Raven bashes everyone again -- Journal update

[Guest Fook_Theta]

The other day, I was reading the sheets, the dirt sheets, the stooge sheets, the rags, the ... you get the point and I read a very interesting article done by this guy Gutterball, or Gutterman or something like that. He talked a lot about how he doesn't want to be Chicken Little and say the sky is falling and how he would much rather put over the business, how he loves the business, but when the business is doing poorly, he feels it's his job to criticize in the hopes that the situation will be rectified. As you know, I have absolutely no problem with critics or criticism as long as its from a position of love and knowledge of the medium. I believe him and I think he cares about the business. I don't think hes a doomsayer. I've read some of his other stuff and I think he's passionate in his love for the business. He made excellent points all the way through and then, at the very end, he showed why he and most other critics, as well as most smart marks who think they are experts in the sport, are summarily dismissed by bookers, veterans and others of that ilk by writing something so stupid, so inane that it completely ruined everything that came before it. He said Ultimo Dragon should be pushed as a major superstar. If you don't understand why this is not only laughable, its idiotic, then you are a big fucking mark and a big fucking moron and have no business commenting on how to run a company. Now in Ultimo Dragon's defense, I will say he's an amazing athlete and an amazing acrobat but, and this but is so monstrous and so unbelievably important, it cannot be understated. He cannot talk. He cannot talk, period. End of discussion.

 

If you can't talk, you can't draw money and you can't be a top guy. Simple as that. People always thought that I have a problem with high spotkateers. I don't. In fact, I'm very entertained by their stuff. Unfortunately, the majority of them can't talk and that is why they'll always be relegated to a certain position on the card. The forerunner to today's high spotkateer matches were the Rock N Roll Express vs The Midnight Express, and if Ricky Morton and Jim Cornette couldn't have talked, they never would've been the main eventers that they were. Maybe your hardcore fans will pay to see two guys wrestle who can't talk, but you certainly aren't drawing casual fans, which is who you need to sustain a full scale national promotion. Every major draw could talk. Hell. most couldn't work, but it didn't really matter. Talking is what draws & that's why Hogan and Austin drew the most money. I'm not saying Austin couldn't work because he could, but that ain't what people paid to see. Of course, there are always exceptions to the rule, Goldberg and 'The Crow' Sting are the only examples that come to mind. One was a jacked up, freaky looking, larger than life killing machine which the promotion had destroy everyone in such short order and was booked so perfectly that it would've been inexcusable if he didn't draw. Sting's character traded on years of push and exceptional charisma to a mute Crow ripoff and, once again, perfect booking, but these are the exceptions, not the rule. In fact, look at Scott Steiner. The more his body broke down and his work began to suffer, the more charismatic and a draw he became. He went from a wrestling machine as one of the Steiner Brothers, who were over but not draws, to the freakazoid Big Poppa Pump who would've been a monster draw if WCW wasn't going down the tubes. Holler if you hear me.

 

Hey, Konnan and I can't stand each other, but I promise you this; as mediocre as his workrate is, if you give him mic time and put him in a singles program and let him talk, people are definitely gonna pay to see him. He is amazing on the microphone and that's what this business is all about, not eighty cool moves in a row and who can do the most acrobatics. It's who can put asses in seats and talking is how its always been done and always will be done.

 

Meltzer wrote an article recently about how bleak the future of the business is and how it was financially worse in '93 and '94, but there was so much different stuff on the horizon to be copied from hardcore to invasion angles etcetera that there were a ton of avenues open. Now he says, there are no new ideas and he's scared. I say, scared of what? There is one tried and true method that has always worked and always will work to get people to pay money to see wrestling: talk them into the seats. Get heat and have the babyface and heel cut blistering promos. I promise you put the right people in the right spots and people will pay to see it. Now, no offense to Ultimo Dragon, he's a phenomenal athlete but that doesn't mean he deserves to be a main eventer just like thirty or so other guys I've read about in the sheets for years who couldn't talk, but were flippy floppers who you moron smart marks thought could draw money because you don't know jack shit. You really think if Ric Flair couldn't talk, he would be the greatest of all time? What about Shawn Michaels? Hey, they'd still be talented, but come on. It wasn't the workrate, they talked us into the seats.

 

Jake Roberts and Michael Hayes could talk me into any building anywhere. You know what, they were so damn good, they could stink the joint out and still talk me right back into the building the following week. That's fucking talent.

 

My apologies to Ultimo Dragon, this is not a shot at him. It's a shot at all the moron smart marks.

 

Everyone thinks that the big draws in TNA are the flippity floppers. well guess what? I just did FOX AM Atlanta, which is an Atlanta morning show and they handed me the list of matches for this Sunday's PPV. It was in order of the fans' interest as picked by the fans on TNA's website poll. Guess what the top two matches were? The Hall and Nash Jarrett match and the DDP/Raven match. No high spotkateers in there. No flippity floppers, even though everyone says that is the main thing our audience wants to see. I guess its star power and how do you get star power? Mic skills. The defense rests.

 

 

I wonder if he didn't subconciously include AJ Styles into his spotkateers label.

