Did I miss something?

[Guest Jason]

For me, one of the most exciting feuds of 2004 in World Wrestling Entertainment was the Cruiserweight rivalry between veteran Billy Kidman and the talented Paul London. These two workers had such great chemistry together, and when they faced one and other in the ring, you knew it would be a highlight of the night. As most people know, at the end of their match at No Mercy (I think that was the event) Kidman hit London with a Shooting Star Press while Paul was strapped to a stretcher, ‘busting him open’ and taking him out of action for a while. From that moment on, I was looking forward to their big rematch, I was even anticipating Kidman winning the Cruiserweight championship while Paul was off, so they could add a title to the mix.

 

Then all of a sudden, London is there, standing in a ring filled with other Cruiserweight’s, including Kidman, in a battle royal to determine the Number 1 contender for the championship. No build up, no video package to hype him coming back, and not even a mention of what Kidman did to him during his last appearance. As if that wasn’t strange enough, WWE had FUNAKI win the match, and go on to win the title. Now I’m not taking anything away from Funaki, he’s a great talent and should be an entertaining champion, but what happened to Kidman vs. London? Why didn’t WWE have those 2 as the last remaining combatants in the ring, with Kidman getting the win, getting the Cruiser title, and then have the much-anticipated rematch with London, for the gold?

 

It was as if I blinked and missed something on this one. WWE had one of their best Cruiserweight feuds ever on the cards, and they through it away…for what? So London can go back to being terribly misused and Kidman can tag with Akio? Where’s the damn sense in that?? People always speculate as to why the WWE’s Lighter-weight division has never seemed to click, but the reason is simple; it’s because WWE A. don’t care about it, and B. aren’t willing to risk anything with it. They only need to take a glace over the rest of the American wrestling scene to see that there is a demand for Light-Heavyweight wrestling, and with 6 hours of television time per week, WWE have more than enough stage to showcase their Cruiserweight talent and really get the division buzzing.

 

Is anyone else a bit pissed that WWE killed what looked to be a good angle, so quickly, and on a wider aspect, there refusal to let the Cruiserweight division develop storylines and feuds?

[Guest LooneyTune]

London pinned Kidman clean on Velocity the week of Armageddon, and the show actually had a video package to open the show with. I guess it's true: Booking Armageddon must always mean making it as bad as possible.

[AndrewTS 0]

It's a shame London's return had no hype, but that doesn't mean there cannot be angles going on in the Cruiser division simultaneously. Plus, it's expected that they wouldn't highlight that angle using the precious actual TV ring time that was on the X-Mas in Iraq show. I think probably 95% of the soldiers in attendance don't give two shits about Cruiserweights.

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

People always speculate as to why the WWE’s Lighter-weight division has never seemed to click, but the reason is simple; it’s because WWE A. don’t care about it, and B. aren’t willing to risk anything with it.

Nobody who has been paying attention to WWE for more than five minutes speculates as to why WWE's Cruiserweight division doesn't click. Vince doesn't think it draws, and so very rarely treats it as anything more than an afterthought, if he ever thinks about it at all. If a division is treated as an afterthought, most of the fans soon think of it as an afterthought too, and stop caring, hence it doesn't click.

[Guest LooneyTune]

WCW never really gave the Cruiserweights much of a chance to shine either. They were randomly thrown on shows and told to have matches. Not much in feuds (maybe 1 at a time) and way too many to keep track of sometimes.

 

I agree thought, at least WCW used the Cruiserweights they had on a regular basis, but just watch Velocity and you'll usually catch a good match with London or Akio or Kidman etc..

[MillenniumMan831 0]

It certainly appears that Vince thinks of the CWs as the ones who get the live crowd pumped up at the beginning of the night. No more, no less.

 

Of course he cares much more for the ones he feels he can make a merchandising buck off of like Mysterio on SD and Hurricane on Raw.

[Guest Jason]

WCW never really gave the Cruiserweights much of a chance to shine either. They were randomly thrown on shows and told to have matches. Not much in feuds (maybe 1 at a time) and way too many to keep track of sometimes.

 

I agree thought, at least WCW used the Cruiserweights they had on a regular basis, but just watch Velocity and you'll usually catch a good match with London or Akio or Kidman etc..

 

I understand what you are saying but WCWs cruiserweight devision was a big part of the shows, we had the cruiserweight title, and cuiserweight tag titles, they did have storylines just usually wheren't as big as the main event storylines in wcw. However the cruiserweights where al over the card and that is ALOT better than what you see in the wwe, just like Juvi vs Rey 30 minute match, you will never see that in the wwe, they get like 10 minutes max.

[AndrewTS 0]

Of course he cares much more for the ones he feels he can make a merchandising buck off of like Mysterio on SD and Hurricane on Raw.

