Guest GenerationNever Posted July 23, 2002 Report Posted July 23, 2002 And The Rock hasn't done the People's Elbow to finish off someone in a long time... Because he's been making movies...
Guest El Psycho Diablo Posted July 23, 2002 Report Posted July 23, 2002 Yes. God forbid someone want to further their own career. Stupid Rocky. Face it. The move gets heat. *smirks* Which is more than most of Benoit's moveset put together. *cheapshot* But seriously. It's over. He's over. He'll use the move.
Guest Kid Kablam Posted July 23, 2002 Report Posted July 23, 2002 It's a fucking Elbow drop, get of it. It's not like Beniot's prior finisher was that "Beliveable". Idiot slaming his head on the other's guy's head..It's a falling headbutt. He dives off the top turn buckle and slams his head into someone!!!!!!! You don't think that's believable? It's simple physics!! Someone coming off he top rope, coming from halfway across the ring will cause impact. The headbutt part is for show, true, but it's as believable of a top rope move as the 5 star
Guest Dangerous A Posted July 23, 2002 Report Posted July 23, 2002 On a personal note, I don't like the elbow finishing. I prefer the Rock Bottom finishing off opponents. The Diving head BUTT hasn't finished anyone off in about 5 years. In fact, Benoit's continued use of it is one of the reasons he had to take the year off and have the surgery. As far as the Rock doing all kinds of jobs, I'll acknowledge them, but they do NOTHING FOR THE OPPPONENT! Plus the way the opponents win is usually put over that had they not cheated and if the stars didn't align that particular day like they did, then Rock would've been victorious. I'm not saying Rock is as nefarious as HHH because Rock doesn't play the backstage games. (he doesn't have time to and he doesn't have to because he is such a star) But with the exception of Jericho, all of Rock's jobs have amounted to exactly dick in terms of putting someone over enough to be seen as a credible threat. Take a look at Booker. Did nothing for him.
Guest Kid Kablam Posted July 24, 2002 Report Posted July 24, 2002 I'm just saying that Benoit's headbutt looks pretty fierce. He probably shouldn't continue to use it, but I like it. Anyway, I gotta tell ya Dangerous A, I probably wouldn't have accepted Angle as early as I did if Rock didn't put him over that one night on Smackdown. I mean, he made Angle look good. True, Triple H or someone was up on the ramp to "distract" him, but I really started to see Angle's skill. Justa thought
Guest Dangerous A Posted July 24, 2002 Report Posted July 24, 2002 What one night on SD are you talking about? Just recently? A year or two ago?
Guest deadbeater Posted July 24, 2002 Report Posted July 24, 2002 If Foley said it was so stupid, why did he do the People's Elbow on Chris Kattan on Saturday Night Live?? To get the audience pop, as even casual fans know of the inflections and motions of the People's elbow.
Guest AlwaysPissedOff Posted July 24, 2002 Report Posted July 24, 2002 As far as the Rock doing all kinds of jobs, I'll acknowledge them, but they do NOTHING FOR THE OPPPONENT! Plus the way the opponents win is usually put over that had they not cheated and if the stars didn't align that particular day like they did, then Rock would've been victorious. I'm not saying Rock is as nefarious as HHH because Rock doesn't play the backstage games. (he doesn't have time to and he doesn't have to because he is such a star) But with the exception of Jericho, all of Rock's jobs have amounted to exactly dick in terms of putting someone over enough to be seen as a credible threat. Take a look at Booker. Did nothing for him. Another great post, DA. And that's bascially the reason why I don't get all the praise Rock gets for "putting people over" when relly he hasn't given ANYONE any type of rub except for Jericho.
Guest Hogan Made Wrestling Posted July 24, 2002 Report Posted July 24, 2002 You can't just "give someone the rub" simply by doing a couple of jobs to them. People have gotten brainwashed by this HHH-Foley crap that all you have to do to get over is get someone more established than you to lose to you a few times in a row. There has to be something there on their end of things as well.
