Guest wrestlingbs Report post Posted May 27, 2003 Ok, let me see the logic behind this. The original plan for Bad Blood was HHH vs. Goldberg. Goldberg gets a weak start and HHH convinces Vince to change the main event of the first Raw PPV to be a match with his best friend, Kevin Nash. Nash proceeds to totally bomb worse than Goldberg, so much so that on Raw now they keep him off most of the show because they are afraid of what reaction he'll get. Then Flair has a match with HHH on Raw. Flair has spend the past 6 (really more like 8 or 9) months being HHH's manager. Because of this, Flair's character is a shell of its former self. So during the match Flair turns face, gets more reaction than he has gotten in a while, and sets up and interesting fued with HHH. However, instead of changing the main event of Bad Blood to HHH vs. Flair, which would draw a whole lot more money since Nash is dead weight right now, the WWE goes in a different direction. They turn Flair back to a heel, despite the fact that the crowd loves him (and will continue to), plus HHH has pretty much told him he's a washed up old fool, PLUS the fact that he fought HHH for the title last week. They use a good program like Flair vs. HBK to get heat onto Nash vs. HHH (notice Nash is the charging hero at the end despite not doing anything). And they reform Evolution (which was in February a synonym for "joke")which puts a returning Orton under the wing of the man who dragged down his career last time, HHH. I know I'm ranting. I know it won't do any good. But I skipped the past two PPVs bcause they were awful, and it looks like I may do the same for this one. And while this whole main event thing doesn't make the PPV, it doesn't help. Maybe it's because for once I actually thought Flair was going to be used right. Anyway, what do you think? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Choken One Report post Posted May 27, 2003 I really wish WWE Would just turn Shawn Heel...Shawn was always a Better then a Face... Oh Well...I know these two will still go at it in a Special Match... Besides...Flair running it Heel over Shawn will be great to see... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cawthon777 0 Report post Posted May 27, 2003 Okay, over the years I've come to one realization. When the WWE hints at a forthcoming match between two faces - be rest assured one of them is going to turn heel before the bout takes place. I wasn't surprised at Flair's turn tonight - but a face Flair vs. face HBK match would have been nice. I'm surprised they didn't try that for Hogan / Warrior at WrestleMania. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest JHawk Report post Posted May 27, 2003 The Flair-HBK match could still be great, especially if we get last week's Flair at Bad Blood. But the whole angle tonight left a sour taste in my mouth, and I'm so damned tired of trying to support this garbage. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest JAxlMorrison Report post Posted May 27, 2003 Honestly, did anyone on this board not see that heel turn coming from a mile away? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest wrestlingbs Report post Posted May 27, 2003 You're right JHawk. While I'm still liking a Flair vs. HBK match, it would have been good if both were faces, and even better if they had changed the main event to HHH vs. Flair rather than this garbage they have now. And I was hoping they would turn Nash heel and let him help HHH win. At least Nash would get booed for a reason. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest JHawk Report post Posted May 27, 2003 JAxl, we all saw it coming. That doesn't mean we have to like it. Hell, to put it into baseball terms, I saw the Yankees winning the 98 World Series from about June on. That doesn't mean I'm going to start rooting for the Yankees because I know they're going to win. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cawthon777 0 Report post Posted May 27, 2003 You know what, when the masked man showed up at the climax of the show - I thought Hell had frozen over because I could have sworn the guy was going to be revealed to be Scott Hall lol Orton is fine and dandy, but where's the shock value there? I don't think anyone's jaw dropped. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest teke184 Report post Posted May 27, 2003 WWE booking logic- If all else fails, pick the most illogical thing you can do. I'm still waiting for Nash to win the belt and to lose it to Goldberg because a returning Scott Hall zaps him with a taser. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest treble charged Report post Posted May 27, 2003 You could tell (or at least I could) it was Orton under the mask as soon as he took out Nash. Speaking of that, he sure didn't do a very good job, as Nash was hitting the ring about 10 seconds later. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest wrestlingbs Report post Posted May 27, 2003 Yeah, but knowing Hall he'll be so drunk he'll think it's WCW and zap Goldberg with the tazer, causing Nash to job to an unconscious Goldberg. Then again, that would be pretty funny. