The Amazing Rando 0 Report post Posted March 12, 2004 Okay, through a conversation with Downhome, I asked him if it is even possible to bring the WWE out of the slump they are in and get casual fans more interested in the product and to bring in the lost fans. As much as this seems like fantasy booking, this is what came out of it all: The Brands: Keep them together...in fact...all most keep them in four seperate pieces...you'll see what I mean. I am looking at the rosters and not counting valets and other eye candy, each brand has about 32 guys/gals they can work with. I would split them up this way... Raw: Singles: Batista, Benoit, Jericho, Christian, Kane, Orton, Steiner, HBK, Test, HHH, Edge, Flair, and Matt Hardy Tag Teams: Booker/RVD, Dudleyz, La Resistance, The Vanilla Connection, Canadian Swingers Women: Jazz, Lita, Molly, Trish, Victoria Heat: Maven, Rico, Spike Dudley, Stevie Richards, Tommy Dreamer (various other OVW guys can come in) Smackdown: Singles: A-Train, Big Show, Eddie, Cena, Angle, Rhyno, SOH, Taker Tag Teams: FBI, Bashams, Too Cool, Japanese Mafia, WGTT, The Superheroes Cruisers: Kidman, Funaki, Chavo, Noble, Nunzio, London, Rey Mysterio, Shannon Moore, Tajiri, Ultimo Velocity: Billy Gunn, Hardcore Holly, Matt Morgan, Orlando Jordan Now...that looks odd...but I would divide feuds out in a way that would keep everything fair and even. I also would not allow the Raw/SD announcers to mention Heat/Velocity (unless for storyline purposes) and instead give the Heat/Velocity announcers there own segment on Raw/SD to talk about the upcoming show and pimp it a little. Adds more meaning to them (or so I would think). Feuds: Each Brand would have 10 feuds going on at all times... yes...10... not all would be important...but there... Raw: 1 World Title feud 1 IC Title feud 2 other feuds 1 Women's Title feud 1 Tag Team Title feud Heat: 2 singles feuds 1 tag feud 1 women's feud SD: 1 World title feud 1 US title feud 1 other heavyweight feud 1 Cruiser Title feud 1 Tag Team Title feud 1 other cruiser feud Velocity 1 heavyweight feud 1 tag team feud 2 cruiserweight feuds Now...this would not take care of EVERYONE...but the feuds happening on Heat and Velocity would be kinda like contendership feuds or call-up feuds that those guys are in to get up to Raw or SD. It keeps you paying attention to the B shows to see who will be moving up to the A shows...and it keeps you watching the A shows cause there is always something happening with a good number of people. I have my own ideas for these feuds, and they involve moving people around (as you can see, Rosey/Hurricane move to SD) and turning them between heel and face to fit the molds. Other Ideas: Now, me and Downhome then began talking about the PPVs...and I had an idea for Survivor Series and one for the Rumble. First off...SurSer... Now, the week after WM ends, a point system would begin. I see it going this way: Points = Action 2 = Win -1 = Loss 4 = Title win 3 = Title retention -3 = Title loss -2 = Title shot loss -5 = Draws, No Contests, etc (making them something that really means something if they happen) This makes winning and losing mean something, and even the titles mean a bit more as keeping them not only keeps you a champion, but gets you points for a tally... show the weekly tally at the end of every show and show BOTH during Confidential to keep people updated. Now...with 4 weeks left until SurSer (after the 6 months between WM and this time) the points would rack up and at this four week mark...the top four guys would be made team leaders (for a total of 8 teams, 4 from Raw & 4 from SD) and they would get to choose 3 teammates... champions would be included in this Now...with 2 weeks until SurSer...the 8 teams have 4 matches..and the four survivors go to SurSer and have 3 more matches (Raw vs. Raw, SD vs. SD, Raw vs. SD) The surviving teams wins bragging rights and something to be named in a moment. Now...onto the Royal Rumble... As the weeks count down, 9 guys from each brand (18 total) will draw and reveal their entrant numbers for the Rumble...leaving 12 others with unkown numbers... except for 1 & 30... which is were SurSer comes in... the winning team of the SurSer tourny has a four way match...the winner gets the 30 spot... the losing team has a mini-tourny... losers of the first two matches fight...and the loser of THAT gets the number 1 spot. That way when it comes down to it... 20 numbers will be known, 10 will not... The Road to WM can remain the same for all I care. Fan Involvement Now, as for how to get the fans into it...I say each brand brings in one new face to comb the crowd and interview the fans (not plants...FANS) and ask them questions about what they are watching or upcoming shows/PPVs and then air them before/after commercials...Even go as far as pick out a "sign of the week" or something...who knows. House Shows can also be brought in...give 60-90 seconds around 9:40 or 10:20 on Raw & SD and have the announcers cover what has been going on at house shows, showing video if possible, or at least pictures and maybe an interview or two with a wrestler or a house show fan. I think that is pretty much all our conversation came up with, most of this crap was MY idea by the way, Downhome just listened and marked out. Thanks for reading, and keep flaiming to a minimum... ~ Rando. