The One and Only Angel Season 5 Thread

[Guest Brian]

Here's a list of how TVTome.com members have ranked Angel episodes with their ratings. Not Fade Away and You're Welcome being over half a point above everything else.

 

http://tvtome.com/tvtome/servlet/DetailsSe...672/moduleid-21

Why in the BLUE HELL is Nowish so damn low?

 

They don't know anything.

 

EDIT:

Okay, looking at the list they did pick a few episodes that deserve to be high, but not these:

 

4. "I Will Remember You"

6. "Waiting in the Wings"

12. "Home"

18. "Dear Boy"

23. "City Of"

Waiting in the Wings is very good.

[Hank Kingsley 0]

Negative? It was sarcasm

 

And I've learned to not take lists or other people's opinions seriously at all. EVER. I swear, at some message boards, people put "Chosen" over "Not Fade Away" because of things like "the scene wer my spikey died was soooooooooo sad but it was soooooooo good and it was better becuz buffy final told spike she luved him! and it was so beautiful (and angel was there and he was soooooooo hot but did buffy appear on not fade away? no so chose is betteR)"

[LaParkaMarka 0]

Here's a list of how TVTome.com members have ranked Angel episodes with their ratings. Not Fade Away and You're Welcome being over half a point above everything else.

 

http://tvtome.com/tvtome/servlet/DetailsSe...672/moduleid-21

Why in the BLUE HELL is Nowish so damn low?

 

They don't know anything.

 

EDIT:

Okay, looking at the list they did pick a few episodes that deserve to be high, but not these:

 

4. "I Will Remember You"

6. "Waiting in the Wings"

12. "Home"

18. "Dear Boy"

23. "City Of"

Waiting in the Wings is very good.

I Will Remember You was also really good at the time. Not the 4th best episode, but good. Waiting in the Wings was also really good. City Of was pretty mediocre compared to most Angel eps though.

[Tawren 0]

And I've learned to not take lists or other people's opinions seriously at all. EVER. I swear, at some message boards, people put "Chosen" over "Not Fade Away" because of things like "the scene wer my spikey died was soooooooooo sad but it was soooooooo good and it was better becuz buffy final told spike she luved him! and it was so beautiful (and angel was there and he was soooooooo hot but did buffy appear on not fade away? no so chose is betteR)"

Stop quoting me

 

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

I finished watching "Not Fade Away".

 

This is just wrong. WRONG. To put two episodes like this against each other. I dare say they compete among the high ranking episodes of my beloved Firefly.

 

"A Hole in the World" was 100% pure awesome. All the way. Every single moment was stunning. In that regard, it beats "Not Fade Away". Right up until the scene with Illyria and Wes, I would probably have said that A Hole in the World was the deserving episode. And in someways, I still do. But that scene... I am still kinda reeling from it. It hit me when she said "Do you want me to lie to you" and then it finished me off with "I missed you" - the rest wasn't needed -the "we'll be together" stuff, the morphing and the head punching, etc.- but good lord was it all wanted and taken. As good as the Wes/Fred scenes were in HITW -and they were awesome- this touched me a little bit more to the point of my heart sinking and my eyes watering... it probably even effected me more than the first time I saw it. NFA walked a tight rope; in lesser hands it would have failed and all the content they were trying to cram in would have scattered rather than fallen into place. Where a HITW gave you plenty of time to absorb the emotion and story, this was almost rushed. Yet, it wasn't. It was amazingly balanced. And after it was over I was still left a little bit breathless. After a Hole in the World, I was left with awe, but it still didn't hit the really high notes NFA did, even if it was a little more consistent.

 

Vote: Not Fade Away

 

(like it matters... I'm just happy I watched it again)

[Mole 0]

Here's a list of how TVTome.com members have ranked Angel episodes with their ratings. Not Fade Away and You're Welcome being over half a point above everything else.

 

http://tvtome.com/tvtome/servlet/DetailsSe...672/moduleid-21

Why in the BLUE HELL is Nowish so damn low?

 

They don't know anything.

 

EDIT:

Okay, looking at the list they did pick a few episodes that deserve to be high, but not these:

 

4. "I Will Remember You"

6. "Waiting in the Wings"

12. "Home"

18. "Dear Boy"

23. "City Of"

Waiting in the Wings is very good.

I Will Remember You was also really good at the time. Not the 4th best episode, but good. Waiting in the Wings was also really good. City Of was pretty mediocre compared to most Angel eps though.

Bah, "Waiting in the Wings" never did much for me. Even though Joss loves the episode.

 

But none of those episodes come CLOSE to how FUCKINNNNNNN AWESOME "Nowish" is.

