Baseball Talk

[Vern Gagne 0]

Todd Walker's an ass. My sister was at LSU the same time, and said he was an arrogant jerk.

 

Gammons said his vote would go to David Ortiz.

 

I think Bill Mueller deserves some consideration. Look at his OPS.

[Bruiser Chong 0]

The Cubs' pen sickens me. People wonder why Baker always sticks with his starters until it's absolutely necessary to bring in a reliever, well tonight was your reason. Yeah, it was Zambrano's fault for loading them up, and with the bags full with no one out, you figure at least one run will score, but six? C'mon, that's pathetic. I would've been content if they had just given up two and left it at a tied game. Some say it's because they aren't used enough, but even when they've had to be used a lot, they've been pretty bad. The five-game series at Wrigley was the only time in recent months they've been good.

 

And I don't know what Zambrano's deal is all of a sudden. Wearing his emotions on his sleeve like that probably doesn't help, but suddenly, he's looking a lot more human and then some. If you're a Cubs fan, you just need to hope that with tomorrow being basically an automatic win (please no jinx), they can take at LEAST one more game or hopefully two. I can't see the Stros sweeping the Brew Crew, so hopefully they'll split the series, which would most likely put the Cubs in the post season. If not, then you can look no further than the Cubs' pen as the reason.

[JangoFett4Hire 0]

What is the A's rotation? Hudson-Zito-Hardin-Lilly?

 

I hope the sox go with their rotation as:

Pedro

Wakes

Lowe

Burkett

 

Have Wakes pitch in the crater sized coliseum , with plenty of foul room, and Lowe pitch at home, where he has excelled this season. Assuming he doesn't get a blister again...

[CanadianChris 0]

No. We NEED a Cubs/Red Sox World Series.

What, you WANT the world to implode on itself?

[CanadianChris 0]

Gammons said his vote would go to David Ortiz.

Shocking.

[Mik 0]

Every voter has a little bit of homer in them. St. Louis voters will go Pujols, San Fran voters will go Bonds. The only difference with Gammons is that he has a forum to promote his homer-ism.

[JangoFett4Hire 0]

No.  We NEED a Cubs/Red Sox World Series.

What, you WANT the world to implode on itself?

YES!

[sfaJack 0]

The Cubs' pen sickens me. People wonder why Baker always sticks with his starters until it's absolutely necessary to bring in a reliever, well tonight was your reason. Yeah, it was Zambrano's fault for loading them up, and with the bags full with no one out, you figure at least one run will score, but six? C'mon, that's pathetic. I would've been content if they had just given up two and left it at a tied game. Some say it's because they aren't used enough, but even when they've had to be used a lot, they've been pretty bad. The five-game series at Wrigley was the only time in recent months they've been good.

 

And I don't know what Zambrano's deal is all of a sudden. Wearing his emotions on his sleeve like that probably doesn't help, but suddenly, he's looking a lot more human and then some. If you're a Cubs fan, you just need to hope that with tomorrow being basically an automatic win (please no jinx), they can take at LEAST one more game or hopefully two. I can't see the Stros sweeping the Brew Crew, so hopefully they'll split the series, which would most likely put the Cubs in the post season. If not, then you can look no further than the Cubs' pen as the reason.

Zambrano is 22 years old. He's never pitched in such a high stakes game before, so it's bound to happen. This is one reason why Dusty has traditionally disliked younger players, and the one thing that really scares me about the Cubs not making the postseason.

 

The bullpen does alright for the most part, excpet for Alfonseca and/or Wellemeyer. The bases loaded jam last night was a very, very tough situation to walk into, though. I can't really fault the 'pen for giving up some runs in that situation (although 6 is excessive)...I put more of the blame on Zambrano for loading them to begin with.

 

The Cubs really, really need to win-out. Houston isn't going to sweep Milwaukee, but I don't think they'll lose more than one game to the Brew Crew. I HATE the thought of a one-game playoff for the division, especially with the way the Cubs' rotation is aligned. Pitching either Cruz/Estes or Zambrano on 3-days' rest when he's never done it before against freakin' Roy Oswalt isn't a pleasant thought.

