Horrible Raw Last night

[Guest TysonTomko420]

Im the kind of guy who always likes RAW. but it has been awful since the draft. Im thinking of stopping watching WWE after 15 years cause i am geting burned out on how awful it is.

 

It was almost the exact same show as last week. How many times are we gonna see Carlito/shelton? I mean im sure were gonna see a NO DQ match next week, some jackass will interfere and Carlito will win. Then we will get a Specail Referee match or some kind of gimmick match at Summerslam. We saw this match like 5 times in the last month and its not a particularly good matchup (not bad but way overdone at this point)

 

And then there was Masterlock Challenge with the Big Slow. Big Slow is fat as hell and has sucked since 1998. they wasting 10 minutes on every show for the last 4 months and nothing is gonna come of it besides a big slow vs chris masters Match? Wow.

 

Kane vs Edge Cage Match. Again we saw this match last week and it was awful. This match isnt new or exciting either. the whole storyline sucks especially now that theres no storyline and we have to deal with the Matt Hardy crap. Crappy cage match with a clean ending yet they are gonna prolong this shit with a stretcher match next week? Stretcher matches are awful. And were gonna see another Matt Hardy run in? who gives a shit about Matt Hardy? I would have cared a little 2-3 months ago but now i dont care.

 

Diva Search is self explanatory. what a crappy 15 minute segment every week

 

And then theres the Main Event. Lumberjack match? worst gimmick match ever. And snitsky in the main event? y? The guy blows. And i dont think a face has ever lost a lumberjack match even though theres always a bunch of heels outside the ring.

 

 

 

Its pathetic. the only thing i enjoyed was kurt angle challenge. And were probaly gonna see the exact same raw next week (with the only matches being Carlto/shelton and kane/edge)

 

And 3 Matches only? thats riddiculus. we get 4 matches usually on Heat which is an hour long and they waste 15 minutes on Raw and smackdown recaps every week.

[Matt Young 0]

There were 4 matches:

 

1. Carlito vs. Shelton

2. Angle vs. Striker

3. Kane vs. Edge

4. Cena vs. Snitsky

 

And this should be in the Raw thread.

[Guest TysonTomko420]

a 2 minute angle squash does not count as a match sorry.

[Matt Young 0]

Technically it was a match, albeit not a very good one.

 

I wasn't trying to be an ass... I just wanted to fill you in (about the Raw thread) since you're new here.

 

And by the way, welcome to the board.

[megaadvice 0]

Duno what has been so bad about the last few raws, I see no real difference between the quality of raws since about late 2001 until now, except for maybe the period just after wrestlemania last year which was of a higher quality.

 

So what your saying about this raw you could basically pick out most raws from 2002/05 and say the exact same thing

[zyn081 0]

I think he means that it was a carbon copy of last weeks and yes it was, since 3 of the matches involved the same participants.

[cabbageboy 0]

I maintain that they try to deliberately make Raw suck when HHH is not on the show. I'm not sure why everyone thinks Raw got the better end of the draft...Cena isn't doing shit, just messing around with Jericho in a feud that no one thinks Jericho can win. Carlito is doing his lame HTM routine and getting DQed and counted out. Angle is still doing the Challenge, and the Big Show is now involved with Chris Masters. Van Dam is injured, who knows what he'll do when he gets back.

 

Meanwhile on SMDN you have Batista cementing himself as champ with what will be a big win over JBL. Benoit is likely to win the US title and feud with the Cabinet. Orton is hurt but once back will likely feud with UT. Christian is at least getting a decent push and can veer into either the US scene or the world title scene.

 

Smackdown is thus far doing a much better job of incorporating the new talent. Raw meanwhile has too many guys doing the same schtick: Angle and Masters doing challenges, Jericho and Carlito doing interview segments, etc.

[Exslade ZX 0]

Well, on the RAW side of things, they had a long 7 weeks of build up to go for Summerslam, and at this point, for a lot of the matches a simple "I hate you, yadda, yadda" promo probaly isn't gonna work as well.

 

For example, if they decide to do Shelton/Carlito one on one (which looks to be the case), at SS, I'd say it was a lot better built up then Hogan/Michaels, which really has no reason at all...And with Edge/Kane, yea..looks like they're having a Steiner/Test series or something, but at least it makes sense. I mean, someone just up and takes your wife in the wrestling world (even though he did you know, rape her and all of that) you aren't just gonna forget about it like that, of course Kane would still want to take out Edge.