And both of those are treated "above" the division, with RVD never even having matches with most of the cruisers unless it's a tag match, and with Rey having rarely been associated with it.

 

I hate to steal Keith lines, but fans really do probably consider it the "Jobberweight Championship."

[Guest LooneyTune]

The Cruiserweight Tag Titles were around for a grand total of 3 weeks, so really using that as part of the argument doesn't really work.

 

Besides, how often does ANY non-Main Event WWE match go 20-30 minutes? WCW would book a PPV with nothing but matches that were 15:00+ minutes, but WWF/WWE has never really done that, even for Wrestlemania they usually don't.

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

And who can forget the time WCW rewarded Juventud Guerrera and Blitzkrieg for their MOTY level affair at Spring Stampede by never mentioning the match on Nitro, turning Juventud into a virtual jobber, and running Blitzkrieg out of the business altogether. Man, those were some good times.

[Guest Jason]

The Cruiserweight Tag Titles were around for a grand total of 3 weeks, so really using that as part of the argument doesn't really work. Besides, how often does ANY non-Main Event WWE match go 20-30 minutes? WCW would book a PPV with nothing but matches that were 15:00+ minutes, but WWF/WWE has never really done that, even for Wrestlemania they usually don't.

 

So it would seem. And the wwe matches well that proves that they have bad booking, they should make there matches longer, and give the cruserweights more time. however I still stand by what I said, and that is wcw did give their cruiserweights an opportunity, they where given 30 minute matches, took up a good part of the card, alot better than the wwe or many companies.

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

WCW gave their cruiserweights the chance to have good matches from time to time, and that's it. They were typically treated as card fillers, used as jobbers a great deal, and were never allowed to rise up the card.

[Guest LooneyTune]

A match can be 5 minutes or an hour, but the Cruiserweight division in WCW was never treated like it meant anything. Same goes for WWE, except the WWE style just cripples people.

[Guest Tjhe CyNick]

The main problem with the Cruisers is that they always have them interact with the big guys, and when they do, they almost always get humiliated, witht he possible exception of Rey.

 

If they would do it like boxing, where you dont ever see a guy like Luther Reigns face a guy like Kidman, they might actually get over.

 

Anyone who has watched the WWE for any length of time knows Vince has no love for the cruisers, so if you're hopsing for that to change, you're just setting yourself up for disappointment.

[Guest LooneyTune]

I actually thought the Wrestlemania XX Gauntlet Match would be long... I set myself up for that like you just commented.

[CanadianChick 0]

The cruiserweight division on Smackdown is equivalent to the women's division on Raw. Both have one or two that are seen above the division (Trish/Lita and Rey) and make guest appearances in the division. It's really sad, since the cruiser division does have some sort of potential while the women's division admittingly should be treated as a afterthought since there are only 4 in the division. Both brands concentrate way too hard on just the World/WWE and IC/US Titles. Variety is the spice of life: give the other divisions, including the Tag Team division, a chance.

 

I too was disappointed when London's big return was jobbing in a tag match against he Bashams with partner Funaki. Even the commentators mentioned how it seemed London was starting from the bottom again.

[Guest Tjhe CyNick]

I really feel the CW title should be on par with the WWE/World titles. I mean the heavyweight titles will always have slightly more appeal, but I think it should be booked like the CW title is just as important as the Heavyweight titles. It'll never happen, but thats how it 'should' be.

 

At least that way, guys like Rey, Chavo, Kidman, and guys like Aj Styles (if they were brought in) could be headliners and allowed to show everything they have.

 

Of course like I said that will never happen, because there's no wy HHH or Undertaker could compete with those guys if they were allowed to go balls out every night.

[CanadianChick 0]

You gotta to remember though, that's like going up to Vince and saying that the Women's Title should be on par with the World Title since it is the World title to the girls. I truly believe that Vince sees them on the same level.

 

I see where you are going with that though. Each title, with maybe the exception of the IC/US title should be treated like that.

[AndrewTS 0]

The WWE honestly holds the women's title in higher esteem than the Cruiserweight title.

[Guest LooneyTune]

The problem is this isn't Boxing where any Weight-Class Title can basically headline a local event. The World Title is booked like the most important thing, and everyone can challenge for it, from Triple H to Funaki. The Cruiserweight/Light-Heavyweight/Whatever Title has a weight restriction, and thus doesn't have as many challengers as all the other titles and thus doesn't have as much importance.

[CanadianChick 0]

As for right now, I absolutely agree with you since Rey has nothing to do with the division. As a division as a whole though, I think WWE still puts more stock on the cruiserweight division. Afterall, being a small guy beats out being a woman any day, unless they make money like Trish and Lita.

