nl5xsk1 0 Report post Posted February 6, 2004 TC, I'm not a huge Sens fan (and not even the person that you directed the question to) but I want to chime in my two cents (because if nothing else, I love it when the OaO NHL thread is near the top of the page) ... While I do question if Lalime is a goalie capable of winning the Cup, I don't think that the Sens should make a trade for a top-shelf netminder. To get one that is too much better than Lalime would be too costly, in terms of which players they had to trade to get him. Why lose a good player from your team this year, or a few good players from the farm team, for a goalie that's not too much better than what you have. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Olympic Slam Report post Posted February 6, 2004 Lalime seems like the obvious lightning rod for any and all Ottawa problems. But, Lalime got the Sens to within a couple of goals of the Cup finals; he deseres at least another chance to match that. I think the magic number today in the NHL for playoff flameouts is two (Cloutier, we're watching you!). Since last season was hardly a disaster, Lalime shouldn't get dumped just yet. btw, the Shaks SMASHED the Coyotes last night 5-0. Although I bet all you anti-Westernites could care less. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
the max 0 Report post Posted February 6, 2004 I only saw highlights of that Dogs/Sharks game, and just have to wonder what exactly Tyson Nash was thinking. Sens/Leafs put me in a pretty bad mood. Lalime is still an upper-echelon guy, he just needs something to push him over the top. Replacing him is not what is going to make him a top goalie. Them advancing deep into the postseason again, and coming out of the East would help immensely. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
treble 0 Report post Posted February 6, 2004 I think Lalime is a good goalie, too, but his playoff play seems to inconsistent to me. He can be awesome for a series and then not good enough the next one (2002 he was amazing vs. Philly but not so much against Toronto) so I don't know if he can be counted on to win it all. There have been 2 games in the past week where he's given a lead late in the game and hasn't been able to hold it (against Dallas and last night's Leaf game), and I'm sure giving up 10 goals to the Leafs in 2 games isn't exactly encouraging. Personally, though, I wouldn't make at trade, since there are no clear-cut upgrades over Lalime available right now. People can talk about Burke all they want, but in no way is he an elite NHL goaltender. Kolzig may be available, too, and maybe Roman Turek, too, but they aren't going to be upgrades. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CanadianChris 0 Report post Posted February 6, 2004 Stajan's goal was quite ugly. And yes, I do think Lalime needs to go. I'm not buying into everyone saying that he just needs some time to work things out and that he'll be back to his old self soon...this is a guy who's only had two seasons where he could be considered a world-class goalie, and I'm thinking those just might have been aberrations. Plus, it's not like he's the goalie of the future, anyway -- you could make arguments that both Martin Prusek and Ray Emery are better than him. The only thing Prusek doesn't have right now is playoff experience. I say trade Lalime to a non-contender for a decent player -- maybe get Shane Doan out of Phoenix -- bring up Emery, and play Prusek the rest of the way. If he qualified, he'd be 7th in the league in GAA, and 12th in save %. He's got the tools to do it. Do I think it'll happen? No -- both Martin and Muckler are committed to Lalime, even to their detriment. