Who should take Lesnar's spot?

[Guest]

Ok... No offense, but how does that make any sense. Right now the WWE needs to push a ton of stars, and frankly, not giving the World Title to Benoit wouldn't be good as the amount of credible main eventers is dwindling big time.

There are 2 ways to explain.....

 

1. HHH must stay strong to build to next year.....probably WILL happen

 

2. Seeing as Lesnar quit because he wanted to be able to walk when he got older....why would they push someone that won't be able to walk in some time?

[Lightning Flik 0]

I'm not saying SD should be "The Orton Show" ... but he could be there as one of the top guys... Angle, Eddie, Cena, Show, Taker, Rhyno(?), Orton, and RVD. that's four faces and four heels that could sit and rotate around, and when Taker leaves, bring over Booker or put Edge back (or maybe even Jericho).

 

I don't know... I don't want to see "The Orton Show" either...but i might be able to make people give a shit about him. MIGHT.

Ok. First of all, you are saying that not only Orton goes over, but also RVD? Excuse me but while I could believe Orton, I doubt RVD goes to SD. RVD will never go to SD because the WWE will not allow a person who gets the dead crowds on RAW to give off some heat to any match that apparently won't have any with another person in it.

 

As for Orton, it is a toss up. But they'd still have to build up to it and unless they want to do the automatic force down our throats (if they WWE really wanted too, they can do much worse with Orton), then they'd just rather build up stars on Smackdown.

[Guest Anglesault]

Um... Anglesault, you do remember the WWE is not that high on Angle right now and worried about having him near the title (as he had recently had his neck scoped).

 

Then tell him to retire.

 

There's nothing left for him.

Then if you do that, you just cut the wheels off of Smackdown.

 

You've got Show, Taker, and Eddie then, if you play with the fact that Angle has retired (and still assuming that Edge is RAW). Instead of trying to at least bring up one, you are now given the frightening possibility of having to push THREE superstars. That's a daunting task to put before the SD crew as well as if RAW won't ship any talent over to SD. Becuase frankly, I don't see anyone on SD that's really able to step up to do that. The WWE might think A-Train can, so that's one, but the other two?

 

But by taking him out of the mains, you're doing that anyway.

[The Amazing Rando 0]

I was just saying...Orton is going to get pushed no matter what...so might as well put him where he is needed.

[Lightning Flik 0]

Ok... No offense, but how does that make any sense. Right now the WWE needs to push a ton of stars, and frankly, not giving the World Title to Benoit wouldn't be good as the amount of credible main eventers is dwindling big time.

There are 2 ways to explain.....

 

1. HHH must stay strong to build to next year.....probably WILL happen

 

2. Seeing as Lesnar quit because he wanted to be able to walk when he got older....why would they push someone that won't be able to walk in some time?

Ok... Option #1 not only is counter productive, then we'll have NO ONE who will be built up to be able to beat Triple H. Shit, I doubt Michaels will have any pops by next year if that were to happen. And hell, if you can't get pops out of Michaels, there will be NO hope. Unless you built up someone going through the other wrestlers to be on the same equal page as Triple H. Last I checked, Triple H doesn't really care for anyone to be on his level.

 

As for option two that's already a chance at happening. After all, it went from Benoit and HHH to Benoit, Michaels and HHH. Besides, most people assume that Triple H is retaining, and then will squash Benoit at Backlash. Hell, even I've given up on Benoit ever getting the title at this point.

[Guest Anglesault]

I was just saying...Orton is going to get pushed no matter what...so might as well put him where he is needed.

Smackdown does NOT need him.

[Lightning Flik 0]

But by taking him out of the mains, you're doing that anyway.

Yes, you take him out of the mains is counterproductive. However, they can make Angle into Michaels. Use him when you need him too, which isn't half bad (as Michaels apparently is still over, isn't he?) as it would be if he's completely gone. At least he's there if you can't push someone up.

[Guest]

I gave up hope once Benoit left Smackdown. Maybe he'll go back with the thought that no one can beat HHH and win the title from Eddie.

[Guest Anglesault]

Yes, you take him out of the mains is counterproductive. However, they can make Angle into Michaels. Use him when you need him too, which isn't half bad (as Michaels apparently is still over, isn't he?) as it would be if he's completely gone. At least he's there if you can't push someone up.

