The Raven vs. Tommy Dreamer Feud

[Guest ChikoDemono]

I didn't know where to place this, so I'll just stick it in this folder because it needs more hits. But yeah, I was wondering why this feud is up there along with Bret Hart vs. Stone Cold (some may argue, though). A lot of people are stating that it had a great storyline; what was it exactly? All I remember is Raven bringing in Beulah who was a childhood "friend" of his and how he treated her like a goddess while chumps like Dreamer treated her like a slut. I could be wrong, however.

 

So anyway, can someone please give me an overview of the feud, storyline wise?

 

Thanks in advance.

[Guest EsotericMaster]

The feud was cutting edge for it's time and place. There was tension, and when they brawled you could see that tension come out. The back-story was, Raven and Dreamer were rivals even at a young age. Beulah was a girl they fought over. I know it sounds simple, but simplicity is great when it comes to wrestling storylines. When you stray from simplicity you get Vince Russo. The matches personified what ECW was all about at the time. To add fuel to the fire Dreamer never beat Raven. Raven would always cheat, and find a way to screw Dreamer. The only reason Raven lost, was because he left for WCW. Just picture a really good feud, spanning the course of 3 years, you get Raven/Dreamer.

[Rendclaw 0]

Add the fact that night after night, week after week Dreamer would get *this close* to winning the title and Raven would pull out something to ensure the victory, more often than not it was Stevie Richards ... That feud went just long enough that you cared, but it didn;t get boring or stale, because Dreamer every so ofter got a measure of revenge, until one night Dreamer finally won the title from Raven.... classic feud....

[Guest Steve J. Rogers]

Also it seemed that for three years that was the main storyline of ECW and various wrestlers/storylines go in and out of the storyline

 

Probably also was the storyline that defined ECW, no other feud in ANY other fed can say that it "defined" the entire promotion, not Austin-Hart, Austin-McMahon, not even nWo-WCW.

 

Steve

[Guest Dynamite Kido]

In my opinion the reason why it was so good was that it was kinda like an old school NWA feud. Animosity, blood, guts, and VIOLENCE!!!!!

[Guest ShooterJay]

until one night Dreamer finally won the title from Raven.... classic feud....

Dreamer never won the title from Raven. Dreamer's only ECW title reign was the 10 minute one, where he beat Tazz and lost to Justin Credible.

 

He SHOULD have won the belt from Raven at Barely Legal '97, but he pulled out of the match to give Terry Funk a slot, either because Heyman wanted to give Funk a nostalgia run or put the belt on a "name" since it was their first PPV. Not sure whether that was a good business decision (might have been, although I bet most of the people who bought the PPV were already ECW fans) but from a sentimental fan standpoint, I hated that booking and still do.

 

Even if Dreamer was replaced, the other two guys were

 

1. Stevie Richards, who finally turned on Raven after being his whipping boy for years and was riding a huge wave of popularity via the bWo.

 

2. Sandman, who had a similarly epic feud with Raven over his son, which he had also failed to get the upper hand in.

 

Funk really had no issue with Raven (to my knowledge) and Funk winning the belt really made the title switch less emotionally satisfying.

[King Cucaracha 0]

The Raven vignettes made it. One of the most underrated promoers ever. And it was typical cutting-edge ECW. ECW or WCW wouldn't dream of doing a storyline like that on that scale at the time, which helped.

 

Plus it must have been good, because they remembered to re-use it when Raven came back in 99, and they gave the two the Tag Belts.

 

ShooterJay, I think the whole point of the Funk title run was a combination of the two you mentioned, plus the fact Funk was 'like a father' to Dreamer at the time, so it'd be the 'logical' choice. Like Rock allowing Hogan to take the title shot at Backlash kinda.

[Mecha Mummy 0]

Wasn't the story that Raven and Dreamer were friends in that summer camp until Beulah got between them?

 

Raven vs. Dreamer was also great just because Raven kept coming so close to losing but he always had something up his sleeve (E.G. Cactus Jack turning on Dreamer), and he seemed to always have people in his pocket, but his cruel, uncaring nature turned everyone, even Stevie Richards, away from him until all Raven had left was Lupus and Chastity.

[Guest Askewniverse]

Funk getting a title shot stemmed from the Raven-Dreamer feud. Shortly before Barely Legal, Dreamer and Funk faced Raven and Brian Lee, with the stipulation that Funk would get a title shot if he pinned Raven. Raven offered to lay down for Dreamer, which would have allowed Dreamer to finally get a win over him, but at the price of Funk's title shot.

