Triple H

[Guest Loss]

I will dislike HHH until he takes a permanent demotion to the midcard and puts Jericho over multiple times cleanly to revitalize him, which means I will dislike him forever.

[notJames 0]

HHH still bores me to tears, workrate or not.

 

And though only marginally related, I was amazed at how many "Let's Go Orton" chants there were last night. If the proposed HHH vs. Orton storyline does take place, I can almost see Orton being the one ousted from Evolution and feuding with them from the face side. Almost. But maybe because I just can't see HHH as a face.

[Promoter 0]

Maybe Orton jobbing last night is opening him up for Chris Benoit. Orton wins the title the following month at the second biggest show of the year to the disdain of Triple H. You know they might do it. If Eddie could lose his strap to friggin Bradshaw, I wouldn't put it past them to have Benoit job in Toronto against Orton. If Triple H is gone in the fall for his movie the chance is there for Orton to really say he is the new man. The build would be Orton/HHH for Mania, but I agree that I can't see HHH being the face in all of this.

[TheOriginalOrangeGoblin 0]

I got no problem with HHH these days, although I prefer Orton by miles.

 

But how was either guy protected last night? They BOTH look like shit. Benoit STILL can't win a meaningful singles match and HHH got ousted by a retard.

[Guest GreatOne]

I got no problem with HHH these days, although I prefer Orton by miles.

 

But how was either guy protected last night? They BOTH look like shit. Benoit STILL can't win a meaningful singles match and HHH got ousted by a retard.

And how the hell is that Benoit's fault? HHH enacts his "plan" since he can't beat Benoit, it explodes in his face. Just cause Benoit hasn't done it doesn't mean he CAN'T. Hell Benoit used HHH's own "plan" against him, that's being booked strong.

 

For a guy that smarks war with each other every other week about whether Benoit has what it takes--promos, presence, whatever, the guy's being booked pretty strong all things considered and some people can't recognize it. Hey if you wanna bitch about Kane being killed off yet again or Jericho being the unofficial luggage carrier of WWE the last year be my guest but don't spill it over here.

[Guest TheZsaszHorsemen]

I have never been more disgusted with a wrestling match than what happened tonight at Veangance. Not even with the Bret Hart/Yokuzana/Hogan Wrestlemania 9 disgrace. Benoit was screwed tonight and the way HHH is protected and made to look good is riduculous.

Why should benoit have won the match clean? If he did, there'd be no reason for a rematch.

[Guest Salacious Crumb]

They could've toned the end down a lot though. I think that's the point he's trying to make. Benoit doesn't have to beat him clean but there are more subtile ways to accomplish it and not toss Benoit into the shadows because "Eugene cost Triple H the title" which will be the entire focus of Raw.

[Dark Age 0]

I have never been more disgusted with a wrestling match than what happened tonight at Veangance. Not even with the Bret Hart/Yokuzana/Hogan Wrestlemania 9 disgrace. Benoit was screwed tonight and the way HHH is protected and made to look good is riduculous.

Why should benoit have won the match clean? If he did, there'd be no reason for a rematch.

Because we really need a rematch? How about Benoit dropping to the title to someone not named Triple H? Orton, Jericho, Christian, Batista, Edge, I really don't care. ANYONE but Triple H. It's boring. I don't care about last night's finish, Triple H can come out on Raw and call himself the best, I don't care. Just get him AWAY from the title scene.

[AndrewTS 0]

"Why should benoit have won the match clean? If he did, there'd be no reason for a rematch. "

 

Yeah, that sure as hell stopped HBK from getting 400 title shots.

[Guest TheZsaszHorsemen]

I have never been more disgusted with a wrestling match than what happened tonight at Veangance. Not even with the Bret Hart/Yokuzana/Hogan Wrestlemania 9 disgrace. Benoit was screwed tonight and the way HHH is protected and made to look good is riduculous.

Why should benoit have won the match clean? If he did, there'd be no reason for a rematch.

