TNA Thread For 4/21

[4hartthreat 0]

How was that not a clean finish? Jarrett went to hit AJ with the guitar and AJ kicked it. It didn't hit Jarrett though. Then Jarrett went to swing the broken guitar at AJ and AJ did a crucifix for the win? What's not clean about that? What did you want Jarrett to do? Just lay down without being touched?

I guess you missed Russo's distraction with climbing up the cage constantly.

 

HHH at WM XX --- THAT was clean.

Heck, Shelton over HHH --- THAT was clean.

 

AJ over JJ --- not clean.

Well this makes it more than obvious that you are just completely biased against JJ and always will be.

 

To say that HHH getting distracted by Flair and Benoit fighting on the floor and Benjamin rolling him up is clean, and then turn around and say JJ getting distacted by Russo and AJ rolling him up is not clean is just retarded. Period.

[Guest MikeSC]

How was that not a clean finish? Jarrett went to hit AJ with the guitar and AJ kicked it. It didn't hit Jarrett though. Then Jarrett went to swing the broken guitar at AJ and AJ did a crucifix for the win? What's not clean about that? What did you want Jarrett to do? Just lay down without being touched?

I guess you missed Russo's distraction with climbing up the cage constantly.

 

HHH at WM XX --- THAT was clean.

Heck, Shelton over HHH --- THAT was clean.

 

AJ over JJ --- not clean.

Well this makes it more than obvious that you are just completely biased against JJ and always will be.

 

To say that HHH getting distracted by Flair and Benoit fighting on the floor and Benjamin rolling him up is clean, and then turn around and say JJ getting distacted by Russo and AJ rolling him up is not clean is just retarded. Period.

Russo attempted to distract Jeff. His GOAL was to distract Jarrett. And he did so REPEATEDLY and DIRECTLY.

 

Benoit attacked Flair --- never even looking at HHH --- and Hunter, stupidly, got distracted.

 

World of difference between the two.

-=Mike

...HHH has also put over GB insanely cleanly (Survivor Series) and Benoit in just the last few months

[Guest CubbyBear]

His goal wasn't to distract Jarrett...his goal was to prevent Jarrett from cheating by using the guitar. It came off exactly like that...Russo didn't come out to screw Jarrett but just to make sure the match was fair.

[Blade2kxx 0]

I'm thinking they're going to use Raven/Styles as the top feud heading into the TV deal and blow that off around the anniversary show (which really needs a name to help it stand out as important, btw)....perhaps with Harris returning to cost Raven his title shot like Raven cost him his.  And then from there, Raven and a partner feud with AMW and Styles goes over Jarrett again (to gain credibility in the new viewers eyes) and then finally Styles drops the belt to Abyss.  After Abyss plows through everyone else, his run will probably be stopped by The Truth.  At least that its vision for the rest of the year....

 

I like that... then again, I'm a Truth mark.

 

1) Use Sabu for the Raven/AMW fued... that can segue into a Raven/Sabu fued when Sabu has enough of Raven and his carelessness.

 

2) Abyss + AJ = GOOD!

 

3) JJ jobbing = GOOD!

 

Nice plan...

[Guest MikeSC]

His goal wasn't to distract Jarrett...his goal was to prevent Jarrett from cheating by using the guitar. It came off exactly like that...Russo didn't come out to screw Jarrett but just to make sure the match was fair.

His STATED goal was to get the strap off Jarrett.

 

And that Russo made himself the central focus of the show is disturbing.

-=Mike

[Blade2kxx 0]

His goal wasn't to distract Jarrett...his goal was to prevent Jarrett from cheating by using the guitar. It came off exactly like that...Russo didn't come out to screw Jarrett but just to make sure the match was fair.

His STATED goal was to get the strap off Jarrett.

 

And that Russo made himself the central focus of the show is disturbing.

-=Mike

yeah, but look at it like I am here... He said he wanted to find the right guy to take it off of Jarrett, not screw him out of it.

 

Secondly, I agree with the people that look at it like this: Russo was trying to prevent Jarrett from cheating. The whole point behind the Cage was to do just that, so when JJ found a way to cheat, Russo came out to stop him.

[Guest Man Of 1,004 Modes]

Styles was down for the entire duration of the Russo trying to prevent a guitar shot. Styles finally got to his feet, turned around, and kicked the guitar into pieces. Jarrett attempted again to hit him, but Styles ducked, crucifixed him, and won.

 

Thats fucking clean. BTW, Mediocre is the same as consistant. You can be consistantly bad, consistantly good, or consistantly great. Tell me how he you can say him being mediocre doesn't mean consistantly good (Good = mediocre I'm assuming).

