The One and Only Angel Season 5 Thread

[Guest Brian]

The thing is...if they did show the battle, how would they end it? Angel signed away his chance at the Shanshu.

Spike takes it. He doesn't have as much to suffer for. Spike chose to get his soul.

 

Angel always going to be the guy working towards something he can never achieve. That's kind of what the shows about: Angel can't win, because there's no way to leiminate the evil, but he can fight the good fight and have the small victories.

 

Where did Lindsay learn to fight so well.

 

Oh, I loved this episode. Tied everything together so well. So fucking beautiful. So sad at times.

[Mecha Mummy 0]

That was... Wow. Just... wow.

[LaParkaYourCar 0]

The thing is...if they did show the battle, how would they end it?  Angel signed away his chance at the Shanshu.

Spike takes it. He doesn't have as much to suffer for. Spike chose to get his soul.

 

Angel always going to be the guy working towards something he can never achieve. That's kind of what the shows about: Angel can't win, because there's no way to leiminate the evil, but he can fight the good fight and have the small victories.

 

Where did Lindsay learn to fight so well.

 

Oh, I loved this episode. Tied everything together so well. So fucking beautiful. So sad at times.

Lindsey seems like the kind of guy that would learn to fight in his time away.

 

I think everyone dying, or presumably dying, is the best way to go out. Better yet leaving it up to the viewer to decide whether they died like some tale of old with no end is the best way.

[Molotov The Bear 0]

Yeah. And if they were to explore on it more, I think the best way would be in a Connor spinoff. The first episode starts off with Connor roaming the streets of LA after the big battle's over with (still keeping the "leaving it to the viewers imagination" thing) and maybe finding things around like spike's duster, or Illyria's arm, stuff like that.

[Guest Brian]

I think it's really the way to go. From what I've gathered watching reruns and the DVD's (and this season), Angel's story is really linked to this continuous fight where there is no real conclusion, and this is what makes it so much different than Buffy. How can you give finality to a show like that?

[LaParkaYourCar 0]

My only wish is that they made the Connor/Angel scenes a little more emotional. It was the moment that Connor finally showed some respect for his father and yet it didn't have the emotion it could have had.

 

Oh and I loved the scene with Angel and Lindsey.

 

Angel: I want you Lindsey.........I need to find a way to rephrase that.

Lindsey: Yeah!

[Edwin MacPhisto 0]

Oh god. Jesus christ, guys. That was incredible. You all said it, but I'll say it again. IN-FUCKING-CREDIBLE.

 

I would have loved the series to continue. But I could not be happier with that ending. I called Lorne leaving, but not in the fashion he did. When he shot Lindsey, it all came together. My god. I didn't even guess that was what would happen, it was laid out so perfectly. That was the mark-out moment. Lorne's character, despite little screen time, has quietly matured all season long, especially in the last run of episodes.

 

Or maybe Angel vamping was the mark-out moment. This episode went to the roots of EVERYTHING that Angel and the Buffyverse has been about. Wes' death? Tears. But perfect. One of the best death scenes in the Buffyverse, a fantastic, true end to his story. The woman he loves his dead - he goes out fighting, and even in his gloom he's changed Illyria into something greater for the world. Illyria's tears - you've already all said it, but wow. My favorite part of this season gets the perfect conclusion. Connor showing up and being the son Angel always wanted him to be, the Godfather-style takedown of every member of the Black Thorns...and the Hamilton fight, which was GREAT. Suddenly the whole thing had so much more impact when he said he had the power of the Wolf, Ram, and Hart flowing through his blood. Angel actually did achieve victory over them - he did what he does best, took their power away from them physically, and then beat down their #1 boy. Gunn fighting the vampires? Going back to street Gunn? Keeping going despite the adversity? It's so great.

 

To top it all off: the Butch and Sundance ending. This series ends, plunging through darkness with a spirit of unbelievable triumph and heroism. It's about doing the hard thing and doing it to the last. Last year, I thought "Chosen" was a pretty good series finale. "Not Fade Away" was an incredible series finale.