Guest AlwaysPissedOff Posted July 24, 2002 Report Posted July 24, 2002 You can't just "give someone the rub" simply by doing a couple of jobs to them. People have gotten brainwashed by this HHH-Foley crap that all you have to do to get over is get someone more established than you to lose to you a few times in a row. There has to be something there on their end of things as well. True, HMW, but I feel Rock has to take some of the blame as well when they try to push someone to go over him and they don't make it. With Rock, the thing is he rarely seems affected when someone calls him out because he'll always seem to come back with more jokes and just make the challenger look like a total loser. Now, what Rock did with Brock on RAW is something he really should have done with Booker, the next big heel to challenge Rock really should make him seem to come out of character a bit(not breaking kayfabe, mind you, just affect the way he seems to percieve and act around the guy). Now, I didn't expect him to do that for Eddy, but that's really what I mean when I say he has RARELY seemed to make anyone out to be near his level. Eddy came out and called out Rock, but Rock makes fun of him and just makes Guerrero look like a complete joke. Really, I blame the bookers and Vince for this, but like in the case of the Booker feud last summer, Rock could have at least said SOMETHING about making Book look good.
Guest El Psycho Diablo Posted July 24, 2002 Report Posted July 24, 2002 ..people around here won't ever forgive the Rock for laying down to a then unover imitation in Booker T..
Guest MrRant Posted July 24, 2002 Report Posted July 24, 2002 The way I look at it is that the Rock does what he is told. If Vince said not to destroy someone in a promo then he won't. I've never heard about the Rock shooting or anything during a promo. So I think the blame lays with El Vinnie Mac O
Guest benoitrules2000 Posted July 24, 2002 Report Posted July 24, 2002 I gotta say this post pissed me off a lot! How the hell can you like this whole situation? The rock has the title rendering it just that little bit more meaningless as he'll be leaving in about a month or so anyway, so what's the point of the title reign? They've got friggin angle RIGHT THERE but they give it to that piece of shit that can't decide whether he wants to be a shitty wrestler or a shitty actor! And also HOW DARE HE MAKE THAT FUCKING SPEECH AFTER AUSTIN LEFT!!!! He returns after about THREE MONTHS to bury someone who'd basically done a similar thing and all you get on here is how much of a hero the rock is! I hope he makes up his mind and just fucks off! Oh and he comes back for a couple of weeks, is immediately inserted into main event feud and gets the title. Hmmmm...who does that sound like....*cough*hogan*cough*
Guest El Psycho Diablo Posted July 24, 2002 Report Posted July 24, 2002 I gotta say this post pissed me off a lot! How the hell can you like this whole situation? The rock has the title rendering it just that little bit more meaningless as he'll be leaving in about a month or so anyway, so what's the point of the title reign? They've got friggin angle RIGHT THERE but they give it to that piece of shit that can't decide whether he wants to be a shitty wrestler or a shitty actor! And also HOW DARE HE MAKE THAT FUCKING SPEECH AFTER AUSTIN LEFT!!!! He returns after about THREE MONTHS to bury someone who'd basically done a similar thing and all you get on here is how much of a hero the rock is! I hope he makes up his mind and just fucks off! Oh and he comes back for a couple of weeks, is immediately inserted into main event feud and gets the title. Hmmmm...who does that sound like....*cough*hogan*cough* Here's the catch. Rocky IS a credible champ, unlike Hokey-mania. He's been a genuine main eventer for the last couple years, and therefore SHOULD be inserted into the main. His 'speech' was appropriate. He wasn't billed to show at any places, so he didn't. Austin WAS billed to show at places, and he stayed home. There's somewhat of a difference. Rock probably makes ten times doing movies than he does wrestling. Yes, I give him credit for coming back. He didn't really have to.