 

In fact, if I were Dusty and I was guaranteed at least a tie for the division going into Sunday, I'd bump Wood back and pitch Cruz (not Estes, despite Wednesday's gem) against the Pirates on Sunday. That way, if you win, you get Wood starting Game 1 of the playoffs and if you lose, you get him pitching the one-game playoff. Pitching Wood on Sunday (unless you HAVE to win to force a tie) could backfire because if he were to somehow lose, then you're fucked because not only do you end up still tied for the division and face a one-game playoff, but now you have to do it without either of your aces available.

 

Of course, the Cubs can solve all these problems by simply kicking some ass and winning out...but I have a bad feeling that that isn't going to happen.

[Bruiser Chong 0]

And the age of the average Cubs starter is the main problem should they make the playoffs. They're all young guys, and Wood's the only one who's seen post season action (I'm not counting Estes) and even that was only once. Prior seems to be able to rise to the occassion, so I'm not quite worried about him, but Zambrano's so emotional that he lets himself get into jams.

 

As for the pen, yeah, I didn't expect them to get out of the inning without giving up a couple of runs, but six is way too much. Alfonseca was the only one who was actually any good out of the pen last night, as he worked his way out of a leadoff error by Ramirez that put Pena at second with nobody out.

[Bored 0]

What is the A's rotation? Hudson-Zito-Hardin-Lilly?

They'll have a 3-man rotation and it will go Hudson, Zito, Lilly. Harden will be in the bullpen.

Edited September 26, 2003 by Bored

[Gert T 0]

Come on Brewers & Pirates, and I need a three game sweep out in Arizona!

 

Well, enough dreaming I think they'll end up playing a tie-breaker, where would it be played, I'm about 4 pages behind.

[Bruiser Chong 0]

It'd be in Chicago if there were to be a tiebreaking game played, which I would think would bode well for the Cubs, as they've played the Astros well at home, and the loyal fans of Chicago being right behind you would definitely be a big advantage.

 

Speaking of fans, watching closely at some of the other games over the past few weeks, I've noticed something and it really bugs me. You look at a place like Wrigley field, where fans are out there packing the place up, regardless of where their team is in the standings, and then you look at a place like Florida, where fans are only now coming out to the park and getting behind their team, now that they'll be making the playoffs. Go look at their stadium two months ago and you'll see a barrage of orange seats and tumbleweeds, but now that they're just about in the playoffs, all of these "fans" are out there supporting their team. I guess it's the whole bandwagon thing that gets under my skin. It's like, they don't want a thing to do with the team if they aren't winning, but as soon as they are, they're the most "loyal" fans in the world.

[EVIL~! alkeiper 0]

Florida's understandable, because the baseball fans were absolutely pissed upon in 1998, disenfranchising them.

[Bruiser Chong 0]

Yeah, but they've added a lot this season to make the team a contender, and the fans still didn't come out until the last couple of weeks.

[EVIL~! alkeiper 0]

Well what they added wasn't much. I seriously doubted their playoff chances up through about three weeks ago.

[Bruiser Chong 0]

I wasn't sure about their playoff chances, either, because I thought the Phillies wouldn't choke, but my point is the fans really aren't loyal in the least. Yeah, management screwed them over but that was FIVE years ago. Put the past in the past and move on.

[Mik 0]

It doesn't work that way. Screwed over five years? Try every year since until this year. Last year we unloaded Cliff Floyd, Ryan Dempster, and others. Every year the best player was supposed to be unloaded. It wasn't until we had a chance to win this year that Lowell was kept. Believe me, if the Marlins thought they were totally out of it this year Lowell would have been dealt.

 

Sure, the major injustice happened five years ago but it would still be happening if the happy accident of winning didn't occur, make no mistake about it.

 

And the Phillies didn't choke, they were beaten head to head by the BETTER team, 13 f'n times.

[Bruiser Chong 0]

No, had the Phillies won several games that should've been easy or sure fire wins, they would've probably clinched the WC. And jeez are you cocky about the Marlins, or what?

[Gert T 0]

Well, the Dempster trade didn't really turn out too bad, although some in the Reds organization speculate that the Marlins knew he was damaged goods.

 

I agree Bruiser, it is funny to see the fans pack the stadium now, didn't that happen at US Cellular for the White Sox during August before their collapse?

[Bruiser Chong 0]

Pretty much, but White Sox fans are fairly loyal, but nowhere near the level that the Cubs fans are.