[The Ghost of bps21 0]

I'm just marveling at the discussion of how HHH being distracted was clean...and Jarrett being distracted wasn't.

 

Anyway...The match needed about 5 minutes of Jarrett beating the crap out of Styles after his bump off the cage to the floor before the finish. That could have had some good near falls and a better face comeback for Styles.

 

Unfortunately...as has been the case for cage matches done at the end of the show (instead of at the beginning like XXX/AMW) they ran out of time.

 

This was the 5th cage match.

 

XXX/AMW started the show so it didn't get cut short...

 

Wednesday Bloody Wednesday and Gathering vs. Abyss and RedShirts were pretaped so they had time...

 

But the two live main event cage matches (AJ/DLo and AJ/JJ) were both rushed because they forget how long it takes to set up the thing.

[The Ghost of bps21 0]

His STATED goal was to get the strap off Jarrett.

True.

 

And allowing him to cheat and nail AJ with a guitar would have prevented that. All he did was give AJ time to regain his footing. He didn't take the guitar out of his hand...he just prevented the cheating long enough for Styles to do it himself.

 

Once Styles was back to his feet he knocked the guitar out of play and rolled JJ up clean.

[Guest dvkorn]

And as for your no great matches comment, that is totally false. I would say the only one for sure is his IC title match with Shawn at IYH 2 which is a 5 star classic.

Re-watch it. It does not age well.

I would say he has at least one more great match, which was a match with Malenko on a PPV during his first WCW run

Likely you mean Slamboree '97 --- and the match was unmitigated crap.

but that is a little known match. I would also like to say that I think his first WCW run is completely underrated as he had really good matches with the likes of Benoit, Malenko, Jericho, Flair, DDP, and others.

No, he REALLY didn't. He is the king of *** matches. He never goes above that level.

What part of consistent didn't you understand. No one was saying he goes out and does ***** matches every night. People were talking about how he goes out and puts on solid to good matches.

 

Let's look at his first title reign. He beats Ron Killings in an extremely good match and minus the Hennig title defenses usually put on about a *** match when he defended it. During the current reign his matches have been most of the only ones that have managed to break the *** barrier with Mantel's booking. He also did carry Harris in that match a month ago.

Mediocrity and consistency are not the same thing.

 

Jarrett is mediocre.

How was that not a clean finish? Jarrett went to hit AJ with the guitar and AJ kicked it. It didn't hit Jarrett though. Then Jarrett went to swing the broken guitar at AJ and AJ did a crucifix for the win? What's not clean about that? What did you want Jarrett to do? Just lay down without being touched?

I guess you missed Russo's distraction with climbing up the cage constantly.

 

HHH at WM XX --- THAT was clean.

Heck, Shelton over HHH --- THAT was clean.

 

AJ over JJ --- not clean.

 

Then again, HHH >>>>>>>> JJ.

Consistentcy seems to be his middle name... never really has a bad match.. sure some aren't the best but never really a bad one, always some facets of them that are enjoyable, well at least to me.

Again, people confuse un-ending mediocrity with consistency.

When he's with a good worker, he can have an awesome match

Umm, when?

and when he's with an average worker he can have a good match...

Umm, when?

Jarrett's 99 WCW work is what made me a fan of him and i have watched him since then and sought out matches from years gone by that i have not seen and watched them and Jarrett has definately had some 'great' matches.

JJ's 99 WCW work was not good, at all. His best match of that era was with Benoit --- and it was worse than Benoit's normal work.

I can list many matches Jarrett has had in recent years (which you said has been 'piddling') and his entire career that have been 'great'.

 

Shall I...?

Feel free. Just remember this...

 

NOBODY has had the best match of their career with JJ.

 

Nobody.

 

Nobody had a match markedly better than their usual work with JJ.

 

Nobody.

-=Mike

Oh come off it, your bias against Jarrett is really shining through now..

 

I think by what you have said about Jarrett/HBK kinda proves that you are not a fan of his style, and i do agree somewhat by saying that his style is not what everyone likes.

 

And you kinda contradicted yourself when you said Jarrett's work has been piddling for year now but then saying

 

With JJ, you can pretty well write in a 3-star affair with most anybody --- not much higher, not much lower.

 

to me a three star match is a good enjoyable affair, not 'piddling.'

 

I'm probably just kinda nit-picking there but i thought i point it out anyway.

 

Also, i think someone who has had there best work with Jarrett is someone like D'Lo Brown... Their SummerSlam 99 match was quite good and their match i TNA i enjoyed. I can't think of much better stuff that D'Lo has done.