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Brush with Greatness 0 Report post Posted February 7, 2004 Emery will be a better goalie than Prusek which is why he is getting the playing time in the A. And there is no way they should trade away Lalime for another goalie. Why? Because there is no one proven that is better. When you take a look at it only three teams actually have established playoff goalies. New Jersey - Brodeur - 3 cups, 80 wins, nuff said (18 series won) Toronto - Belfour - 1 cup, 3 final appearances, 80 wins (17 series won) Detroit - Hasek - 53-39 (10 series won) and if you want to you could possible count - Joseph - a poor 58-62 (10 series won however) and I'm not going to count Osgood because frankly I don't feel he's there. So unless the Sens make a trade of Lalime for Hasek, then I don't think they are getting a goalie for goalie deal that will give them a more proven guy. Trading Lalime for a depth player? That would be a big risk and one that could blow up in your face if you are management and its the goaltending that ends up faltering in the playoffs. But just say they did, who would they deal to? You're likely not going to go in conference (especially to either the two teams in the playoff race that would want a good goalie - Philly and Boston). The only playoff team in the West that I could see wanting him would be Colorado but they won't want to part with too much. Phoenix for Doan? No chance with Boucher, Burke and Bierk there. Most non-playoff teams actually still have decent goaltending and wouldn't want to part with someone too talented for Lalime. The one potential team could be the Hurricanes if they give up on Weekes. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Olympic Slam Report post Posted February 7, 2004 And there is no way they should trade away Lalime for another goalie. Why? Because there is no one proven that is better. When you take a look at it only three teams actually have established playoff goalies. Not only that, but is there an available goalie who has taken their team as far as Lalime took the Sens last year? - Kolzig went to the cup finals in 98' with Washington. That's it though. Cujo, Burke, Biron, and Turek have never gone as far as Lalime did last year. Besides, the market is so diluted with goalies now that the Sens would never be able to unload Lalime. The market for goaltenders is stagnant as most teams are looking to sell. Only Philly is really searching for a netminder. Buffalo has three options in Noronen, Miller and Biron so they have plenty of time to get their act together. Vancouver might be interested in the off-season if Cloutier has any more postseason "Jim Carey" moments. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Brush with Greatness 0 Report post Posted February 7, 2004 Because I'm bored, here are the playoff records of goalies. East 1 PHILADELPHIA Esche 0-0 2 TORONTO - Belfour 82-61, 17 series, 3 finals, 1 cup 3 TAMPA BAY - Khabibulin 15-18, 1 series 4 BOSTON - Raycroft None 5 NEW JERSEY - Brodeur 83-56, 18 series, 4 finals, 3 cups 6 OTTAWA - Lalime 18-16, 3 series 7 MONTREAL - Theodore 7-8, 1 series 8 NY ISLANDERS 9 BUFFALO - Biron None 10 NY RANGERS 11 ATLANTA - Nurminen None 12 FLORIDA - Luongo None 13 CAROLINA - Weekes 3-2 14 WASHINGTON - Kolzig 20-24, 3 series 15 PITTSBURGH West 1 COLORADO - Aebischer 0-0 2 DETROIT - Hasek 53-39, 10 series, 2 finals, 1 cup Joseph 58-62, 10 series 3 SAN JOSE - Nabokov 8-8, 1 series 4 VANCOUVER - Cloutier 9-12, 1 series, Hedberg 9-9, 2 series 5 DALLAS - Turco 6-6, 1 series 6 ST LOUIS - Osgood 44-33, 8 series 7 CALGARY 8 NASHVILLE - Vokoun None 9 LOS ANGELES - Cechmanek 9-14, 1 series 10 MINNESOTA 11 EDMONTON 12 PHOENIX 13 ANAHEIM Giguere 15-6, 3 series 14 COLUMBUS - Denis 15 CHICAGO I'll finish this up later, gotta go. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Slovakia 0 Report post Posted February 8, 2004 Some discussion of the All-Star Game, guys. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LaParkaMarka 0 Report post Posted February 9, 2004 Amusing how Bertuzzi got the crap booed out of him. I'm from Vancouver, and it's still funny. Reminds me of how much Chelios got booed whenever he was in town after the Nucks lost to Detroit in 6. I wonder why Keith Tkachuk got booed though. What has he ever done to Minnesota? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
