Bored 0 Report post Posted November 1, 2005 ESPN's "exclusive" announcement is in a couple of hours but it has already been leaked that Derek Jeter has won the Gold Glove at shortstop for the second straight year. I guess unecessarily diving into the stands after he caught a foul ball last year has carried him two awards and probably now has it nailed down for the rest of this decade. Wonderful. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
EVIL~! alkeiper 0 Report post Posted November 1, 2005 ESPN's "exclusive" announcement is in a couple of hours but it has already been leaked that Derek Jeter has won the Gold Glove at shortstop for the second straight year. I guess unecessarily diving into the stands after he caught a foul ball last year has carried him two awards and probably now has it nailed down for the rest of this decade. Wonderful. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Bill James wrote an excellent piece regarding Rafael Palmeiro's Gold Glove in '99, stating that it wasn't that the voters were idiots, but that the process is screwed up. If you divided the vote into "Jeter" and "other," you would find that most of the votes went elsewhere. But since there is no concensus regarding who the best defensive SS in the American League is currently, it allows a player like Jeter with a devoted base of support to win these things. Jeter's defensive statistics improved again so I don't think it is a travesty. Juan Uribe put on a showcase this postseason, so if he remains a starter he will garner serious support next year. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Failed Bridge 0 Report post Posted November 1, 2005 Orlando Cabrera should have won the Gold Glove in the AL this season. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Brett Favre 0 Report post Posted November 1, 2005 The dive wasn't unnecessary. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
EVIL~! alkeiper 0 Report post Posted November 1, 2005 AL Gold Gloves C- Jason Varitek, Bos 1B- Mark Teixeira, Tex 2B- Orlando Hudson, Tor SS- Derek Jeter, NYY 3B- Eric Chavez, Oak OF- Torii Hunter, Min OF- Vernon Wells, Tor OF- Ichiro Suzuki, Sea P- Kenny Rogers, Tex Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
EVIL~! alkeiper 0 Report post Posted November 1, 2005 Jason Varitek's the worst selection, IMO. On what basis could Varitek possibly deserve a Gold Glove? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Failed Bridge 0 Report post Posted November 1, 2005 Tek actually made a few game changing plays this season with his plate blocking ability and willingness to get barreled over. I'm not saying its gold glove worthy, but its not the worst. I mean Torri Hunter missed the last two months of the season and O-Cab was the best fielding SS in the majors this season. I'd say Jeter and Hunter getting gold gloves is much more questionable than Tek. And Jeter's dive into the stands was unnessecary. He had caught the ball in fair ground, kept on running and then dove into the stands. He could have slid on his ass at any given time and stopped before the wall. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kahran Ramsus 0 Report post Posted November 1, 2005 Nice to see Hudson finally get some credit. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Precious Roy 0 Report post Posted November 1, 2005 And Jeter's dive into the stands was unnessecary. He had caught the ball in fair ground, kept on running and then dove into the stands. He could have slid on his ass at any given time and stopped before the wall. You're an idiot. He was RUNNING FULL SPEED WITH HIS EYES ON THE BALL. Moron. Anyway, I'm bummed that A-Rod didn't win, but Chavez is good too Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Failed Bridge 0 Report post Posted November 1, 2005 I've seen plenty of players make very similiar plays to that one without feeling the need to dive face first into the stands. Everybody who's not a Yankee fan or working for ESPN seem to think he did his best to turn what would have been an above average play into something tremendous. He got his face all busted up for doing it though so in the end I don't care. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
EVIL~! alkeiper 0 Report post Posted November 1, 2005 Let's not turn this into an argument about that dive, especially with Frigid Soul. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Failed Bridge 0 Report post Posted November 1, 2005 that's Al's way of saying I'm right! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
EVIL~! alkeiper 0 Report post Posted November 1, 2005 that's Al's way of saying I'm right! <{POST_SNAPBACK}> That's my way of saying it happened last year and no one outside of a select few really gives a damn about it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Brett Favre 0 Report post Posted November 1, 2005 I've seen plenty of players make very similiar plays to that one without feeling the need to dive face first into the stands. Everybody who's not a Yankee fan or working for ESPN seem to think he did his best to turn what would have been an above average play into something tremendous. He got his face all busted up for doing it though so in the end I don't care. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Johnny Damon said he would have broken a leg if he didn't dive; and it's not like he had more than half a second to decide. It sucks that A-Rod didn't win a gold glove, and Hudson is nice. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bored 0 Report post Posted November 1, 2005 See it's a shame because Jeter's best play ever is completely overlooked by the many overrated ones (the "dive" into the stands and the Jeremy Giambi play). The best play he ever made was against the A's in that infamous 2001 ALDS in Game 5 when literally did have to fall into the stands to make a catch. Anyways I almost feel bad for pointing out the Jeter selection after seeing Jason Varitek win it. Awful, awful selection. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mike546 0 Report post Posted November 1, 2005 Orlando Cabrera should have won the Gold Glove in the AL this season. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Beyond all the fancy fielding statistics, Jeter had only two more errors than Cabrera in over 200 more chances. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Red Baron 0 Report post Posted November 1, 2005 Not surprised that Hudson was nominated but surprised to see Vernon Wells there. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Precious Roy 0 Report post Posted November 1, 2005 I've seen plenty of players make very similiar plays to that one without feeling the need to dive face first into the stands. Everybody who's not a Yankee fan or working for ESPN seem to think he did his best to turn what would have been an above average play into something tremendous. He got his face all busted up for doing it though so in the end I don't care. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> You've seen a lot of players run from shortstop past the third baseline full speed to catch a foul ball? Yeah, sure you have And even if that play can be made without going over the wall into the crowd, it wasn't that time. Baseball is not an exact science, you can take the same situation and get a different result every time. If Jeter gets 10 chances to make the play he won't go over the wall every time, but on the chance he did get that's what happend. And "everybody who's not a Yankee fan" usually means people who actively dislike them, as most baseball fans seem to do. Of COURSE they're going to think he did it just to try and be cool, which is seriously one of the dumbest things I've ever heard. I don't like the Red Sox, so I'm going to say Johnny Damon ran into that dude headfirst in 2003 because he thought it would be "cool" and he needed an excuse to grow a beard. Yeah, that's the ticket. EDIT* and that's the last I'll say, out of respect for Keiper. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CanadianChris 0 Report post Posted November 2, 2005 Post #9000 sez... Not surprised that Hudson was nominated but surprised to see Vernon Wells there. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Why? It's his second. Besides, he was the only regular CF in the league without an error this season -- that will win it for you more times than not. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Fishyswa Report post Posted November 2, 2005 Some of you are retarded, what was he supposed to do, slide into the siding and break a hip, magically float over the stands and back onto the field, go into it like ring-steps, shoulder first? Any option still leaves you with a great play. I'm not sure I wouldn't of picked someone else, but it's not like somebody got robbed. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Precious Roy 0 Report post Posted November 2, 2005 magically float over the stands and back onto the field Now THAT would have been cool Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Brian Report post Posted November 2, 2005 Turn his back and take the back bump like a man. Of course, not all of us can measure up to the likes of Chris Benoit. Give that man a gold glove. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
EVIL~! alkeiper 0 Report post Posted November 2, 2005 Another point on the Varitek selection. If he is really the best defensive catcher in the league, why do the Sox use Doug Mirabelli to catch Tim Wakefield? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mike546 0 Report post Posted November 2, 2005 Game 5 ALCS 2004, when he catching Wake almost cost them the game. One .. more ... passed .. ball. argh. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vern Gagne 0 Report post Posted November 2, 2005 Anyone have a list of defensive win shares by position? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bored 0 Report post Posted November 2, 2005 Yup. A.L. C: Joe Mauer (Varitek, 10th) 1B: Mark Teixeira 2B: Orland Hudson 3B: Chone Figgins (Chavez, 2nd) SS: Juan Uribe (Jeter, 6th) OF: Aaron Rowand, Vernon Wells, Grady Sizemore (Suzuki, 9th; Hunter, 16th) N.L. C: Mike Matheny 1B: Derrek Lee 2B: Craig Counsell 3B: David Wright SS: Rafael Furcal OF: Carlos Beltran, Brady Clark, Willy Taveras Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mike546 0 Report post Posted November 2, 2005 Just wondering, where does Posada rank in defensive win shares? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bored 0 Report post Posted November 2, 2005 Posada finished 4th in the A.L. this year. Link Even though Win Shares are better than the basic metrics for defense it's not without its flaws and weird results as well. UZR (Ultimate Zone Rating) is probably the best stat for defense but it's not one that is made readily available by it's creator Michael Lichtman who works for the Cardinals. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
EVIL~! alkeiper 0 Report post Posted November 2, 2005 I would point out that while Figgins has more win shares than Chavez, those are accumulated over six positions. Figgins played 56 games at third base. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vern Gagne 0 Report post Posted November 2, 2005 What is the difference between zone rating, and ultimate zone rating? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites