For those "The Red States are Leeches" crowd...

[The Czech Republic]

Well, the NAACP I know subscribes to the Jesse Jackson "Shakedown" school of fund raising.

Did you read Shakedown, Mike? My family picked it up maybe two or three summers ago, and it was a real eye-opener, I enjoyed it a lot. Problem is, my dad loans it out to everyone he feels must read it, and I haven't seen the damn book in years.

Yes. Fascinating book. I wasn't shocked about Jackson's Wall Street game (I'd heard about the shakedowns for years) --- but his ties to street gangs in the 70's was a shocker.

-=Mike

The part about the Blackstone Rangers and making grocers sell only Joe Louis milk was amusing. Our hero, honing his craft.

[Guest MikeSC]

Well, the NAACP I know subscribes to the Jesse Jackson "Shakedown" school of fund raising.

Did you read Shakedown, Mike? My family picked it up maybe two or three summers ago, and it was a real eye-opener, I enjoyed it a lot. Problem is, my dad loans it out to everyone he feels must read it, and I haven't seen the damn book in years.

Yes. Fascinating book. I wasn't shocked about Jackson's Wall Street game (I'd heard about the shakedowns for years) --- but his ties to street gangs in the 70's was a shocker.

-=Mike

The part about the Blackstone Rangers and making grocers sell only Joe Louis milk was amusing. Our hero, honing his craft.

And how he never gets audited is just mind-boggling. He and Sharpton both seem to live comfortably despite not having actual jobs.

-=Mike

[The Czech Republic]

Bill O'Reilly had a stretch where he was always like "Where does Jesse get the money to DO all these things?" and never got a straight answer. I think this unsolved mystery is what led to Bill's current insanity.

[Guest MikeSC]

Bill O'Reilly had a stretch where he was always like "Where does Jesse get the money to DO all these things?" and never got a straight answer. I think this unsolved mystery is what led to Bill's current insanity.

I want to know why SpikeTV chose Al Sharpton for that "I Hate My Job" show, since he's never held a job in his life.

-=Mike

[The Czech Republic]

Bill O'Reilly had a stretch where he was always like "Where does Jesse get the money to DO all these things?" and never got a straight answer. I think this unsolved mystery is what led to Bill's current insanity.

I want to know why SpikeTV chose Al Sharpton for that "I Hate My Job" show, since he's never held a job in his life.

-=Mike

That's not true. He worked for James Brown, and wore jumpsuits with big chains.

[Big Ol' Smitty]

Apparently, the red states are the ones who actually DONATE money.

-=Mike

Even if that chart is accurate (it doesn't come from Argentina, though, so I question its veracity) it does not negate the fact that the red states receive more from the government than they give.

 

This from the "get the government out of my life" crowd.

[Guest MikeSC]

Apparently, the red states are the ones who actually DONATE money.

    -=Mike

Even if that chart is accurate (it doesn't come from Argentina, though, so I question its veracity) it does not negate the fact that the red states receive more from the government than they give.

 

This from the "get the government out of my life" crowd.

Actually, a nice bit of it is from old people moving here to retire.

 

Nice try, though.

-=Mike

[Big Ol' Smitty]

Apparently, the red states are the ones who actually DONATE money.

     -=Mike

Even if that chart is accurate (it doesn't come from Argentina, though, so I question its veracity) it does not negate the fact that the red states receive more from the government than they give.

 

This from the "get the government out of my life" crowd.

Actually, a nice bit of it is from old people moving here to retire.

 

Nice try, though.

-=Mike

States Receiving Most in Federal Spending Per Dollar of Federal Taxes Paid:

 

1. D.C. ($6.17)

2. North Dakota ($2.03)

3. New Mexico ($1.89)

4. Mississippi ($1.84)

5. Alaska ($1.82)

6. West Virginia ($1.74)

7. Montana ($1.64)

8. Alabama ($1.61)

9. South Dakota ($1.59)

10. Arkansas ($1.53)

 

Source: Tax Foundation

 

Yeah, all those poor people moving to North Dakota and Alaska.

[Guest MikeSC]

Apparently, the red states are the ones who actually DONATE money.

    -=Mike

Even if that chart is accurate (it doesn't come from Argentina, though, so I question its veracity) it does not negate the fact that the red states receive more from the government than they give.

 

This from the "get the government out of my life" crowd.

Actually, a nice bit of it is from old people moving here to retire.

 

Nice try, though.