Guest AlwaysPissedOff Posted July 24, 2002 Report Posted July 24, 2002 ..people around here won't ever forgive the Rock for laying down to a then unover imitation in Booker T.. What I said doesn't even concern the Booker thing because he does it to just about single heel he comes in contact with. Hell, I'm not even talking about him jobbing to somebody, it's about how he(the character) deals with heels that aren't getting a Jesus push a la HHH or Brock. How is a hopefully major heel supposed to look credible when Rock just completely buries him in the interviews? And yes, it's not the supposed HHH-like burial of Jericho like a lot of people speak of around here, but he DOES do it. He doesn't have to JOB or anything to make a heel look credible, he just has to show that the guy against has affected the way he acts. Jericho did this, Austin did this, Triple H did this, and as of Monday, Brockberg did it, and you know what? Three out of four of those programs actually drew money. Like I stated before, I DO blame Vince and the bookers, I'm pretty sure Rock has the stroke to say something like, "Hey, this probably isn't a good idea, Vince." Eh, I'm rambling again.
Guest snowfan Posted July 24, 2002 Report Posted July 24, 2002 I really feel sorry for marks who believe the People's Elbow is a credible finisher. Heck when the Big Show drops a jumping elbow on someone he doesn't even get a win...that right there is poor continuity. I liked when Rock was a heel and People's elbow was more to spite the crowd than to win a match. I am starting to wonder if maybe the pure marks actually buy into "wrestling physics". The ONLY way that Rocky's elbow can be more "lethal" than Pig Show's is if he focuses his ego converted into mass into the bone at the point of his elbow at impact. I agree it is a credible finisher because of the build up it has gotten. The fact that the marks eat up what WWEee feeds them on the matter speaks volumes as to why Uncle Vince gets away with feeding crap to the US pro wrestling fanbase. snowfan
Guest The Flying Dutchman Posted July 24, 2002 Report Posted July 24, 2002 Maybe it's just me, but I think that an elbow driven into my solar plexus would be enough to put me out. Now, the running around beforehand, that's the ridiculous (albeit really fun) stuff.
Guest Ripper Posted July 24, 2002 Report Posted July 24, 2002 Just so I get this straight, Rock should be critisized for jobbing to guys because the writers did nothing with it afterwards??? ALot of Rocks jobs didn't mean much because a week or 2 later, the officials acted like they didn't see it... Much like every other one-two week push that became common place in the WWF... Critize the Rock all you want, but this is one area there is no room for critisizm.
Guest AlwaysPissedOff Posted July 24, 2002 Report Posted July 24, 2002 Don't know if you were mentioning me, but I didn't critize his jobbing.
Guest snowfan Posted July 24, 2002 Report Posted July 24, 2002 Hey the rock is probably the least political multi-time champ in the WWEeee except maybe Angle. I just don't mark for the elbow.
Guest Hogan Made Wrestling Posted July 24, 2002 Report Posted July 24, 2002 It's a catch-22. Guys like Austin, Undertaker, and HHH won't do meaningless jobs, so when WWE wants someone to do those, they get the Rock to. Of course, by the time he's done jobbing to Al Snow, Bossman, Christian, and Steph, it's not surprising to see him lose anymore. So the reason it's harder for the Rock to "give people the rub" is because his disappeared at the expense of guys who won't let theirs get hit even a little bit.
Guest Redhawk Posted July 24, 2002 Report Posted July 24, 2002 Would someone tell me why the People's Elbow is supposed to suck so much when it's been established again and again in wrestling that elbows hurt? Macho Man, Shawn Michaels, Dusty Rhodes and many others (Test, Shane, etc.) have used their elbows to win matches, so what's so bad about The Rock? The running the ropes gives him the momentum needed to make it hurt, using the same logic that Macho Man would get momentum by coming from the air for the elbow drop.
Guest art_vandelay Posted July 24, 2002 Report Posted July 24, 2002 Would someone tell me why the People's Elbow is supposed to suck so much when it's been established again and again in wrestling that elbows hurt? Macho Man, Shawn Michaels, Dusty Rhodes and many others (Test, Shane, etc.) have used their elbows to win matches, so what's so bad about The Rock? The running the ropes gives him the momentum needed to make it hurt, using the same logic that Macho Man would get momentum by coming from the air for the elbow drop. LOL! While I stated before that I like The People's Elbow, even I couldn't help but laugh at your reasonings. The flying elbow pad is supposed hypnotize the dazed opponent on the canvas too, right?