Because we really need a rematch? How about Benoit dropping to the title to someone not named Triple H? Orton, Jericho, Christian, Batista, Edge, I really don't care. ANYONE but Triple H. It's boring. I don't care about last night's finish, Triple H can come out on Raw and call himself the best, I don't care. Just get him AWAY from the title scene.

Yeah, Benoit/HHH would provide a pretty strong buyrate. Why waste the blowoff on Vengeance, which is like the 8th or 9th most important show of the year?

 

Thank god some of you don't actually run the company.

[AndrewTS 0]

"Yeah, Benoit/HHH would provide a pretty strong buyrate. "

 

Unless they actually bother to build it up, it won't be helping the buyrate.

 

You'd think Vengeance automatically going to have a lower buyrate than Summerslam would have made them decide to build that up a lot better than they did, but instead they didn't bother at all.

 

Surely they have to do better going into Summerslam...or it all the focus going to be on Eugene and Trips?

[Dark Age 0]

Becase Backlash brought in MILLIONS! Here's an idea: Why not just save the match for SummerSlam instead of having 2 matches? At the end of the day, the Vengeance bout isn't going to matter, the SummerSlam one is the blow-off.

 

Seriously, NO ONE on the active roster draws big money any more. Benoit vs Triple H at SummerSlam won't bring in an extra 500,000 buys. I'd say it would get pretty much the same amount of buyers as Benoit vs Jericho or Orton or whoever.

 

And did you even respond to anything I said, or just use my post as another excuse to post about how Triple H is the biggest draw, or the best or whatever?

 

And 'Thank God some Of you don't run the company? Wow, I feel so fulfilled now that I've recieved criticism from YOU! Thank you MrZsaysZ!

[Guest TheZsaszHorsemen]

"Yeah, Benoit/HHH would provide a pretty strong buyrate. "

 

Unless they actually bother to build it up, it won't be helping the buyrate.

 

You'd think Vengeance automatically going to have a lower buyrate than Summerslam would have made them decide to build that up a lot better than they did, but instead they didn't bother at all.

 

Surely they have to do better going into Summerslam...or it all the focus going to be on Eugene and Trips?

That's obviously true, but one can only hope they'd build it strong this time, with HHH claiming he was cheated out of his shot, and Benoit being stoic. Perhaps a gimmick to be added in the coming weeks as well.

[AndrewTS 0]

DarkAge makes a good point--nobody is really "a draw" these days except for guests appearances by Foley or Rock. *Now* is the time for experimenting and building long-term stars. Putting HHH right back on top again is just promoting more stagnation.

 

That's obviously true, but one can only hope they'd build it strong this time, with HHH claiming he was cheated out of his shot, and Benoit being stoic. Perhaps a gimmick to be added in the coming weeks as well.

 

So all we have is "a hope" they'll build it up?

 

What's the chances of that vs. "it's Summerslam, it'll sell anyway. Book more Eugene wackiness"?

[Guest TheZsaszHorsemen]

Becase Backlash brought in MILLIONS! Here's an idea: Why not just save the match for SummerSlam instead of having 2 matches? At the end of the day, the Vengeance bout isn't going to matter, the SummerSlam one is the blow-off.

 

Seriously, NO ONE on the active roster draws big money any more. Benoit vs Triple H at SummerSlam won't bring in an extra 500,000 buys. I'd say it would get pretty much the same amount of buyers as Benoit vs Jericho or Orton or whoever.

 

And did you even respond to anything I said, or just use my post as another excuse to post about how Triple H is the biggest draw, or the best or whatever?

 

And 'Thank God some Of you don't run the company? Wow, I feel so fulfilled now that I've recieved criticism from YOU! Thank you MrZsaysZ!

There really isn't a better choice for the Main Event of the second largest PPV then the blowoff to HHH/Benoit... PERIOD. It's the feud that was hinted at since before WrestleMania itself, and it deserves a decisive conclusion at the most important PPV possible.