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Amazing Rando 0 Report post Posted March 12, 2004 sorry about whomever having to move this. *dives back behind bulletproof glass* Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Coffey Report post Posted March 12, 2004 You know, it pissed me off that I replied, in-depth to this thread once only to have it deleted due to an error message because someone moved the thread. So, I took the time to type out what I said again. Now that it's in a sub-folder that no one really reads, I'm not so happy. I really didn't think it was in the wrong area. I wouldn't consider it fantasy booking as much as it's a WWE discussion thread. There shouldn't even be a fucking fantasy booking forum! There's fucking E-Fed shit at the bottom, that should be enough. Anyway: I firmly believe that a "ranking system" (similar to WCW of old) would solve all of their problems. You have people wrestling to advance up the ladder. You have people wrestling for belts because the titles should mean everything. I remember when I was a little boy growing up, every single title seemed important. If you won the Tag Team Titles or Intercontinental Heavyweight Title it was a big deal. So big, in fact, that I recall several people throwing champaign parties and shit in the back as part of the celebration. Mean Gene would catch up to them and they would be in a state of euphoria over the victory. Titles meant everything. Working to get there was just important. Nowadays you have wrestlers being thrown together a week or two before the PPV just so they can fill the card up and change people to pay for it. Back then you only had four PPV's a year so they had months to build it up. It made you want to see it more. There was a lot less television time too, so each show didn't have the ability to waste time on selling Stacker 2 or giving a non-wrestler 15 minutes to "pep" the crowd up with cheap pops and catch phrases. It also kept wrestlers from becoming overexposed. You didn't get to see their finishers or main spots every single day. You got the see them in small doses...so they were more impactful when they happened. If someone kicked out of a finisher it was a big fucking deal. Now it's expected. I think the biggest problem with wrestling, truth be told, is the amount of time that they have. If they could utilize, spread it out evenly and justly, it would go a long way. Give the wrestlers time to work. Give each wrestler time...not just the flavor of the month OVW green jobber. The "B" shows should matter. Are you telling me that if you stuck a main eventer on Sunday Night Heat or Velocity that the ratings would still stink? People used to watch WWF Saturday Nights Main Event...and Hulk Hogan was often on it. Better use of time. A ranking system would help them start heading in the right direction for corrected the problem. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Amazing Rando 0 Report post Posted March 12, 2004 Another small thing I had with the rankings would be if say... somebody like Hurricane went on a nice win streak... the announcers could recognize it and maybe somebody could come out to try and put an end to it... making a small angle out of it... I wish the matches meant something more than filling time until Wrestler A fought Wrestler B at PPV....which is a big reason I came up with some of this stuff. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Downhome 0 Report post Posted March 12, 2004 Why move a topic this in depth to this folder? It wasn't fantasy booking, no one specific is mentioned. It's all about what the actual WWE, in the real world, can do to solve all of it's problems and to make it seem important once again, as it was a few years ago. We get a really great topic posted in WWE, and it's moved...to the wrong folder. That doesn't make sense at all. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Coffey Report post Posted March 12, 2004 I agree. It should most definitely be moved back to the WWE folder...and I feel it can spawn some good discussion. Let's hope that the person who moved it bothers to read this sub-forum again after moving the thread.