 

I may be wrong, but from what I remember, Dreamer stole Beulah from Raven in summer camp. Raven wasn't very kind to Beulah because of the fact that she was a "fat, ugly loser", while Dreamer was a bit nicer to her.

 

At Three Way Dance '95, Stevie Richards told Raven that he had surprise for him, which was Beulah. Raven wasn't too pleased at first, because he remembered Beulah as being fat and ugly. To his surprise, she had changed since then.

 

I'm a bit surprised that the "chair shot heard around the world" hasn't been mentioned yet. That's one of the most memorable moments from the feud.

 

EDIT: checked my tape, the event was Three Way Dance.

Edited May 30, 2003 by Askewniverse

[Guest BorneAgain]

Raven vs. Dreamer was also great just because Raven kept coming so close to losing but he always had something up his sleeve (E.G. Cactus Jack turning on Dreamer), and he seemed to always have people in his pocket, but his cruel, uncaring nature turned everyone, even Stevie Richards, away from him until all Raven had left was Lupus and Chastity.

This may sound pretty stupid, but can someone elaborate on who this Lupus guy was? I mean I saw him on the Wrestlepalooza '97 DVD, but I don't know much about him. Can anybody explain who he was and how he got involved with Raven?

[Guest Your Olympic Hero]

Who can forget this classic Beulah line....

 

"I'm pregnant... it's Tommy's"

 

Then the Kimona/Beulah lesbian angle.

 

ECW kicked ass.

[Mecha Mummy 0]

Raven vs. Dreamer was also great just because Raven kept coming so close to losing but he always had something up his sleeve (E.G. Cactus Jack turning on Dreamer), and he seemed to always have people in his pocket, but his cruel, uncaring nature turned everyone, even Stevie Richards, away from him until all Raven had left was Lupus and Chastity.

This may sound pretty stupid, but can someone elaborate on who this Lupus guy was? I mean I saw him on the Wrestlepalooza '97 DVD, but I don't know much about him. Can anybody explain who he was and how he got involved with Raven?

Lupus was Raven's response to Stevie leaving him. Raven said he could take any putz and make them just as good as Stevie was, basically, and so in came Lupus.

[Guest BorneAgain]

Raven vs. Dreamer was also great just because Raven kept coming so close to losing but he always had something up his sleeve (E.G. Cactus Jack turning on Dreamer), and he seemed to always have people in his pocket, but his cruel, uncaring nature turned everyone, even Stevie Richards, away from him until all Raven had left was Lupus and Chastity.

This may sound pretty stupid, but can someone elaborate on who this Lupus guy was? I mean I saw him on the Wrestlepalooza '97 DVD, but I don't know much about him. Can anybody explain who he was and how he got involved with Raven?

Lupus was Raven's response to Stevie leaving him. Raven said he could take any putz and make them just as good as Stevie was, basically, and so in came Lupus.

Ah, I see, thanks for the info. Did he and Stevie ever feud because if they did, I must have completely missed it.

[Guest Steviekick]

Stevie and Lupus never feuded. When Lupus debuted, Stevie was already far out in the bWo gimmick. Stevie wound up leaving a little later after Raven did to join WCW. Lupus wound up working the NJ Indies in the late 1990s and retired due to a pretty serious injury (i think it was neck related).

[Guest BorneAgain]

Stevie and Lupus never feuded. When Lupus debuted, Stevie was already far out in the bWo gimmick. Stevie wound up leaving a little later after Raven did to join WCW. Lupus wound up working the NJ Indies in the late 1990s and retired due to a pretty serious injury (i think it was neck related).

Thanks for the info.

[Guest Shane Legend]

Yeah, the Raven/Dreamer feud just had pure heartfelt emotion, which was missing from storylines at the time.

[Guest The Metal Maniac]

While I never saw the majority of the fued, I must say that I really liked how they did Raven's return from WCW - he ran in to make the save for Dreamer in a tag match, and they won the tag team belts.

 

Raven's reasoning? This was the first championship Dreamer had won in ECW...and he owed it all to RAVEN.

 

That's dickish.

 

(At least, that's what I recall happened...and I'm too lazy to fact-check. Bleh.)

[Guest Kid Kablam]

what's the chair shot heard round the world?

[Guest BorneAgain]

what's the chair shot heard round the world?

It refers to an incident in which Dreamer handcuffed Raven to a cage and completely blasted him with a steel chair so hard that it was heavily dented.