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Foley vs. Vader>Sting vs. Vader

Not at all, I hate the untalented bastard. Cancelled within the first season.

I'll order to see him.

I dunno, I guess the finish is I went back the following month, got in for free, and had the Rockin Rebel ask me to not be near the guardrail when she came out.

Foley's got way more charisma and understanding of ring psychology then that dullard Sting. He also has many more memorable matches under his belt. What's Sting got? Clash Of The Champions I? Starrcade '97?

Fight Club Scarface Taxi Driver The Shawshank Redemption

Taken directly from RAW magazine, This is the kind of **** I was putting up with - despite the fact that I was on the booking committee. That’s why it pissed me off when Mick Foley blamed me for not recognizing his full potential during that period. In his book, Have A Nice Day, Foley wrote, “Ric Flair was every bit as bad on the booking side of things as he was great on the wrestling side of it.” First of all, I’ll never call myself a great booker, because wrestling always came first. But Foley took a shot at me. Here’s his receipt - I’m taking a shot at him. When I first started on the booking committee, Foley was working as Cactus Jack and doing an angle where he was living in a homeless shelter. I admit it - I didn’t know what to do with a 300-pound guy living in a homeless shelter. It took P.T. Barnum, in the form of Vince McMahon, to take a guy whose claim to fame was his willingness to get thrown off a cage, to turn him into Mankind, and make him into a champion. Foley has a cult following because of his contribution to hardcore wrestling. But hardcore is such a small part of the history of this business. When I was training, falling off a ladder was not a prerequisite to making it as a professional wrestler. Being fundamentally sound was. Occasionally seeing the inside of a gym was. When I trained under Verne Gagne, we started with 500 free squats, 250 push-ups, 250 sit-ups and a two-mile run over farm terrain in zero-degree weather. Then we came back to the barn to be wrestled into submission, cross-faced into submission, stretched into submission - and if Verne didn’t like the way things were going, we’d start all over. He would have looked at Mick Foley on day one - after Mick failed to do even one thing Verne required - and said, “Mick, I don’t think so.” I don’t care how many thumbtacks Mick Foley has fallen on, how many ladders he’s fallen off of, how many continents he’s supposedly bled on, he’ll always be known as a glorified stuntman. Verne Gagne didn’t fall off a ladder. Dory Funk, Jr. didn’t fall off a ladder. Neither did Wahoo, Steamboat, or Steve Austin. Terry Funk was a great worker before he started doing that. Kurt Angle, Shawn Michaels, and Chris Jericho can do it and maintain their reputations because they’re already respected as athletes. And what about people who never did anything else, like the Sandman? He’s no wrestler. Hardcore became a niche for a lot of guys who couldn’t do **** -all in the ring. I’m not saying that Mick Foley wasn’t a star, that he wasn’t a great attraction. But in my estimation, Mick Foley was not a great worker. He couldn’t punch. He couldn’t kick. In the World Wrestling Federation, he’d spend half the day before television broadcasts sucking up to the writers - because he’s such a fan of himself. There’s a difference between being a great performer and being a guy - like Brutus Beefcake or the Ultimate Warrior - who became famous because he happened to be working for Vince. It’s the same with Foley. When he hasn’t been working for Vince, there’s been no demand for him whatsoever. He’s just another guy. Mick Foley doesn’t understand what it was like to be on that booking committee. Jim Herd humiliated me and made me cut my hair - after I’d won the NWA championship six times. How much power did I have? When I was going through all that, how should I have been able to look at Mick Foley, push everything else aside, and mold him into a superstar? Sting, on the other hand, was worthy of becoming the champion. Foley>Sting And by taking potshots at Foley's training, he is taking shots at WWE Legend Dominic Denucci. At this point, I wish Mick would've stiffed the old bastard in the ring at Mania. Although this pisses me off severely, I am going to enjoy the hell out of the verbal ass raping Flair gives to Shane Douglas. And, while I am thinking of it, Cactus Clothesline>Flair Flip

Agreed. Flair hasn't had a memorable match since 1998 that wasn't nostalgia based. Foley tore it up about 2 months ago at Backlash. Flair is also *a lot* older than Mick Foley. When Flair was 38 (Foley's age now?), he was putting on CLASSICS everytime he wore tights. UYI I'm soooooooooooooo glad someone said this. It's my fault for saying that to begin with, because comparing the two is somewhat ridiculous. Let's just say that Flair is a dick for talking shit on Foley, and an idiot for not recognizing his marketability when he was in WCW, and leave it at that.

Agreed. Flair hasn't had a memorable match since 1998 that wasn't nostalgia based. Foley tore it up about 2 months ago at Backlash.

