Cover for Infinite Crisis #1

[Renegade 0]

Notice how Darksieds face is not part of those memory panels.

[SuperJerk 0]

The three ships carrying baby Superman from Earth 1, 2, and Post Crisis

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

That's the rocket John Byrne used in "Man of Steel"...wasn't the rocket (like the rest of Superman's origin) revised for Birthright?

 

I can't help but wonder if they'll try to explain the difference between Man of Steel continuity and Birthright continuity.

[Vampiro69 0]

That cover is simply awesome. I Can't wait to get the next issue in 2 weeks.

[caboose 0]

The three ships carrying baby Superman from Earth 1, 2, and Post Crisis

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

That's the rocket John Byrne used in "Man of Steel"...wasn't the rocket (like the rest of Superman's origin) revised for Birthright?

 

I can't help but wonder if they'll try to explain the difference between Man of Steel continuity and Birthright continuity.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thats also been puzzling me recently.

 

Just how can the varying Birghright/Man of Steel origins create two different Supermen, when Birthright is simply eliminating Man Of Steel from continuity?

[ZGangsta 0]

Notice how Darksieds face is not part of those memory panels.

Are you referring to the fact that his face (under her left boot) doesn't look as faded as everything else? Cause if so, that's an awesome observation. Wasn't there a storyline where Darksied was trying to break through the 'wall' at the end of the universe? Maybe beyond that wall was the place where Superman/Superboy/Lois/Axlexander went to.

Or maybee we're on crack and it's just supposed to be an image of him in the panels.

[Renegade 0]

As far as I know Darkseid is still stuck on the wall at the edge of the universe.

[JasonX 0]

As far as I know Darkseid is still stuck on the wall at the edge of the universe.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Uberboss at DC Dan DiDio has stated that Darksied has jack shit to do with Infinite Crisis and will be MIA during the mini-series.

 

Also, the face under the green hood is Pariah, who appeared in Crisis with his face save for his eyes covered in darkness at various points in the mini-series.

 

As for Birthright, one of the theories regarding the two Lex Luthors currently running around is that one of the two is the Birthright Lex Luthor and the other is the Post-Crisis Lex.

 

As for Birthright, the current policy at DC is that only the "Lex Luthor lived in Smallville" stuff from Birthright is considered canon. Which is a hillarious means to tell Mark Waid to fuck off, since Waid initially refused to include the Lex Luthor in Smallville stuff and DC had to threaten Waid with refusing to publish the fucker if he didn't include it.

[JasonX 0]

Double Post

[Renegade 0]

It's funny how Mongul shows up in IC 1, it was like they wanted to do Darkseid but Jimenez liked Mongul and drew him instead until it was too late. Seriously, Mongul? Surely they could have used a better run in and do shit character without raising a whole lot of continuity problems.

[SuperJerk 0]

The three ships carrying baby Superman from Earth 1, 2, and Post Crisis

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

That's the rocket John Byrne used in "Man of Steel"...wasn't the rocket (like the rest of Superman's origin) revised for Birthright?

 

I can't help but wonder if they'll try to explain the difference between Man of Steel continuity and Birthright continuity.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thats also been puzzling me recently.

 

Just how can the varying Birghright/Man of Steel origins create two different Supermen, when Birthright is simply eliminating Man Of Steel from continuity?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Someone should make a list of all the ways Birthright messed up the post-Crisis continuity.

[ZGangsta 0]

It's funny how Mongul shows up in IC 1, it was like they wanted to do Darkseid but Jimenez liked Mongul and drew him instead until it was too late. Seriously, Mongul? Surely they could have used a better run in and do shit character without raising a whole lot of continuity problems.

Someone should make a list of all the ways Birthright messed up the post-Crisis continuity.

I thought the whole point of Infinite Crisis was that continuity WAS totally messed up (sometimes intenionally) and they were going to make it all clean again at the end of the series.

I mean the writers were given permission to do all sorts of messed up continuity stuff lately weren't they? Like having the Kryptonian Supergirl come back, or the Crime Sydicate. Or that whole arc with the 'alternate present' in Superman/Batman.

So I can accept stuff like Mongul showing up because the universe is getting so fucked up that it's supposed to be pretty much 'anything goes' at this point. I mean, there's two Lex Luthors running around!

