bps

[Guest art_vandelay]

There have been far worse breaks from psychology than Edge last night to start an anti-wrestler group because of it. He did kinda sell the shoulder after the spear, at least. Plus, he hooked the leg with the right arm. You can look at it as a person sacrificing his already-injured body to do the one move that he knows will take out his opponent. I think a lot of you will feel better about the finish if they continue to play it up on SmackDown.

 

They really should have gone with a different finish to avoid all this debate, but I don't think it's as big of a deal as some of you are making it out to be.

[Guest Kid Kablam]

I often wonder if guys who have a reputation for high workrate and the like, get away with spotty selling. Just a thought. I'll admit, I'm not the person to ask, as I haven't seen quite enough matches, but it just seems that some people can get away with it, but when Edge no sells for one move, we jump on him. I don't like Edge, but I'm gonna have to see some Kane type no selling to go after him.

[Guest bps "The Truth" 21]

Good Lord...

 

I never thought the day would come...

 

but here it is...

 

Anglesault makes a valid point:

 

"But if you sell the injury for an hour, then just totally ignore it for the win, you have rendered the last hour pointless. "

 

 

And it happened in a thread with my name on it.

 

I feel...such...pride...

[Guest Incandenza]

Bah. RVD's shitty selling offended me more than Edge's. Edge failed to sell at the end--which is bad, yes--but Van Dam couldn't get his act together AT ALL last night. As great as his match was, it was ALL Benoit.

[Guest bps "The Truth" 21]

He sold the arm dammit.

 

People get upset because he raised the title afterwards...

 

well then no one in the history of wrestling has ever sold to the lofty standards that RVD is held to by you people.

 

Cause if they had their leg worked...god knows they should NEVER BE ABLE TO WALK EVER AGAIN!!!!!!!!!

 

HE shook and grabbed his arm constantly throughout the match...he even stopped attacking with Shoulder thrusts in the corner and grabbed his arm in pain...because he...unlike Edge realized that should hurt.

 

Whatsmore...when he went for his second rolling thunder...he didn't even do one that would require any use of arm...he rolled from his head to his back and left his arm out of it this time.

 

I swear...Ric Flair raised the title after WrestleWar 89...which should be impossible by these standards since Steamboat worked it for 20 minutes.

[Guest godthedog]

He sold the arm dammit.

 

People get upset because he raised the title afterwards...

 

well then no one in the history of wrestling has ever sold to the lofty standards that RVD is held to by you people.

 

Cause if they had their leg worked...god knows they should NEVER BE ABLE TO WALK EVER AGAIN!!!!!!!!!

 

HE shook and grabbed his arm constantly throughout the match...he even stopped attacking with Shoulder thrusts in the corner and grabbed his arm in pain...because he...unlike Edge realized that should hurt.

 

Whatsmore...when he went for his second rolling thunder...he didn't even do one that would require any use of arm...he rolled from his head to his back and left his arm out of it this time.

 

I swear...Ric Flair raised the title after WrestleWar 89...which should be impossible by these standards since Steamboat worked it for 20 minutes.

well, this is a straw man argument if there ever was one.

 

okay, point-by-point:

 

he sold the arm, but pretty inconsistently.

 

and please stop with the hyperbole "leg work analogy" bullshit. and i'll say it again: jericho easily sold to my "lofty standards." at the end of the ladder match, when the ref tried to raise his hand, he couldn't because it was in too much pain. jericho looks good for having overcome such punishment to win the match, benoit looks good for having done so much damage. everybody wins. when rvd completely no-sells his opponent's finisher 2 minutes later, it makes his opponent look like shit. i didn't let austin get away with it at the 2001 calgary raw match, i didn't let the rock get away with it last week, i'm sure as hell not going to let rob van dam get away with it.

 

his shoulder thrusts were the only way his offense was affected in any way. all his other spots (cartwheeling, going up for the 5 star) looked exactly like they always do. he didn't allow the arm work to affect his performance as a whole, he apparently thought he could get it over simply by not being able to do the shoulder thrusts. anyone who's ever done a cartwheel can tell you that you have to use your arms to get your weight up. and couldn't he have at least clutched the arm for a second or something after he'd done it?

 

ok, let's compare this match to wrestlewar. let's say steamboat's finisher was some type of arm submission move. let's also say that he suplexed flair on to his own arm 3 times, as well as putting flair in his finisher twice. if flair held up the title with his left hand after all that, i would've been really pissed. there's a world of difference between ten minutes of armbars and a wrestler's finisher.

 

the selling doesn't stop after the match. i'm not saying rvd is worse than the rest of the roster, because two thirds of the roster doesn't know how to keep selling after the match. i enjoyed the match a lot, & i wanted to enjoy it more. i wanted to suspend my disbelief & think that rvd was hurt, but the sloppy selling kept me from enjoying the match as much as i should have.

[Guest bps "The Truth" 21]

"his shoulder thrusts were the only way his offense was affected in any way. all his other spots (cartwheeling, going up for the 5 star) looked exactly like they always do. he didn't allow the arm work to affect his performance as a whole, he apparently thought he could get it over simply by not being able to do the shoulder thrusts. anyone who's ever done a cartwheel can tell you that you have to use your arms to get your weight up. and couldn't he have at least clutched the arm for a second or something after he'd done it? "

 

 

He didn't cartwheel after the arm was worked over. He cartwheeled the first time he tried it...which he mised then got slapped in the crossface. After that he didn't do any cartwheels...he did the rolling thunder that has nothing to do with the arm...the tumble one.

 

 

 

 

"ok, let's compare this match to wrestlewar. let's say steamboat's finisher was some type of arm submission move. let's also say that he suplexed flair on to his own arm 3 times, as well as putting flair in his finisher twice. if flair held up the title with his left hand after all that, i would've been really pissed. there's a world of difference between ten minutes of armbars and a wrestler's finisher. "

 

 

Yeah...and if Steamboats finisher wasn't the double chicken wing...(which is an arm submission) I guess this last paragraph would have been worth typing.

 

"the selling doesn't stop after the match. i'm not saying rvd is worse than the rest of the roster, because two thirds of the roster doesn't know how to keep selling after the match. i enjoyed the match a lot, & i wanted to enjoy it more. i wanted to suspend my disbelief & think that rvd was hurt, but the sloppy selling kept me from enjoying the match as much as i should have."

 

 

Every match RVD wrestles...a thread pops up about his selling.

 

Meanwhile...HBK is doing kipups after having his formerly broken back destroyed to people salivating.

 

There is a double standard here.

[Guest the 1inch punch]

People live in South Dakota? I thought it was just there to protect the rest of the country in case Canada invades and gets through North Dakota.

Just so you know, I'm Irish, and thats pretty much what the rest of the world thinks

[Guest godthedog]

wasn't steamboat's finisher the flying body press? i thought they were just making a big deal about the chicken wing because flair had submitted to it at the clash.

 

the point is moot anyway. flair was in the chicken wing for all of a second & a half before he made the ropes. rvd was in the crossface for 2 or 3 minutes. world of difference.

 

and, partly due to shawn's selling (mostly due to his lack of speed), hhh/hbk WASN'T as good as rvd/benoit.

 

like i said: i enjoyed the match a lot, but it could've been way better.

[Guest Brian]

I don't think there's a double standard. People are still so caught up in the most part with marking out that they've failed to recognize that HBK failed to sell the back. Just like RVD failed to sell the arm (but not to the same degree), and as Edge rendered the arm work pointless. It wasn't just the cartwheel, it was the fact that the crossface was never a threat despite the work, it was that he was incosistent, it was the frog splash at the end.