This has gotten fucking ridiculous

[Guest Choken One]

Don't get AS hyped...

[Guest RavishingRickRudo]

But it's showing no signs of improvement. It's getting worse. Even if it magically turns around at the PPV, a one month even build? Why should the feud only be good for one month?

 

Because they want their first match to be at wrestlemania. They can't go for 3 Months having Brock and Angle directly feud with each other without having a match.

[Guest Anglesault]

Ya know what Buggers me AS? U never make observations about anything else other then Angle and Brock...You are very one dimisional, Expand your hatred and contempt to more then just one set of characters.

 

I don't follow.

 

Because they want their first match to be at wrestlemania. They can't go for 3 Months having Brock and Angle directly feud with each other without having a match

 

Then stop having Brock go over Angle and Team Angle in beat downs and such.

[Guest RavishingRickRudo]

The Heros Journey:

 

The Separation

 

The Call

The Call invites we into the adventure, offers us the opportunity to face the unknown and gain something of physical or spiritual value. We may choose willingly to undertake the quest, or we may be dragged into it unwillingly.

 

The Call may come boldly as a "transformative crisis," a sudden, often traumatic change in our lives. Or it can sneak up on us gradually, with our first perception of it being a vague sense of discontent, imbalance or incongruity in our lives. Within this range the Call can take many forms:

 

We have had something taken from us, our family, or our society; our quest is to reclaim it,

we sense that there is something lacking in our life, and we must find what is missing,

we want to save or restore honor Å our own, our family's, or our country's.

 

We realize that something is not permitted to members of our society, and we must win these rights for our people.

 

On a psychological level, the call might be an awareness of a shift in our spiritual or emotional "center of gravity." We discover that we have outgrown the roles we are playing or the environment in which we live.

 

The Threshold

 

Once called to the adventure, we must pass over the Threshold. The Threshold is the "jumping off point" for the adventure. It is the interface between the known and the unknown. In the known world, we feel secure because we know the landscape and the rules. Once past the threshold, however, we enter the unknown, a world filled with challenges and dangers.

 

Often at the threshold, we encounter people, beings, or situations which block our passage. These "threshold guardians" have two functions. They protect us by keeping us from taking journeys for which we are unready or unprepared. However, once we are ready to meet the challenge, they step aside and point the way. More importantly, to pass the guardian is to make a commitment, to say: "I'm ready. I can do this."

 

Early in our lives, our parents function as our threshold guardians. They try to keep us from doing things which would cause us harm. As we get older, our parents' job becomes more difficult. They must both protect and push, measuring our capabilities against the challenges we must face.

 

As adults, our threshold guardians are much more insidious. They are our fears, our doubts, our ineffective thought and behavior patterns. In fact, they may be the "dragon in disguise," our greatest fear, the catalyst for the journey, taunting and threatening, daring us to face him in the abyss.

 

Also at the threshold (and very often later in the journey), we will encounter a helper (or helpers). Helpers provide assistance or direction. Often they bring us a divine gift, such as a talisman, which will help our through the ordeal ahead.

 

The most important of these helpers is the mentor or guide. The mentor keeps we focused on our goal and gives us stability, a psychological foundation for when the danger is greatest.

 

Helpers and guides may appear throughout the journey. Fortunately, they tend to appear at the most opportune moments. The Swiss psychologist called these "meaningful coincidences" synchronicity.

 

We need to understand, too, that the journey is ours. Our mentor and helpers can assist and point the way, but they cannot take take the journey for us. The challenge is ours, must be ours if we are to benefit from it and grow.

 

The Initiation

 

The Challenges

 

Once past the Threshold, we begin the journey into the unknown. The voyage can be outward into a physical unknown or inward to a psychological unknown. Whichever direction the voyage takes, our adventure puts us more and more at risk, emotionally and physically.

On our quest, we faces a series of challenges or temptations. The early challenges are relatively easy. By meeting them successfully, we build maturity, skill and confidence. As our journey progresses, the challenges become more and more difficult, testing us to the utmost, forcing us to change and grow.