treble 0 Report post Posted February 9, 2004 Burke heading to Flyers for Comrie? ST. PAUL, Minnesota (CP) — A report Sunday that the Phoenix Coyotes had traded veteran goalie Sean Burke to the Philadelphia Flyers in exchange for centre Mike Comrie was premature but sources indicate a deal could happen as soon as Monday. Coyotes general manager Mike Barnett denied Sunday that the Coyotes had already Burke to Philadelphia. "I haven't spoken to anyone since Friday morning," Barnett told The Canadian Press from Los Angeles on Sunday. "I don't plan to expand on those conversations until Monday (at the GM meetings) in Las Vegas." A Flyers spokesman said Sunday there was no trade to announce. Philadelphia's goaltenders have had injury problems this season. The Flyers called up Antero Niittymaki from the AHL after starting goaltender Robert Esche sprained his knee on Feb. 2. Esche is expected to be out at least three weeks and Jeff Hackett is out indefinitely with vertigo. Burke has appeared in 32 games with Phoenix this season and has a goals-against average of 2.81. Comrie has nine points in 21 games with the Flyers since coming to Philadelphia from Edmonton in a trade last December. The New York Rangers have also showed interest in Burke. I don't see why they don't just stay with Esche, since Burke has probably the weakest playoff credentials of any of the 'big name' goalies that might be available. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Red Baron 0 Report post Posted February 9, 2004 You can be freakin Terry Sawchuck, and you can not get the Flyers the cup Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nl5xsk1 0 Report post Posted February 9, 2004 RE: the Flyers getting Burke, what will they do if/when Esche and Hackett both get healthy again? They'll have 3 veteran goalies to juggle going into the postseason (yet won't have one that's truly a Cup-winning-caliber goalie). If Bobby C. was smart (and that's a BIG if) he'd try to finagle a 3 way deal, and send Hackett somewhere else while picking up Burke. Of course, why anyone would pick up a goalie that's suffering from vertigo is beyond me. And I haven't watched the all-star game yet (I had to pick up a friend at the airport so I taped the game to watch tonight) but I did watch the skills competition and the YoungStars on Saturday ... man, did the Bruins reps look bad. Razor Raycroft got shelled in the YS game, Boynton lost the puck in his event, Thornton had the weakest "Hard Shot", and Muzz Murray only went 3/8 in the accuracy. Damn, it was tough to watch. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
the pinjockey 0 Report post Posted February 9, 2004 If the Flyers get Burke, Hackett will get a medical buyout of his contact. There is a chance that happens even if they don't get Burke. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Red Baron 0 Report post Posted February 9, 2004 I was just on TSN.ca, and Eric Weinrich was traded to the Blues for future considerations, and Jeff Hackett might retire Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nl5xsk1 0 Report post Posted February 9, 2004 I was just on TSN.ca, and Eric Weinrich was traded to the Blues for future considerations, and Jeff Hackett might retire In the NHL, aren't "future considerations' normally just the willingness to pay the rest of the guys salary, and maybe a very-low draft pick? And count me among those that'd feel bad for Hackett if he had to hang up the blades. He had a pretty good season and a half in Boston, but wanted too much money for a goalie that couldn't win a playoff series. Of course, I wish the team had kept Johnny Grahame. Grahame & Racroft > Potvin, Hackett, Shields, Skudra, Dafoe, Carey, etc. etc. etc. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Olympic Slam Report post Posted February 10, 2004 I was just on TSN.ca, and Eric Weinrich was traded to the Blues for future considerations, and Jeff Hackett might retire In the NHL, aren't "future considerations' normally just the willingness to pay the rest of the guys salary, and maybe a very-low draft pick? Usually that or a 5th round or lower pick. It's finally a done deal: Burke goes back to Flyers in trade TSN.ca Staff 2/9/2004 The long-awaited Sean Burke trade to the Philadelphia Flyers is done. Phoenix Coyotes General Manager Michael Barnett made the announcement Monday, two hours after TSN broke the details of the trade. The Phoenix Coyotes sent the veteran netminder, plus Coyotes forward Branko Radivojevic and unsigned prospect Ben Eager of the Oshawa Generals to the Flyers in exchange for centre Mike Comrie. Burke arrival spurred the retirement of Flyers goalie Jeff Hackett, who has been battling vertigo this year. Related Info Flyers' Hackett announces retirement Weinrich dealt to Blues In 32 games with Phoenix this season, the 37-year-old Burke has collected a 10-15-5 record, 2.81 goals against average (GAA) and .908 save