 

 

And what does he do when they aren't using him?

[Lightning Flik 0]

Yes, you take him out of the mains is counterproductive. However, they can make Angle into Michaels. Use him when you need him too, which isn't half bad (as Michaels apparently is still over, isn't he?) as it would be if he's completely gone. At least he's there if you can't push someone up.

 

 

And what does he do when they aren't using him?

God only knows Anglesault. Frankly, I'm neither impressed with the decision nor do I want them to do what they feel like, but the WWE feels the need to do such.

 

It's just not getting any better. I mean, here's what you've got for each show.

 

Raw Main Eventers

Triple H (Champion)

Chris Benoit (dependant on success at Mania)

Shawn Michaels (if they need him, they'll use him)

Bill Goldberg (if they actually go out of their way to resign him)

Kane (if they actually promote him)

RVD or Booker T or Edge (if they actually go out of their way to bring one of these guys up, and assuming Edge gets traded)

 

 

Smackdown Main Eventers

Eddie Guerrero (Champion)

Undertaker

Big Show

A-Train (can they actually build him up into main eventer calibre)

Angle (if they don't make him become Michaels the Smackdown Version)

Edge (if he doesn't get traded)

RVD or Booker T (assuming they get traded for Edge)

 

Seriously, that's the line up for Main Eventers. Besides FOUR people, there are no main eventers that will be permenant or believable (depending on who you look at).

Edited March 10, 2004 by Lightning Flik

[Papacita 0]

You want Angle to do the double PPV job to keep Big Show strong?

 

Why not have Eddie beat Show at J-Day and then have both he and Angle really start to gun for Eddie over the Summer (Like we were gonna do with Brock and Angle)

 

Why kill Angle off totally at Judgment Day?

Well the reason I said Show needs to be kept strong is because he already has a PPV win over Eddie, which would logically place him in line for a title shot soon. Thing is, it'd be a little hard to sell Show as a title contender coming straight off a loss to Cena, so the win over Taker would serve to build him up so that Eddie can knock him down at Vengeance. Basically, when all's said and done, Eddie gets his job back from No Mercy.

 

As far as "killing off" Angle...I never said anything about killing him off. I'm just saying that'd be be the most logical solution IMO for the next show without scrambling to find someone to fill Brock's void. Anything could happen during the Judgment Day match, and a loss there doesn't necessarily kill Kurt off. If I was seriously booking, I'd probably save the final blowoff between those two for something like SummerSlam.

 

As for the idea of pushing someone up, you want Rhyno to go over Cena? Excuse me, but the WWE is trying to build up Cena even more then before. Hence, I don't think Rhyno will be going over Cena anytime soon. The problem is, it seems the WWE don't feel Cena is ready to step up himself, so I could see Rhyno and Cena duking it out to build themselves up as more than nothing.

I'm not saying I'd just put Rhyno over Cena and let that be that, but I'd probably give those two a healthy feud over the U.S. Title in the immediate future (which Cena would definitely win, BTW) to help build up Rhyno as a credible heel, to help build the title up as a more credible belt (WWE needs a strong upper-midcard title) and hopefully give Cena more time to develop as a face character. Cena's over, yes, but I'd say right now, he probably not the best choice for WWE Champion, because his character is too one-dimensional. I say give him a strong U.S. reign, maybe a *good* feud or two to give him a little more character depth, and then he can be sent into main event. But in the meantime, if we're grooming Cena for the main event status, I see no reason why we can't take someone along with him.

[Lightning Flik 0]

I'm not saying I'd just put Rhyno over Cena and let that be that, but I'd probably give those two a healthy feud over the U.S. Title in the immediate future (which Cena would definitely win, BTW) to help build up Rhyno as a credible heel, to help build the title up as a more credible belt (WWE needs a strong upper-midcard title) and hopefully give Cena more time to develop as a face character. Cena's over, yes, but I'd say right now, he probably not the best choice for WWE Champion, because his character is too one-dimensional. I say give him a strong U.S. reign, maybe a *good* feud or two to give him a little more character depth, and then he can be sent into main event. But in the meantime, if we're grooming Cena for the main event status, I see no reason why we can't take someone along with him.