 

SummerSlam deserves a match with a story that's at least a couple months old. The Elimination Chamber last year capped off all the storylines and challengers leading back to the weeks after Mania. Brock/Rock had a two month build. Austin/Angle had been hinted at since the weeks after KOTR. Rock/HHH/Angle had a doubly great build with the eternal Rock/HHH rivalry and the developing HHH/Angle story.

[AndrewTS 0]

The mere fact that Benoit/HHH happened at Vengeance doesn't mean it was a well-booked and built-up 2 month feud. They were both kind of "there" up until Vengeance, and had a match where HHH won the title. In the end, it isn't like that match made people care any more than if it was a one-month deal, simply because of the piss-poor way they handled it.

[Dark Age 0]

That would be all well and good, but at the end of the day it leaves us back where we started: Triple H as champion.

 

I'm not a Triple H hater, but the fact is, it's time for someone to 'beat' him. Not win a match against him, BEAT HIM. Who was the last guy to get the last laugh in a feud with Triple H? Undertaker in 2001? That would be fine, but Triple H is a BAD GUY. The good guy is supposed to win the feud, not the bad guy. Why not have H win last night, then Benoit wins at Slam to make it 2-1 in the series, win the blow-off, win the feud and both guys can move on to something else? Instead, we'll get Triple H winning the title, defeating ANOTHER babyface, and we'll be back at the point we where at 6 months ago.

 

That was to MrZ, btw.

Edited July 12, 2004 by Dark Age

[AndrewTS 0]

From S_D in the Raw thread:

 

"Meltzer said on the LAW last night that an idea for SummerSlam is being kicked around for HHH vs. Benoit vs. Eugene."

 

Whoopie.

[Lord of The Curry 0]

Oh yes, that HHH vs Angle feud really did set the fed on fire, didn't it?

 

Of all the SummerSlam buildups you could've used, THAT is not the right one.

[Guest TheZsaszHorsemen]

That would be all well and good, but at the end of the day it leaves us back where we started: Triple H as champion.

 

I'm not Triple H hater, but the fact is, it's time for someone to 'beat' him. Not win a match against him, BEAT HIM. Who was the last guy to get the last laugh in a feud with Triple H? Undertaker in 2001? That would be fine, but Triple H is a BAD GUY. The good guy is supposed to win the feud, not the bad guy. Why not have H win last night, then Benoit wins at Slam to make it 2-1 in the series, win the blow-off, win the feud and both guys can move on to something else? Instead, we'll get Triple H winning the title, defeating ANOTHER babyface, and we'll be back at the point we where at 6 months ago.

 

That was to MrZ, btw.

Benoit did beat him. Goldberg beat him before, and if he wasn't a giant prima donna who thought he should go over everyone, he'd probobly be the champion on SmackDown right now.

 

Benoit's had his run, and it's time for HHH (the guy who RAW is built around ANYWAY) to take the gold.

[Guest Loss]

HHH got his win back. That's what he's saying. When will HHH lose a feud and move on to something else? It's time for it to happen.

[Guest TheZsaszHorsemen]

HHH got his win back. That's what he's saying. When will HHH lose a feud and move on to something else? It's time for it to happen.

I'm more entertained by HHH then benoit, so I don't care if it doesn't happen.

[Guest Loss]

Well, it looks like WWE books to cater to you, or rather that you create viewpoints to cater to WWE. Can't figure out which, since I think you love everything they do.

 

Not a flame, just an observation.

[Dark Age 0]

That's cool for you. Triple H is your favourite wrestler(?), huzzah!

 

But the fact is, no one has 'beat' him. Shawn? Lost BOTH feuds with H. Goldberg? Triple H got the last laugh. All the other losers were beaten by Triple H. Who has really beat the guy? Benoit has a chance, but he's jobbing at SummerSlam by all acounts. Trips will then probably lose to Edge, but it doesn't matter, because he will get that win back when they need him to drop the belt to someone else. WHY is Triple H getting the belt back? So he can 'put Edge over'? Can't Benoit do that? Surely if Benoit got a decisive, feud ending victory against Triple H, he would have enough 'rub' to put Edge over.

 

Tell me Z, apart from your own personal reasons for Triple H to get the belt back, what will it do for business?