 

Speaking of the Cubs, today may have been the fatal blow we've been hoping wouldn't hit. With the game cancelled, not only do the Astros have a chance to take a half-game lead in the Central, but it'll be quite hard for the Cubs to take two tomorrow.

[Vern Gagne 0]

So some people aren't loyal. Why should you root for a team flat out sucks, or a team that didn't play up to it's potential.

[EVIL~! alkeiper 0]

Milwaukee leads the Astros 5-1 in the 2nd.

[Mik 0]

It's only because they are my team, Bruiser, and what I said was the truth. They weren't supposed to win this year, and the fact that they have is making me extremely happy. No matter the outcome of the playoffs, I will be happier with the outcome of this year than the WS title in 97, because this came out of nowhere. SI picked them 4th in the NL East, and ESPN wasn't much higher. I love my team, and where I am (New York), there aren't many Marlins fans. If I'm come across cocky, it's only because it's hard to read emotion over a message board.

 

And my emotions at this time are pure and total happiness.

 

Don't be so damn negative.

[EVIL~! alkeiper 0]

-Mike Lowell has been cleared to return, and hopes to play in the Marlin's last game on Sunday.

 

-Mark Grace is retiring after the season.

 

-Author George Plimpton died. Plimpton is best known to baseball fans for authoring SI's infamous portrait on Mets "prospect" Sidd Fynch, a fictional pitcher who was rumoured to throw 168 MPH. Everyone bought it.

[Guest Choken One]

168 mph? Talk about overselling...COuldn't they just gone 120 which is still somewhat realistic?

[Bruiser Chong 0]

If you're a fan of a team and actually loyal, you stand by the team in just about any situation. Otherwise, you're nothing more than a bandwagon jumper. It's annoying to see so-called fans behind on a team only when the team's winning, but the second they're not, these supposed fans are nowhere to be found.

 

And Mike, I know you feel that way because you're a big fan of the Marlins, and I'm not trying to bring you down. And regardless of how big a fan you are of a team, identifying them as your team is a little much, methinks. I've loved the Cubs since 1994, but I've not referred to them as my team.

 

As for Grace retiring, I think most of us saw it coming and with him having won the ring a couple years back, there's really not anything left for the guy to do. He helped out a lot of the young guys with the DBacks this season, and now he's essentially done all one could ever want to do and more.

 

I've been flipping between the Tigers/Twins game and Braves/Phillies game. With the latter already over much earlier, I'm watching the bonus coverage, but my focus remains on the Tigers/Twins game, and the Astros/Brewers game. What's with the Tigers looking decent all of a sudden? I guess immense pressure can do that to you. And if the Brewers hang on to win, I'll be quite greatful.

 

And just when I mention the Tigers, they let one go in the 10th, which is a shame since they had a good chance to win it in the 9th.

[EVIL~! alkeiper 0]

168 mph? Talk about overselling...COuldn't they just gone 120 which is still somewhat realistic?

 

The whole thing was an April Fools Gag. The thing is, Plimpton painted such a vivid portrait that people BOUGHT it.

[Bruiser Chong 0]

And here come the Tigers as Young doubles to start off the inning, a stolen base by a pinch runner, and a one-out single ties it up. The home plate ump has been pretty bad tonight, btw.

[Guest Choken One]

168 mph? Talk about overselling...COuldn't they just gone 120 which is still somewhat realistic?

 

The whole thing was an April Fools Gag. The thing is, Plimpton painted such a vivid portrait that people BOUGHT it.

Heh. Cute. So he created his own little Steve Nebraska and people brought it? Cool.

[Guest BobbyWhioux]

The "spoiled" or "bandwagon" fans put the pressure on their team's owners to try to put a competitive team out there they won't sell tickets.

 

If the team sells out whether they win or not, then the owners can turn a healthy profit without even trying to field a winner (and, in fact, pursuing winning talent might cut into the money being made), where's the motivation to try and win?

 

Just something to think about. A theory blatantly swiped from Mike Wilbon.

 

I'm pulling for the Marlins, too. So the Giants can sweep 'em and get revenge for '97. [That's gonna be the first round match up, unless the Marlins utterly melt down and the Dodgers or Cubs/Astros take the wild card. And with their win over the Mets today I don't think they can melt down enough with only two games left.]