 

One of our greatest tests on the journey is to differentiate real helpers from "tempters." Tempters try to pull us away from our path. They use fear, doubt or distraction. They may pretend to be a friend or counselor in an effort to divert our energy to their own needs, uses or beliefs. We must rely on our sense of purpose and judgment and the advise of our mentor to help us recognize true helpers.

 

Whatever the challenges we face, they always seem to strike our greatest weakness: our poorest skill, our shakiest knowledge, our most vulnerable emotions. Furthermore, the challenges always reflect needs and fears, for it is only by directly facing these weaknesses that we can acknowledge and and incorporate them, turn them from demons to gods. If we can't do this, the adventure ends and we must turn back.

 

Into the Abyss

 

When we reach the Abyss, we face the greatest challenge of the journey. The challenge is so great at this point that we must surrender ourselves completely to the adventure and become one with it. In the Abyss he must face our greatest fear, and we must face alone. Here is where he must "slay the dragon," which often takes the shape of something we dread, or have repressed or need to resolve.

 

There is always the possibility that, because we are unprepared or have a flaw in our character, the challenge beats us. Or perhaps we can't surrender ourselves to it and must retreat. In any case, unless we set off to try again, our life becomes a bitter shadow of what it could have been.

 

Transformation and Revelaton

 

As we conquer the Abyss and overcome our fears, our transformation becomes complete. The final step in the process is a moment of death and rebirth: a part of us dies so that a new part can be born. Fear must die to make way for courage. Ignorance must die for the birth of enlightenment. Dependency and irresponsibility must die so that independence and power can grow.

 

Part of the Transformation process is a Revelation, a sudden, dramatic change in the way we think or view life. This change in thinking is crucial because it makes us truly a different person. (The Revelation usually occurs during or after the Abyss, but sometimes it may actually lead us into the Abyss.)

 

The Atonement

 

After we have been transformed, we go on to achieve Atonement, that is we are "at-one" with our new self. We have incorporated the changes caused by the Journey and we are fully "reborn." In a spiritual sense, the Transformation has brought us into harmony with life and the world. The imbalance which sent us on the journey has been corrected -- until the next call.

 

The Return

 

After Transformation and Atonement, we face the final stage of our journey: our Return to everyday life. Upon our return, we discover our gift, which has been bestowed upon us based on our new level of skill and awareness. We may become richer or stronger, we may become a great leader, or we may become enlightened spiritually.

 

The essence of the return is to begin contributing to our society. In mythology, some heroes return to save or renew their community in some way. Other mythological heroes return to create a city, nation, or religion.

 

Sometimes, however, things don't go smoothly. For example, we may return with a great spiritual message, but find that our message is rejected. We are ostracized or even killed our for our ideal. We also run the risk of losing our new understanding, having it corrupted by putting ourselves back in the same situation or environment we left earlier.

 

In some cases, the hero discover that her new level of awareness and understanding is far greater than than the people around her. She may then become disillusioned or frustrated and leave society to be on her own. On the other hand, many great heroes such as Buddha and Jesus have sacrificed the bliss of enlightenment or heaven to remain in the world and teach others.

[Guest Choken One]

Ya know what Buggers me AS? U never make observations about anything else other then Angle and Brock...You are very one dimisional, Expand your hatred and contempt to more then just one set of characters.

 

I don't follow.

 

U never talk about anything else other then God Damn Angle...

[Guest EternallyLazy]

I also see Angle retaining at Mania. The money is in the chase

[JN News 0]

The Heros Journey:

 

The Separation

 

The Call

The Call invites we into the adventure, offers us the opportunity to face the unknown and gain something of physical or spiritual value. We may choose willingly to undertake the quest, or we may be dragged into it unwillingly.