 

Plus, the've still got a few shows before they start announcing Matt Hardy as officially back, so they've got to do something. And like someone said in the Raw thread, the roster isn't as big as some would think. What are they gonna do, have MAtt run in on a pointless Edge...Hurricane match? Conway match? Rosey, Dupree, Venis? There really aren't that many more credible people, and not many credible faces at that. Not many more people Edge could face at this point. http://www.wwe.com/superstars/raw/

[zyn081 0]

I maintain that they try to deliberately make Raw suck when HHH is not on the show.  I'm not sure why everyone thinks Raw got the better end of the draft...Cena isn't doing shit, just messing around with Jericho in a feud that no one thinks Jericho can win.  Carlito is doing his lame HTM routine and getting DQed and counted out.  Angle is still doing the Challenge, and the Big Show is now involved with Chris Masters.  Van Dam is injured, who knows what he'll do when he gets back.

 

Meanwhile on SMDN you have Batista cementing himself as champ with what will be a big win over JBL.  Benoit is likely to win the US title and feud with the Cabinet.  Orton is hurt but once back will likely feud with UT.  Christian is at least getting a decent push and can veer into either the US scene or the world title scene. 

 

Smackdown is thus far doing a much better job of incorporating the new talent.  Raw meanwhile has too many guys doing the same schtick:  Angle and Masters doing challenges, Jericho and Carlito doing interview segments, etc.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I cant see either how people say that SD is being jobbed out.

 

RAW got Angle, Cena, CCC, TBS and RVD. Doing nothing, ok, ok, nothing and injured. Look at the heel side of the locker room for the lumberjack match, look how thin it is. The face side was Shelton, TBS, Big Vis, Val Venis, Tajiri and the Superheros. Thats the undercard and midcard. Great.

 

Were going to get CCC-Shelton at SummerSlam, title can change hands on a Countout, DQ, etc... Thats RAWs side of the card down.

 

The Tag Titles and Womens Championship are a joke. Is there like a rule which states that you must defend your title every 30 days? When did Trish last defend hers. Hell, I would have preferred if Christy would have won it. I hate it when they have to drop an angle cause s/hes injured and job out the title, but at least the title is still defended. Rosey didnt even bother to come out with his Tag Strap.

[cabbageboy 0]

The thing that disturbs me about this Carlito/Shelton feud is that they are jobbing out a guy with huge potential to a guy that frankly isn't any good. Carlito is a good talker, but man does he suck in the ring. I saw the same match at a house show and Carlito on offense is like watching paint dry. It's simply not believable to have him beat people when he has not ONE credible offensive move. No finisher, nothing.

 

Smackdown is still a decent enough show. The Eddie/Rey stuff is consistently entertaining (though I worry what this secret will be). At least you have guys like the Mexicools who can have a fun midcard match. Just job the useless Orlando Jordan to Benoit and get a real US title scene going and that show is going to be just fine.

[Exslade ZX 0]

The thing that disturbs me about this Carlito/Shelton feud is that they are jobbing out a guy with huge potential to a guy that frankly isn't any good. Carlito is a good talker, but man does he suck in the ring. I saw the same match at a house show and Carlito on offense is like watching paint dry. It's simply not believable to have him beat people when he has not ONE credible offensive move. No finisher, nothing.

That's just it though, he's not being jobbed out. He hasn't really 'lost' a match to Carlito yet. Each and every time they've faced since his arrival on RAW, Carlito has had to cheat somehow to beat Shelton. It's just Old School Heel.

 

It's obvious, the way they're portraying it, Shelton can evidently beat Carlito. In most of thematches, it's Shelton who has the upper hand and it's Shelton who's kicking ass (barring almost fucking himself up a few times, and then getting beat or something after that) until Carlito cheats somehow to end the match. So IMO it's not so much as him being jobbed out.

 

I also think Shelton will win the title back cleanly at SS. I could be wrong, but that's what I'm guessing.

[Black Lushus 0]

damn...so much for starting an Angle/Benjamin fued when it's RIGHT FUCKING THERE and there was still time to start the buildup for Summerslam...

[zyn081 0]

The thing that disturbs me about this Carlito/Shelton feud is that they are jobbing out a guy with huge potential to a guy that frankly isn't any good.  Carlito is a good talker, but man does he suck in the ring.  I saw the same match at a house show and Carlito on offense is like watching paint dry.  It's simply not believable to have him beat people when he has not ONE credible offensive move.  No finisher, nothing.