Guest TheBlurricane Posted July 25, 2002 Report Posted July 25, 2002 If Foley said it was so stupid, why did he do the People's Elbow on Chris Kattan on Saturday Night Live?? To get the audience pop, as even casual fans know of the inflections and motions of the People's elbow. He did a really poor version, probably more to show the Rock how silly he looks. Someone said The Rock running gives him momentum for the elbow.........but he comes to a complete stop before he drops it. That's one of the things so silly about it. Plus Test, Macho, Shane all do elbow drops off the top rope...Dusty....well that's just bad...his elbow was laughably weak looking.
Guest HollywoodSpikeJenkins Posted July 25, 2002 Report Posted July 25, 2002 No one else has said it, and I doubt anyone will here, but here it goes: you've got to respect, if not love, the Rock. Short title reign and long filming absences aside, he's 3/3 (with 3 really good matches--a better batting average than Benoit thus far) since coming back last week. In the words of the Rock... WHOA WHOA WHOA WHOA WHOA WHOA WHOA Take a look at who Rock has faced.... 1) Angle (Smackdown match that was good.) 2) Angle and Taker (For Christs sakes ITS ANGLE. Angle can get a good match out of a paper bag, and Taker actually tried in this match.) 3) Eddie (EDDIE IS THE SECOND BEST WRESTLER ON RAW FOR CHRISTS SAKES.) Now, lets look at Benoit.... 1) Benoit/Eddy vs. Bubba/Spike (Not a bad match, but come on, Benoit and Eddy could only do SO much) 2) Bubba (Bubba vs. Benoit. Come on...) 3) Benoit/Eddy vs. Bubba/Spike (Not a bad match.) 4) Benoit vs. Booker T (Great match) NOW, there is no way you can compare Rock's return to Benoit's return. When Rock is facing Angle 2/3's of the time, and Benoit is in the ring with Bubba Dudley 3/4's of the time, OBVIOUSLY, the matches arent going to be equal. So, until Benoit gets MORE Good Opponent (Booker/RVD for example), you CAN NOT, and WILL NOT, compare Benoit to Rock. Why? BECAUSE BENOIT WILL ALWAYS BE 20 TIMES BETTER THEN ROCK. PERIOD.
Guest Hogan Made Wrestling Posted July 25, 2002 Report Posted July 25, 2002 Career wise, the Rock's matches with Angle have been on average as good or better than Benoit's with him.
Guest TheBlurricane Posted July 25, 2002 Report Posted July 25, 2002 I can't agree with that...Benoit and Angle have put on some classics. I just haven't gotten into Rock/Angle matches that much.
Guest bob_barron Posted July 25, 2002 Report Posted July 25, 2002 Angle v. Rock have had some great matches. So have Angle v. Benoit. Call it a draw
Guest El Psycho Diablo Posted July 25, 2002 Report Posted July 25, 2002 The Rock may not be as good as a pure wrestler as Benoit, but he's just 'as good'. Why? Rocky brings an electricity to his matches..something Benoit just dosen't..and will never..have. That, and the ability to get the crowd in an outright frenzy.
Guest Spaceman Spiff Posted July 25, 2002 Report Posted July 25, 2002 Would someone tell me why the People's Elbow is supposed to suck so much when it's been established again and again in wrestling that elbows hurt? Macho Man, Shawn Michaels, Dusty Rhodes and many others (Test, Shane, etc.) have used their elbows to win matches, so what's so bad about The Rock? The running the ropes gives him the momentum needed to make it hurt, using the same logic that Macho Man would get momentum by coming from the air for the elbow drop. Are you serious? Everyone you listed (except Dusty) does the elbow off the top rope. You're going to compare that to bouncing off the ropes, pausing, then dropping the elbow? There's *a lot* more force being generated by coming off the top rope. By that reasoning, I guess Psicosis's top rope legdrop or the Alabama Jam gives credibility to Hogan's legdrop? (man, arguing wrestling physics - how sad does that make us )
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