[Murmuring Beast 0]

Great.

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

Raven kind of kills his point when using Ricky Morton's mic skills as part of his reasoning for the RnR's v MX being a big draw. 99.99% of the money Ricky Morton drew was because of what he did in the ring, and nothing to do with his mic skills, which even Ricky himself admits were never that good. Ricky Morton drew because he sold his ass off in the ring, and was such a great babyface, that he had fans jumping the rails to help him out. Ricky Morton didn't draw with his mic skills, so using that to promote mic skills is weak. Same thing with Shawn Michaels. His drawing power, was down to his charisma, personality and flamboyance, and nothing do with his mic skills, which were, at best, good, and then not often.

 

If a guy can't talk, then give him someone to talk for him. You don't get anywhere by emphasising someone's weaknesses, and I'd have thought someone of Raven's intelligence would know that. Does that mean giving Ultimo a strong mouthpiece could make him a draw ? Maybe, maybe not, but unless you try, and not just with him but with anyone who can't talk, then you could be missing out on something.

 

As for the TNA PPV poll, is it any wonder that the two most anticipated matches were the two matches given the most hype.

[Guest Coffey]

I actually agree with him though. That's one reason why I've always thought that Chris Jericho would be a good WWE champion is given the chance. His undisputed title reign was a joke. Just let him let loose and get some victories. Of course, I hate his moveset, so I'm against Jericho a lot. Especially as a babyface.

 

It's also the same reason why I always thought that Chris Benoit would be a bad champion. His reign ended, and I wasn't impressed with it. Of course, it can be argued that it wasn't his fault, but I didn't have any desire to watch any of his matches because none of them mattered. They didn't have meaning outside of being a wrestling match. Of course, I like Benoit's moveset, so I'm on his side a lot....

[JoeDirt 0]

It's hard to really argue with him. I disagree that Konnan is a great talker (and if he is I haven't heard anything new from him in seven years), but most of his points are very true.

[Guest OSIcon]

He is right to an extent but he does generalize things a little too much.

 

For starters, what does "cannot talk" entail? Is he just including the absolute bottom of the barrell talkers in this statement or is it a much larger range? It is confusing because he acts as if you need to be a good talker to be a true, legit draw (ie. Flair, Hogan, Austin, Rock...those kind of guys). However, he includes guys like himself, Konnan, DDP, and Ricky Morton in that group. With the exception of Morton and maybe Raven in WCW, none of those guys can be considered "big time draws" in the US. If anything, they were role players that were over and contributed to their promotions while their promotions were "hot". He talks about drawing in terms of good talkers, but then some of his "good talker examples" are guys who were never draws.

 

Perhaps he is just referring to needing to be a good talker to be over, but then his whole argument is shot since there are plenty of bad or mediocre talkers who are plenty over because of in-ring skill or other assets.

 

I do agree that in order to be a TRUE draw like the Hogans, Austins, Flairs, and Rocks of the world, you need to be able to talk. To even be a second level draw in the vain of Nash, Hall, and guys like that, you need to be a good talker. I don't think it is essential if a wrestler is just an upper mid card (or even main event) roleplayer in a hot promotion. Rey Mysterio has always been way over and I'd go out on a limb and say he was even a small draw at a time in WCW. Yet his mic skills leave little to be desired. I'd say Rey is more popular and was more popular in the wrestling world than Raven and more successful. So obviously mic skills aren't always the be all end all.

 

His main point still is valid though. A guy like Ultimo Dragon most likely won't be a main eventer because he can't talk and therefore can't get as over as others. However, he stretches it a little too far by using himself, Konnan, and DDP as examples of successful good talkers.

[Guest Dynamite Kido]

I like Raven and all, but honestly everytime the guy opens his mouth he seems to get dumber. First off, most smartmarks would tell you that you would have to be able to talk to draw. I think most know THAT much about wrestling and how it works. I would never pay money to see Konnan and neither would ANYONE in their right mind, I don't give a shit HOW he is booked. So that was a terrible example by Raven as well. HTQ also summed up how poor of an example of how Morton drew with ringwork and not micwork already, so I'll leave that be. Also, Raven refers to Flair as the greatest of all time...........well, according to Raven's philosophy wouldn't Hogan, Austin be above him as the greatest. They both outdrew Flair over the course of their careers, and his Shawn Michaels comparison is the worst of the bunch. Michaels didn't draw shit over his career and if it wasn't for Diesel........Shawn would have been the lowest drawing champion of all time. So until Raven pulls his self rightous head out of his ass...........his opinions mean very little to me anymore.

[reign 0]

Raven was off his head on a lot of what he was saying but to be fair it sounded like the rant of a man who has sean the ups and downs of an industry he loves and has been told by many that he could've been a great pro wrestler had he had the right chance. His arrival to TNA was met with great fanfare and things looked like they might turn around when he arrived but now TNA is close to dying like so many other promotions Raven has worked for. Plus now all he sees around the indies are these little guys doing gobs of highspots with little psychology,somwthing he believes is the backbone of the sport. Raven probably just wishes things were different and is frustrated with the state of business and I don't blame him for going off, even though much of what he said was wrong.