You see, I agree with what your saying. My problem is, the WWE will be wanting people to step up in a hurry to the main eventer podium. And frankly as you pointed out neither man is available or ready to do so. Hence, we are going to see some awful stuff happen in the WWE because of it. I could see people getting put in the mains just so the WWE can have a lot of people there.

[Guest Anglesault]

.Anything could happen during the Judgment Day match, and a loss there doesn't necessarily kill Kurt off.

He blows two PPV title shots in a row. People generally don't become big contenders after that.

[Lightning Flik 0]

.Anything could happen during the Judgment Day match, and a loss there doesn't necessarily kill Kurt off.

He blows two PPV title shots in a row. People generally don't become big contenders after that.

At least in the current era of sports entertainment.

 

Some people did in the old days, but nowadays, with the even steven booking that isn't possible.

[Papacita 0]

.Anything could happen during the Judgment Day match, and a loss there doesn't necessarily kill Kurt off.

He blows two PPV title shots in a row. People generally don't become big contenders after that.

All depends on how you play up the loss. Plus you've got a lot of time between Judgment Day and SummerSlam. If the issue between Eddie and Kurt is kept alive, it wouldn't be all that hard to for fans to accept a third match between those two.

 

Kurt would probably have to win that one though if he plans on staying around.

[Lightning Flik 0]

.Anything could happen during the Judgment Day match, and a loss there doesn't necessarily kill Kurt off.

He blows two PPV title shots in a row. People generally don't become big contenders after that.

All depends on how you play up the loss. Plus you've got a lot of time between Judgment Day and SummerSlam. If the issue between Eddie and Kurt is kept alive, it wouldn't be all that hard to for fans to accept a third match between those two.

 

Kurt would probably have to win that one though if he plans on staying around.

And we of course assume that the WWE keeps Angle as a Main Eventer, this idea becomes a very plausable one. Still doesn't help with the Main Eventer problem they are having (but helps not make it as bad).

Edited March 10, 2004 by Lightning Flik

[Guest Anglesault]

.Anything could happen during the Judgment Day match, and a loss there doesn't necessarily kill Kurt off.

He blows two PPV title shots in a row. People generally don't become big contenders after that.

All depends on how you play up the loss. Plus you've got a lot of time between Judgment Day and SummerSlam. If the issue between Eddie and Kurt is kept alive, it wouldn't be all that hard to for fans to accept a third match between those two.

 

"Eddie! You beat me at Mania! And then you beat me again at Judgment Day! In fact, I've been trying to beat you since Febuary and have thus far been completely unsuccessful! But this Sunday, at Summerslam, I really mean it!"

 

No.

[Guest Goodear]

I think the only way you can really play off Kurt losing twice in a row and still come back to him later is to have the Mania match end with Eddie doing his usual cheating off his ass. Follow that up with Kurt simply coming back saying that all that did was verify that everything he's said about Eddie is true and that he's still a stinky disgrace. You set up the rematch to have Eddie dig in deep and come back 'honest' for a victory only to send Angle off into a maniacal spiral that circles back around to Eddie at a later date that has Angle go over.

[Guest Anglesault]

Even then, he's still a heel who blew it twice.

[Lightning Flik 0]

Even then, he's still a heel who blew it twice.

But what if Eddie actually wins it fairly, and Angle does everything possible to get that return match and announces he'll win it "fair and square".

 

Yet, right as Eddie seemingly has it won, Angle cheats his ass of to win the title. That might work.

[Guest Goodear]

Yeah, I wouldn't want to do it personally. But at least that way the matches would be significantly different enough to warrant going through the process. Angle losing the same way a couple of times would be a horrible, horrible disaster for his character.

[Guest Goodear]

Yet, right as Eddie seemingly has it won, Angle cheats his ass of to win the title. That might work.

Oh yeah, if Angle wins at the second match of the series it really doesn't matter. But taking the belt off Eddie that quickly would be a real shame at this point, and I think most people would prefer Angle taking a break from Eddie for a few months before coming back and challenging fo0r the strap again. Losing two PPV matches in a row and THEN winning would also deflate the audience considering the match and feud would be 4 months or so long by that point and they would need to mix it up before then.