 

The Call may come boldly as a "transformative crisis," a sudden, often traumatic change in our lives. Or it can sneak up on us gradually, with our first perception of it being a vague sense of discontent, imbalance or incongruity in our lives. Within this range the Call can take many forms:

 

We have had something taken from us, our family, or our society; our quest is to reclaim it,

we sense that there is something lacking in our life, and we must find what is missing,

we want to save or restore honor Å our own, our family's, or our country's.

 

We realize that something is not permitted to members of our society, and we must win these rights for our people.

 

On a psychological level, the call might be an awareness of a shift in our spiritual or emotional "center of gravity." We discover that we have outgrown the roles we are playing or the environment in which we live.

 

The Threshold

 

Once called to the adventure, we must pass over the Threshold. The Threshold is the "jumping off point" for the adventure. It is the interface between the known and the unknown. In the known world, we feel secure because we know the landscape and the rules. Once past the threshold, however, we enter the unknown, a world filled with challenges and dangers.

 

Often at the threshold, we encounter people, beings, or situations which block our passage. These "threshold guardians" have two functions. They protect us by keeping us from taking journeys for which we are unready or unprepared. However, once we are ready to meet the challenge, they step aside and point the way. More importantly, to pass the guardian is to make a commitment, to say: "I'm ready. I can do this."

 

Early in our lives, our parents function as our threshold guardians. They try to keep us from doing things which would cause us harm. As we get older, our parents' job becomes more difficult. They must both protect and push, measuring our capabilities against the challenges we must face.

 

As adults, our threshold guardians are much more insidious. They are our fears, our doubts, our ineffective thought and behavior patterns. In fact, they may be the "dragon in disguise," our greatest fear, the catalyst for the journey, taunting and threatening, daring us to face him in the abyss.

 

Also at the threshold (and very often later in the journey), we will encounter a helper (or helpers). Helpers provide assistance or direction. Often they bring us a divine gift, such as a talisman, which will help our through the ordeal ahead.

 

The most important of these helpers is the mentor or guide. The mentor keeps we focused on our goal and gives us stability, a psychological foundation for when the danger is greatest.

 

Helpers and guides may appear throughout the journey. Fortunately, they tend to appear at the most opportune moments. The Swiss psychologist called these "meaningful coincidences" synchronicity.

 

We need to understand, too, that the journey is ours. Our mentor and helpers can assist and point the way, but they cannot take take the journey for us. The challenge is ours, must be ours if we are to benefit from it and grow.

 

The Initiation

 

The Challenges

 

Once past the Threshold, we begin the journey into the unknown. The voyage can be outward into a physical unknown or inward to a psychological unknown. Whichever direction the voyage takes, our adventure puts us more and more at risk, emotionally and physically.

On our quest, we faces a series of challenges or temptations. The early challenges are relatively easy. By meeting them successfully, we build maturity, skill and confidence. As our journey progresses, the challenges become more and more difficult, testing us to the utmost, forcing us to change and grow.

 

One of our greatest tests on the journey is to differentiate real helpers from "tempters." Tempters try to pull us away from our path. They use fear, doubt or distraction. They may pretend to be a friend or counselor in an effort to divert our energy to their own needs, uses or beliefs. We must rely on our sense of purpose and judgment and the advise of our mentor to help us recognize true helpers.

 

Whatever the challenges we face, they always seem to strike our greatest weakness: our poorest skill, our shakiest knowledge, our most vulnerable emotions. Furthermore, the challenges always reflect needs and fears, for it is only by directly facing these weaknesses that we can acknowledge and and incorporate them, turn them from demons to gods. If we can't do this, the adventure ends and we must turn back.

 

Into the Abyss

 

When we reach the Abyss, we face the greatest challenge of the journey. The challenge is so great at this point that we must surrender ourselves completely to the adventure and become one with it. In the Abyss he must face our greatest fear, and we must face alone. Here is where he must "slay the dragon," which often takes the shape of something we dread, or have repressed or need to resolve.

 

There is always the possibility that, because we are unprepared or have a flaw in our character, the challenge beats us. Or perhaps we can't surrender ourselves to it and must retreat. In any case, unless we set off to try again, our life becomes a bitter shadow of what it could have been.