 

Smackdown is still a decent enough show.  The Eddie/Rey stuff is consistently entertaining (though I worry what this secret will be).  At least you have guys like the Mexicools who can have a fun midcard match.  Just job the useless Orlando Jordan to Benoit and get a real US title scene going and that show is going to be just fine.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I actually prefer Cena's ringwork over CCC, which is saying something.

 

The thing that disturbs me about this Carlito/Shelton feud is that they are jobbing out a guy with huge potential to a guy that frankly isn't any good. Carlito is a good talker, but man does he suck in the ring. I saw the same match at a house show and Carlito on offense is like watching paint dry. It's simply not believable to have him beat people when he has not ONE credible offensive move. No finisher, nothing.

That's just it though, he's not being jobbed out. He hasn't really 'lost' a match to Carlito yet. Each and every time they've faced since his arrival on RAW, Carlito has had to cheat somehow to beat Shelton. It's just Old School Heel.

 

It's obvious, the way they're portraying it, Shelton can evidently beat Carlito. In most of thematches, it's Shelton who has the upper hand and it's Shelton who's kicking ass (barring almost fucking himself up a few times, and then getting beat or something after that) until Carlito cheats somehow to end the match. So IMO it's not so much as him being jobbed out.

 

I also think Shelton will win the title back cleanly at SS. I could be wrong, but that's what I'm guessing.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

What is the point of Shelton becoming IC Champ again? He did nothing with the belt when he held it the 1st time. That championships a curse I tell you. I think Shelton needs to be pushed to the ME and soon.

[Black Lushus 0]

exactly, and winning a fued against Angle woulda been a step in that direction but nooooo....

[Team Angle Pusher 0]

Just have a non-title match against Carlito and Shelton Benjamin easily wins. Kurt Angle comes up to him and he says "you think you are it hah?". Next week Shelton beats Gene Snitsky easily. Then have Shelton versus Edge and Shelton wins because Matt Hardy comes out and Edge is scared, Exploder Suplex, Shelton wins. Three impressive wins in a row. Then Kurt says he'll teach Shelton what he's all about. They do the medal challenge and Shelton dominates Kurt for 2 minutes, Kurt gets desperate and starts hitting Shelton with a chair, DQ for Shelton, Kurt says Shelton didn't hold on till 3 minutes. At Summerslam in a Ladder match Shelton beats Kurt. Next PPV he beats Kurt again. Next PPV he feuds with Triple H etc etc....it's easy

[Guest MikeSC]

I don't get why they're so hesitant to try Shelton as a star. Just push him to the moon. I don't think he'll fail.

 

And since they obviously have nothing planned for him --- dumping Haas is REALLY baffling, since that feud was ready-made.

[Angle-plex 0]

Kane/Edge is pointless and horrible. ALMOST as bad as Edge/Regal 2002. Even if they didn't already the whole thing was fake; Kane already got his "revenge". So stop having them have matches!

 

Shelton/Carlito is even MORE predictable and horrendous, with Shelton's Sabu-style fucking up of spots. Their matches are just a fucking mess of moves thrown together until a "hot" finish.

 

Both of these feuds need to end.

[zyn081 0]

exactly, and winning a fued against Angle woulda been a step in that direction but nooooo....

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I agree with you Lushus.

 

Just have a non-title match against Carlito and Shelton Benjamin easily wins. Kurt Angle comes up to him and he says "you think you are it hah?". Next week Shelton beats Gene Snitsky easily. Then have Shelton versus Edge and Shelton wins because Matt Hardy comes out and Edge is scared, Exploder Suplex, Shelton wins. Three impressive wins in a row. Then Kurt says he'll teach Shelton what he's all about. They do the medal challenge and Shelton dominates Kurt for 2 minutes, Kurt gets desperate and starts hitting Shelton with a chair, DQ for Shelton, Kurt says Shelton didn't hold on till 3 minutes. At Summerslam in a Ladder match Shelton beats Kurt. Next PPV he beats Kurt again. Next PPV he feuds with Triple H etc etc....it's easy

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Bit late for that now. And why squash your IC Champ (I know hes lame, but still) and Edge (who is supposedly in a big programme right now) just to feed them to Shelton?