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lightning Flik 0 Report post Posted March 12, 2004 Ok... WHO THE FUCK MOVED THIS??? Whoever was the mod who moved this (which isn't fantasy booking, but an in-depth system of how to fix things) should be forced to apologize to Rando. I'm not being sarcastic or anything. You, the mod who moved this deserve to apologize for practically kill off this very good thoughtful thread. You send it here everyone is going to assume this is a fantasy thread. And it isn't. That being said, I think this idea is a pretty good idea. Actually it is a hell of an idea. I really like the idea of the feuds since having that many feuds would make people care a lot. Although, I have a problem with so many as you'd need to have some end at the same time so as to get people to bounce from one to another. My only problem with the feuding system. The point category also comes up with the problem is how do you decided who gets to challenge for what title? Would there be a selected amount, or would people have to be slated in certain divisions? And if they are slated, how do they ever rise above their division they are in? Other than that, good read. I'd rather think about this before I respond more, although I must say the OVW idea is ingenious really. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Amazing Rando 0 Report post Posted March 12, 2004 As for feuds ending and beginning at the same time... that doesn't necessarily have to happen... as there would be enough people not in feuds at any given time to be pushed into one if need be. I figured there are 64 or so people that can wrestle (give or take retirements and the like) ...and not all of them would be used by 20 total feuds. As for the point system/title shot thing... I have two basic principles that can be used... 1. If Wrestler A's total points are ABOVE a given champions...then he can challenge. 1. There would be seperate rankings for Heavyweights (and Cruisers for SD), Women, and Tag Teams. 2. The 30 day rule would come back into play...with the champion having to do it at least once every 4 weeks (to the person whose right below them in points, unless that person is a champion himself). Also...PPVs would not count in the 30 days (unless it's something storyline-related) ...that way some TV title matches could occur as well. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Amazing Rando 0 Report post Posted March 12, 2004 Another thing that just popped into my head... Vince & Co. need to turn this downward trend into a marketing campaign... Guys like Austin, HHH, Flair, even Vince himself need to get themselves onto talk shows and speak about the ratings drop and talk about what WCW vs. WWE was really like. Not the bastardized spin version of it...the TRUTH. They need to admit where wrongs happened and take blame and tell the world OUT OF CHARACTER that changes can be made and will be to bring the viewers back. The Viewers are the most important thing. PERIOD. It's not about making certain guys look better than others... These guys need to look at the whole picture and be a REAL team player... politicking needs to die and they need to concentrate on getting back the fan base... by going out and actually admitting they failed and showing that they know why and that they know how to fix it... and then ACTUALLY DO SOMETHING instead of faking it...it could bring people back... To have a guy like Vince or even Austin to come out and say "it's true, we aren't where we were 4 years ago and ________ is why, but we know we can correct the problems and we hope the fans that have left in that time can give us another chance..." ...it's almost begging... but I don't think they are above that right now if they actually fix things. They just need to admit failure. Acceptance is a key step to recovery. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HVilleThugg 0 Report post Posted March 12, 2004 Not a bad effing idea Rando...not bad at all. Personally, I'd just like to see them merge the rosters again and stop putting on one C+/B- product and one D product. I think THAT will solve a lot of issues and bring fans back to watching ONE WWE. This two brand crap makes it annoying, and it allows fans to do something you DON"T want them to do...which is WATCH ONLY ONE BRAND!! The fact is...I like Raw...so I hardly every watch Smackdown because I'm not going to miss anything. The people that I have a vested interest in are on Raw, so there's no reason for me to watch Smackdown. If it were possible for anyone to show up on any show, I'd watch Smackdown. Be that as it may, I think the ranking system is a great way to get interest back in the matches and making the belts mean something. Because now, no one cares that much about the matches...what they seem to care about is whether or not Taker is going to reach up from under the ring and pull Kane down to hell...instead of whether or not they'll have a solid match. That's all. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Toxxic 0 Report post Posted March 12, 2004 As for the "divisions" problem, that could be countered. make it so that every werstler is either assigned or picked a division, then if they want to swap out, they have to start again. What I mean is, if say Cena's character is never quite making it into a position to challenge for the WWE Title, he can't just get fed up and jump to the US Title division and immediately get a title shot simply because he used to be a main event player. No, he has to start at the bottom of the US rankings and beat everyone above him in order to get the shot. It would make more sense and justify people not taking championships that might be considered "below" them... especially because if Cena then decided he wanted back in the Main Event scene he'd have to go back to the WWE Title division and start from the bottom of there, meaning he'd have been better off never leaving. Some good ideas, but basically this is so far-fetched given the current state of the WWE that Fantasy Booking is the only place for it... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Amazing Rando 0 Report post Posted March 12, 2004 I'm beginning to dislike the current state of the WWE... but anything can change with time... whether the change is for good or bad...well... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Askewniverse Report post Posted March 12, 2004 I think most of Rando's ideas are really good. There's only a few things that I don't quite agree with. -I don’t think there are enough women on the roster to have feuds on both Raw and Heat. Right now, there's only about five women who could be considered wrestlers: Victoria, Molly, Jazz, Trish, and Lita. Inevitably, you would have the same feuds over and over, which wouldn't make the women's division much different than it is now. -The Royal Rumble concept. In my opinion, the Rumble is less exciting if you know the order of entrance ahead of time. I don’t really like it when I know who will be the first and last entrants, like this year’s Rumble. I think knowing 18 additional numbers would be even worse. Now, the week after WM ends, a point system would begin. I see it going this way: Points = Action 2 = Win -1 = Loss 4 = Title win 3 = Title retention -3 = Title loss -2 = Title shot loss -5 = Draws, No Contests, etc (making them something that really means something if they happen) This makes winning and losing mean something, and even the titles mean a bit more as keeping them not only keeps you a champion, but gets you points for a tally... show the weekly tally at the end of every show and show BOTH during Confidential to keep people updated. The point system is good, but I think it needs a little work. In my opinion, losing 5 points for going to a draw or no-contest is a bit much. It makes it seem as if going to a draw is worse than losing a title. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Amazing Rando 0 Report post Posted March 12, 2004 Okay...the Rumble concept was just a top of the head thing, nothing that I really care to see ... but just an idea. Again, nothing important. The women...yeah...I saw that there wasn't a very big group of females...I think they need to bring some in. If not, then just do one feud on the A Show and leave the others around to fill in spaces or put them on the house show circuit. About the "draw" thing... I saw it more as a way to punish the guy that made the draw happen... again... not a big deal with the draw thing, but it needs to have some affect on the rankings so that (scenario) if a guy was wrestling to move up in the ranks, he wouldn't want his friends to interfere and cost him that chance to move up, but at the same time the OTHER person wouldn't want a run-in or a draw because it would cost him points as well. Another thing I thought of...just now...would be talent that was exclusive to house shows. By this I mean that they put guys on the road and tell the viewing audience that these guys are wrestling on the tours and working there way onto TV. Give them promo time on the shows to say that they hope to be able to perform in front of the world soon, but enjoy the touring and see the fans and etc. This could be a good way to introduce some OVW guys to the masses, put them on little TV vignettes, and even (in the little house show reports that I mentioned) show them winning a few matches and getting some pops and showing themselves off and put them as a "new upcoming star" and if the GMs are still around, have them talk about 'giving the wrestler a shot' to get onto TV full time. The match wouldn't be for points, it would be for a spot. Fans may tune in to see if he makes it and if he doesn't... then he goes back to the house-show circuit to get another chance in a few weeks or whatever. If the GMs seem impressed with a wrestler and the wrestler shows it, then the fans are more apt to care. There are exceptions (Nathan Jones/Matt Morgan), but for the most part they could get "cult support" for these lower rung talents through the house show reports and through the little fan interview segments and then put them on TV full-time. If they flop...then put them back down on the circuit and use the flop as an angle for the character. Have the character say that he thought he was ready but now is more motivated to try even harder to gain the fan's respect. Always keep the fans in mind and mention them. It might be a cheap pop...but it helps. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HarleyQuinn 0 Report post Posted March 12, 2004 Raw: Singles: Batista, Benoit, Jericho, Christian, Kane, Orton, Steiner, HBK, Test, HHH, Edge, Flair, and Matt Hardy Tag Teams: Booker/RVD, Dudleyz, La Resistance, The Vanilla Connection, Canadian Swingers Women: Jazz, Lita, Molly, Trish, Victoria Heat: Maven, Rico, Spike Dudley, Stevie Richards, Tommy Dreamer (various other OVW guys can come in) Smackdown: Singles: A-Train, Big Show, Eddie, Cena, Angle, Rhyno, SOH, Taker Tag Teams: FBI, Bashams, Too Cool, Japanese Mafia, WGTT, The Superheroes Cruisers: Kidman, Funaki, Chavo, Noble, Nunzio, London, Rey Mysterio, Shannon Moore, Tajiri, Ultimo Velocity: Billy Gunn, Hardcore Holly, Matt Morgan, Orlando Jordan I would also toss occasional Raw stars onto Heat/Velocity(if kept) like Rhyno, Eddie and Cena occasionally appearing on Velocity while Kane, Benoit, HBK appear sometimes on Heat. This makes them more appealing to the average fan and gives them a sense of importance like it had back in the late 90's. Now...that looks odd...but I would divide feuds out in a way that would keep everything fair and even. I also would not allow the Raw/SD announcers to mention Heat/Velocity (unless for storyline purposes) and instead give the Heat/Velocity announcers there own segment on Raw/SD to talk about the upcoming show and pimp it a little. Adds more meaning to them (or so I would think). If they want to be looked at as 'separate' brands then I would completely denounce any and all mention of the opposing show from the announcers with the exception of an opposing wrestler appearing on their show/cutting a promo on the opposing wrestler. Also the wrestlers/announcers would stand up for their company no matter what, includes trash talking those who jump(Ex: Brock shows up on Raw and ambushes Austin. Austin returns the favor on Smackdown, they cut opposing promos) Feuds: Each Brand would have 10 feuds going on at all times... yes...10... not all would be important...but there... Raw: 1 World Title feud 1 IC Title feud 2 other feuds 1 Women's Title feud 1 Tag Team Title feud Heat: 2 singles feuds 1 tag feud 1 women's feud SD: 1 World title feud 1 US title feud 1 other heavyweight feud 1 Cruiser Title feud 1 Tag Team Title feud 1 other cruiser feud Velocity 1 heavyweight feud 1 tag team feud 2 cruiserweight feuds Now...this would not take care of EVERYONE...but the feuds happening on Heat and Velocity would be kinda like contendership feuds or call-up feuds that those guys are in to get up to Raw or SD. It keeps you paying attention to the B shows to see who will be moving up to the A shows...and it keeps you watching the A shows cause there is always something happening with a good number of people. I have my own ideas for these feuds, and they involve moving people around (as you can see, Rosey/Hurricane move to SD) and turning them between heel and face to fit the molds. I like this idea a lot as it would make everybody somewhat usefel and get them over in the long run by making fans care about them. Other Ideas: Now, me and Downhome then began talking about the PPVs...and I had an idea for Survivor Series and one for the Rumble. First off...SurSer... Now, the week after WM ends, a point system would begin. I see it going this way: Points = Action 2 = Win -1 = Loss 4 = Title win 3 = Title retention -3 = Title loss -2 = Title shot loss -5 = Draws, No Contests, etc (making them something that really means something if they happen) This makes winning and losing mean something, and even the titles mean a bit more as keeping them not only keeps you a champion, but gets you points for a tally... show the weekly tally at the end of every show and show BOTH during Confidential to keep people updated. I like this idea although the points system seems a little odd in some aspects. Draws/NC's costing so much and a loss costing less then a win. Now...with 4 weeks left until SurSer (after the 6 months between WM and this time) the points would rack up and at this four week mark...the top four guys would be made team leaders (for a total of 8 teams, 4 from Raw & 4 from SD) and they would get to choose 3 teammates... champions would be included in this Now...with 2 weeks until SurSer...the 8 teams have 4 matches..and the four survivors go to SurSer and have 3 more matches (Raw vs. Raw, SD vs. SD, Raw vs. SD) The surviving teams wins