percentage (SV%). In 16 NHL seasons split between New Jersey, Hartford, Carolina, Vancouver, Philadelphia, Florida and Phoenix, Burke has compiled a 298-316-99 record, 2.97 GAA, .902 SV% and 34 shutouts. In his 5 seasons as a Coyote, Burke turned his career around registering a 97-78-29 record, 2.39 GAA, .919 SV% and 15 shutouts in 211 games. We wish Sean Burke many more seasons of success in the NHL and thank him and his family sincerely for everything they have done for the Coyotes organization both on and off the ice, said Barnett. He is often referred to as the consummate professional and deservedly so. Sean Burkes performance since his arrival in Phoenix has much to do with our new arena in Glendale standing proudly. His leadership has accelerated the development of our younger players both as athletes and as people. Burke leaves the Coyotes among the all-time franchise goaltending leaders in several categories: ranking first in GAA and SV%; tied for second in shutouts; and third in games played, minutes played and wins. The 6-foot-4, 209-pound netminder twice represented the Coyotes at the NHL All-Star Game (01 and 02) and, in 2001-02, finished as a finalist for the Vezina Trophy and the Lester B. Pearson Award. Over the last 5 seasons, Burkes .919 save percentage ranks in a tie with Floridas Roberto Luongo and Detroits Manny Legace for the best in the NHL during that span. Burke was acquired by the Coyotes with a 5th round choice in the 2000 NHL Entry Draft in exchange for goaltender Mikhail Shtalenkov and a 4th round choice in the 2000 Entry Draft on Nov. 19, 1999. The Windsor, Ontario native was originally drafted by New Jersey (2nd round, 24th overall) in the 1985 NHL Entry Draft. To get a young player like Mike Comrie, it is necessary to give up young promising talents as well, said Barnett. Both Branko Radivojevic and Ben Eager have bright futures in the NHL. Radivojevic, 23, has collected 9-14-23 and 36 PIM in 53 games this season with Phoenix. In his three-year NHL career, the Piestany, Slovakia native has recorded 25-31-56 and 103 PIM in 150 games, all with the Coyotes. Last season, Radivojevic represented Phoenix at the 2003 NHL YoungStars Game as part of NHL All-Star Weekend in Florida. The 6-foot-2, 207-pound forward was originally drafted by the Colorado Avalanche (3rd round, 93rd overall) in the 1999 NHL Entry Draft and was later signed by the Coyotes as a free agent on June 19, 2001. Eager has played in 52 games with Oshawa (OHL) this season, recording 21-20-41 and 168 PIM. The 6-foot-3, 211-pound left wing was drafted by the Coyotes in the 2002 NHL Entry Draft (1st round, 23rd overall). A native of Ottawa, Ontario, the 20-year-old Eager is in his fourth season with Oshawa (OHL) and has collected 55-73-128 and 759 PIM in 234 career games. The 23-year-old Comrie has played in 21 games with the Philadelphia Flyers this season, recording 4-5-9 and 12 penalty minutes (PIM). In his four NHL seasons, Comrie has collected 65-77-142 and 161 PIM in 213 career games split between Edmonton and Philadelphia. Comrie spent the previous three seasons with Edmonton before being traded to Philadelphia earlier this season in exchange for Jeff Woywitka, a first round pick in the 2004 NHL Entry Draft and a third round pick in the 2005 NHL Entry Draft on Dec. 16, 2003. The addition of Mike Comrie to our roster gives us another proven scorer and a player who brings passion to his profession, said Barnett. He has enjoyed success at a very young age in the NHL and we look forward to watching how far his skills will take him and the Coyotes in the years to come. Comries best season came in 2001-02 when he set career highs in goals, points and games played, finishing the campaign with 33 goals, 27 assists and 60 points in 82 games with Edmonton. That year, he led the Oilers in goals and finished tied for the team lead in points. He also ranked fourth on the team in assists and second in power play goals (8), power play assists (14) and power play points (22). Comries 33 goals ranked 17th in the NHL and his shooting percentage (19.4%) finished 6th in the NHL in 01-02. He also played in the 2002 NHL YoungStars Game as part of NHL All-Star Weekend in Los Angeles. Last season with Edmonton, the 5-foot-9, 185-pound forward recorded 20-31-51 and 90 PIM in 69 games. Comrie finished 