 

They could have had Shelton in Striker/Martels postion, with Angle cheating to win. Just have RAW in Sheltons hometown the 1st week, cheating to win, and Shelton coming out the next week saying that he doesnt care where hes from, he wants a rematch with Angle. Angle plays the cowardly heel and backs out of it . . .

 

I love the Ladder Match idea. Angle has my idea of what a Ladder Match should be. Incapacitate your opponent and climb the ladder, dont do stupid shit with it. Leave that to Benjamin. And Benjamin is up over HHH already so HHH automatically has beef with Shelton.

 

I don't get why they're so hesitant to try Shelton as a star. Just push him to the moon. I don't think he'll fail.

 

And since they obviously have nothing planned for him --- dumping Haas is REALLY baffling, since that feud was ready-made.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Damn Mike, when were you allowed back in?

 

My sentiments exactly regarding Shelton.

 

Yes, would have been gold. Could you imagine an Angle-Shelton-Haas Tripe Threat for Angles Medals or Sheltons IC title.

[RedJed 0]

I don't get why they're so hesitant to try Shelton as a star. Just push him to the moon. I don't think he'll fail.

 

And since they obviously have nothing planned for him --- dumping Haas is REALLY baffling, since that feud was ready-made.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Yeah, all it would have taken was Hass to Raw or Shelton to Smackdown (which in hindsight I think would have been the better idea) and there ya go.

 

I think this Carlito/Benjamin feud is getting old and there is no need for anymore matches other than another on Raw where Shelton wins convincingly just to prove it can be done, of course doesnt have to be for the title. I hate to devalue the IC title, but have him cut a promo saying he accomplished what he wanted by having the IC title before and now wants the WWE title. Cue Angle and you have a start of a program beginning with a SummerSlam match. Carlito can then work against someone else for the title at SummerSlam like Kane for all I care.

 

Team Angle Pusher basically summarized how Shelton could get some credibility back to lead to an Angle feud...

[Exslade ZX 0]

The thing that disturbs me about this Carlito/Shelton feud is that they are jobbing out a guy with huge potential to a guy that frankly isn't any good.  Carlito is a good talker, but man does he suck in the ring.  I saw the same match at a house show and Carlito on offense is like watching paint dry.  It's simply not believable to have him beat people when he has not ONE credible offensive move.  No finisher, nothing.

 

Smackdown is still a decent enough show.  The Eddie/Rey stuff is consistently entertaining (though I worry what this secret will be).  At least you have guys like the Mexicools who can have a fun midcard match.  Just job the useless Orlando Jordan to Benoit and get a real US title scene going and that show is going to be just fine.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I actually prefer Cena's ringwork over CCC, which is saying something.

 

The thing that disturbs me about this Carlito/Shelton feud is that they are jobbing out a guy with huge potential to a guy that frankly isn't any good. Carlito is a good talker, but man does he suck in the ring. I saw the same match at a house show and Carlito on offense is like watching paint dry. It's simply not believable to have him beat people when he has not ONE credible offensive move. No finisher, nothing.

That's just it though, he's not being jobbed out. He hasn't really 'lost' a match to Carlito yet. Each and every time they've faced since his arrival on RAW, Carlito has had to cheat somehow to beat Shelton. It's just Old School Heel.

 

It's obvious, the way they're portraying it, Shelton can evidently beat Carlito. In most of thematches, it's Shelton who has the upper hand and it's Shelton who's kicking ass (barring almost fucking himself up a few times, and then getting beat or something after that) until Carlito cheats somehow to end the match. So IMO it's not so much as him being jobbed out.

 

I also think Shelton will win the title back cleanly at SS. I could be wrong, but that's what I'm guessing.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

What is the point of Shelton becoming IC Champ again? He did nothing with the belt when he held it the 1st time. That championships a curse I tell you. I think Shelton needs to be pushed to the ME and soon.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Triple H, John Cena, Kurt Angle, Edge, HBK...guys clearly in line ahead of Shelton for a shot at the WWE Championship.

 

And what's with all this Angle/Shelton talk? Unless they do a whole Team Angle wasn't sucessful because of you, or something to do with team Angle..there's really no point to a Shelton/Angle feud...And Angle could quite possibly already be getting a new superstar over. For all we know, we could see Angle/Striker at Summerslam? Doubt it..but it's very possible.

 

And plus..the point of him winning again..is just to have it. Since when has a WWE championship been anything more then something you just hold, and can say you're better then so and so?