[Guest Brian]

"Waiting in the Wings" is sooooooooo beautiful, it's almost picturesque. I love the way it deals with these two different relationships in the show, and then it throws in this third, possessive relationship which totally is metaphoric for the way Wes was in "Billy". Wes wanted to capture their relationship before that moment in time, because he could never go back, and Fred was so innocent like that dancer. And the way it all played out and unraveled. Especially with Angel and Cordelia, and Groo. And the shooting was very good. Did I mention picturesque?

[Anya 0]

I Will Remember You bugs me. Boreanaz's acting is weak and the story came too early in the series. I've come to realize a lot of Boreanaz's acting is pretty bad. Like looking at a lot of the Buffy/Angel stuff now, his facial expressions are very goofy. He got so much better on his own show.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

It pains me to see Summer Glau in a non-River role. Plus the Angel/Cordy stuff doesn't lead to anything good. Other than that, it was a really good episode. Unfortunately, "that" takes up a good deal of it.

[Guest Brian]

It leads to Angel waiting in the wings with Cordelia.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

I never liked the Angel/Cordy storyline. It was horridable.

[Anya 0]

Champion Cordy sucks all together.

[Mole 0]

I just watched "Not Fade Away" and it isn't as good as "Nowish." I just like "Nowish" so much, I could watch that everyday for the next 10 years and no get tired of it.

 

And I believe someone had already said this, but I realized something when I was watching "Not Fade Away." Angel didn't really care about the Shanshu prophecy because the Shanshu to him is Connor. Connor is safe, Connor doesn't have to live his life, Connor is human; Connor is what Angel gets for trying to redeem himself.

 

Basically, Connor full-filled the Shanshu prophecy in Angel's eyes.

[Guest SP-1]

As smart a move as signing away the prophecy was for the character, there's a small part of me hoping that later on we'll see a loophole there. Maybe Angel signed it, "Tim" or something will invalidate it.

 

I dunno. I'm conflicted about that part. It works supremely but I wouldn't mind seeing him get what he wants.

[Guest Brian]

The thing is, they've been establishing all along that redemption isn't something you receive, it's something you continue to work for, from "I will remember you" to Faith to "Why we fight". And in some ways, like Spike said, they might not be redeemable. But like "The House Always Wins" and "Not Fade Away", they will always have something to fight for whether they have a destiny or not. So in that sense, the Sanshu was never really meant for either of them. It was meant for Connor.

[Ripper 0]

I Will Remember You bugs me. Boreanaz's acting is weak and the story came too early in the series. I've come to realize a lot of Boreanaz's acting is pretty bad. Like looking at a lot of the Buffy/Angel stuff now, his facial expressions are very goofy. He got so much better on his own show.

Boreanaz didn't learn to act until season 2 of Angel honestly. All he could play was angst and a damn good evil guy. He did a great job in that ep on Buffy when the first came for him, but besides that he was a pretty blah actor when playing good guy angel until they expanded his character depth in season 2 of Angel.

[Mole 0]

The thing is, they've been establishing all along that redemption isn't something you receive, it's something you continue to work for, from "I will remember you" to Faith to "Why we fight". And in some ways, like Spike said, they might not be redeemable. But like "The House Always Wins" and "Not Fade Away", they will always have something to fight for whether they have a destiny or not. So in that sense, the Sanshu was never really meant for either of them. It was meant for Connor.

That is what I was trying to get at.

[Guest Brian]

We'd all love to see Angel get his day in the sun, but we all know it isn't meant to be. There's nothing he can ever do to atone for what he's done, for torturing Dru, killing his village, killing Holtz's family, and all the others.

[Hank Kingsley 0]

I just watched "Not Fade Away" and it isn't as good as "Nowish."

...why?

[Guest reekspeak]

Vote Nowish!

 

I consider Waiting in the Wings as one of the best ever, it wouldn't be top 10 for me but it would still be up there. Home and Dear Boy deserve to be up in the top 20 too.

[AnonymousBroccoli 0]

As my first foray into Buffyverse ownership, I got Buffy's 2nd season in the mail today from a dude on eBay. The package is a little beat up, but the discs are fine, and 40 bucks beats 70.

 

It may just be the messed up order in which I watched the series, but I think season 2 is my favourite. During their initial airings, I missed the first two seasons, and a lot of season 3, then caught a fair bit of 4, most of 5, then I saw and taped all of seasons 6 and 7. I've watched Angel pretty much the same, using that timeline, though I never taped any of it permanently.

 

Anyhow. I started renting DVDs early this year, from the start of the series. I thought season 1 was too heavy in the cheesy horror area, which I really don't like, but it was still good to see how the whole thing got started. Season 2, on the other hand, started off right away in the more Whedon-esque style, so I thought it was great. Since I'd seen the Buffy and Angel characters and stories for about 4 years longer apiece than I would've when the season first came along, it probably helped their storyline mean a lot more.