That match did indeed boost Ric's confidence and he got the tribute he deserved afterwards. Good for him. Why is that such a bad thing? Flair's obviously past his prime and can't hold up with the rest of the guys in the ring, but is he really that unwatchable or are you just finding something to complain about? Obviously, he's having the time of his life and the fans are still reacting, so more power to him. umm, do YOU watch his matches? He hasn't brought anything new or fresh to his matches in over 5 years. He can't even take a back body drop properly. He is just an old flabby guy that can't just let go. It is no different then the boxer Roberto Duran and George Foreman still trying to get in the ring and box. Not to mention he is seriously risking his health and well being. I know the argument is, "well that is his choice" but when you are becoming senile like he is, he may not even know what is best for himself. He needs to retire. So, because you don't agree with him, he's senile? Heck, Flair, in many ways, is right about Foley. What did his style do to him? Retired him young and he'll be in pain for the rest of his life. Is THAT a style you want to have young workers emulate? -=Mike Flair's a bitter dumbass. And Foley is clearly not in pain, as he was moving around the ring like he was 25 in the match against Orton.

He was a main eventer in WCW. What the hell is flair talking about? No demand for him at all when he wasn't working for Vince? Senile old bastard. He was NOT a main eventer in WCW. He did have a few main event feuds, but he was never a Main eventer that would be taken seriously...... Amnesia angle anyone? Besides, that Texas Death Match with Vader looked like it was taken pretty seriously to me.

”I had a thousand reasons for never punching out Eric Bischoff in WCW. He was an executive. I had dragged my family through one lawsuit, and didn’t want to get caught up in another – particularly one I would lose. But, when I was alone, I’d think, Why didn’t you just beat the sh-t out of him? And I blamed myself for never doing it.” - Ric Flair on Eric Bischoff, To Be The Man Ric Flair is among the most beloved performers to ever step inside a professional wrestling ring and with good reason. He has given fans more stellar matches, more memorable interviews, and more nostalgic moments than any one performer in the history of the business. Now, with his new autobiography "To Be The Man". Ric Flair’s legacy will be remembered at an even greater level, as now, it’s in print for all the world to read, and nothing is held back. The book follows Flair’s life as it begins as the adopted son of a Minnesota couple, then follows him through his trials and tribulations he rises to the top of the professional wrestling industry. From breaking into the AWA under Verne Gagne to Mid-Atlantic Wrestling to Japan to Puerto Rico to becoming the NWA World champion to meltdowns with WCW to his runs in the WWF/WWE. There is no review that could ever properly convey the greatness of this book. It’s like the greatness that is Ric Flair the performer. You either understand why he’s great or you’ll never get it at all. Flair explains the differences between being good and being a great performer. He discusses who was great, who could be, and who would have been if not for mitigating circumstances. He explains why someone like Kurt Angle could be great, while someone like Bruno Sammartino in his opinion, wasn’t. It’s fascinating reading from someone 99% of fans believe to be the best of all time. Flair also delves into his private life, discussing his failed first marriage, which he blames on caring more about being the Ric Flair character than dealing with issues at home. He goes into his deep love for his children and his pride for a WCW segment featuring he, David, and Reid at the same time in the ring. He writes about meeting and pursuing his second wife, Beth. He notes that when he made $5000, he spent $6000 and sometimes ran into trouble with the government over taxes. He writes about how much he loved his parents, and how much he misses them, but also notes that they never understood what a big deal it was to Flair to be a star in the business. Mick Foley, move over. Your status as the best wrestling author has been challenged. Flair is honest beyond the point of political correctness as only someone of his stature could be. If anyone else had attempted to write this book, they’d likely end up the most hated person behind the scenes of the business. Instead, Flair will become more beloved as for once in his career, he asserted how he really feels about not just himself (Flair is quick to point out his own faults and errors) but all of the major and minor names he has dealt with during his run in the business. “Bret never regained the fame he’d had in the World Wrestling Federation. Part of it had to do with terrible booking, the other part with Bret’s own deficiencies. What unnerved me the most was the way he used his brother’s death. Through his column in the Calgary Sun, Bret relentlessly bashed Vince McMahon. I sympathize with the emotion – and even the anger – he felt over losing a brother, but I lost respect for him when he made the case into a public spectacle. Why didn’t he take the matter up privately with Vince? It seemed to me that Bret cared more about getting “screwed” in Montreal than he did about Owen’s death, and he used his brother’s death to grind his ax with Vince” - Flair on Bret Hart Flair pays tribute to many of those he worked with early in his career. He tells crazy stories of working in the Caribbean as NWA champion with Roddy Piper as his backup. He discusses the toughness of Harley Race, including how Race watched his back on Japanese tours. He credits Terry Funk and Wahoo McDaniel for his trademark chops, and goes into loving detail about working with McDaniel. He tells an outrageous story about a night on the town with Funk that left Terry naked in Flair’s front yard and Flair vomiting on his kitchen floor. This is just the tip of the iceberg as Flair discusses partying with Stan Hansen, The Horsemen, and so many others. You can see Flair misses the old way the business used to run and misses many of his old friends. He writes about his regrets of missing funerals for those who have passed on. ”Jim Herd was an idiot. This is not defamation. I’m just telling you history. The man had no right to be anywhere near a wrestling company.” - Flair on former WCW executive Jim Herd, the man who fired him in 1991. Flair discusses the rigors of the road including a breakdown that sent him fleeing from Japan back to the United States, where he was met by promoter Jim Crockett and taken right back to Japan. He details the plane crash that nearly ended his career and his determination to return to the business. He discusses suggesting Dusty Rhodes as Crockett’s booker after George Scott departs, only to see Rhodes’ ego shoot into the stratosphere and the company collapse. Flair discusses, almost in amazement, the poor management of WCW from day one by Turner Executives. He recounts his feuds with Ricky Steamboat. He remembers his battles with Jim Herd and how he was fired and sent Vince McMahon the gold NWA World championship belt the next day. ”This isn’t kind to say, but fans didn’t care about Randy as much once Elizabeth was no longer part of the package. The company tried reversing this; they gave Randy the “Macho Midget,” and made Randy a color commentator like Bobby Heenan and Jesse “The Body” Ventura. But the departure of Elizabeth had taken away some of his edge as a performer. It’s another reason why I don’t consider Savage great; he just couldn’t carry it on his own.” - Flair on Randy Savage, who he wrestled at Wrestlemania VIII Flair praises his first run in the WWF, although he rightfully feels his matches with Hulk Hogan should have been the biggest thing ever, but were barely a blip on the business’ Richter scale due to Hogan’s issues with Vince McMahon at the time. He discusses his return to the company, the various incarnations of the Four Horsemen, Eric Bischoff’s rise in power and more. Flair also goes deeply into his personal agony as WCW tried to destroy his legacy, despite how much he meant to the lineage and tradition of the company. He places the blame without hesitation on Eric Bischoff being awestruck and maneuvered by the likes of Hulk Hogan and Randy Savage, among others. Flair refuses to forgive Bischoff (and Hogan) even today, especially after he reveals that many of the acquisitions that helped set WCW onto the path of dominance over the WWF (Bobby Heenan, Gene Okerlund, Hogan, Savage) were ones that Flair himself suggested. Like Dusty Rhodes before him, Bischoff ignored Flair after Flair had tried to do nothing more than help the company succeed. Despite his desire to help the company and initial approval of Bischoff as the head of WCW, Flair found himself on the outs and the target of a jealous group of performers who sought to keep him out of the spotlight, all for ego. They were already making more then Flair, but they couldn’t stop the crowd from loving him. One can actually feel Flair’s pain as he became the designated fall guy for WCW again and again in an attempt to placate Hogan’s ego and do the best thing for business, despite the business doing nothing in exchange for him. At the same