 

So, some matches now.... these are just off the top of my head and i thoroughly enjoyed them all and would rate them around *** or more...

 

Jarrett Vs Eric Embry - SuperClash III - Only about 5 minutes but had a shit load of reversal and was quite an enjoyable affair.

 

Jarrett & Lawler Vs the Moondogs - (Concession Stand Brawl) Quite a great brawl IMO... Jarrett's shoulder is all bleeding by the end of it... Lawler sticking one of the moondogs head in the sink and trying to turn the tap on (can't remember if he did) was great.

 

The numerous other Jarrrett & Lawler Vs Moondog brawls were some good shit. from about 92. Jan - March ish USWA.

 

Jarrett Vs Scotty the Body - 10 years before it was the most anticipated match in TNA. It was only about an 8 minute match but i quite enjoyed it.

 

(i don't put more from USWA in because i haven't seen too much more, although the DVDVR top 20 Indy matches of the 90's puts Jarrett Vs Brian Christopher at number 16. and an article on Kayfabe Memories gives a Jarrett Vs Jesse James Armstrong (Road Dogg) match four stars, the one where it is for ownership of USWA vs Jarrett's hair... i think... SMW may be on the line as well...)

 

I haven't seen a lot of mid 90's WWF so thats why there may not be more.

 

Jarrett Vs HBK - IYH #2

Jarrett Vs Bret - RAW 16/1/95

Some Jarrett Vs Razor matches were quite good.

A friend (who is not a Jarrett mark like me) said a match from i think a november 95 RAW against the British Bulldog is quite a good encounter, i am yet to view it.

 

Jarrett Vs Benoit - Starrcade 96 (Meltzer rating - ***1/2)

He had a bit of a slow spot for a while feuding with Steve 'Mongo' McMichaels and Steve Blackman in 98 in the WWF as well... Plus i haven't seen much of the TV around this time...

 

Hair Vs Hair match Vs X-Pac as SummerSlam was quite the encounter IMO.

Jarrett & Owen Vs the New Age Outlaws from Backlash 99 i would around *** maybe a little less..

Vs Edge at Fully Loaded 99 was quite good..

Vs D'Lo at SummerSlam 99

 

Now his 99 WCW work which made me a fan of his... his debut was fabulous... "You wanna talk about stroke Buff, you wanna talk about being somebody's boy, let me tell you a little somethin about stroke, how is it that last night less than 24 hrs ago, i was in Cleveland Ohio wrestling on a pay per view and tonight i'm here live on monday nitro." - i know this isn't a match but i thought i would mention it because it is one of my favourite Jarrett moments.

 

Vs Benoit at Mayhem was great (Meltzer rating ***1/2)

Vs Benoit Starrcade 99 (Meltzer rating ****)

Vs Bret - November 99 Nitro

Vs Kidman - December 99 Nitro (PowerSlam's December 99 match of the month)

some of the matches on Nitro Vs Benoit were great while they lasted but kinda got cut off or ended up screwy in the Russo booking era.

Vs Page - Spring Stampede

Vs Page - Slamboree

Vs Page on a nitro or two around the time

Vs Booker T - BATB

Vs Booker T - New Blood Rising

Vs Booker T on various nitros

Some of the matches with Sting weren't too bad but mainly that feud was great, Jarrett imitations of the old Sting were excellent.

The Starrcade 2000 6 way bunkhouse brawl was a very enjoyable match IMO.

Vs Lance Storm - Nitro 18/12/99 - only got 5 minutes but it was awesome in the time they had, just nonstop action and a great finish.

Vs Page at SuperBrawl Revenge

 

now to the TNA era..

 

Vs Ron Killings (Meltzer rating - ***3/4)

Vs Styles (1st time - Meltzer rating ***1/2)

Vs Raven - (i'd say ***)

Vs Raven Vs Styles (again ***ish)

Vs Styles II (again ***ish)

haven't seen much of the recent stuff, still catching up, i am in australia.

 

 

I am sure there would be more that i have looked over from RAW's and Nitros and definately a heap from USWA.

 

anyway, that'll definately do for now...

[Michrome 0]

You're still yet to point out one great match since 1995. There haven't been any. Meltzer ratings are so irrelevent and biased that they're not even worth the time. When the guy rates Angle-Cena over Brock-Eddy, you know he's not worth listening to. This is the same guy that gave Muto-Kawada ****3/4. Debate the matches on merit rather than using someone else's ratings. If the Jarrett-Benoit ladder match is ****, I can only imagine what the Jericho-Benoit one from 2001 was.

