first 8-Time WWF/WWE World Champion.

Tajiri/Noble wasn't announced. I'm throwing that in there because I think they need a cruiser match. Honestly, Ultimo Dragon doesn't have the crowd reaction to face Tajiri on PPV (yet...) and Mysterio/Tajiri has been beaten to death. A lot of talent left off, yeah....Dragon, TWGTT, London Spankings, Guerreros, etc.

Wow, I totally forgot Shane was fighting Kane. And I've seen every incident between them. Shows my anticipation for that, I guess. Can't all be good.

I think that the Paul London/Spanky team draws comparisons to one of my favorite teams ever, The Rockers. Their entrance has a lot of energy, they've got the blonde/brunette mix, they're cruiserweights, use a combination of exciting double-team and aerial moves, and their attire is somewhat colorful. Question, with the WWE finally giving us a NEW, EXCITING FACE team to get behind (unlike the reformations of stale 1999-2000 acts like APA, Rikishi/Scotty or unover lame heel teams like the Bashams or La Resistance...), could Spanky and London work the "young, high-flying face" thing? I think a few changes need to happen: 1) Spanky needs to go back to using Brian Kendrick as his ring name. It adds a greater dimension of seriousness to a good worker, not "hey, its the funny guy that Brock always pummels". He can still be the "funny guy" of the team... 2)Coordinated ring attire? Or at least similar colors in their different ring outfits they use now? 3)Mic time to establish them. What do you guys think of this? I'd like these guys pushed more than the BORING Bashams, who remind of the DOA but with talent...the APA...Too Cool II...La Resistance...Morgan/Jones...etc. It couldn't hurt. (TWGTT Vs. London/Kendrick...WM XX...here it comes...)

My highlights so far (An Eagles Fan): Panthers stumble to an improving Texans team. Defense can't do it ALL. Buccaneers continue their downward spiral, losing to the lowly Saints. Giants crawl to a win over the J-E-T-S...NFC East continues to look like garbage. Raiders/Lions crap. Chargers/Bears crap. Colts look great, easily the 2nd best NFL team right now. Bengals not ready to hold a lead...so far. Cowboys/Redskins suck. Eagles can't put away Falcons, sigh. Rams, huh? That's my shocker of the day.

DEUUUUUUUUCE!!!!!!!!! And he's in for the touchdown!!!

Isn't Johnny Polo (aka Raven) the commentator for that match? I've yet to watch it... I heard some positive reviews earlier in this thread about him.

What an awful week in the NFL this is. Vikes/GB (barely) and Indy/Dolphins only quality games. I'm stuck watching the two shitty NY teams play until my (hopefully) somewhat-healthy Eagles play the Vick-less Falcons. BOR-ING.

:::1999 mode::: C'Mon, this is easy. Everyone knows Jeff Hardy is the next Shawn Michaels, is so much better than Matt, and will be the WWF Champion by 2003. Sometimes I'm glad we know so much more than the marks. :::2003 mode::: Will o' the What?

Oh cmon, the Hardyz wore tassels, true...but with Bright neon PLAID tights and headbands...looked like the love spawns of Billy & Chuck and Roddy Piper.

Ah, leave him alone. Bret, links are rarely put here for MP3s of songs that are pretty easily found on downloading devices, like Kazaa. If its "Undertakers 35th Theme, found off my buddy's old Titan CD", then its new, and posted here usually. But for Limp Bizkit (and c'mon, they may SUCK now, but I think everyone marked out for "My Way" one time or another...), they're pretty easy 2 find on Kazaa. So go find it.

:::begs AND chooses::: I also would have liked The Rock Vs. Stone Cold Steve Austin from the Raw after WM 17. It fit the DVD perfectly b/c it illustrated two HATED rivals going at it and one of them getting pummeled into the cage at the end.

I really liked this DVD...haven't watched HBK/Marty yet, though. The lighting is fine, stop crying. Anyway, WHAT ABOUT SCHIAVONE'S MUSTACHE? HAHA! Tully/Magnum is sweet. I love all these historical highlight packages. Magnum's Belly to Belly was just...wow. Great FIGHT. Anyone catch the trash thrown in the ring after Garvin wins the belt from Flair? Bret/Owen, my favorite feud ever, and a great match. I wanted the "You're gonna cry a river!" promo though. How come Bruno and Larry Z is like 5 seconds long? Eh. Bret/Yankem has no place on here. Coulda put Steiners/Money Inc., whatever. Good stuff. Great DVD.

Hunter has been employed for 10 years in WCW/WWF, and a big name since '96. So he's already reached half of Leslie's time...

What was the damn name of the move the Express did (pick up opponent, lean himbackwards...other guy jumps off top with flying legdrop.) I believe its the same as AMW's Death Sentence....

Yo, I was a big mark for The New Midnight Express. They had cool knock-off music and Cornette, and everyone legitimately Hated them. Plus they gave the NAO their best match ever. Spanky is a tassel fan, as his has indicated on Confidential. I always found it interesting that Shawn and Marty called themselves "The Midnight Rockers"...this had to piss of the two Express teams (Midnights, R n Rs).

What the fuck...Spanky is being Adolf Hitler... Hillary Duff, baby.

Do you prefer Turd Fergison?