-=Mike

States Receiving Most in Federal Spending Per Dollar of Federal Taxes Paid:

 

1. D.C. ($6.17)

2. North Dakota ($2.03)

3. New Mexico ($1.89)

4. Mississippi ($1.84)

5. Alaska ($1.82)

6. West Virginia ($1.74)

7. Montana ($1.64)

8. Alabama ($1.61)

9. South Dakota ($1.59)

10. Arkansas ($1.53)

 

Source: Tax Foundation

 

Yeah, all those poor people moving to North Dakota and Alaska.

And they have, what, 4 people?

-=Mike

...In case you missed it, FL is a bit of a retirement haven...

[Big Ol' Smitty]

Apparently, the red states are the ones who actually DONATE money.

     -=Mike

Even if that chart is accurate (it doesn't come from Argentina, though, so I question its veracity) it does not negate the fact that the red states receive more from the government than they give.

 

This from the "get the government out of my life" crowd.

Actually, a nice bit of it is from old people moving here to retire.

 

Nice try, though.

-=Mike

States Receiving Most in Federal Spending Per Dollar of Federal Taxes Paid:

 

1. D.C. ($6.17)

2. North Dakota ($2.03)

3. New Mexico ($1.89)

4. Mississippi ($1.84)

5. Alaska ($1.82)

6. West Virginia ($1.74)

7. Montana ($1.64)

8. Alabama ($1.61)

9. South Dakota ($1.59)

10. Arkansas ($1.53)

 

Source: Tax Foundation

 

Yeah, all those poor people moving to North Dakota and Alaska.

And they have, what, 4 people?

-=Mike

...In case you missed it, FL is a bit of a retirement haven...

What about those conservative strongholds of Mississippi and Alabama?

[Guest MikeSC]

Apparently, the red states are the ones who actually DONATE money.

    -=Mike

Even if that chart is accurate (it doesn't come from Argentina, though, so I question its veracity) it does not negate the fact that the red states receive more from the government than they give.

 

This from the "get the government out of my life" crowd.

Actually, a nice bit of it is from old people moving here to retire.

 

Nice try, though.

-=Mike

States Receiving Most in Federal Spending Per Dollar of Federal Taxes Paid:

 

1. D.C. ($6.17)

2. North Dakota ($2.03)

3. New Mexico ($1.89)

4. Mississippi ($1.84)

5. Alaska ($1.82)

6. West Virginia ($1.74)

7. Montana ($1.64)

8. Alabama ($1.61)

9. South Dakota ($1.59)

10. Arkansas ($1.53)

 

Source: Tax Foundation

 

Yeah, all those poor people moving to North Dakota and Alaska.

And they have, what, 4 people?

-=Mike

...In case you missed it, FL is a bit of a retirement haven...

What about those conservative strongholds of Mississippi and Alabama?

In case you're unaware, more than a few retirees and military people in those states.

-=Mike

[Big Ol' Smitty]

And Florida is pretty low on the list $1.00 received per $1.00 spent.

[Big Ol' Smitty]

Apparently, the red states are the ones who actually DONATE money.

     -=Mike

Even if that chart is accurate (it doesn't come from Argentina, though, so I question its veracity) it does not negate the fact that the red states receive more from the government than they give.

 

This from the "get the government out of my life" crowd.

Actually, a nice bit of it is from old people moving here to retire.

 

Nice try, though.

-=Mike

States Receiving Most in Federal Spending Per Dollar of Federal Taxes Paid:

 

1. D.C. ($6.17)

2. North Dakota ($2.03)

3. New Mexico ($1.89)

4. Mississippi ($1.84)

5. Alaska ($1.82)

6. West Virginia ($1.74)

7. Montana ($1.64)

8. Alabama ($1.61)

9. South Dakota ($1.59)

10. Arkansas ($1.53)

 

Source: Tax Foundation

 

Yeah, all those poor people moving to North Dakota and Alaska.

And they have, what, 4 people?

-=Mike

...In case you missed it, FL is a bit of a retirement haven...

What about those conservative strongholds of Mississippi and Alabama?

In case you're unaware, more than a few retirees and military people in those states.

-=Mike

And none in these states?

 

States Receiving Least in Federal Spending Per Dollar of Federal Taxes Paid:

 

1. New Jersey ($0.62)

2. Connecticut ($0.64)

3. New Hampshire ($0.68)

4. Nevada ($0.73)

5. Illinois ($0.77)

6. Minnesota ($0.77)

7. Colorado ($0.79)

8. Massachusetts ($0.79)

9. California ($0.81)

10. New York ($0.81)

[Guest MikeSC]

Military installations are overwhelmingly in the South.

 

Retirees are overwhelmingly in the South.