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Choken One Report post Posted May 27, 2003 Does it Matter? I say as Long as Shawn and Ric give us the Quality match that they EVEN well past their prime...can... Still though...Who goes over here? I'm afraid of Shawn going over here and H3 putting him over again at Summer Slam.. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cawthon777 0 Report post Posted May 27, 2003 Goldberg will get Triple H at Summer Slam - that's the only logical reason to push the title match back a few months. Raw is without a PPV for 2 months which should be more than enough time to buildup a big money match between the two. Keeping Goldberg occupied with the midcard establishes his cred with the WWE audience. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Jobber of the Week Report post Posted May 27, 2003 Where have I seen this before? April 2001: HHH, who had been receiving face heat from crowds when feuding with Kurt Angle, is pissed off at Vince McMahon for allying with his hated enemy Austin. As the crowd begs for HHH to turn face, he instead turns heel for no reason and teams up with Austin. Ratings and buyrates sink. June 2003: Ric Flair, who had been receiving face heat from crowds when performing heel interference, is pissed off at HHH for writing him off as a has-been and allys with hated enemy Shawn Michaels. As the crowd begs for Flair to turn face, he instead turns heel for no reason and teams up with HHH. Ratings and buyrates sink. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Hogan Made Wrestling Report post Posted May 27, 2003 Where have I seen this before? April 2001: HHH, who had been receiving face heat from crowds when feuding with Kurt Angle, is pissed off at Vince McMahon for allying with his hated enemy Austin. As the crowd begs for HHH to turn face, he instead turns heel for no reason and teams up with Austin. Ratings and buyrates sink. June 2003: Ric Flair, who had been receiving face heat from crowds when performing heel interference, is pissed off at HHH for writing him off as a has-been and allys with hated enemy Shawn Michaels. As the crowd begs for Flair to turn face, he instead turns heel for no reason and teams up with HHH. Ratings and buyrates sink. That HHH turn was quite possibly one of the dumbest in wrestling history. It would be one thing if the Rock was sticking around and so the Austin-HHH-McMahon clique would have had a strong face to feud against, but that turn left them in a horrible position until the Invasion came along to bring in something new. Had HHH stayed face they could have run a hot HHH vs. Austin program that probably would have done very well. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Adam 0 Report post Posted May 27, 2003 Damn good observation Jobber, you are right on that one. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest JDMattitudeV1 Report post Posted May 27, 2003 WWE Logic: It is more important to keep HHH happy than it is our fans. The fans want Flair to feud with HHH but instead they get Ric Flair- HHH's man servant, for no other reason than to stroke HHH's ego. Oh well, at least we get Flair/HBK. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest AndrewTS Report post Posted May 27, 2003 Honestly, did anyone on this board not see that heel turn coming from a mile away? Oh, I saw a turn coming, I just wasn't sure who it was going to be. You could tell (or at least I could) it was Orton under the mask as soon as he took out Nash. Speaking of that, he sure didn't do a very good job, as Nash was hitting the ring about 10 seconds later. I think that was a production error. I don't think Nash would even be able to get up without help Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Youth N Asia Report post Posted May 27, 2003 The Flair turn was too predictable and too pointless...the people like Flair too much to boo him, and that's that. I don't care what's on the ppvs anymore, I don't order them. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest AndrewTS Report post Posted May 27, 2003 I don't see why they were so scared to have a face vs. face match. It wouldn't be the big headliner so it isn't as much of a "risk." So they decided to go face vs. heel. They had two choices. Their first choice was turning the horribly stale HBK, who hasn't really done jack since Mania. There wouldn't be a very good way to explain this, but that wouldn't be anything too different than what they usually do anyway. Although at least they didn't give us some bullshit explanation and have HBK kissing HHH's ass. Also, they may have been worried that since the PPV is in Houston, the Texan would be cheered anyway (HBK). The other choice would be to turn Flair back after a week of being a face. The fans were hugely behind Flair, because it was so refreshing to see him actually get his balls back from Triple H, and look dignified and motivated out there. A heel turn, however, would be less interesting since Flair would end up as HHH's valet again. Flair's still going to get cheered whether he's a face or heel, so this isn't going to make him look like the big heel in the HBK-Flair match. I assume the main reason was the semi-revival of Evolution, although with Batista missing I don't know what they're going to do. I don't even know if Orton is healthy enough to wrestle. It isn't the worst thing they've done, far from it. Ric Flair as a heel is just part of Ric's nature. However, turning after a week kinda makes the fans apathetic. If Ric hadn't turned, the crowd would have been VERY hot for the Ric/HBK match. Now, I think they'll be less interested. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mrnoitaull 0 Report post Posted May 27, 2003 I know this may be sad to admit but I knew it was Orton from his posture of him recklessly stomping at Shawn after the match. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest godthedog Report post Posted May 27, 2003 Where have I seen this before? April 2001: HHH, who had been receiving face heat from crowds when feuding with Kurt Angle, is pissed off at Vince McMahon for allying with his hated enemy Austin. As the crowd begs for HHH to turn face, he instead turns heel for no reason and teams up with Austin. Ratings and buyrates sink. right...millions of fans stopped tuning in, not because they wanted to cheer austin, but because they wanted to cheer triple h that badly. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Goodear Report post Posted May 27, 2003 Having Flair as a face doesn't work for me at all. The guy cannot play a major role in the company anymore as a upper midcarder or main eventer, and would be subsequently jobbed to nothingness if they left him without an active guy to work with in a mentor role. Otherwise you're stuck with another Michaels who just doesn't appear all the time and gets immediately stale from too many promos and not enough action. The face moment (I wouldn't call it a turn myself since it was obvious that he was never going to be staying face) only helped Flair rejuvinate the character and shake off his appearence as Triple H's window dressing in my opinion. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest AndrewTS Report post Posted May 27, 2003 The face moment (I wouldn't call it a turn myself since it was obvious that he was never going to be staying face) only helped Flair rejuvinate the character and shake off his appearence as Triple H's window dressing in my opinion. Huh? I'm not seeing that. They just decided to use him like that since they were passing through the Carolinas. He's going to be going right back to being HHH's valet now. And he could have mentored some one else. Does HHH need him that badly? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Jimmy Beard Report post Posted May 27, 2003 hey maybe theres a huge twist in the making and theres gonna be a story line that will leave people talking for years to come.................But then again Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Goodear Report post Posted May 27, 2003 Huh? I'm not seeing that. They just decided to use him like that since they were passing through the Carolinas. He's going to be going right back to being HHH's valet now. Since they're going to push Flair into a feud of his own apart from Triple H, I do not think you are going to see Ric turn back into his managerial "I don't really do anything" role. He shook off that rust to create a resurgance of The Nature Boy and seems to be taking on a much more physical and emotional character than he did before this angle began. It was a good mini angle for my money and I think you'll find that Flair got himself more over because of it. And he could have mentored some one else. Does HHH need him that badly? Nope. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Dynamite Kido Report post Posted May 27, 2003 The turn last night of Flair is totally the opposite of what they should have done with him. I guess they just did what they did so people would quit saying "Flair needs to stop being HHH's lackey". They could have built up Flair and had a great feud but they took all the steam out of it last night. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest RavishingRickRudo Report post Posted May 27, 2003 We all know in a few months Nash and HBK will turn heel and join with HHH and Flair and all of this will be forgotten. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Choken One Report post Posted May 27, 2003 I still want Shawn to Turn heel one last time because he was best when he was Heelin. I still am scared with the Potential Ego war between those four (Nash, Shawn. Hunt and Flair)... Throw in Goldberg and it's going to be a festive TSM summer... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest RavishingRickRudo Report post Posted May 27, 2003 No, Goldberg would be the face who stands up to them. They'd probably turn Jericho face too. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