 

Transformation and Revelaton

 

As we conquer the Abyss and overcome our fears, our transformation becomes complete. The final step in the process is a moment of death and rebirth: a part of us dies so that a new part can be born. Fear must die to make way for courage. Ignorance must die for the birth of enlightenment. Dependency and irresponsibility must die so that independence and power can grow.

 

Part of the Transformation process is a Revelation, a sudden, dramatic change in the way we think or view life. This change in thinking is crucial because it makes us truly a different person. (The Revelation usually occurs during or after the Abyss, but sometimes it may actually lead us into the Abyss.)

 

The Atonement

 

After we have been transformed, we go on to achieve Atonement, that is we are "at-one" with our new self. We have incorporated the changes caused by the Journey and we are fully "reborn." In a spiritual sense, the Transformation has brought us into harmony with life and the world. The imbalance which sent us on the journey has been corrected -- until the next call.

 

The Return

 

After Transformation and Atonement, we face the final stage of our journey: our Return to everyday life. Upon our return, we discover our gift, which has been bestowed upon us based on our new level of skill and awareness. We may become richer or stronger, we may become a great leader, or we may become enlightened spiritually.

 

The essence of the return is to begin contributing to our society. In mythology, some heroes return to save or renew their community in some way. Other mythological heroes return to create a city, nation, or religion.

 

Sometimes, however, things don't go smoothly. For example, we may return with a great spiritual message, but find that our message is rejected. We are ostracized or even killed our for our ideal. We also run the risk of losing our new understanding, having it corrupted by putting ourselves back in the same situation or environment we left earlier.

 

In some cases, the hero discover that her new level of awareness and understanding is far greater than than the people around her. She may then become disillusioned or frustrated and leave society to be on her own. On the other hand, many great heroes such as Buddha and Jesus have sacrificed the bliss of enlightenment or heaven to remain in the world and teach others.

That's a great post. But, could you shed a little light on this?

[Guest TheHulkster]

Haas and Benjamin win the belts clean from the Guerreros even though they have only been on TV for a few weeks and Angle has held the belt since December, with 2 clean wins over Benoit. They must've called Stephanie fat to get that kind of burial.

[Guest RavishingRickRudo]

The Heros Journey is a univeral theme, and it's used in wrestling.

 

The Separation

 

The Call: We have had something taken from us, our family, or our society; our quest is to reclaim it, we sense that there is something lacking in our life, and we must find what is missing, we want to save or restore honor Å our own, our family's, or our country's.

 

Heyman turns on Brock, Big Show steals the title. Angle then inturn gets the title from big show.

 

The Threshold: Once called to the adventure, we must pass over the Threshold. The Threshold is the "jumping off point" for the adventure. It is the interface between the known and the unknown. In the known world, we feel secure because we know the landscape and the rules. Once past the threshold, however, we enter the unknown, a world filled with challenges and dangers.

 

Often at the threshold, we encounter people, beings, or situations which block our passage. These "threshold guardians" have two functions. They protect us by keeping us from taking journeys for which we are unready or unprepared. However, once we are ready to meet the challenge, they step aside and point the way. More importantly, to pass the guardian is to make a commitment, to say: "I'm ready. I can do this."

 

Brock vs. Big Show and the Royal Rumble.

 

Initiation

 

The Challenges: On our quest, we faces a series of challenges or temptations. The early challenges are relatively easy. By meeting them successfully, we build maturity, skill and confidence.

 

Brock Lesnar right now. This is what Anglesault is complaining about.

 

As our journey progresses, the challenges become more and more difficult, testing us to the utmost, forcing us to change and grow.

 

This is what will happen around/after No Mercy.

 

The rest should happen at WM.

[Guest Goodear]

Considering that AngleSault has declared Angle's career over about three times now, I find it highly amusing that people will even talk to him about this topic anymore.

