College Hoops: December

[SilverPhoenix 0]

From the way U of L has played lately, Nova by all rights should kill us by at least 20 at home, and 30 in Philly.

 

What's up with Zaga's red jerseys here? They look like Arizona. I can see why they are still viewed as a mid major, but Memphis? They've been to a few Final 4s before. I know they are playing in a crap conf. but I wonder if the Big East regrets not taking Memphis now? Wouldn't they be better than taking nonentities like DePaul and Marquette? Or USF, who sucks in basically everything and has zero fanbase?

 

That's the only reason why Memphis would be considered a Mid Major, is in terms of conference strength. Memphis had a lot of big boys in the past to lock horns with that kept the Mid Major tag off of them (and the rest of the CUSA Gang), but when you go from playing Cincinatti to playing Fucking Marshall in Conference Play, you're going to have a few problems with perception.

 

As for whether Memphis should be in the Big East (which they should) there is a good reason why they may have been left out in the first round of expansion/rebuliding.

 

- The Big East itself needed equal representation between the Division I-A, and the non I-A side of things. Too many times in the past, one side controlled everything, and made things very uncomfortable for the others. With equal voting power, the theory is that the conference will be easier to move in its adminstrative affairs.

 

- South Florida has alot of potential, honestly. Even with a 6 - 5 record, they are going to a bowl game (which is a good sign), and have been recruiting very well off the field as well (They just landed one of the top JC Quarterbacks in the nation), and have shown they can play on the BCS level (*Insert all of your Big East Football Sucks Cracks*), even if it is the "worst" BCS conference.

 

- The main reason I think is because the Big East is getting ready for what seems to be the final act in all of this conference Realignment that has dominated College Sports this decade. The spilt between the I-A and non I-A schools into their own leauges. In 2003, when this was done, you needed to have 6 Teams together for 5 years to retain an Auto-Bid to the Tournament, or you would not have one. Without DePaul and Marquette, you have the original Catholic 5 (St. Johns, Georgetown, Seton Hall, Providence, and Villanova), plus Norte Dame, who is not guranteed to stay with that group, and if they bolted at any time, it would dick over original Big East Members (which would be fucking retarded for the I-A members to screw) and leave them without that. DePaul and Marquette gives them the foundation to return the Big East to what it orignally was. A Major Basketball conference for those without I-A programs. Except this time it would be mostly Catholic.

 

So in a scenario where Norte Dama leaves both future conferences for other plans (i.e. The Big 10) if they both spilt and went to 10 members, here are your new leauges.

 

Big East Basketball.

 

Villanova

Georgetown

St. Johns

Marquette

Providence

De Paul

Seton Hall

Dayton

Xavier

And any one from this combination of Holy Cross, St. Joseph's, or possibly Manhattan (St. Joes is not a lock due to the fact that Villanova doesn't want to be in a Conference with other Big 5 Members, IIRC)

 

Eastern Athletic Conference (Working Title)

 

Syracuse

Louisville

West Virginia

South Florida

Cincinatti

Pittsburgh

Rutgers

U Conn

Memphis (No one should fool themselves here, Basketball will drive any Northeast Conference. And if you think otherwise, you're not seeing the whole picture.)

 

And either Central Flordia or ECU (If they're ready)

 

And that is the long answer as to why Memphis isn't in the Big East today. (without getting into the politics)

[cabbageboy 0]

That's looking way ahead or far too much into it. Since the Big East just now got all these teams they can't just split in two immediately and do all that. I'd maybe add Memphis to the mix since they stick out like a sore thumb in an otherwise lousy C-USA, but otherwise leave it alone.

[Damaramu 0]

I cry at how bad OU's offense is. I haven't got to watch a lot of b-ball though. Can they just not get the ball to Bookout and Gray?

 

Is ESPN trying to give Gonzaga a jesus push? I waswatching the Top 10 Plays on SC and they show a Zaga/Memphis highlight and then throw in at the end "Memphis won BUT Gonzaga is still America's team!"

What's even worse is that Ivan Maisel told me these jokers on SC write their own copy. Jesus christ get a producer to write your shows!

[Gert T 0]

Jesus could probably play better on the road than the Zags.

[cabbageboy 0]

Two things hurt Gonzaga last night: 1. The refs in Memphis called about 20 ticky tack fouls in the 2nd half against them. 2. Morrison vanished the last 8 minutes.

 

Truth be told I have given up on Gonzaga ever doing anything. The crappy WCC schedule simply doesn't get them ready enough for tourney play, as they might play their last truly solid opponent before Jan. 1 and then get to squash jobbers. Don't be shocked if they are gone after the 2nd round again.

 

Dama, what should ESPN do? Give Memphis the Jesus push? I think I'd vomit.

[SilverPhoenix 0]

That's looking way ahead or far too much into it. Since the Big East just now got all these teams they can't just split in two immediately and do all that. I'd maybe add Memphis to the mix since they stick out like a sore thumb in an otherwise lousy C-USA, but otherwise leave it alone.

 

Oh no, this wouldn't happen immediately. I give it 5 - 7 Years down the road, if it does happen. Yeah, I admit this is all theory at this point, but it could move into that direction. A 16 Leauge All Sports Giant where some of its members don't play Football hasn't work (see the WAC 1996 - 2000) at all, but at the same time, it really does depend on three things.

 

1) Tournament Bids

2) The new TV contract for the Conference

3) Norte Dame, and what it plans to do in the future

 

This will either keep the Conference together, or drive it apart, IMHO.

 

As for Basketball last night, it seems like Memphis may be the real deal. Having passed this last test at the end of the day, they have momentum of taking down yet another ranked opponent. They have one big match coming up on Janurary 2nd with Texas, and another match that could be more of a test for their opponent (Tennessee) than themselves, but it may end up being a big win in March, if the opponent continues to improve.

 

Memphis has a real shot of going 32 - 1, 31 - 2 (Depending on Texas), and getting itself a #1 Seed despite the crappy Conference. At the worst I see them going 29 - 4 or 28 - 5 (Losing only the games with Texas, the UAB away game, and Houston or UTEP, and if some freak accident happens in the C-USA Championship Game) and still getting a good seed.

 

As for Gonzaga, any hopes for a #1 Seed are now gone, as the WCC will soften up their Resume and themselves as well. If the Zags are to have any shot at the Final Four, they need to find someone other than Morrison to step up in Big Games.

Edited December 28, 2005 by DragonLordKaiba

[Damaramu 0]

No cabbage. They shouldn't give anyone the jesus push. They should report the facts and that's it. I wasn't saying they should give either team that push I was just saying it was stupid that Zaga loses and then rather than comending Memphis they start defending Zaga.

[cabbageboy 0]

Dragon, you've got way more confidence in Texas than me. I think Memphis is going to crush them by 20+ in that game. Texas looks like the biggest fraud of the year thus far.

 

I dare say Tennessee could be a tough one for Memphis, but it's also at home for them. Memphis seemed to have gotten most of their tough games either at home or neutral sites. UAB is a decent team, but a really serious contender finds a way to beat them.

[Damaramu 0]

I agree on Texas. I don't think they're even the best team in their conference. I think OU whoops them this year.

 

Actually OU beat them twice last year but it'd be entertaining to see again.

[SilverPhoenix 0]

Dragon, you've got way more confidence in Texas than me. I think Memphis is going to crush them by 20+ in that game. Texas looks like the biggest fraud of the year thus far.

 

I dare say Tennessee could be a tough one for Memphis, but it's also at home for them. Memphis seemed to have gotten most of their tough games either at home or neutral sites. UAB is a decent team, but a really serious contender finds a way to beat them.

 

And the thing is, I agree with you about Texas being a fraud, but the biggest fraud of the year, not yet (that happens if they lose to Memphis (an if, that seems likely) ) for that, dig just a little bit deeper to the Mid Majors and look at Old Dominion. This may be a personal opinion here, but on the boards for the CAA, Old Dominion was pimped out like the second Jesus, with people saying that they would be a Top 10 with a gaudy record of 31 - 1 and a Top 4 Seed to their name. (Ha. Fat Chance), but Old Dominion was definetely pimped out to be this year's Dominant "mid major" save Gonzaga, and ranked in quite a few pre season dirt rags. And so far ODU has lost to.

 

Wisconsin (okay, not a bad loss)

Drexel (This was an In-Conference Game where they scored 10 points in the First Half)

Richmond (They will not finish in the Top 150 RPI wise)

UAB (They got Killed!!)

 

Teams that they needed to beat to make National Noise. They have lost all credibility, all chances at being Raked, and any chance at an At-Large.

 

As unfair as it sounds. Texas still has a chance to save face with a win aganist Memphis, and I don't think it'll be a 20+ point victory for Memphis. Texas is going to be desperate to look for another big win this season (escpecially with the Big XII being down), and I think they may use that desperation to make a run at Memphis. Cause if they lose, it's basically over for them as far as being a legit contender goes.

 

And even if they beat Memphis, they still need to win the Big XII to regain any good chunk of their lost hype.

 

We'll see on Monday at 2:30, it seems.

[iggymcfly 0]

Texas isn't as bad as they looked against Tennessee, but they're definitely not as good as Memphis. Memphis is a legitimate national title contender, and could easily go through the rest of the year undefeated. They get up big for big games, and I don't see them coming out weak against Texas.

 

The Longhorns aren't going to collapse or anything (especially with how bad the Big XII is this year), but they're going to pick up their fair share of losses, and will probably end up somewhere around a 4 seed.

[cabbageboy 0]

Anyone who would rank Old Dominion that highly is a sap though. I thought they might win their conf. (which isn't saying much) but saying they will be 30-1 or whatever is about like saying Iona will be 30-1.