[Lightning Flik 0]

Yet, right as Eddie seemingly has it won, Angle cheats his ass of to win the title. That might work.

Oh yeah, if Angle wins at the second match of the series it really doesn't matter. But taking the belt off Eddie that quickly would be a real shame at this point, and I think most people would prefer Angle taking a break from Eddie for a few months before coming back and challenging fo0r the strap again. Losing two PPV matches in a row and THEN winning would also deflate the audience considering the match and feud would be 4 months or so long by that point and they would need to mix it up before then.

Um, I was actually refering to their third match as where Angle cheats to win. And I never specified when those two would have to meet each other for those matches. Just saying if you want those two to face each other, that's the plan you should follow.

 

But what would keep it fresh is also if both men sign a legally binding contract that doesn't let the other competitor near the title whilst either

 

A) The other person holds the title.

 

or

 

B) An extended period of time.

 

That way you build it up as that Eddie won't have to worry about seeing Angle again should he lose.

[Papacita 0]

Goodear, that's pretty close to what I was thinking, actually. With him believing so deeply in his cause against Eddie, I could easily see him turning that into a semi-psychotic rampage after the loss (maybe have him randomly run in people's matches and put the anklelock on people...or something like that). That, or maybe they could run an angle where Kurt injures Eddie sometime before Judgment Day, Eddie somehow steals a second win from Kurt, injuring him in the process, then having Kurt return for revenge at Vengeance, which in addition to setting up the SummerSlam match would give Kurt a chance to heal up if his neck is giving him trouble.

 

Still doesn't help with the Main Eventer problem they are having (but helps not make it as bad).

Maybe, but something like that would probably give them more time to build up the guys they've got now. Hotshotting people from Raw to Smackdown is just a quick fix and if it's not well thought out, it could do more to disrupt the show than it'd do to help it. If down the line they see fit to move people over, then so be it, but for now I think they'd be better off just working with what they've got.

 

And they should keep Edge on Smackdown.

[Papacita 0]

But what if Eddie actually wins it fairly, and Angle does everything possible to get that return match and announces he'll win it "fair and square".

 

Yet, right as Eddie seemingly has it won, Angle cheats his ass of to win the title. That might work.

That'd have been good if they didn't turn Kurt before Mania. That's why I would've preferred a face vs face match.

[Toxxic 0]

I love the way that one person leaving appears to completely screw over the company in the minds of everyone here.

 

I'm saying I agree or disagree at the moment. But it sure is funny, even if it does mean the quality of the wrestling I watch is going to take a massive nosedive from the fallout of this (not just the loss of Brock's character and workrate, but also the horribly sudden pushes etc).

[Fro 0]

It's just not getting any better. I mean, here's what you've got for each show.

 

Raw Main Eventers

Triple H (Champion)

Chris Benoit (dependant on success at Mania)

Shawn Michaels (if they need him, they'll use him)

Bill Goldberg (if they actually go out of their way to resign him)

Kane (if they actually promote him)

RVD or Booker T or Edge (if they actually go out of their way to bring one of these guys up, and assuming Edge gets traded)

 

 

Smackdown Main Eventers

Eddie Guerrero (Champion)

Undertaker

Big Show

A-Train (can they actually build him up into main eventer calibre)

Angle (if they don't make him become Michaels the Smackdown Version)

Edge (if he doesn't get traded)

RVD or Booker T (assuming they get traded for Edge)

 

Seriously, that's the line up for Main Eventers. Besides FOUR people, there are no main eventers that will be permenant or believable (depending on who you look at).

Raw:

 

Main Eventers

 

HHH (going to do movies, gets injured like crazy because of the roids)

Michaels (has bad back)

Benoit (has bad neck, buried by HHH)

Jericho: (could main event; HHH unsuccessful at completely burying him)

Kane (stopgap main eventer)

 

Part-time Wonders:

Foley/Rock (once-a-year guys at best)

Steve Austin (one more match?)

 

Leaving:

Goldberg (not resigned)

 

 

 

 

---

Upper Midcard

 

Orton (not a draw yet, finally getting somewhat over... might get over if he's cut away from HHH?)