 

When he's in the ring with AJ Styles, he drags him down. When he's in the ring with Chris Daniels, he drags him down. He knows how to work one kind of match, and he's not even very good at it.

[Guest MikeSC]

Styles was down for the entire duration of the Russo trying to prevent a guitar shot. Styles finally got to his feet, turned around, and kicked the guitar into pieces. Jarrett attempted again to hit him, but Styles ducked, crucifixed him, and won.

 

Thats fucking clean. BTW, Mediocre is the same as consistant. You can be consistantly bad, consistantly good, or consistantly great. Tell me how he you can say him being mediocre doesn't mean consistantly good (Good = mediocre I'm assuming).

If Russo isn't there, Styles loses. Simple. JJ should have put Styles over with NOBODY at ringside at all.

 

And, mediocre does not mean good, Mediocre means average.

 

JJ is a "C" worker.

Oh come off it, your bias against Jarrett is really shining through now..

Name a guy who's best match was with JJ.

 

Heck, HBK and Bret Hart worked better with friggin' Diesel than they did with Jeff.

I think by what you have said about Jarrett/HBK kinda proves that you are not a fan of his style, and i do agree somewhat by saying that his style is not what everyone likes.

 

And you kinda contradicted yourself when you said Jarrett's work has been piddling for year now but then saying

*** is piddling. It's not bad. It's just...blah.

to me a three star match is a good enjoyable affair, not 'piddling.'

 

I'm probably just kinda nit-picking there but i thought i point it out anyway.

 

Also, i think someone who has had there best work with Jarrett is someone like D'Lo Brown... Their SummerSlam 99 match was quite good and their match i TNA i enjoyed. I can't think of much better stuff that D'Lo has done.

D-Lo v HHH and D-Lo v X-Pac own his work with JJ. Ditto his work with AJ.

Jarrett Vs Eric Embry - SuperClash III - Only about 5 minutes but had a shit load of reversal and was quite an enjoyable affair.

Please tell me you're not being serious here. THAT is a good match in your eyes?

 

Your love of JJ is blinding.

Jarrett & Lawler Vs the Moondogs - (Concession Stand Brawl) Quite a great brawl IMO... Jarrett's shoulder is all bleeding by the end of it... Lawler sticking one of the moondogs head in the sink and trying to turn the tap on (can't remember if he did) was great.

Provided you find crappy, prop-filled brawls entertaining.

 

I don't like them when New Jack does them, either.

The numerous other Jarrrett & Lawler Vs Moondog brawls were some good shit. from about 92. Jan - March ish USWA.

Umm, no.

Jarrett Vs Scotty the Body - 10 years before it was the most anticipated match in TNA. It was only about an 8 minute match but i quite enjoyed it.

Never saw it --- but seeing your list up to this point, I doubt I'll be impressed.

(i don't put more from USWA in because i haven't seen too much more, although the DVDVR top 20 Indy matches of the 90's puts Jarrett Vs Brian Christopher at number 16.

I have the match on tape. It is not a good match.

and an article on Kayfabe Memories gives a Jarrett Vs Jesse James Armstrong (Road Dogg) match four stars, the one where it is for ownership of USWA vs Jarrett's hair... i think... SMW may be on the line as well...)

Wow, a random article says a match is good. It MUST be now.

I haven't seen a lot of mid 90's WWF so thats why there may not be more.

 

Jarrett Vs HBK - IYH #2

Jarrett Vs Bret - RAW 16/1/95

Some Jarrett Vs Razor matches were quite good.

Care to name one? I've seen several and none were good.

 

JJ v HBK is ***1/2 and, EASILY, the best match Jeff was involved with.

A friend (who is not a Jarrett mark like me) said a match from i think a november 95 RAW against the British Bulldog is quite a good encounter, i am yet to view it.

Then don't mention it.

Jarrett Vs Benoit - Starrcade 96 (Meltzer rating - ***1/2)

Wow. THAT was ***1/2? Does that make Benoit v Jericho at Rumble '01 *******?

He had a bit of a slow spot for a while feuding with Steve 'Mongo' McMichaels and Steve Blackman in 98 in the WWF as well... Plus i haven't seen much of the TV around this time...

 

Hair Vs Hair match Vs X-Pac as SummerSlam was quite the encounter IMO.

Hardly the best match on a not-that-good show. D-Lo v Val and Rock v HHH easily were much better --- and neither of those hit ****.

Jarrett & Owen Vs the New Age Outlaws from Backlash 99 i would around *** maybe a little less..

Which is where Jeff's work usually hits.

Vs Edge at Fully Loaded 99 was quite good..