 

I have the premonition however that U of L will end up one of the biggest frauds of the year along with Texas, at least among major teams. At least it'd make sense though, what with home and homes with Nova, UConn, and Cincy and other road games with Cuse and WVU.

 

There really aren't many days off from here on in, maybe USF here at home, but even Marquette and DePaul will likely cause us some trouble.

[SilverPhoenix 0]

I think Iona and/or Bucknell are going to be this year's Pacific where they barely lose any games, get ranked in the Top 20, and have a letdown in their championship game. They'll still get into the tournament due to their low loss totals and Bulletproof RPI rankings.

 

And one of them will win their first round game too.

[cabbageboy 0]

Oh I was quite impressed with Iona in a tough loss I saw to UK in person last week. Steve Burtt is a bad ass. As long as Iona doesn't run into someone in the 1st round with a really excellent big man, they can pull an upset. Hell, if Burtt hadn't gotten the bogus 2 fouls in the 1st half (a la David Padgett vs. UK), Iona might have had a shot.

[SilverPhoenix 0]

This may be late, but UAB had a very impressive performance last night on ESPN, taking down a rebuilding (but still pretty good) Oklahoma State Team at their house masterfully. UAB may not be Memphis, but if they keep this up. They may be able to keep up with them in Memphis, and possibly beat them at their house.

 

Too bad Mike Anderson may soon be swallowed up by a Bigger Program, cause he could help build UAB into a Monster, and in turn make C-USA Basketball worth a shit, again.

[therealworldschampion 0]

Nova beat Temple by 23 points, but they did look a little sluggish in the second half. Louisville on the road is next, and they have a road date at Texas in a couple of weeks.

[nogoodnick 0]

Arizona beats #7 Washington in 2 OTs 96-95. Maybe the Huskies wont run away with the conference after all.

[Guest Ether]

Pitt beats Wisconsin 73-64 to finish their non-conference slate at 11-0 and, more importantly, shows that their record and ranking wasn't built on beating up low-level competition.

 

To add my thoughts on Big East expansion, while I know many fans think Memphis should have been invited instead of Cincinnati, I think your front-runners for possible expansion are UCF and East Carolina. A small tidbit I heard is that the football coach at Toledo has told some recruits that they are going to be invited soon (which I personally find hard to believe, but hey). Army and Navy are mentioned all the time also. I've also heard that nothing would likely happen till at least 2008 because the most viable teams for expansion are C-USA teams, and the Big East agreed not to invite any teams from there for a few years. Didn't want to act the same way some other conferences do. cough...ACC...cough

[Guest Leelee]

Oklahoma beat Alabama in a fairly boring game. Sampson is gonna have to tone down his beliefs in defensive rebounding... because Alabama shot over 60% on them in the first half. And they have no shooters outside of Davis. I guess it worked since they did dominate the boards against the size of Alabama... but it's noticeable that OU barely defends the outside shot.

 

Gonzaga/St. Joe's was a fun shootout. It's weird to see two teams on national TV with no depth like both of them. Like watching the MAAC games like I used to. While I love watching Gonzaga... they're just not as good previous years, and I'm not sure if they're even a Top 20 team, most nights. Batista is too slow to defend, thus they have nobody who can defend the post. They really need a defender like Turiaf.

[cabbageboy 0]

I never thought Pitt was any kind of fraud team. In fact I am more worried about U of L playing them than I am either Nova or UConn. At least those teams play similar styles to Pitino ball.

 

U of L has a rare opportunity to begin BE play. Nova will be undefeated, Pitt might be, UConn might be...all when coming to Freedom Hall. Good chance to puncture some balloons.

[Guest Ether]

Unlike the other teams that started off highly ranked that maybe should not have been, not much was expected of Pitt for this season. Troutman graduated and Taft left early, while Pitt didn't know if Krauser was going to return until July. Pitt is playing three freshman that are having to see a lot of playing time already.

 

I don't know how other media outlets and fans around the country are viewing Pitt basketball, but Pitt is cursed in having Penn State people in the major newspapers puting a negative spin on most of the stories. When Pitt crushed Auburn, they "played the worst team from a major conference" or they "muddied the water" when they beat South Carolina. Crap like that which diminishes their accomplishments.

[cabbageboy 0]

Pitt is more about their style and system than who they actually have. At least I think so. Lose Knight? No problem, just plug in Krauser. Lose Taft or Troutman? Just plug some guys in who can rebound and defend, you'll be ok. I joked about the possibility of Pitt/Cincy this year in the Big East, but Cincy is actually playing some up tempo ball at the moment. Then you see some of these U of L scores this year (53-45 over Richmond, 56-48 vs. Detroit, 58-43 vs. Miami)....man that U of L/Pitt game has the chance to be bowling shoe ugly.