[Guest Brian]

Just seeing him thank Angel was enough for me. And Connor wanting to fight with him. But it's always sorta emotional when you get a father-son moment like that, especially since you can't really expect much more given what Connor's gone through.

[LaParkaYourCar 0]

Illyria saying "Wes is dead...I grieve for him and I cannot control it. I want more violence!" had me marking out!

[Molotov The Bear 0]

Illyria saying "Wes is dead...I grieve for him and I cannot control it. I want more violence!" had me marking out!

That was awesome.

[Edwin MacPhisto 0]

Another wonderful note: tuning into "Bad Girls" over 5 years ago to see the first appearance of Wesley Wyndham-Price, who would have ever guessed that this stuck-up caricature would go out in a blaze of blissed-out, angsty glory in the closest thing he could find to his one true love? Enchanting.

[Edwin MacPhisto 0]

So I just hopped back to the spoilers RRR posted and some of you guys chattered about, back on page 84 of this monstrous thread. Here's my question: were you all expecting Gunn to die, as those early spoilers indicated, or did something come up beforehand that tipped you off to his actual survival?

[LaParkaYourCar 0]

So I just hopped back to the spoilers RRR posted and some of you guys chattered about, back on page 84 of this monstrous thread. Here's my question: were you all expecting Gunn to die, as those early spoilers indicated, or did something come up beforehand that tipped you off to his actual survival?

I read the second set of spoilers that said Gunn's death wasn't actually going to happen. I'm glad, because I think it would have been too much death with both Lindsey and Wes dying.

[Guest Brian]

Shit. The Buffyverse is over.

[LaParkaMarka 0]

That was so freaking awesome. I am very, very sad that this show is over, and I'm not sure what I can add to this discussion that hasn't already been said. But hey, whatever.

 

1) Illyria + Exploding Head Punch = win.

2) Gunn + Axe + Double Stakes of Doom = win

3) Spike using the day off to read poetry.

4) Connor making the save. I actually like the new Connor now...he has the old Connor edge, without the annoying Linkin Park angst. I would watch his spinoff.

5) Harmony turning on Angel, and Angel knowing all about it. Good times.

6) Lorne and Lindsey. I didn't see that coming from a million miles away. Wow. Awesome.

7) The look on Eve's face when Angel tells her Lindsey isn't coming. Excellent stuff.

8) Wes. I <3 Wes, and <3++ Illyria.

9) Fuck the WB, fuck them up their stupid asses.

 

I know this thread isn't ending yet, but it's been really fun discussing the show with you guys. We've had a lot of good times in both the Buffy and Angel threads, from arguing over season 4 to publicly lusting after Amy Acker to making lame pictures of RRR and the Beast. Good times indeed.

[LaParkaYourCar 0]

I just rewatched the "thank you" from the WB and at the end it says "from your friends at the WB"......that's just cold...damn cold.

[Guest wrestlingbs]

Yeah. And if they were to explore on it more, I think the best way would be in a Connor spinoff. The first episode starts off with Connor roaming the streets of LA after the big battle's over with (still keeping the "leaving it to the viewers imagination" thing) and maybe finding things around like spike's duster, or Illyria's arm, stuff like that.

That's terrible. And not just story-telling wise, either. I mean, what's Connor going to do, pick up a clump of dust and say, "Oh my God, Daddy!" I'd rather have no new spinoff than that.

 

I like the ending they had. It makes sense, really. Not only does the viewer conclude what happens next, but it also fixes any problems if they do or do not get picked up. If they do, it still leads things open for more story. If they don't, it ends things nicely.

 

And for anyone who doubts they could bring Angel and the AAs out of that ending, look at the end of Season 5 of Buffy. She was a freakin corpse in the ground at the end and she was slayin vamps by Ep. 2 of Season 6.

[Molotov The Bear 0]

I just rewatched the "thank you" from the WB and at the end it says "from your friends at the WB"......that's just cold...damn cold.

It is. It comes off really asshole-ish. Almost like a big "fuck you" from the wb to all the save angel campaigns and stuff.

[Anya 0]

It bugs me that they would all die, or perhaps worse that we just don't know. Yeah, I get the whole "the fight never ends" thing but I care about the characters too much for a cliffhanger ending or for them to all die. I also think it kind of goes against the spirit of it all. Ok so they stopped armageddon and have seriously hurt the partners but now what? They're all gone. Two champions are no more all just to piss off the bad guys? That's weaksauce and makes no sense for the long term. The idea that the fight never ends, that his redemption is forever doesn't mean he should just go for a suicide mission. I thought Angel was better and more noble than that.

[LaParkaMarka 0]

I just rewatched the "thank you" from the WB and at the end it says "from your friends at the WB"......that's just cold...damn cold.

It is. It comes off really asshole-ish. Almost like a big "fuck you" from the wb to all the save angel campaigns and stuff.

This is why WB must die.

 

I'm not sure what to watch next year. Alias is ok, but I was never very into it. Smallville is fine, but it constantly gets moved around here in Canada so it's tough to watch it. Maybe I'll start watching 24.

[Molotov The Bear 0]

Besides Smallville and 24, the "new" fall lineup looks like complete shit.

[LaParkaYourCar 0]

I just rewatched the "thank you" from the WB and at the end it says "from your friends at the WB"......that's just cold...damn cold.

It is. It comes off really asshole-ish. Almost like a big "fuck you" from the wb to all the save angel campaigns and stuff.

This is why WB must die.

 

I'm not sure what to watch next year. Alias is ok, but I was never very into it. Smallville is fine, but it constantly gets moved around here in Canada so it's tough to watch it. Maybe I'll start watching 24.

That stinks because next season of Smallville is shaping up to be quite good after tonight's finale. If it weren't for Smallville I'd give up on the WB, but I still want to watch Smallville.

 

However, I'm still pissed at the way the WB just cancelled Angel on short notice and then tried to act like they really cared about the show.

[Anya 0]

They didn't cancel it on short notice, they told ME like halfway through the season.

[fazzle 0]

I......I don't know WHAT to think about the series finale. It was a damn good episode, but then, that ending? Do I hate it? Do I love it? I don't fucking know. It feels too damn incomplete. It feels like a great START to a series finale. When's part 2?

 

If only they would have started this end arc two weeks ago, instead of that stupid fucking pointless Rome episode.

[LaParkaYourCar 0]

They didn't cancel it on short notice, they told ME like halfway through the season.

That's shorter notice than a show like Angel needs. The storylines have gone on too long to wrap up in that short of notice.

[Anya 0]

That's silly. You cannot make WB the bad guy because they didn't give ME like a year to wrap their canceled show up. Telling them halfway through like they did is perfectly reasonble and shows that they did care about it. Some shows don't even get near that treatment. Just look at Firefly.

 

 

Everyone seems to forget season 5 was questionable to begin with. If it wasn't for James Marsters it probably wouldn't have happened.

[LaParkaYourCar 0]

Maybe I'm just upset.

 

On another note. Someone should make this a sig:

 

Two Roads

[The Ghost of bps21 0]

I don't see what's not to get about the ending.

 

What's the last image you see? Angel fighting.

 

What's the last image in Buffy? Buffy being done fighting.

 

Each finale perfectly represented the characters and where they stood after their shows had ended.

[Max Danger 0]

Yeah, what did some of you expect? Them to stop the apocolypse, and then for Angel(or Spike) to be Shanshued? The thing is, this was just another apocolypse. There were going to be more after this if they stopped it. There would always be more. It would never end, the fighting wouldn't stop, and eventually, no matter how long Angel lasted on earch, evil would still be there, plotting another apocolypse.

 

They just chose this time to make their stand. And now I go watch the finale again.

[Anya 0]

I didn't want him to become human or to defeat evil once and for all. He should continue to fight the good fight. But there's a difference between that and going on a suicide mission just to to temporarily make the Senior Partners mad and stop their latest plan. Tonight and last week he sounded beaten, like he was giving up and this was his last resort and they should just accept their deaths. That sucks. That isn't what he learned in Amends, or from Doyle, or from the ephinay after the Holland Manners speech. The fight never ends, evil is always there, but that means he has to keep going.....not purposely go out trying to stop one plan. Not just assume he's going to die. That attitude and that message is lame.