Vs D'Lo at SummerSlam 99

His match with Edge was pretty good. ***1/2. His match w/ D-Lo at SS was worse than their TV matches --- **1/2.

Now his 99 WCW work which made me a fan of his... his debut was fabulous... "You wanna talk about stroke Buff, you wanna talk about being somebody's boy, let me tell you a little somethin about stroke, how is it that last night less than 24 hrs ago, i was in Cleveland Ohio wrestling on a pay per view and tonight i'm here live on monday nitro." - i know this isn't a match but i thought i would mention it because it is one of my favourite Jarrett moments.

Wow, he made his big debut and that is the best they could come up with? Sad.

Vs Benoit at Mayhem was great (Meltzer rating ***1/2)

Hint: ***1/2 isn't "great".

Vs Benoit Starrcade 99 (Meltzer rating ****)

BWA HA HA HA!

 

Geez, has Benoit hit below **** very often with Dave? Heck, I can think, easily, of A LOT of matches that blow that one out of the water.

Vs Bret - November 99 Nitro

Vs Kidman - December 99 Nitro (PowerSlam's December 99 match of the month)

some of the matches on Nitro Vs Benoit were great while they lasted but kinda got cut off or ended up screwy in the Russo booking era.

**1/2 and **1/2.

Vs Page - Spring Stampede

Vs Page - Slamboree

Stampede was set up for the lame Kimberly heel turn. The match itself was junk.

 

And Slamboree? The 3-tiered cage never produced a good match.

Vs Page on a nitro or two around the time

Vs Booker T - BATB

Vs Booker T - New Blood Rising

Easily mongst Booker's lesser work in his singles push.

 

Isn't it sad that Booker's match with Kanyon at BATB was better than his match with JJ?

Vs Booker T on various nitros

So, you won't even give specific matches --- just "any of them"?

Some of the matches with Sting weren't too bad but mainly that feud was great, Jarrett imitations of the old Sting were excellent.

Yes, his imitations were nifty. The matches, though, sucked hard.

The Starrcade 2000 6 way bunkhouse brawl was a very enjoyable match IMO.

Vs Lance Storm - Nitro 18/12/99 - only got 5 minutes but it was awesome in the time they had, just nonstop action and a great finish.

"Awesome in the time they had" isn't the same thing as "good".

Vs Page at SuperBrawl Revenge

Man, is the term "average" non-existant to you?

now to the TNA era..

 

Vs Ron Killings (Meltzer rating - ***3/4)

I do NOT care about Dave's ratings. His match with Killings was ***, at best. Killings v Low-Ki were MUCH better.

Vs Styles (1st time - Meltzer rating ***1/2)

I'd actually agree. Too bad AJ did much better with others.

Vs Raven - (i'd say ***)

I'd say you're wrong.

Vs Raven Vs Styles (again ***ish)

Vs Styles II (again ***ish)

I'd say you're wrong twice-ish.

haven't seen much of the recent stuff, still catching up, i am in australia.

 

 

I am sure there would be more that i have looked over from RAW's and Nitros and definately a heap from USWA.

 

anyway, that'll definately do for now...

Well, if your goal was to show average matches he's worked, you've done one wonderful job.

-=Mike

[Guest Dynamite Kido]

I'm not siding with anyone on the JJ argument, but seriously anyone that rates a match **** that has Road Dogg(Jesse James, BG James) in it, I immediately quit listening to them about match quality.

[Guest MikeSC]

I'm not siding with anyone on the JJ argument, but seriously anyone that rates a match **** that has Road Dogg(Jesse James, BG James) in it, I immediately quit listening to them about match quality.

It was a decent enough NAO match --- but it wasn't even close to ****.

-=Mike

[Guest Man Of 1,004 Modes]

Just to make one final point...

 

A bad worker: Nathan Jones. Has yet to have a match past * in my eyes. EVER.

 

Another Bad Worker: The Godfather/Kama/Papa Shango: If not for his bit of charisma, he out right sucks.

 

Even More: Jim Niedhart. Sure, teaming him up with Bret Hart covered him up, but stick him in a 1-on-1 match and he blows. Hence why we never got a Jim Niedhart: IC Champ scenario.

 

 

Jeff Jarrett is leaps and bounds better than all three of those guys, and they are the true definition of bad wrestlers (there is more, but I'm too busy watching the Yanks hopefully whoop the Red Sox' red monkey asses). Jarretts major flaw is the Memphis style, which he pretty much uses all the time.

[Guest CubbyBear]

His STATED goal was to get the strap off Jarrett.

 

And that Russo made himself the central focus of the show is disturbing.