3rd on the Oilers in assists and power play goals (8), and 4th in goals and points in 02-03. His six game winning goals led Edmonton and ranked 15th in the NHL. Comrie made his NHL debut on Dec. 30, 2000 and finished the season with 8-14-22 and 14 PIM in 41 games with Edmonton in 2000-01. The Edmonton, Alberta native was originally drafted by the Oilers in the third round (91st overall) of the 1999 NHL Entry Draft. Comrie spent two seasons at the University of Michigan (CCHA) from 1998-99 to 1999-2000, totaling 43-60-103 in 82 games. In his first collegiate season (98-99), he was named CCHA Rookie of the Year and was named to the CCHA All-Rookie Team and the CCHA First All-Star Team. In 99-00, Comrie was a finalist for the Hobey Baker Award (as the NCAAs outstanding player) in addition to being named to the CCHA First All-Star Team and NCAA West Second All-American Team. Source TSN I think the Coyotes might have given up a little too much for Comrie. Burke isn't much of a loss as there are more benefits with his departure than their are negatives. But, in today's NHL, one player is not going to help a team dramatically offensively. I'd be wary about making any trades that aren't 1 for 1 or 1 for and 1 and a pick. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nl5xsk1 0 Report post Posted February 10, 2004 I agree that a 3-for-1 transaction is a bit one-sided, but I still think that PHX got the better end of the deal. Burke isn't an elite goalie, and I really think that he won't even be their #1 goalie going into next season (if there is a next season). Comrie has been pretty good for Philly, and should be better playing in the Western conference again. If that kid Radivojevic turns out to be good, then maybe the Flyers got the edge. But if he turns out to be a 3 or 4 line player (which wouldn't be surprising with Philly's depth) then I'd have to give the edge to the Coyotes. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CanadianChris 0 Report post Posted February 10, 2004 A primer on why exactly the Chicago Blackhawks are the worst sports franchise in all of North America: http://www.suntimes.com/output/mariotti/cst-spt-jay10.html Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
the pinjockey 0 Report post Posted February 10, 2004 Comrie hasn't done jack since the first week with the team. He hasn't been able to adapt to the east or Hitchcock's style. Granted, part of it is due to the fact Hitch put him on the 4th line with Todd Fedoruk and Patrick Sharp, but now it is just in a cycle stage (can't learn-->doesn't play--->can't learn). Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nl5xsk1 0 Report post Posted February 10, 2004 Comrie hasn't done jack since the first week with the team. He hasn't been able to adapt to the east or Hitchcock's style. Granted, part of it is due to the fact Hitch put him on the 4th line with Todd Fedoruk and Patrick Sharp, but now it is just in a cycle stage (can't learn-->doesn't play--->can't learn). Comrie is geared to play the Western Conference style of play, more than the physical grind style of the East. I think that he'll put up better numbers with Phoenix than he ever would have with Philly. On a related note, when Esche and Burke are both healthy, who gets the bulk of the minutes? Who starts in the playoffs? It's almost like the Flyers are in the same boat that they were with Boucher & Cechmanek: two goalies ready to play, but neither should be considered a #1. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
the pinjockey 0 Report post Posted February 10, 2004 Accoding to most theories, if Esche is healthy it is his team. But god only knows what happens if Burke lights it up while Esche is out. If Esche had stayed healthy and been given the starting job from the start of the season he would have been in the mix for the all star game, so if Burke takes the job I would be quite pissed off. That seems to be part of the reason they wanted Burke. Him and Esche are best friends and they aren't worried about Burke causing trouble. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