[Guest GreatOne]

Tell me Z, apart from your own personal reasons for Triple H to get the belt back, what will it do for business?

Unless they stopped the brand extension tomorrow, what top heel do you have on RAW? Christian ain't ready, Kane's a joke, Batista dear god no, Orton always does something to curtail his momentum--he just doesn't have it folks. Again no heels so you've got HHH by default.

 

I guess you could end up have like in HHH's first run where you just have everybody feuding with each other but you don't have the personalities (ce for Eugene being Foley maybe) to play off of to do it.

 

Benoit=Austin

Edge=Rock

Kane=Kane

Batista=Big Show

Orton=UT

HHH=HHH

Eugene=Foley

 

For this to happen Kane's going to actually have to GO OVER SOMEBODY, Edge might actually work here just replace the goofiness of his old promos and make them more Rock-ish, Eugene would be more a lovable goof like Foley instead of a full-blown retard.

 

Actually the only part of the whole bit that made it was the Rock promos, so Edge has got his work cut out for him.

 

KANE CAN TALK, THE BIG RED RETARD CAN TALK!!!!! I--WON, I--WON, LET'S PAR-TEEE!!!!!!!!!

[Dark Age 0]

Is there an urgent need for a heel to win the title?

 

You could have Benoit keep it for the rest of the year. It's not like business is bombing, so keep someone new at the top, as opposed to going back to Triple H AGAIN. Benoit can feud with Jericho. What's wrong with a face vs face feud?

 

By the end of the year, you could have established a new top heel (Kane, Orton, Christian) to take the belt, you could turn a face (Edge, Jericho, Shawn), you could move it onto another face, or, heck, even turn Benoit heel. All better options than the same old babyface gets the belt for 3 months, H wins it back again. Shawn, Edge and Jericho are all much better options as the next champion.

[TheOriginalOrangeGoblin 0]

Orton's a better option than Edge or Shawn. Fuck if I'm booking I let Benoit run wild till Mania then I give it to Orton. Let Benoit and Jericho do a 2/3 match series on PPV like Flair/Steamboat to take up most of the fall. Then Benoit/Edge or Benoit/Christian. Do Benoit/HBK for the first 2 months of 05 while Orton unseats HHH. Then give Orton the belt at Mania over Benoit.

 

That's how I'd do it atleast.

[Dark Age 0]

I'm with you.

 

Benoit as champ leads to so many potential ppv main events. Jericho, Shawn, Orton, Christian, Batista, Flair, Shelton and Edge could all face Benoit on pay per view, and some of those matches couldn't happen without the belt. What does Trips as champ lead to that's new and fresh? Orton? Edge? That's all I got.

[AndrewTS 0]

I'm with you.

 

Benoit as champ leads to so many potential ppv main events. Jericho, Shawn, Orton, Christian, Batista, Flair, Shelton and Edge could all face Benoit on pay per view, and some of those matches couldn't happen without the belt. What does Trips as champ lead to that's new and fresh? Orton? Edge? That's all I got.

You're still left with the problem of how to build it up.

 

Part of the problems we have now with Benoit's reign is that they don't treat him like the champ, but they also *can't* treat him like they usually would a champ. Benoit's not going to be able to do money promos at the start of the shows. They don't have faith in him to carry part of a segment to build up a big match. If you would do any of those matches, how would you build towards it?

[Dark Age 0]

Who says Benoit needs to cut 'the money promo'? Couldn't Flair, or Jericho do that if he was feuding with either of them? If a good Benoit interview is that important, then bust out the old black screen interviews he did during his feud with Angle. They were pretty awesome.

 

What's wrong with a simple storyline? Jericho wins a shot, talks about respect for Benoit and the belt, Benoit and Jericho team together and try to one-up each other, Jericho gives interview talking about his and Benoit's history, and how Benoit has got the better of him on most occasions, they show clips of past matches and Jericho says he's learnt from them. Usual stuff follows where they tease turning on each other, then at a pay per view they tear the house down. Not much wrong with that.