 

Booker T (buried, retiring soon)

RVD (buried, contract up in July)

Batista (poor worker, steroid monster)

Christian (buried more or less)

Flair (bad neck may force retirement, hurt, buried as a legit threat)

 

---

 

Buried

 

Matt Hardy, Storm, Venis, Dudleys, etc. (a huge dropoff, in other words)

 

Smackdown:

 

Main Eventers:

 

Eddy Guerrero

John Cena

Angle (bad neck, may need time off)

Taker (old, should retire soon)

Edge (bad neck)

Big Slow (bad knees)

 

Leaving: Lesnar

 

---

Upper Midcard

 

Rey Misterio (too small to main event regularly, bad knees)

Chavo Guerrero

Bob Holly (lol)

A-Train (half-buried)

Rhyno (buried, but has a prayer)

 

---

 

Buried

 

Bradshaw (another big dropoff), Rikishi

 

What's scarier than the main eventer/upper midcarder people is how much of a disaster the rest of the midcard is... a total wasteland.

[Guest Anglesault]

Goodear, that's pretty close to what I was thinking, actually. With him believing so deeply in his cause against Eddie, I could easily see him turning that into a semi-psychotic rampage after the loss (maybe have him randomly run in people's matches and put the anklelock on people...or something like that). That, or maybe they could run an angle where Kurt injures Eddie sometime before Judgment Day, Eddie somehow steals a second win from Kurt, injuring him in the process, then having Kurt return for revenge at Vengeance, which in addition to setting up the SummerSlam match would give Kurt a chance to heal up if his neck is giving him trouble.

So, we have it with the heel blowing it twice, the face injuring the heel, and the heel coming back to avenge an injury?

 

And people are supposed to care?

[Papacita 0]

Goodear, that's pretty close to what I was thinking, actually.  With him believing so deeply in his cause against Eddie, I could easily see him turning that into a semi-psychotic rampage after the loss (maybe have him randomly run in people's matches and put the anklelock on people...or something like that).  That, or maybe they could run an angle where Kurt injures Eddie sometime before Judgment Day, Eddie somehow steals a second win from Kurt, injuring him in the process, then having Kurt return for revenge at Vengeance, which in addition to setting up the SummerSlam match would give Kurt a chance to heal up if his neck is giving him trouble.

So, we have it with the heel blowing it twice, the face injuring the heel, and the heel coming back to avenge an injury?

 

And people are supposed to care?

That's a worst-case scenario, but it's not impossible to make that work.

[justcoz 0]

If I were WWE, I'd negotiate a BIG MONEY DEAL with Bob Sapp to do a run in at Mania and lay out Lesnar, Goldberg and Austin.

 

The only downside in this line of thinking is that while Sapp would fill the monster role of Lesnar, where does he fit in with the rest of the talent? You can't job the guy and you don't necessarily want to put him over Angle or Eddie immediately.

 

So let's have some fun with this and start shaking things up and creating tension between the brands.

 

Booker T and RVD no show a RAW tag title defense. The announcers speculate what could have possibly happened. Their opponents, Matt Hardy and Steven Richards, feel that they should be deemed tag team champions by forfeit but that idea is nixed by Sheriff Austin who states that he will fine Booker and RVD for their actions but wants to know what happened before any decision is made about the titles.

 

On Smackdown, Booker T and RVD show up along side Paul Heyman. Paul explains that his good friend, Rob Van Dam, was nice enough to call Paul and notify him that he and Booker's RAW contracts expired the day following Wrestlemania and that Bischoff and Stone Cold didn't prioritize correctly and negotiate a new deal with their tag team champions. Paul goes to ringside and picks up a trash can. Booker and RVD throw the RAW titles in the trash and cut promos about how they were held down on RAW and look forward to working with the genius that is Paul Heyman.

 

In the following weeks, Booker calls out Cena as he takes offense to a white boy talking about being a Thug as if he grew up in the ghetto rather than a nice suburban home in Boston. This sets up a Cena/Booker feud.

 

Reunite Benjamin and Haas with Kurt Angle only to set up a scenario where Angle and Benjamin turn on Haas.

 

Just ideas, we all have them...

 

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