 

I rented season 3 as well, and it was pretty close to #2, though the Mayor and Faith as villains, again, didn't quite mean as much as Angelus, Spike and Dru. I'd like to keep going, but I'd rather re-watch Buffy's season 4 and Angel's first concurrently, as they were originally shown. I do have the problems of a depleted supply of free rentals, no money, and somewhat ridiculous rental rates. Since most places are content to rent one disc at a time, at a new release price, by the end, I'd probably have spent over half the purchase price in rentals. So I guess I'll be waiting.

[Guest Brian]

It's a shame they didn't get longer to work with Angellus. It was the far superior trio. And Boreanaz really blossomed under that role.

 

Should we set up a bronze medal match or should we have Not Fade Away run the gauntlet?

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

Gauntlet!!!!

 

WHEDONDOME!

 

2 EPISODES ENTER! 1 EPISODE LEAVES!

[Jericholic82 0]

tnt aired gunns first appearance episdoe (Im sorry Im not good with the names of all the eps) yesterday. Interesting to watch again. good intro for him and his first emotional moment (his sister is sired by those vamps and he has to stake her). of course it also offered some lighthearted moments with wesley and cordelia.

 

that means its time for the quote of the day

 

"Cordy:Oh the smell of that salt air

Wes: That's not salt in the air (pull back to reveal them in a slumy part of town)

 

wes gets an iced coffee type drink (I wouldnt know what its called, I dont drink coffee or lattes or whatever that crap is)

 

"Wes:I ordered a coffee, what is this? LATER:I think theres coffee in here somewhere."

 

 

"Cordy:I think,professionally speaking, I'd like to prostitute myself to billionaire david (whatevber his name is).

[Anakin Flair 0]

Not Fade Away was a great episode, but after watching AHITW again last night, I still think that AHITW was better. Lorne was great, Gunn was angsty, Angel and Spike working together as a team, Knoxy-goodness, bad-ass Wesley (shoots a lawyer, then tells his secretary to bring him anybody else who isn't working on Fred's case.) And fred's death was very heart-wrenching.

 

Here are some quotes of the day:

from A Hole In the World:

EMPLOYEE

I'm sorry to interrupt. I just need to know if the Holbine Clan history was here. It was supposed to be faxed to my office.

 

WESLEY

It can wait.

 

EMPLOYEE

These guys are really important. I just need— I mean, the whole company can't be working Miss Burkle's case.

 

WESLEY

(reaches into his desk)

Of course.

 

Wesley pulls a gun out of his desk and shoots the man in the knee, sending him to the floor screaming in agony. A secretary rushes to Wesley's office to see what the commotion is all about.

 

WESLEY

(calmly returning to his reading)

Jennifer, please send anyone else who isn't working Miss Burkle's case to me.

 

And from Underneath:

ILLYRIA

In my time, nightmares walked among us, walked and danced, skewering victims in plain sight, laying their fears and worst desires out for everyone to see. This...to make us laugh.

 

WESLEY

I'll bet you were jolly as frat boys.

 

and one more:

ILLYRIA

All I am is what I am. I lived 7 lives at once. I was power and the ecstasy of death. I was god to a god.

(looks down)

Now... I—I'm trapped... on a roof. Just one roof... in this time and this place, with an unstable human who drinks too much whiskey and called me a Smurf.

(Wesley chuckles)

[Guest Brian]

First Gauntlet match: Apocalypse Nowish v. Not Fade Away

[Mole 0]

I just watched "Not Fade Away" and it isn't as good as "Nowish."

...why?

Hmm...

 

1. The fight scene with THE BEAST is the best fight scene in Angel/Buffy history. Tell me ONE fight scene that was just as good? I will then watch it, and say you're wrong.

 

2. The story seems a lot smoother.

 

3. There is just something misssing from "Fade." I can't put my finger on it, but it is something.

 

4. WES WIPING OUT THE SHOTGUUUUUUUUUUN.

[Anakin Flair 0]

Back to Buffy-

In "Never Leave Me', when the Bringers raid Buffy's house, one of them goes to stab Dawn a'la the potentials. Nice little subtle fake-out for later on.

[Anya 0]

I don't get Sleeper. FE tries to get Spike and the vamps he sired in the basement to kill Buffy....yet at that point it shouldn't have wanted Buffy dead. That goes against it's slayer line plan they introduce just 2 eps later.

[Mole 0]

Yeah, Joss wasn't there to set them straight and Marti lost her job as EP.