[JasonX 0]

It's funny how Mongul shows up in IC 1, it was like they wanted to do  Darkseid but Jimenez liked Mongul and drew him instead until it was too late. Seriously, Mongul? Surely they could have used a better run in and do shit character without raising a whole lot of continuity problems.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Actually, Mongul was used because Geoff wanted to rip off the Alan Moore "The Man Who Has Everything" story for the first issue, to demonstrate how fucked up the entire dynamic between Superman, Batman, and WW had gotten.

 

I thought the whole point of Infinite Crisis was that continuity WAS totally messed up (sometimes intenionally) and they were going to make it all clean again at the end of the series.

 

IC is not about fixing continuity, since Dan Dildo DiDio (one of the main brains behind IC) HATES continuity and would gladly see DC become unreadable due to fucked up continuity just to spite comic fans who like continuity.

 

By all accounts, IC is more of "Crisis meets Kingdom Come" in that the theme is how fucked up and dark/depressing the DCU has gotten since Grant Morrison decided that the only way Batman can pull his bitch weight in the JLA is to be the biggest piece of shit possible. Some of the more cynical critics even think that's why DC greenlighted IDC and Countdown, under the notion that if they started killing off turning evl the Giffen JLA members, that it would make people say "enough with the darkness in the DCU" and push for the allegeded "shiney happy people" nature of the DCU that is supposed to come after IC ends......

[caboose 0]

As far as I know Darkseid is still stuck on the wall at the edge of the universe.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Uberboss at DC Dan DiDio has stated that Darksied has jack shit to do with Infinite Crisis and will be MIA during the mini-series.

 

Yeah but this is the same DC that denied Infinite Crisis had anything really to do with the original Crisis.

[Vampiro69 0]

He they had to tease the people, and keep the people talking. You don't want to blow your load and tell them everything.

[caboose 0]

Exactly, thats why I think Darkseid is showing up in a big way before this things over.

[JasonX 0]

Exactly, thats why I think Darkseid is showing up in a big way before this things over.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Given that IC is a sequel to Crisis and not Legends (AKA the big Darkseid X-Over), the only possible way Darkseid should appear in IC is if they have him be appear in the final issue, doing a run-in to distract the villains so that the good guys can save the day so that the status quo can be kept in the DCU.

[SuperJerk 0]

Also, the face under the green hood is Pariah, who appeared in Crisis with his face save for his eyes covered in darkness at various points in the mini-series.

 

As for Birthright, one of the theories regarding the two Lex Luthors currently running around is that one of the two is the Birthright Lex Luthor and the other is the Post-Crisis Lex.

 

As for Birthright, the current policy at DC is that only the "Lex Luthor lived in Smallville" stuff from Birthright is considered canon. Which is a hillarious means to tell Mark Waid to fuck off, since Waid initially refused to include the Lex Luthor in Smallville stuff and DC had to threaten Waid with refusing to publish the fucker if he didn't include it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I think its more likely they just really want to make their comics compatible with their TV show.

 

Is the post-Birthright Lex younger than the post-Crisis Lex? Originally the post-Crisis Lex was an older fat man, until he had his brain put into a younger clone body. Has used-to-be-old-and-fat-but-now-Im-a-clone-posing-as-my-own-son Lex been wiped out by Birthright as well?

 

So confused...

[JasonX 0]

Also, the face under the green hood is Pariah, who appeared in Crisis with his face save for his eyes covered in darkness at various points in the mini-series.

 

As for Birthright, one of the theories regarding the two Lex Luthors currently running around is that one of the two is the Birthright Lex Luthor and the other is the Post-Crisis Lex.

 

As for Birthright, the current policy at DC is that only the "Lex Luthor lived in Smallville" stuff from Birthright is considered canon. Which is a hillarious means to tell Mark Waid to fuck off, since Waid initially refused to include the Lex Luthor in Smallville stuff and DC had to threaten Waid with refusing to publish the fucker if he didn't include it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I think its more likely they just really want to make their comics compatible with their TV show.

 

Is the post-Birthright Lex younger than the post-Crisis Lex? Originally the post-Crisis Lex was an older fat man, until he had his brain put into a younger clone body. Has used-to-be-old-and-fat-but-now-Im-a-clone-posing-as-my-own-son Lex been wiped out by Birthright as well?

 

So confused...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Most writers have been specifically avoiding contradicting the early Post Crisis Luthor stories since the Smallville retcon was imposed; plus writers have, ever since Byrne left the Superman books, distanced themselves from the whole fat and ugly Lex Luthor, opting to draw him less like a fat, bald evil Kojack and more like a younger looking, physically fit version...