treble 0 Report post Posted February 10, 2004 Hasek's gone for the year. DETROIT (AP) -- Red Wings goalie Dominik Hasek will miss the rest of the season because of an injured groin, leaving the team with Curtis Joseph and Manny Legace in the net. Hasek, 39, ended his retirement after one year to return to Detroit, but he played in just 14 games before Tuesday's announcement. Hasek was 8-3-2 for the Central Division-leading Red Wings. Hasek retired after Detroit won the 2002 Stanley Cup, and the Red Wings signed Joseph to replace him. After the Red Wings were swept in the first round of the playoffs last year, the six-time Vezina Trophy winner and two-time league MVP came back and the team tried to trade Joseph. It has helped the Red Wings that no team wanted to take Joseph, and his $8 million contract, because he has played well at times in Hasek's absence. When Hasek was healthy, Detroit put Joseph on waivers and sent him to its AHL team in Grand Rapids twice. Joseph has another year and $8 million remaining on his contract, and Hasek is making $6 million this season. Entering training camp before this season, Hasek hadn't played as much as a pickup game as a goaltender since Game 5 of the Cup finals against Carolina in 2002. But he said in coming out of retirement in July that he felt he had more to contribute to the game. In addition to his NHL hardware, Hasek was a gold medalist in the 1998 Nagano Olympics. Lucky for them they couldn't find any takers for Joseph. I have to wonder if Hasek's done for good now, though. If there's no hockey next year, he'll be over 40 whenever it starts back up again and teams probably aren't going to want to take a chance on a 40 year-old with a wonky groin. At least not as a #1 guy. And if I were the Flyers, Esche would be my guy going into the playoffs. Burke has a 12-22 career record in the playoffs, but he's not a bad guy to have on the bench in case Esche can't handle the playoff pressure. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lomasmoney 0 Report post Posted February 10, 2004 This just in: Dominik Hasek out for remainder of the season Wow, I am so happy the Wings didn't trade Cujo Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
treble 0 Report post Posted February 10, 2004 And Rob Blake has a broken leg (hairline fracture) and is out indefinitely. I wonder if it happened at the All Star game. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nl5xsk1 0 Report post Posted February 10, 2004 Accoding to most theories, if Esche is healthy it is his team. But god only knows what happens if Burke lights it up while Esche is out. If Esche had stayed healthy and been given the starting job from the start of the season he would have been in the mix for the all star game, so if Burke takes the job I would be quite pissed off. That seems to be part of the reason they wanted Burke. Him and Esche are best friends and they aren't worried about Burke causing trouble. If there's one team in the league that wouldn't care about pissing off a player, it'd be Clarke and the Flyers ... remember Roger Neilson, just a few years ago? If they'll fuck over Roger, they'll certainly fuck over Esche. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
the pinjockey 0 Report post Posted February 10, 2004 I meant I personally would be pissed if they dumped Esche for Burke Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nl5xsk1 0 Report post Posted February 10, 2004 I meant I personally would be pissed if they dumped Esche for Burke Ohhhh ... good point. As someone that's a Flyer-hater (Fucking Brashear. If he got traded to the Bruins I'd learn to hate them), I'd personally be pretty psyched for Burke to take over the top spot. Why? Flyers would lose in the first or second round, and it'd be due to yet ANOTHER poor GM decision by Clarke. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Red Baron 0 Report post Posted February 10, 2004 Burke is the best bet for a solid goalie, and lately he has been improving every year, and its been a while for him to prove himself in the playoffs. Now with Burke to Phili, Colorado really needs a solid number 1 goalie to carry them into the playoffs (Osgood), and if Belfour has constant back problems, that could be a problem for Toronto (no Stanley Cup) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
treble 0 Report post Posted February 10, 2004 I wish the Leafs would play Tellqvist more. Kidd can be OK, but for every good game he has there's a 7 goal blowout in there somewhere. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