-=Mike

 

SO what if his goal was to get the strap off of Jarrett? He never cheated to do it. He was trying to find a guy that could be Jarrett clean which explains the tournament. Russo came out and distracted Jarrett when he grabbed the guitar. After that stopped, Jarrett and Styles were face to face for atleast five seconds before he swung the guitar. AJ then rolled him up and got the CLEAN win.

[Guest Man Of 1,004 Modes]

His STATED goal was to get the strap off Jarrett.

 

And that Russo made himself the central focus of the show is disturbing.

-=Mike

 

SO what if his goal was to get the strap off of Jarrett? He never cheated to do it. He was trying to find a guy that could be Jarrett clean which explains the tournament. Russo came out and distracted Jarrett when he grabbed the guitar. After that stopped, Jarrett and Styles were face to face for atleast five seconds before he swung the guitar. AJ then rolled him up and got the CLEAN win.

Don't bother, I already tried. I think e have a new Dave O'Neill.

[Guest dvkorn]

The reason i used Meltzer ratings was because he seems to be the most, how shall i say, respected guy in wrestling news and all that crap. So, i thought it would lend credence, to my arguement. And to someone like myself, and many wrestling fans, i would assume, that they would take more note in what meltzer rates matches then say some of you guys.

 

And a kayfabe memories article, i wouldn't call some random article, as you probably know, it is a hell of a site and i would dare say, a respected site, for all that is old school.

 

For some of those matches my love of Jarrett may have made it a more enjoyable affair. But i think it is like that for everyone, when one of their favourite wrestlers is wrestling, you sit up, take notice and get into moreso. And Jarrett is one of my favourite wrestlers, but that doesn't take away from the fact that some of those matches i mentioned are damn good.

 

Booker T's match at BATB 2000 with Jarrett was the best match of the night and a real good match. One of my favourites.

 

As for the Jarrett/Embry match, hey, i liked the match. Had a heap of reversals, and i quite enjoyed it.

 

Another one, Ron Killings has probably had his best match against Jarrett.. I know you said the Low Ki one was better, but i would disagree. Glen Gilberti may be another one. His matches with Jarrett mid last year and with styles (the street fight) a number of weeks beforehand were some of Gilberti's best work ever. Gilberti is someone that is fairly average to say the least who had an enjoyable match with Jarrett.

 

I still think it all comes down to you guys not liking his style. When he brawls, i enjoy it. I like watching brawls in general. And i know from reading reviews of TNA on this site by both Corey Lazarus and Dames that they are not a fan of brawls, especially Jarrett brawls and rate some of the matches that are brawls less than i would have. And that is fine. But the Jarrett & Lawler Vs Moondogs stuff was very enjoyable to me.

 

When he works normal matches he's got like an old school memphis style and just mainly likes working the basics. But he does that very well, there is no question. Like the 1st 8 or so minutes of the first Jarrett/Styles match before all the interference. It was awesome. I loved it. It was just them doing basic stuff and building the match up to what looked like was going to be an excellent match and then the interference. Like Jarrett pulling out that slingshot crossbody to the outside out of nowhere. At that time, i had rarely seen Jarrett do that in ages and when i saw it, it certainly had me marking out. It is just a basic move (especially in todays type of wrestling) yet, he knows how to work it to have people excited about it. And the rest of the match when there wasn't any interference, it was great stuff.

 

It is pretty hard to argue now, none of us will change our opinions. I happen to believe that Jarrett is a good worker and one of the best on the TNA roster, if you guys don't, that's fine, although, it would just be nice to see some of you guys stop proclaiming your opinion as fact.

[Corey_Lazarus 0]

Actually, dv, I'm a HUGE fan of brawls. My favorite matches have been brawls (hence why my favorite wrestlers of all-time are Foley and Raven, and ECW is my favorite all-time promotion). It's just I like it when brawls are done RIGHT, with PSYCHOLOGY and SELLING. Jarrett can't sell for more than a minute, and downright refuses to take any bump on the outside...which is NECCESSARY for brawls. Jarrett also works the Southern style, which I'm not a fan of whatsoever, and I don't think he should be in the main event, regardless of the promotion.

 

FYI: I'd give Raven/Jarrett ****, Truth/Jarrett I ***1/2, Truth/Jarrett II ***, Styles/Jarrett I ***1/2, Styles/Jarrett II **3/4, and Styles/Jarrett III ***3/4 (mostly for the emotion). I'm not a fan of Jarrett at all, but I can still rate a good match.