[Vampiro69 0]

Just over four days away from issue two coming out. Any guesses as to who dies this issue?

[JasonX 0]

Just over four days away from issue two coming out.  Any guesses as to who dies this issue?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Probably no-one, since Geoff and company have said that IC #2 is going to be a huge fucking talking heads issue, as they have stated that IC #2 is going to be the issue where every fucking thing from the last two years is finally going to be tied together in a nice little package, complete with them explaining the plot for the entire IC mini-series.

 

Plus, given the George Perez cover for IC #3, I think they would be taking the issue off for killing characters since IC #3 is supposed to be a huge fucking

OMAC/Amazon battle

.

[Vampiro69 0]

Boy Themyiscra gets attacked alot. For being hidden from the world it sure gets invaded alot.

[Renegade 0]

From issue 2

 

Supes wants to bring back earth-2. Not very heroic to change the world just because Lois is dying. Also the Joker is pissed because the society didn't give him an invite so he killed the royal flush.

[Steviekick 0]

I just read issue #2, and I'm still waiting to see what the correllation between the five prelude series and this are.

 

To be honest, I haven't been digging Infinite Crisis so far. We are two issues into it and aside from the returns of

Superman-2, Alex Luthor, Superboy-Prime and Lois 2

, nothing much has been learned. The pace has been kinda slow and I hope the remaining issues don't feel rushed.

[JasonX 0]

The following was taken from K-Box, the Comic Book and Porn Comic Book Message Board I regularly frequent; a guess towards the identity of the real Big Bad, IE the Apex Predator that Pariah warned the SSOSV Luthor about in Villains United #5. Credit goes to Paul Pogue

 

A bit of explanation on my thinking.

 

First off, I'm using "Apex Predator" and "Big Bad" interchangably, despite the fact that they might be two different people -- Pariah inferred, though did not outright say, that the Apex Predator originated on Earth. All he said was that he was OPERATING on earth. But I love the term "Apex Predator," so I'm gonna use it.

 

First off, the facts I am taking as givens until proven otherwise:

 

- There is in fact one big bad manipulating EVERYTHING to come to this point

- Including the OMACs, the Day of Vengeance, the Villains United, and the rift at the center of the universe.

- Which would mean that he manipulated the Spectre. THE. SPECTRE. Placing his manipulations as far back as GL: Rebirth.

- He has some kind of motivation

- Which is, knowing Geoff Johns, tied into longtime DCU continuity and might even require a PhD in DC History to really understand.

 

What do we know for sure about this villain, then?

 

- He Knows The Truth. Big step right there. He knows just about everything worth knowing: the Crisis, the true nature of the Crisis and what preceded it, everything.

 

- He is really, really powerful. You're not going to see the Red Hood creating an interspatial antimatter rift.

 

- He is highly intelligent and manipulative, to the point that he could teleport Oa out of sync with the universe RIGHT UNDER THE GUARDIANS NOSES and have them utterly mystified as to how the fuck it happened.

 

- He was recognized by J'onn J'onzz, wears red, and the Watchtower computers recognized him as Superman. Which means that he either is some variant on Superman -- or is capable of making the Watchtower think he is.

 

A word on Ganthet. Readers of GL comics over the last few years may have come to think of him as Vaguely Generic Guardian Guy who shows up to give exposition and is mostly notable as the one Guardian who consistently has a name. But his first appearance, "Ganthet's Tale," 1990, is a very strange tale with a MOUNTAIN of unanswered questions. It acts, unintentionally, as a very nice leadin to Hal Jordan's insanity, several years later. Certainly it sets the stage for Hal to crack, though "Emerald Twilight" wasn't even on ANYONE'S mind at the time.

 

In brief, Ganthet is "encouraged" to take a break from being a Guardian because his investigations into the origins of the universe have driven him insane -- said insanity never again mentioned, though he looked DAMN nuts when he mentioned it. He believes that the Hand at the dawn of time is a clue, a hint to look further. Given that the last time someone tried that it wiped out a billion years of history and created the multiple earths and the Anti-Monitor, this is perhaps not a wise course of research to be pursuing. Yet he is, and it is never really explained why. Instead of taking a break, though, he recruits Hal and tries to form his own secret force of GLs to go after the people he deems responsible, a rogue Guardian, Dawlok, and his family, who are attempting to undo Krona's experiment and kill Krona -- which would undo EVERYTHING since the Crisis.