 

Brock is beating up A-Train and probably John Cena... Kurt Angle is beating Edge, Rey Mysterio, and Chris Benoit clean as a whistle while his fucking boring ass lackeys beat Los Guerreros for the tag titles. Both guys are getting pushed towards Wrestlemania with Angle actually getting the better in ring push at the moment. Brock runs out simply to send the folks home happy after Angle beats someone and wet the fans appetites for the actual showdown. I could care less if Shelton, Haas, and Big Show get buried in the process.

[Guest notJames]

Lesnar administering a beatdown at the end of the show makes perfect sense. All three wrestled lengthy matches, whereas the most Lesnar did all night was make booboo-kittyfuck-eyes at Hogan. A fresh überface will always get the upperhand on three worn-down heels with 30 seconds left in the program. And it's not like Lesnar got his hands on Angle, either. So that matchup is still somewhat safe.

 

I see the 6-man tag at NWO ending with Angle pinning Brock for sure.

[Guest Anglesault]

Haas and Benjamin win the belts clean from the Guerreros even though they have only been on TV for a few weeks and Angle has held the belt since December, with 2 clean wins over Benoit. They must've called Stephanie fat to get that kind of burial.

Angle is NOT being buried. Brock is being built too damn well. NO ONE can beat a man with no weaknesses.

[Guest Anglesault]

The Challenges: On our quest, we faces a series of challenges or temptations. The early challenges are relatively easy. By meeting them successfully, we build maturity, skill and confidence.

 

Brock Lesnar right now. This is what Anglesault is complaining about.

 

No, that was the Big Show. The World Champion and the Tag Champions should present SOME sort of challenge to this man.

[Guest THE MIGHTY THOR]

I guess you guys didn't get the memo, Brockmania is runnin' wild.

[Guest RavishingRickRudo]

No, Big show was the theshold.

 

Who says that Team Angle won't provide to be challenges? Again, they have from No Mercy to Wrestlemania to beat the hero down.

[Guest Human Fly]

Go to Wrestlemania.com and look at the match logo for Angle v. Brock. Brock is all huge, in focus and center of the picture and Angle is small, blurry, and peeking over Brock's shoulder. It's stuff like that that gets on my nerves.

 

Before Angle worries about Brock he needs to get past Edge first, he succumbed to the spear again last night. At NWO they should have Angle go over Edge clean. Screw the 6 man tag.

[Guest Anglesault]

Who says that Team Angle won't provide to be challenges?

 

Are they gonna nuke him? Because he seems to be in firm control of them both times they faced off. (Rumble) This is Two men, people. The Tag Champions. Brock beats them without breaking a sweat. He also destroyed Angle (WWF champ) and Big Show (Big fat guy) at the same time.

[Guest BorneAgain]

Again, they have from No Mercy to Wrestlemania to beat the hero down.

Between No Way Out and Wrestlemania I believe is what you mean

[Guest ManKinnd]

You know what AS, even if what you're saying is all true, that Angle is finished after Wrestlemania, won't he still be wrestling SOMEone, SOMEwhere on the card, in *** or **** matches? And isn't that what matters in the end?

[Guest RavishingRickRudo]

Yeah, that's the second time in the same thread that I put No Mercy instead of No Way Out... Fuckin No... Fucking Mercy....

 

Who knows what the WWF could be planning with Team Angle - for all we know they will try to break brocks ankle so 1)he can't do the F5 and 2)he will tap to the Ankle lock. Then the uphill struggle begins.

[EL DANDY~! 0]

Brock did it BY SURPRISE to Team Angle. That means he has one up on them and that he has started his road to Wrestlemania. Now, you can't judge one damn after-match brawl and say Brock will never be beaten.

[Guest RavishingRickRudo]

He's anglesault, of course he can

[Guest Choken One]

I'm thinking the ONE Case incident of an attack was really just to sell NWO instead...

[Guest Agent of Oblivion]

No, brock is being built so huge because he's a fucking MONSTROSITY of a babyface. Remember Goldberg's streak? His character went to shit after he looked weak. Luckily, people have pretty much forgotten that Brock got pinned by Show, since Show is a universal joke anyway. For Brock's character to be effective right now, he needs to completely destroy everyone in his way, including Angle at WM, until the heels finally outsmart him, THEN you get the chase. This isn't rocket science.