[Guest MikeSC]

I was allowed back in because I did nothing wrong.

 

And I gotta disagree with Angle-plex. Shelton doesn't blow spots that badly or often --- and the only time he goes overboard with spots is when he has to do all of the work in a match alone. Which he has to with Carlito.

 

Carlito, to me, is a modern-day WWF Roddy Piper --- not terribly good in the ring, but has a personality enough to make him a draw.

[RedJed 0]

Quick thought about the Carlito/Benjamin match last night. Was Shelton "working it" or was he slipping and shaking when he would do top rope spots, generally looking a little clumsy? That could be intentional, playing into the past match regarding that. But hell, he even slipped when he ran out during the lumberjack match. Weird.

[Guest MikeSC]

I didn't notice it, but I wasn't paying close attention. He might have been, as I do remember the announcers mentioning their past matches more than once.

[Exslade ZX 0]

Quick thought about the Carlito/Benjamin match last night. Was Shelton "working it" or was he slipping and shaking when he would do top rope spots, generally looking a little clumsy? That could be intentional, playing into the past match regarding that. But hell, he even slipped when he ran out during the lumberjack match. Weird.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Like I said in the RAw thread, I have to think he's legit fucking up...I know had I taken a fall like he did a few weeks ago, I might be a little hessitant to hit all these spots too, and yet he still goes for them. So maybe it's a conscience thing. Because I can't imagine anyone "working it" to that extent...because he could really, really, get hurt trying that.

 

edit- Also look at the ropes everytime he stood on them last night..they were loose as hell. That doesn't explain his slip on the steps though...but yea, that may have had something to do with it.

[zyn081 0]

Yeah, all it would have taken was Hass to Raw or Shelton to Smackdown (which in hindsight I think would have been the better idea) and there ya go.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I dont see how that would have worked. RAW is already low on talent. They needed Haas more than SD needed Shelton. Why does everybody have to go to SD?

 

Triple H, John Cena, Kurt Angle, Edge, HBK...guys clearly in line ahead of Shelton for a shot at the WWE Championship.

 

And what's with all this Angle/Shelton talk? Unless they do a whole Team Angle wasn't sucessful because of you, or something to do with team Angle..there's really no point to a Shelton/Angle feud...And Angle could quite possibly already be getting a new superstar over. For all we know, we could see Angle/Striker at Summerslam? Doubt it..but it's very possible.

 

And plus..the point of him winning again..is just to have it. Since when has a WWE championship been anything more then something you just hold, and can say you're better then so and so?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

HHH should be kept far away from the WWE Championship. Last time I checked, Cena was WWE Champion, so how can he get a shot at it. The other guys are obviously ahead of Shelton. I said Shelton should be in the ME and not win the bloody thing.

 

There are a number of ways they can build up Angle/Shelton. People would just like to see it, is that ok? Id like Angle/Striker too, but how are they going to justify it given 4 weeks to SS?

 

Oooo, wow, look at my shiney new belt. Thats the whole point of it. But you add prestige to yourself and the title by defending it as much as you can. Winning it is only the beginning. Shelton did nothing with it.

 

Quick thought about the Carlito/Benjamin match last night. Was Shelton "working it" or was he slipping and shaking when he would do top rope spots, generally looking a little clumsy? That could be intentional, playing into the past match regarding that. But hell, he even slipped when he ran out during the lumberjack match. Weird.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Like I said in the RAw thread, I have to think he's legit fucking up...I know had I taken a fall like he did a few weeks ago, I might be a little hessitant to hit all these spots too, and yet he still goes for them. So maybe it's a conscience thing. Because I can't imagine anyone "working it" to that extent...because he could really, really, get hurt trying that.

 

edit- Also look at the ropes everytime he stood on them last night..they were loose as hell. That doesn't explain his slip on the steps though...but yea, that may have had something to do with it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Am I the only here that thinks that this is like the Randy concussed angle they were thinking of doing at the beginning of they year?

[Exslade ZX 0]

HHH should be kept far away from the WWE Championship. Last time I checked, Cena was WWE Champion, so how can he get a shot at it. The other guys are obviously ahead of Shelton. I said Shelton should be in the ME and not win the bloody thing.

Yea, I didn't quite word it right..in regards to Cena, I basically meant those are guys higher on the stepping stone, and Atm, I can't picture Shelton 'up there' with them so to speak, unless I guess he does like he did HHH and beats a main eventer in a random match or something.