-=Mike

[Justice]

Aren't, though, a lot of those states bringing in a ton of revenue due to state taxes? I mean, a lot of those states have a lot of extra taxes and state taxes that make federal aid redundant. :\

[Guest Loss]

Arkansas does, I know for sure. There is a "prepared food tax" and a personal property tax, on top of everything else.

[Big Ol' Smitty]

Loss, hate to break it to you --- but the ONLY group seeking actual change are conservatives. It's been that way for nearly 20 years.

 

Why was welfare reformed? Why is Social Security reform even discussed? Why is tort reform even a possibility? Why is affirmative action reform being discussed? It was all conservatives doing that.

Those are not changes, Mike, those are undoings of progress that has been made. Taking steps backwards on welfare, affirmative action and tort reform is not a shake-up of the status quo.

Those absolutely are changes and are an attempt to fix massive problems evident in the system. There are no backwards steps involved. Requiring work and a time limit for welfare has been a massive boon. Affirmative action DESPERATELY needs reformation. Tort reform is unbelievably needed.

The left has been the pro-status quo side for a while now.

Not really. It's the left that supports stem cell research without ridiculous limitations, gay marriage and government-sponsored healthcare. All changes proposed with the future in mind.

 

By your logic, Bush abolishing the Clean Air Act was "change"

The "Far right" Bush is the only President to EVER allow ANY federal funding for stem cell research, so the complaint doesn't begin to hold water. The conservatives have no problem with stem cell research --- they have a problem with the gov't funding it. And the "changes" the left want will be damaging unbelievably to America (health care) or the usual innocuous crap (gay marriage).

And the liberal rich folks don't give their money away. Nice of them.

               -=Mike

How do you think organizations like Planned Parenthood, the ACLU, the NAACP, NOW and GLAAD, just to name a few, continue to exist without donations?

Well, the NAACP I know subscribes to the Jesse Jackson "Shakedown" school of fund raising. NOW nand GLAAD are such insignificant groups on the landscape that their fund-raising matches that.

 

I'm going with independent figures to state that the left doesn't give.

-=Mike

Requiring work and a time limit for welfare has been a massive boon

 

Not to child poverty.

 

Affirmative action DESPERATELY needs reformation. Tort reform is unbelievably needed.

 

...in my opinion. That's what you meant, right?

[Guest MikeSC]

Requiring work and a time limit for welfare has been a massive boon

 

Not to child poverty.

 

Affirmative action DESPERATELY needs reformation. Tort reform is unbelievably needed.

 

...in my opinion. That' what you meant, right?

No, it's not my opinion. It's a fact.

-=Mike

[Big Ol' Smitty]

Requiring work and a time limit for welfare has been a massive boon

 

Not to child poverty.

 

Affirmative action DESPERATELY needs reformation. Tort reform is unbelievably needed.

 

...in my opinion. That' what you meant, right?

No, it's not my opinion. It's a fact.

-=Mike

fact (n.)- a concept whose truth can be proved

 

Get to provin'.

[Big Ol' Smitty]

Military installations are overwhelmingly in the South.

 

http://www.cr.nps.gov/nagpra/DOCUMENTS/BASES.PDF

 

I'm underwhelmed.

[Big Ol' Smitty]

[The Czech Republic]

Who the fuck bumps a five-hour-old topic?

[Big Ol' Smitty]

Who the fuck bumps a five-hour-old topic?

I just wanted Mike to respond if he had a chance, since he had been on.

 

And...

 

What do you care? Why you always hatin' on a playa?

[Guest MikeSC]

Who the fuck bumps a five-hour-old topic?

I just wanted Mike to respond if he had a chance, since he had been on.

 

And...

 

What do you care? Why you always hatin' on a playa?

The .pdf don't display --- and I simply do not give enough of a shit to DL updates for Acrobat to read it.

-=Mike

[Big Ol' Smitty]

Who the fuck bumps a five-hour-old topic?

I just wanted Mike to respond if he had a chance, since he had been on.

 

And...

 

What do you care? Why you always hatin' on a playa?

The .pdf don't display --- and I simply do not give enough of a shit to DL updates for Acrobat to read it.

-=Mike

Yeah this debate was kind of stupid.

 

I was just trying to show that the blue states might not necessarily get their ass whipped, as you suggested. It turned into me blasting the red states, which is kind of blasphemous for me because I'm a red stater and, despite its hue, I love my red state.

 

The map just showed a pretty heavy concentration of military bases along the eastern seabord and in Cali. The bases definitely weren't overwhelmingly in the South.