[Guest FeArHaVoC]

Anglesault bitched, kicked, Whined and Cried when Brock got his push without paying dues.

 

How come AS hasn't bitched about Team Angle getting Pushed & Winning the Tag Belts from the Guerrero's without paying their dues?

[Guest Anglesault]

You know what AS, even if what you're saying is all true, that Angle is finished after Wrestlemania, won't he still be wrestling SOMEone, SOMEwhere on the card, in *** or **** matches? And isn't that what matters in the end?

 

No, not really. I'd rather have a guy get rewarded and finish the show with his good matches than get punished for having good matches by being demoted.

 

Now, you can't judge one damn after-match brawl and say Brock will never be beaten.

 

Well, there was the time he killed Angle and broke Angle's leg in a one on two environment, and the 78 times he's outsmarted Paul Heyman, and taking both members of TA out at the Rumble.

 

For Brock's character to be effective right now, he needs to completely destroy everyone in his way, including Angle at WM,

 

THAT will cement Angle as a main eventer.

 

I bitched because Brock WAS NOT AT ALL over until September, and not Main event over until October. And his matches sucked.::Checks TA:: Nope, niether apply.

[Guest The Amazing Rando]

AS...

 

I will agree that Brock shouldn't be getting the upperhand so much...but you can't argue with this fact:

 

Angle is OVER. Period. Just because he loses a match or even loses his title won't kick him out of the main event scene. He has proved it to everyone that he is worthy of keeping a main event spot for a long time and I don't see him losing it just because of Brock beating him all the time.

 

Brock will have to lose to Angle sometime....and when it happens I'm sure that you will be the happiest of all. Just let things happen. I am not cheering him any less because Brock beats him...nor are fans booing him any less because of that. Benoit and Angle got another standing ovation at Smackdown...but it lead to the swerve/beatdown stuff...but before that the crowd was solidly behind both of them...only caring about who was wrestling, and not who was going to run in.

[Guest Your Olympic Hero]

Simple. Edge, Benoit, & Brock vs. Team Angle at No Way Out. Angle gets the clean pin over Brock and they beat him down afterwards, shutting a chair over his ankle and stomping it. Brock has been pinned and injured in a way that makes Angle's finisher even more deadly. This gives Angle a chance in hell of winning.

[Guest Kotzenjunge]

Actually, I see bitching about Angle beating Brock also, but that's beside the point I wanted to make originally.

 

You said that between No Way Out and Wrestlemania isn't enough for a good build to a match. I'd like to direct you to Rock v. Austin, Wrestlemania XVII. Granted, there was no split then and they had twice the programs to have things happen, but in this year's case, No Way Out will help to kick the build into overdrive. Notice how this is the first time in years that they've said outright that specifically Angle and Lesnar were facing each other at Wrestlemania. Normally it's just "(insert Rumble winner) faces the champion at Wrestlemania," but the announcers are already starting the hype.

[Guest Anglesault]

AS...

 

I will agree that Brock shouldn't be getting the upperhand so much...but you can't argue with this fact:

 

Angle is OVER. Period. Just because he loses a match or even loses his title won't kick him out of the main event scene

He's been demoted from the mains 3 or 4 times already. he was always over st the time of demotion.

 

HOWEVER,Besides Brock, he most certainly is the most credible guy on SD!, because in everything that doesn't involve Brock, he's booked VERY strong, so he probably should be staying up.

 

But week after week after week after week of Brock going over really isn't helping that cause.

 

Simple. Edge, Benoit, & Brock vs. Team Angle at No Way Out. Angle gets the clean pin over Brock and they beat him down afterwards, shutting a chair over his ankle and stomping it. Brock has been pinned and injured in a way that makes Angle's finisher even more deadly. This gives Angle a chance in hell of winning.

 

Perfect.