 

And I'm pretty sure house show matches are having HHH vs John Cena? So I suppose that's what they're building too...whether people want him kept far away or not.

[RedJed 0]

Yeah, all it would have taken was Hass to Raw or Shelton to Smackdown (which in hindsight I think would have been the better idea) and there ya go.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I dont see how that would have worked. RAW is already low on talent. They needed Haas more than SD needed Shelton. Why does everybody have to go to SD?

 

 

My thought I've always had was that Raw should be the predominant "sports entertainers" show and Smackdown could be of the more pure wrestlers who could get over in a brand that wouldnt emphasize the importance of mic skills as much, and more push the strong points of a person's workrate. With that said, Shelton should have been sent to Smackdown. I fear he's going to flounder on Raw without any decent opponents to work with long term.

 

And IMO I dont see where Smackdown got the best of the deal and Raw is "low on talent" at all. It seemed very much like an even trade back and forth with the talent.

[Guest xad]

Quick thought about the Carlito/Benjamin match last night. Was Shelton "working it" or was he slipping and shaking when he would do top rope spots, generally looking a little clumsy? That could be intentional, playing into the past match regarding that. But hell, he even slipped when he ran out during the lumberjack match. Weird.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Too me it didn't seem like he was working it, instead he was legitimately close to messing up. Lumberjack match he did mess up, where he slipped when jumping on the steel steps, i cringed when i saw that - i think his messed up spot messed him up a little mentally to the extent that he still has it on his mind when doing his current spots which makes him hesitate a little ultimately causing him to come close to messing up moves.

 

One other thing about Shelton, am i in the minority who thinks Sheltons mic work is terrible? Its just emotionless and bad, not only that, most of the time it sounds like he's got a mouthful of saliva - his delivery i find to be bad as well. His mic work i'd best describe as being bland. I think if his mic work was better he'd be getting a much better push by management.

[zyn081 0]

Yea, I didn't quite word it right..in regards to Cena, I basically meant those are guys higher on the stepping stone, and Atm, I can't picture Shelton 'up there' with them so to speak, unless I guess he does like he did HHH and beats a main eventer in a random match or something.

 

And I'm pretty sure house show matches are having HHH vs John Cena? So I suppose that's what they're building too...whether people want him kept far away or not.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Thats what people are saying, build him up with fueds vs Angle and HHH.

 

I thought HHH was off all WWE shows, TV or not.

 

My thought I've always had was that Raw should be the predominant "sports entertainers" show and Smackdown could be of the more pure wrestlers who could get over in a brand that wouldnt emphasize the importance of mic skills as much, and more push the strong points of a person's workrate. With that said, Shelton should have been sent to Smackdown. I fear he's going to flounder on Raw without any decent opponents to work with long term.

 

And IMO I dont see where Smackdown got the best of the deal and Raw is "low on talent" at all. It seemed very much like an even trade back and forth with the talent.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Yes, so are mine. But you can strip the shows so one is entertainment and the other is sports, cause both would be hit by that. I think he can work with Angle, HHH, RVD, HBK and Cena so hes not too bad.

 

Look at the lumberjacks, dont they normally have like 20 of them round the ring? There was 12 heels and then 7 faces came on down. That was like close to the entire locker room. Was there any really decent talent given the current state of booking. I dont see how you can compare TBS and CCC to Orton and Christain. Its pretty obvious whose better. The 3 other trades where pretty even. Look at the trade though. People traded to RAW were cut or given a real shitty gimmick.

[RedJed 0]

Look at the lumberjacks, dont they normally have like 20 of them round the ring? There was 12 heels and then 7 faces came on down. That was like close to the entire locker room. Was there any really decent talent given the current state of booking. I dont see how you can compare TBS and CCC to Orton and Christain. Its pretty obvious whose better. The 3 other trades where pretty even. Look at the trade though. People traded to RAW were cut or given a real shitty gimmick.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

The way I look at it is this way -

 

Angle for Orton, fair trade, both are viable main eventers

TBS for Hassan, fair trade, both stink it up IMO

Christian for Carlito, fair trade - both have potential but are just kind of there right now

RVD for Benoit, seems fair to me also

 

Those trades didnt amount to shit on either side and were more a joke than anything since many got released, on both sides. The only people who have benefitted (or at least got airtime) since then is Chavo, Dupree, and Simon Dean.