bragging rights and something to be named in a moment. I fucking LOVE this idea. I wonder, would it continue down the ladder for the rest of the 4 on 4 matches in terms of point standings? What if there're 5 wrestlers tied at 1 point level or even just 2? Do they have a match to decide who gets chosen? Now...onto the Royal Rumble... As the weeks count down, 9 guys from each brand (18 total) will draw and reveal their entrant numbers for the Rumble...leaving 12 others with unkown numbers... except for 1 & 30... which is were SurSer comes in... the winning team of the SurSer tourny has a four way match...the winner gets the 30 spot... the losing team has a mini-tourny... losers of the first two matches fight...and the loser of THAT gets the number 1 spot. That way when it comes down to it... 20 numbers will be known, 10 will not... The Road to WM can remain the same for all I care. I like this idea although I'd probably cut it down to 15 known, 15 unknown. I despise knowing who the #1 and #30 entrants are so I'd can anybody from getting those on live TV as it ruins the experience IMO of wondering who's got both. Fan Involvement Now, as for how to get the fans into it...I say each brand brings in one new face to comb the crowd and interview the fans (not plants...FANS) and ask them questions about what they are watching or upcoming shows/PPVs and then air them before/after commercials...Even go as far as pick out a "sign of the week" or something...who knows. House Shows can also be brought in...give 60-90 seconds around 9:40 or 10:20 on Raw & SD and have the announcers cover what has been going on at house shows, showing video if possible, or at least pictures and maybe an interview or two with a wrestler or a house show fan. I love the sign of the week idea. I'd probably devote 5 minutes to the 'House Show' circuit and show clips of various matches to give fans a more urgent feeling of attending and maybe point out matches that haven't been seen on TV before. I also like the interview idea though I'd probably keep it to fans to give it a more personal feel to other fans. I think that is pretty much all our conversation came up with, most of this crap was MY idea by the way, Downhome just listened and marked out. Thanks for reading, and keep flaiming to a minimum... Done and....Done ~ Rando. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Amazing Rando 0 Report post Posted March 12, 2004 You stayed in the realm of my first post... and alot of my ideas changed between then and now... The point system problems were adressed in there somewhere... I always liked the idea of a completely unknown Rumble...but that'll never happen. Hence why i'd like the SurSer to help choose 1 & 30. As for the "multiple guys at the same place in the standings" - yeah, if the Number 4 spot is many guys...then there could be a match... but after that... the team captains pick their partners... anyone they want. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Mandarin 0 Report post Posted March 12, 2004 Hey, Rando, is it all right if I use these rules to start an EWR fed that I'll post on here? I've been looking for some inspiration to start up a new fed, and this sounds pretty damn good. I'm thinking since you only get three TV shows per week on EWR, I could have both Velocity and Heat on a two hour show. First hour Velocity, second hour SmackDown. Rosters for everything would be the same, and I could keep tally of the point system. Sound good? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Amazing Rando 0 Report post Posted March 12, 2004 I was hoping somebody would do it... as I don't have the time. Use the rosters I have listed up there...they make the most sense and provide good opportunities... my big ideas were Matt Hardy, A-Train, and the WGTT as faces and Kidman & Tommy Dreamer as heels. Bring in a few OVWers as well for the weekend show... Dinsmore & Nova as starters and others can follow... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kahran Ramsus 0 Report post Posted March 13, 2004 I moved it. This certainly falls under this folder as we've defined it. A post this in-depth describing a complete overhaul of the WWE system definitely belongs here. The WWE forum is for discussing the current product by an large, and this goes beyond it into booking the course of action they should take in the future. Sure it is a good post, and I even agree with much of it, but it belongs here. I don't blame Rando, which is why I didn't tell him. It was just a simple mistake. No biggie. I just simply moved it to its proper folder. From the folder description, Fantasy Booking Crap all goes here. How would YOU run WWE? This is also the home for any columns you want to write -- tape reviews, rants, whatever -- for the enjoyment and critiquing of your fellow TSM'ers. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites