LessonInMachismo

<<They went on to have a good match with Barbarian and Haku at WM7, too.>> That was probably their only WM win, too. With the Brainbusters, I remember this badass part on Superstars once where the 'busters came out to ringside and Marty and Shawn looked at each and exchanged a few words, both nodded, then they just jumped over the top rope onto the 'busters and started brawling. As for the Hart Foundation and Bulldogs, I think it sucks that the WM3 match was a six-man.

I don't know about anyone else, but I don't have twenty hours to spare a week. Twenty sounds good to me...

I am one hundred percent sure. Why were Nash and Hall wrestling Giant at Slamboree and why did they come out in red and black nWo shirts? EDIT: Here is something to read other than my word. "On the episode of WCW Monday Nitro on May 5, 1998, the federation announced that nWo had split into two "factions". On one side was the nWo Wolfpac faction, which was headed by Kevin Nash. On the other side was nWo Hollywood, which was headed by Hogan" Source: Wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NWo Slamboree was on May 17th.

I want to be the eleventh. How?

Do you think it was over Bret's declining mental state and depression post-Montreal and being misused by WCW? Plus Julie didn't seem like the nicest person in Wrestling w/ Shadows It might have been over Montreal. I know in the days and weeks after it, Bret felt very betrayed at what happened. I thought Julie was probably the sanest person in Wrestling With Shadows. She stood up for her man. And I liked how she called Triple H "Hunter."

::Helwig shows up at Titan.:: Receptionist: Okay, your escort will take you to see Mr. McMahon now. Vince: Come on in, Jim. Short drive from Queens? Jim: Yes, Mr. McMahon. ::Later:: Vince: Okay, from what I've seen of your tapes, what we've got here is a great character. You are exciting...you are full of energy...you've got the look...you are sports entertainment. Jim: Thanks. Vince: The one thing we admittedly do not like is your name. The Dingo Warrior may have been sufficient for a little promotion down in Texas, but this is the World Wrestling Federation. You are no longer The Dingo Warrior. Why we're gonna call you The Ultimate Warrior! THE ULTIMATE WARRIOR! THEE ULTIMAATE WAARIORRR! Jim: Yeah! Vince: You like that! Jim Yeah!!! Vince: Say it! Jim: DA UH-TUH-MIT WOH-RIIII-UH! Vince: Hell yeah! Are you gonna shake those ropes, huh?! Like I saw you do on those tapes? Jim: Yeah! Vince: Are you gonna run around the ring like a crazed buffoon?! Jim: Yeah! Vince: Jack, get his signature! ::Later:: Jim: Hey, mom, it's me. I'm now known as The Ultimate Warrior AKA The Crazed Buffoon!

Slamboree 1998. Scott Hall turned on Nash costing them the tag titles. Nash went on to form the face Wolfpac and Hall stayed with the heel Black and White. It stayed this way for about 7 months when both factions reunited as heels with the fingerpoke incident. Although, only the top names were kept in the reunited NWO (which kept the black/red wolfpac theme). The jobbers (like Stevie Ray, Scott Norton, Vincent, and Horace) were left in the black/white stable, which became known as the "NWO B-team." After Hogan was injured at Spring Stampede 99, they all just went their separate ways. Couldn't tell you about any of the later versions, but that's what happened to the original. Actually, the red and black Wolfpac existed before Slamboree '98. It was Nash, Konnan, Luger, Rude and Hennig (am I missing anyone?) Hall returned from one of this hiatuses as a member, but as mentioned before, turned on Nash in the ME, which was Hall and Nash (faces, accompanied by Dusty) against Giant and Sting (heel and face, respectively). The black and white were trying to get Sting to join. Hall turned on Nash so Sting and Giant won the belts and Sting was handed an nWo shirt. The PPV ended with him looking at it and Tony S. actually said some lame line like "WOW! YOU'LL HAVE TO BUY OUR NEXT PPV TO FIND OUT WHAT THIS ALL MEANS!" or some such. Dusty also took off his red jacket and sided with Giant and Hall. The next PPV was Great American Bash. Sting wound up not wanting to be nWo (duh) and a match was set for GAB: Him vs. Giant, with the winner taking the tag belts and choosing their own partner. Sting came out in red face paint. He won. He chose Nash. Then the Wolfpac went on to become huge faces, almost as over as Goldberg was at the time. I know I was a big mark for them.