[Guest dvkorn]

Actually, dv, I'm a HUGE fan of brawls. My favorite matches have been brawls (hence why my favorite wrestlers of all-time are Foley and Raven, and ECW is my favorite all-time promotion). It's just I like it when brawls are done RIGHT, with PSYCHOLOGY and SELLING. Jarrett can't sell for more than a minute, and downright refuses to take any bump on the outside...which is NECCESSARY for brawls. Jarrett also works the Southern style, which I'm not a fan of whatsoever, and I don't think he should be in the main event, regardless of the promotion.

 

FYI: I'd give Raven/Jarrett ****, Truth/Jarrett I ***1/2, Truth/Jarrett II ***, Styles/Jarrett I ***1/2, Styles/Jarrett II **3/4, and Styles/Jarrett III ***3/4 (mostly for the emotion). I'm not a fan of Jarrett at all, but I can still rate a good match.

Ah, I should have said Jarrett related brawls then... like i remember reading that you didn't like the crowd brawling in Jarrett/Killings I which i quite enjoyed, and also, the Jarrett/D'Lo match i believe they started out brawling backstage and in the crowd and if i remember correctly, which i am not saying i will, but i think i read a while ago that you didn't like that... and again, i quite enjoyed how that match turned out.

 

Just out of interest, do you remember the Raven/Ki Vs Corino/Sandman tag match from the same show as Jarrett/Styles I..? What'd you think of that...? It's just because it sticks out in my mind, because i saw in Dames review he rated it less than a star but to me it had a great story and was quite an enjoyable brawl. Just interested in what you thought of it if you remember..?

[Corey_Lazarus 0]

I remember the Raven/Ki vs. Corino/Sandman match, actually. I make it a havbit of watching my old TNA tapes since I started watching (have every show from July 10th, 2002 on tape) now and then, and I finished that week's show a while ago. I'd give it *1/2, but only because the brawling was done good. Corino didn't get to show his expertise (in-ring psychology), but Raven and Sandman showed theirs (brawling). LowKi...he was included out of left field, really.

[SuperJerk 0]

I guess I don't even have to ASK if the replay's worth buying this week.

[Styles 0]

ignores useless and predictable Jarrett bashing

 

Whooo!!! Just watched the tape of this week's show, and boy I'm thrilled I was able to avoid that spoiler in the last couple days!

What can I say, TNA comes through big time! Glad AJ got the belt, clean too (Russo was as much as a distraction as Naitch and Benoit were in the HHH/Benjamin match).

I do think it was a little silly to advertise Harris for the match, which turned off a lot of people from ordering the show. Maybe this will encourage some of the TNA doubters to tune in, because you never know what might happen.

AJ/Raven for the NWA title is gonna be an AWESOME feud. Jarrett can now feud with Harris/Abyss/Truth who all are built as viable contenders for the near future.

Oh and America's X-cup IV sounds insane. I love it.

I'm tired and don't feel like typing much more, but I'm very happy with the current direction and excited about the future...

[Guest MikeSC]

His STATED goal was to get the strap off Jarrett.

 

And that Russo made himself the central focus of the show is disturbing.

-=Mike

 

SO what if his goal was to get the strap off of Jarrett? He never cheated to do it. He was trying to find a guy that could be Jarrett clean which explains the tournament. Russo came out and distracted Jarrett when he grabbed the guitar. After that stopped, Jarrett and Styles were face to face for atleast five seconds before he swung the guitar. AJ then rolled him up and got the CLEAN win.

Don't bother, I already tried. I think e have a new Dave O'Neill.

Better than the special ed student you've portrayed with such remarkable aplomb, you blithering idiot.

-=Mike

...Who's been nice up to this point

[RedJed 0]

Can the f'n shit just stop here already and can't we just post on stuff here in this folder without 1) complete bias towards or against a certain wrestler or company and 2) disrespecting each other? A handful of you guys have really turned this folder into complete and utter shit since last year. If you hate someone that a part of TNA or hate TNA so bad that you can't even be fair to him/her or the company as a whole, can't you just go do your trolling somewhere else? Fucks sake......

 

Anyway, the last two weeks I've seen a solid direction here in overall feel of the show. The world title thing was also very well put together. Alot of people aren't seeming to "get it" but the idea with switching up everything leading to the cage match last week was this:

 

1) You could figure and downright assume that someone was going to be beating Jarrett in that cage match, whoever it was. So they were building it up more and more, and in the past few months, Jarrett has been getting vulnerable enough to the point where you knew this was the time and place they were going to do the switch. So the idea is that everyone wants to see it off Jarrett, right?

