Captain America

[Guest The Midnight Rocking Warrior]

Hello, I was just wondering if the good captain has fought another heroes in marvel or Dc. ( And please don't mention Batman, the outcome of that fight was determined by fans, and Batman was at the height of his popularity with his cartoon show. And besides Captain America beat Bane who crippled Batman) Thanks

[Steviekick 0]

I know he's tussled with Wolverine, Hawkeye, and Punisher in the past

[Guest The Midnight Rocking Warrior]

Thanks, do you know who won those fights?

[Guest TheZsaszHorsemen]

He fought (and was beaten by) The Batman.

 

Oh and you know very little about Batman if you think Cap beating Bats means anything..

 

Bane was never better than Batman in the purest sense of the word. For months before KnightFall began the writers had made very subtle hints that batman wasn't doing too good physically. He was tired more and more and came to rely less and less on his friends. The message was clear: Batman was not at his peak.

 

Enter Bane.

 

In KnightFall, Bane exploited Batman's fatigue by releasing all the inmates of Arkham Asylum and watching as Batman attempted to capture them all on his own. Only when he was at his weakest (but still managed to take out Bane's gang beforehand) did Bane strike. And after that Jean Paul Valley (who was never in Bruce's league) crushed Bane. Bruce rested, recuperated, came back and defeated Valley(Who had beaten Bane). In subsequent battles with a Batman at full strength, Bane has never beaten Batman and has been forced to retreat.

 

So your point about Bane is worthless in deciding if Cap could beat Bats.

[Steviekick 0]

I consider Batman and Cap to be equal. Depending on the situation, it can go either way.

[Guest The Midnight Rocking Warrior]

I know the story of Knightfall, I have the graphic novel, thanks. And Let's see:

 

Batman beat Superman in Dark Knight returns and DKSA ( Although he needed help from other people)

Batman got beat by Wonderwoman in a league of one

Batman beat Bullseye in Marvel Vs. Dc

Batman ( Last I checked) is 1-1 with Prometheus

Batman vs. Daredevil was a tie in my opinion

And Batman forced Azreal ( As Batman) to give up the batman name in Knightsend

 

( Did I miss any other Bat- fights? I don't include elseworlds)

 

Oh and Mr. Zsaz is the most underrated villan in the batman comics

[Guest TheMadmanGreg]

Dark Knight Returns and Dark Knight Strikes again are now considered Elseworld's by DC, so, by your standard, they shouldn't count, either.

 

And Wonder Woman has beaten Batman on more than one occasion... (but Bats was sandbagging, I'm sure.)

 

And, if Batman forcing Az out of the mantle wasn't good enough for you, he did it more forcefully during the Bruce Wayne Fugitive arc.

[Guest The Midnight Rocking Warrior]

Thank you for correcting me. Now more importantly, who has beaten superman in a non- elseworld story? All I have so far is:

 

Parralax ( My all-time favorite villan, next to the Joker)

Lobo ( Although Superman won their rematch)

 

And that's all I have, last I checked

[Guest TheZsaszHorsemen]

Batman defeated Lex Luthor to end No Man's Land.

 

Batman defeated Superman in Part 5 of Hush.

 

(Just felt like sharing those two points)

 

Oh and while DKR is an "ElseWorlds" story, it doesn't mean the fight doesn't count. It's about as accurate a simulation as to how a fight would go between the two as any.

 

As to the Bats/Cap debate... it's Bats. Cap has a keen tactical mind, and is the best pure fighter in the Marvel Universe. But as far as pure knowledge in nearly every form of lethal and non-lethal combat coupled with the greatest array of chemical and mechanical weapons known to man... who can stand up to that? If I was writing a story about the two battling I'd have Cap "win" an early battle, then batman demolish him in a rematch, then have the two team against Hydra/Checkmate or whatever.

[Guest TheZsaszHorsemen]

I'd also like to add that Batman could've eliminated the JLA at anytime (Tower of Babel).

 

Batman's ability to defeat forces seemingly far beyond his means is supposed to be affirming to normal people. That you don't need powers to be a hero.

 

Not too shabby.

[Guest The Last Free Voice]

I think Hal at his peak could take Bats. (Good or Evil, take your pick. I agree Paralax rocked.)

[Guest TheZsaszHorsemen]

I think Hal at his peak could take Bats. (Good or Evil, take your pick. I agree Paralax rocked.)

That would be cool. Especially since Hal has near unlimited power with a BIG weakness. Bats KNOWS about the yellow thing, so it could either way.

[Steviekick 0]

Parallax would destroy Batman in seconds. As far as good ol' peak of his career Hal, it would be a great fight. Aside fromt the whole yellow thing, Hal's only weakness would be Batman distracting him so he wouldn't be able to use the full power/effect of the ring. The fight would be over, however, if Hal was to use the ring to create an oxygen removal device around Batman and choke him to death. But I don't think Hal is as sick and twisted as me.

 

Although Kyle's GL ring is more powerful, in any confrontation with Batman I would say that Bats has the upper hand.

[Guest The Midnight Rocking Warrior]

Parralax had no weaknesses, and he could create more than one thing at once, ( read Emerald knights), And he's the only person to defeat Supes without Kryptonite or a red sun. Mr. Zsaz, has Supes ever beaten batman, or has Captain Whitebread ever fought batman?