Under the Mat? What is this?

They shouldn't in your perspecitve, they should in mine, but what WILL happen is in WWE's hands. This is my point. As for fairness in HHH/Steph...is there any proof of their relationship like there is with Edge/Lita? And Chyna and HHH were not married.

Edge should only be depushed if he's not getting over in his current role. Not because he had a thing for Lita. If it's true- Edge is a major asshole for doing it but I think making him lose fake fights is a stupid way of punishing him- especially since most viewers have no idea that Edge fucked her. Why should WWE get involved in Edge and Lita's business? They're two adults involved in something that's consensual. It's totally scummy on both Edge and Lita's part but the company should not be playing babysitter. There's no reason they shouldn't be on the same show. WWE is a business. We live in an economically libertarian society (capitalism) and companies can make their own policies. I work for a multi-billion dollar company and we do allow relationships, even boss-underling relationships (as long as it isn't marriage), but the company is a "good ole boy" company. Other smaller corporations I've worked for do not allow relationships under any circumstances. Between underlings, between bosses and underlings, between bosses. There are numerous reasons for such a policy, and logical thinking will bring them to you. When you work for a company, you are more or less under contract (in WWE literally) and you must play by their rules. This isn't like the government saying Edge and Lita can't be together because Edge is married or whatever. This is their employer who has business concerns to think about. Stephanie/HHH? Welcome to the real world. Life isn't fair.

This implies that all Japanese matches are about flips and junk. Not true. US wrestlers tend to be a million times more spotty than Japanese. Japanese or Mexican. But I think you're reading too far into it. The message is there. Besides, American workers learned that style from them.

No it isn't. It's true. There is taste to be considered, as well. Ironically, the worker played a Japanese character under a mask and did spotfest matches.

I don't think he has super-duperstar potential. I just don't think American fans will accept a Frenchman who speaks French as a main event guy. Even as a heel. If you look at the heels today, we accept them as being stars. Well, not today per se, but within the last five years. I believe that if he were shoved down our throats, he'd get JBL heat.

Being a "smart" fan, it's sometimes hard to watch guys like HBK and actually like them, knowing what we know about them. When he puts on great matches, it's easy to suspend your knowledge of such things, but it always comes back. It's the same way with Triple H. I tend to be a fan of upstanding guys in real life. Lance Storm is probably tied for my favorite of all time. I named my son Lance, partially because of Mr. Storm. On Hogan/Warrior: I have written it before, but I marked out big time when Warrior won, not so much because I was into him, but because someone beat Hogan. I had never been a fan of Hogan as a kid and even if I had been, even the most devout Hulkamaniacs were getting tired of his formulaic matches. The match was the culmination of an angle and while not great athletically, it was very decent for the guys involved. I just watched it a few weeks ago and I was surprised at how much I enjoyed it. There is an old saying from an indy worker I once knew: "A great match isn't always foreigners doing backflips."

I remember that being a thing of beauty. And you can just hear Bret saying it.

Was Bret U.S. Champ here? Bret Hart [3] 98/11/30 Chattanooga, TN Roddy Piper [3] 99/02/08 Buffalo, NY

Here is an obscure one. In mid-98 or so, the nWo kept saving Jericho. The commentators would put forth questions as to why but nothing ever came of it.

It was the cage match against Hogan. That explains it. That match was so convoluted that I try to forget it.

Wow, are you sure? For some reason, I remember Savage helping Flair, not Bisch. Bischoff "let" Flair go over because he was desperate to get ratings. Remember, he also lost to David Flair the next week and had his head shaved. Something like that would have been better on a PPV, with actual buildup and stuff, though I can speak for myself when I say that it wouldn't have made a difference to me. As far as the 90-day stip, Flair beat someone else so it was for life. I don't remember who or when. Then Piper returned and tried to become president by beating him. It was a clusterfuck. Don't even try to make any sense out of it all.

Too bad WWE couldn't get the GWF library for 24/7. A lot of WWF/E superstars were former GWF stars. But was GWF syndicated? It was on cable... As for syndicated eps...Superstars always had gems aside from the jobber matches. Like the time Heenan and Patera faced off and they had to "censor" Bobby when he began cussing. The usually had a superstar vs. superstar ME, too, and there were some good matches.

Also awesome was something I read in the Observer a while back about ICP coming to a show in the Carolinas to start shit with him. Either it was a work or Cornette is quick on the draw with witty remarks. Ths was during a questionaire in front of a crowd. ICP people: Why don't you give us a mic so we can defend ourselves? Cornette: They're probably afraid you'll sing. Later... ICP people: Why do you talk down to ICP? They've released a lot of albums. Cornette: I don't think "released" is the right word..."escaped" is more like it.

What a great DVD, I might add. I just got it a few weeks ago. I was pleasantly surprised by the match with 2CS. I've never been a big fan of the guy, but he put on a good match with Benoit. And the finish was fantastic.

I'd really started zoning out on WCW at this point in time, but some of this makes no sense to me.... Wasn't DDP a mega-over face when he won the belt? And weren't WCW fans not that into Hogan at that point? I don't get why a sarcastic comment directed at Hogan would get DDP that much heel heat. Was Hogan even a face at this point, I thought he was still nWo in early 99? Was Piper the commish at this time? And why was Savage interfering on behalf of DDP? I don't remember them ever being aligned together. DDP's heel turn was teased much earlier. His overmess was on the decline (along with interest in the product at this time), but this was definitely a major catalyst: "WCW TV Champ Scott Steiner KO Diamond Dallas Page (13:53)." That was at Superbrawl. Some time in the prior month or two, BPP had come out and interrupted a Nitro Girl number and came on to them. He then became obsessed with Kimberly, almost doing an insane gimmick, thinking she was coming on to him. I have this all on tape, but I am not going to search through dozens of tapes to find it, so I will have to go by memory. Anyways, BPP cut a promo to set up a match for SuperBrawl. I remember it word for word because they actually did a good job of promoting it: "Diamond Dallas Page...you got nothin' I want, you got nothin' I need! But you DO got someone who wants me! So at SuperBrawl, after I BEAT you, I'm gonna take your wife and show her what it's like to be with a REAL man! Big Poppa Pump is your hook up...holler if ya hear me!" So, somehow, DDP agreed to a match where BPP would get Kimberly for "forty days and forty nights" (stupid) if he won. The heel won and Kimberly had to go. DDP did a Mike Tenay interview on a Nitro after a few weeks off. The heel turn was hinted at, as he kept berating himself for basically being too nice a guy. Then there was the Spring Stampede Hogan injury to play up. Hogan had turned face at Uncensored, as HTQ mentioned, in a strange angle/match with Flair. DDP then aligned himself with Kanyon and BBB and became the East Coast (or Jersey) Triad. It didn't make a lot of sense, as in DDP's first true heel promo he said he didn't need anyone...look at his song, he told us, "self high-five!" The face turn was gradual and did not have a defining moment, as UTSU illustrated.

I heard a rumor on the net in '99 that a possibility was going to be Chris "Gericho." Yes, they were supposedly going to change the spelling of his name. There were other Jericho rumors then, too. Such as a face and heel DX, the former consisting of Road Dogg, X-Pac and the Hardy Boyz, the latter HHH, Chyna, Gunn and "X-Calibur" (Jericho). It turned out that a heel vs. face DX would be for one PPV only, supposedly a match for the rights to the DX name.

Bossman Is that Aurora Snow and Gauge in your avatar?