time, according to Flair, Hogan was more obsessed by insider wrestling newsletters then anything else. Flair admits he was just trying to survive by then. ”In 1999, four months after being released from WCW, The Renegade shot himself to death in his kitchen in Marietta, Georgia. The guy obviously had other problems, so I’d never blame Hogan for the suicide. But I do blame both Hogan and Bischoff for inflating the kid’s ego and giving him the impression that he was capable of being a star.” - Flair on the late Renegade Rick Wilson, who held the WCW Television championship. You can hear the outrage as Flair’s best friend Arn Anderson is disrespected by management and later the disgust in the NWO sketch that mocked Arn’s retirement. Flair also reveals for the first time the person who came up with the sketch, and shockingly, it wasn't Kevin Nash or Hulk Hogan, but Flair's friend Terry Taylor. Flair tells a hysterical story about Brutus Beefcake trying to explain why he shouldn’t be having a competitive house show match with Eddie Guerrero at the same time Flair was feuding with Hogan. He discusses his lawsuit with WCW over missing a date to attend his son Reid’s amateur wrestling competition and Bischoff burying him to the WCW wrestlers, boasting he would ruin Flair’s life. ”David didn’t say a word. He took it like a man. You had Curt Hennig and Barry Windham, two of the best performers during their primes, and they bounced around for every one of David’s moves. My son couldn’t do anything, and they made him look like a star. And then there was Hogan – with all his experience, and all his celebrity – trying to be cute. He whipped David like a dog. It was sickening, and I’ll never forgive him for it." - Flair on Hulk Hogan taking liberties on David Flair during a Nitro angle, whipping him 15-20 times instead of the discussed 3-4 lashes with a belt. Despite his best efforts, the problems continued and little by little; piece by piece, political woes and injuries ate away at Flair. Flair discusses needing to see a sports psychologist and his own loss of faith in himself. While fans have always seen him as the jetflying, limo riding son of a gun of their youth, Flair himself had lost all belief in his talent by then. It was so bad that by the time he returned to WWE in late 2001, his feelings remained. Flair writes about how he needed to be constantly reminded by the McMahon family (who he obviously loves based on their portrayal in the book) that he was one of the greatest performers in the sport and not someone who time had passed by. One also understands the feeling of relief that went through Flair when WCW finally collapsed, although he admits that if he knew how cheaply Vince McMahon got it for, he would have made a play for the tape library himself. Flair admits that he only wrestled on the last Nitro as a favor to McMahon, who wanted to close the Nitro circle the way it began, with Flair vs. Sting. ”There’s a difference between being a great performer and being a guy – like Brutus Beefcake or the Ultimate Warrior – who became famous because he happened to be working for Vince. It’s the same with Foley. When he hasn’t been working for Vince, there has been no demand for him whatsoever. He’s just another guy.” -Flair on Mick Foley Despite his dislike of Foley (and he has lots more on that subject), Flair’s biggest issue remains with Bischoff and Hogan for their abuse of him in WCW. One can tell of Flair’s disgust when he was hired by WWE, although Flair notes that Bischoff is on the same level as Flair now. Flair writes about trying to force Bischoff to fight him backstage at a Raw and when being reprimanded by Vince McMahon, being asked who else he wanted to do that to. Flair’s answer was Hogan. Flair even admits that of everyone he met in the business, Bischoff was the worst, noting that at least Vince Russo did his best to insure Flair received money owed to him by WCW. The book finishes with the impromptu Greenville, South Carolina Ric Flair pep rally that WWE held for Flair after his match with Triple H on Raw. Flair notes that the wrestlers coming out, organized by Tommy Dreamer, was the moment he felt like “The Nature Boy” again. He credits Triple H for that match and for helping him when he returned to WWE. For all the talk of political abuse of power and other Internet complaints about Triple H, if he truly did help Flair find himself, every fan of this business owes him a thank you. ”To Be The Man” features a humble introduction by Triple H. It lists Mark Madden as editor and was co-written by Keith Elliot Greenberg, who authored Freddie Blassie’s biography. With this tremendous book, Greenberg himself takes another step towards his own place in wrestling history, as one of the most important historical writers on the business. He should be proud of this body of work, as should Flair. Madden as well, should be praised for his work on the book. The book is sprinkled with awesome photos taken at different points of Flair’s career. The book is written from Flair’s point of view, but also features comments from many who impacted his career and life including all of his children, his wife Beth, Ricky Steamboat, David Crockett, Harley Race, Jim Cornette, Earl Hebner, Triple H, Ken Patera, Bobby Heenan, and so many others. While I would have loved a few comments from Sting, this book is as perfect as any ever written about the business. This book will remind everyone once and for all that, “Diamonds are forever, and so is Ric Flair.” If you are any kind of fan of this business, you need to read this book. If you are a fan who has given up on the business, this book will remind you of what you loved. If you are someone breaking into this business, this book will teach you the very important lesson of knowing when to give in and how hard work will always endear you to the most important people in the business – the fans. No matter who you are, if you are reading this, you want to read this book, as soon as you can. Link You Bret Hart fan boys going to jump on Flair's shit now for what he said? I don't agree with what he said about Foley of course. People loved to see him in ECW, WCW, and Japan, he was not a nobody, or "just another guy" to the fans in any of those places.

Eric Clapton's "Wondeful Tonight" would also be a good one.

3PW! 3PW! 3PW!

Drug addiction isn't mental, but anorexia is? They're both for the weak, but still, if you're gonna consider one mental, then the other surely is.

Yeah, what kind of sick freaks could be turned on by Nicole Kidman getting her gear off? I mean, she is kinda pasty.........

I didn't get it anyway, by the time I sent it, all the positions were filled. Well, for now, till someone quits.

Think about it....you're still 18-20 years old and you're earning 200K a year. Your parents are more than happy to give you a cheap place to live. Your money stacks up over the course of say....5 or so years. Eventually, you've earned nearly a million and can now buy a decent place, and have some money left over to live on for years until you have to go get a real job. I'd say that he was smart. I'd say he sounds like me like he is the uber-nerd.

I don't believe any of that mental shit. I call it being a moron.

They've been waiting for that since 1996.

And what about when Pacey nailed his teacher?

Allow me to be the first to say "Ha Ha".

If they fired Mack after all the hours of entertainment he has provided me with, I was going to be pissed.

You know there will be some perverts (Catholic priests, wrestling promoters) turned on by this.

I always wanted to mix that with vodka, but never got around to it.