[Guest Tjhe CyNick]

The problem is this isn't Boxing where any Weight-Class Title can basically headline a local event. The World Title is booked like the most important thing, and everyone can challenge for it, from Triple H to Funaki. The Cruiserweight/Light-Heavyweight/Whatever Title has a weight restriction, and thus doesn't have as many challengers as all the other titles and thus doesn't have as much importance.

Yeah I agree with you, but I think if you change the mentality where being a CW means curtain jerking, they would get over. The larger guys wouldn't challenge for the CW title, and the smaller guys wouldn't challenge for the Hevayweight title. Just like boxing/MMA.

[CanadianChick 0]

Admittingly, my knowledge is scarce, but isn't that how Japan does it? Heavyweights fight heavyweights, juniorweights fight juniorweights?

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

Admittingly, my knowledge is scarce, but isn't that how Japan does it? Heavyweights fight heavyweights, juniorweights fight juniorweights?

With only occasional exceptions, that is the case.

[Guest Ransome]

The cruiserweight division on Smackdown is equivalent to the women's division on Raw. Both have one or two that are seen above the division (Trish/Lita and Rey) and make guest appearances in the division.

The Women's division is made far more important than Cruiserweight. Compare the two most recent title matches for each: Spike vs Funaki (!), and Trish vs Lita on Raw. One got the least amount of heat and buildup on the *14th* most important pay per view of the year, and the other was the main event of Raw and built up in video packages from six months worth of storylines.

 

The Women's division may be down to just four people, but one look at the Cruiserweight champions from 2004 should show which title has more credibility right now. I mean, Jacqueline, Chavo Guerrero Sr, Spike Dudley, Funaki? That's the best they can do with the 10 other Cruiserweights they have under contract? Have they even had a single Rey vs Ultimo Dragon match in WWE?

[Guest LooneyTune]

They had 1 Rey vs. Ultimo match, and it was fucked up by given 3 minutes and a Tajiri, Akio, and Sakoda run in.

[CanadianChick 0]

I think that's more the women's division having more 'starpower' (I obviously use the term loosely, since starpower can be made) currently than the cruiser division. Trish and Lita are popular, while the only cruiserweight 'star' is Rey, and he's currently in a tag team and has nothing to do with the division. Once the Lita/Trish novelty runs out, and the cruiser division gets at least one star, it'll be more important than the women's division.

[AndrewTS 0]

The Women's division is made far more important than Cruiserweight. Compare the two most recent title matches for each: Spike vs Funaki (!), and Trish vs Lita on Raw. One got the least amount of heat and buildup on the *14th* most important pay per view of the year, and the other was the main event of Raw and built up in video packages from six months worth of storylines.

 

That's basically what I was thinking when I made the comment. Plus Victoria could be plugged back into a major program any time. At any given time, each division has *one* actual angle in it, which almost always revolves around the title.

 

Trish and Lita ended over the title, but there was a ton of (yes, very stupid) backstory and incidental buildup.

 

The CW division had its one angle going, which sputtered to an end while WWE let the Lita/Trish thing blow off with a match that people actually saw.

 

WWE isn't going to give London anything resembling a half-decent push until he either gains 40 pounds or gets fake boobs.

 

And remember that according to the WWE, the top stars within the CW division (Rey doesn't count) are Spike Dudley and Billy Kidman.

[zyn081 0]

This is all very sad. Each title should be seen as important. Obviously, the World and WWE Championships are the one everybody wants to hold, but holding the others shouldnt be seen as a joke. The IC and US are used (or should be) to elveate people to the ME level. The tag titles are the WORLD Tag Team and WWE Tag Team Championships, i.e. tag variants of the WORLD and WWE titles. They should be used for those out of the title hunt, too low for IC/US status or 'generics'.

 

The Womans title would be alot better if the division hadnt just been canabilised. A division consisting of Trish, Lita, Victoria, Molly Holly, Gail Kim, Jazz, Shaniqua, Ivory and Jacquelin could be solid and entertaining. You could even have a faction of Kim, Jazz, Shaniqua and Jacquelin based a la NOD.

 

The CW title is to be the entertaining title. Look at the talent for f**ks sake. Rey rey, kidman, london, spike, chavo, nunzio, funaki, moore, akio, tajiri (why he wa traded to RAW, I will never know), noble (why he was released, I will never know) and hurricane. If you cant come up with 1/2 storylines for that sort of talent, your an . . . And I think that sticking CWs in the CW division is wrong. The upper CW talent should join the hunt for the US title (such as rey rey, kidman and chavo) and tag teams could be formed (such as rey and kidman, akio and funaki or spike and nunzio as the leaders of the dudley and FBI gangs). You could have a CW involved in the US title hunt, a CW tag team and the CW title.

 

Its sad about London, his return should have been mega-hyped. Kidman should have been the champ for Armageddon and the rematch should have been for the title. A 5 year old with crayons could have painted that picture for you :@.

[zyn081 0]

At least we have Velocity, the WWE CW show!