[Steviekick 0]

has Captain Whitebread ever fought batman?

If you mean Captain Marvel, I'm not sure.

[pochorenella 0]

Funny how this thread went from Captain America to Batman in an instant.

 

What do you guys think about Batman saying Cap could probably beat him, but that it would take him a while? This happened in Avengers/JLA #2 in case you're living under a rock.

[Steviekick 0]

I think what Batman said was a fair assessment of the situation. However, he said it with the "it could take a while" was more to get under Captain America's skin.

[Guest The Midnight Rocking Warrior]

Ok, so caps record so far is :

One victory over Bane

One ( Fan-voted on, never would have happened if it were written by the writers........ Take that Zsaz "loss" to batman

One draw with Batman......... please help if theirs anything else, thanks

[Guest The Midnight Rocking Warrior]

And even though Bats was not at his peak, it was an official win for Bane ( If these posts seem like I hate Batman, it's not true, Bats was my favorite hero growing up) What was the storyline for Hush? Thanks

[Steviekick 0]

And even though Bats was not at his peak, it was an official win for Bane ( If these posts seem like I hate Batman, it's not true, Bats was my favorite hero growing up) What was the storyline for Hush? Thanks

Hey, a win is a win. I'll save explaining Hush to Mr. Z, as I wouldn't be able to do it justice

[Guest TheMadmanGreg]

Batman's words to Cap in the JLA/Avengers crossover state: "It's conceivable you could beat me." That is not an admission of defeat, but more accurately an assessment of the situation. He did not say "You can beat me." He just said that Cap was good enough at fighting that it is within the realm of belief that in some distant galaxy Captain America could beat Batman.

 

Here's Hush broken down to its bare essentials:

Batman gets hurt, then fixed. Batman likes Catwoman. Batman and Catwoman hate Ivy. Ivy likes Superman. Batman fights Superman. Krypto likes Catwoman. Batman hates Joker, Batman hates Ra's. Harvey Dent is back. Where's Jason Todd? I don't know. There he is. No, that was Clayface. Harold did it. Harold dies. Who's Hush? Batman fights Hush. Harvey saves the day. It was Riddler all along. Batman doesn't like Catwoman anymore.

 

And that, ladies and gentlemen, is the better part of a year's worth of comics in one paragraph.

[Steviekick 0]

Good job, Greg. That makes much more sense than I could have ever made in describing it.

[Sass 0]

Captain America has fought just about every noteworthy super hero in the MU at one time or another.

[Steviekick 0]

Captain America has fought just about every noteworthy super hero in the MU at one time or another.

Except for Peter Porker the Spectacular Spider-Ham~!

[Masked Man of Mystery 0]

Okay, I must admit that I have not read any of the original Cap comics, I've read volumes 2 and 3 of Essential Avengers, but he retires for a while in 3 and it's quite evident that this is pretty close to the end for him. ANyways, from what I understand of his storyline, Cap was injected with some stuff that made him superhuman, so, given that, in a straight up fight he could presumably beat up Batman, who has no superpowers. The only way Batman could win is by using his Bat gear. Just my two cents.

[Steviekick 0]

Okay, I must admit that I have not read any of the original Cap comics, I've read volumes 2 and 3 of Essential Avengers, but he retires for a while in 3 and it's quite evident that this is pretty close to the end for him. ANyways, from what I understand of his storyline, Cap was injected with some stuff that made him superhuman, so, given that, in a straight up fight he could presumably beat up Batman, who has no superpowers. The only way Batman could win is by using his Bat gear. Just my two cents.

Aside from his gadgets, Batman has received much more martial arts/fighting training than Cap.

[Masked Man of Mystery 0]

Okay, I will admit I didn't know that.

[Guest The Midnight Rocking Warrior]

I just read Hush, and Zsaz, where did you get the idea that Batman defeated Superman? Batman was about to be murdered when he convinced Supes to save Lois. So let's review:

 

Hush: Draw

Dark Knight returns: Fictional to even the Dc universe

Dark Knight Strikes again: ditto

Batman never has and likely never will defeat Supes

 

Have a good night.

[Guest The Midnight Rocking Warrior]

Tomorrow I'm going on vacation for ten days so please, keep this Topic afloat so I can argue with Zsaz when I get back. Thanks

[Guest TheZsaszHorsemen]

I just read Hush, and Zsaz, where did you get the idea that Batman defeated Superman? Batman was about to be murdered when he convinced Supes to save Lois. So let's review:

 

Hush: Draw

Dark Knight returns: Fictional to even the Dc universe

Dark Knight Strikes again: ditto

Batman never has and likely never will defeat Supes

 

Have a good night.

Because even with all of Superman's powers, Batman was still able to stay alive long enough to allow his plan with catwoman to work.

 

That's a victory, buddy.

 

 

And DKR being non-continuity has no bearing on the fight itself. The two were kept in character. The character of Batman defeated Superman. And besides that, the Tower of babel arc of JLA shows bats could take ANY member of the JLA, and has planned on that chance that he may be forced to.