 

Ganthet's attempt to recruit new GLs from offshoots of the Guardians is a failure save for one, an old fellow named Percival. He trains Percival and they go after Dawlok's family. A fairly neat battle ensues, and our heroes win the day. It is revealed that Dawlok's interference actually caused the failure of Krona's device and the subsequent fuckups. Dawlok dies, two of his family members are captured, one escapes and swears revenge. None of those three are ever seen again. Percival is never seen again. Incidentally, a close reading of the battle shows that Ganthet and Percival should receive at least partial responsibility for the Krona disaster, since Percival's tactics wipe out Dawlok's machine. Had they not done so, Dawlok would have succeeded, resulting in ... what? We never know. Ganthet waves off the responsibility issue glibly, and takes the prisoners to Oa to be judged. In the process, he subtly protects Hal Jordan's memory from the other Guardians so that they don't know what Ganthet told him -- namely, damn near EVERYTHING. Certainly enough to make a person put together the pieces of the Crisis. And more than enough to make someone go batshit insane. Ganthet outright tells Hal that if he could comprehend what he had already been told, that is exactly what would happen.

 

It has never been explained why Ganthet told Hal all this, or indeed why he himself is recreating a research project that ended so disastrously.

 

Theory: Ganthet is, indeed, batshit insane. This fits in nicely because it doesn't change a thing about what we know about him, and in fact brings him back to his roots, as "Ganthet's Tale" was his first appearance.

 

He has the power to have done all this, including the Oa swap. All the other guardians now respect him, as opposed to his time as the crazy rogue one. (It would crack me the hell up if Ganthet was really The Old Timer, but that would require a retcon of such massive proportions it makes my head ache.) Point being, he could have pulled this off and hidden it from the other Guardians.

 

Furthermore, he is the ONLY being in a position to have manipulated the Spectre into his vulnerable, hostless state. (If we assume that he was not so manipulated, then this means that the Apex Predator just got very, very lucky when the Spectre and Hal were separated. Not something in line with the ultra-planner we've been presented with.) But Ganthet could conceivably have controlled events to create that situation -- in fact, nobody else could have. And who wrote that particular miniseries, hmmm? It is entirely possible, based on the events of "Ganthet's Tale," that he's been manipulating Hal since "Emerald Twilight" and before.

 

I don't know if it fits in here, but the Mark Waid Kingdom Come takes on Ganthet have him as a fairly creepy schemer who's willing to sacrifice a million lives to give his Green Lantern, Kyle Rayner, a higher profile.

 

He has full knowledge of the Crisis, and could easily have done things like the Two Luthors and set up what's going on with the villains, including the possible five-earths plot currently in motion.

 

Similarly, the OMACs would have been ridiculously easy for him to fuck around with, as a potent weapon to keep the first line of defense, the JLA, out of his way.

 

Theory: Ganthet is trying to find out the secret and intends not to make the mistakes Krona did. And while he's at it, take out every single possible line of attack against him by orchestrating the worst day in DC history (which, unlike Avengers Dissassembled, is probably not an exaggeration -- EVERYTHING has gone to hell in 8C.) He put all the dominoes on the table years ago and is now knocking them down.

 

I'm not sure how much I'm actually married to this theory, but I think it holds a lot of water.

[pochorenella 0]

My head hurts after reading that.

[Kurt Angle Mark 0]

Jim Lee's cover to issue 3

 

[Renegade 0]

Supes offering Batman his Earth-2 life? Doubt he'd ever accept that.

[JasonX 0]

Supes offering Batman his Earth-2 life? Doubt he'd ever accept that.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Given the rumors that IC will be ending with Batman batshit insane and in Arkham, I don't think Earth-2 Superman will be "offering"; most likely he's going to be using physical force to reboot Batman against his will to his Earth 2 incarnation with Batman literally having his soul and memories destroyed and replaced being the big moment in which we get established that Earth 2 Superman has gone evil on us.

[Steviekick 0]

Based on that picture of Superman of Earth-2 offering that life to Batman, this makes me believe that someone more powerful is going to be the main villain in Infinite Crisis.

 

It would be interesting if they revealed one of the Endless as being behind this (After all, Sandman was vaguely a member of the DCU in a detatched sort of way...Batman was involved in the first arc of Gaiman's run, Sandman/Morpheus appeared in the first arc of JSA).

[caboose 0]

Could DC possibly turn Earth-2 Superman evil?

 

Alexander Luthor is living up to his name me thinks.