 

2) The idea here as well with having a good handful of top tier guys vying for the world title shot in the cage is to still keep them all in the hunt. They even continued this last week after Harris got injured, with them all asking for the shot, etc. Whoever is writing is attempting to keep everyone in the hunt here (likely for months) and I dont get why people can't see that.

 

Off of that......Harris is still going to be in the hunt by what happened. That was smart if you ask me, as it will keep him out for awhile, make for a strong return whenever that happens (seeking revenge on Raven and potentially has unfinished business with Jarrett) and in feuding with those two stong, will build him up slow and hopefully right.

 

Truth is still a contender based on the raw potential they keep harboring on, and I'm sure they are not going to let this rest.

 

Abyss seems to be the only one that I've seen take a small step back in the booking, but will be around as needed in a return to a Styles feud (which he would put him over strong I would assume).

 

Raven continuously will be in the hunt and now this is the perfect setup to Styles-Raven in a potentially big title match next month or maybe in June. My feelings is this is THE feud to focus on for the time being, as these are the two best talents that people will likely take note of if/when a TV deal comes into the fold. Raven/Jarrett right now would be off since both are legit heels...give that time and I'm sure they will return to it sooner or later when Raven does another face turn.

 

The Styles thing.......throughout this contenders deal leading to the cage and even before, he's consistently been screwed over for shots and opportunities (much like Raven was which lead to a heel turn in frustration) left and right. Last one was in the 4 way for the match against Harris. Before that was the stuff with Abyss. The idea here was that realistically, he was the one who truly deserved this the most if you look at the past 6 months, as he was screwed out of the title in the first place. Full circle.

 

3) The actual swerve on Wednesday was served to pull an unpredictabily factor into the show, something that has been missing for awhile. They knew ahead of time what they were doing, and it probably didnt hurt that Harris getting the title shot initially didnt wow most of anyone. I think a title shot for Harris in 3 or 4 months might though. So they might have lost a few viewers last week who didnt bother getting it not knowing it was going to be Styles-JJ, but when they pull a swerve like that, the idea in theory is the typical "don't miss any certain week because you never know what could happen." With that said I think they turned a potentially damaging move in giving the title to Harris OR having Jarrett keep the belt after all this buildup into something good in putting a complete surprise and having Styles regain the title - something I thought a lot of you here wanted to see in the first place, but now that it's happened just want to bitch about the logistics of it. Styles and Jarrett have already have more than a few singles matches that were hyped up weeks in advance, does it have to happen again.....what's so wrong with pulling a surprise once in awhile? If anyone is pissed that they missed it or something, just get the freaking replay before next week's show. Jeez

 

As for the the show itself, the thing with the tag belts is lame. Between all the stripping of those titles that they do and stupid booking like this, they really seem to devalue those belts alot. I'm not sure what the answer is other than probably having a really solid team hold them. The tag scene itself is a big issue here, as there isnt any good teams, just singles guys they are pairing up.

 

Desire returned, which should put some purpose of keeping Trinity around finally.

 

Shane and Daniels had a surprisingly good match. Daniels on the Team NWA is fine by me. Interesting booking in that Shane Douglas looks to be tried as a face now.

 

Opening deal was pretty good, as was the angle afterwards. Sabu and Raven will likely feud when the time is right......the fact that they are building that up longterm here will hopefully make the payoff decent enough.

 

Main event itself was about a *** match, but I dont get where people are saying that was a nondesicive finish or not clean?

 

Very interested to see what the weeks hold here going into May and June. If they can keep up the momentum on things and if this World X Cup works, we might see a clear shift in card quality down the road. I dont know whats being done differently other than maybe Russo being allowed to work more in writing, but still being controlled enough in that things still make sense and his ideas are implimented correctly.

[Corey_Lazarus 0]

Can the f'n shit just stop here already and can't we just post on stuff here in this folder without 1) complete bias towards or against a certain wrestler or company and 2) disrespecting each other? A handful of you guys have really turned this folder into complete and utter shit since last year. If you hate someone that a part of TNA or hate TNA so bad that you can't even be fair to him/her or the company as a whole, can't you just go do your trolling somewhere else? Fucks sake......

I'll have it known that I am VERY biased against Jeff Jarrett...as a booker. He's a solid wrestler, and as Mike said, usually delivers *** matches with everyone, but what REALLY hampers him (ring-wise) is the Southern style. It's all he knows how to work with, and seeing as how most of the TNA roster are either high-flyers or hardcore brawlers, with only SOME exceptions (Abyss and Brown do power wrestling, and are fairly good at it, especially Abyss), and Jarrett can do neither very good at all. If Jarrett would do the Southern technical style with somebody that can work the mat as good, if not better, than he can, such as LowKi, then I think we could get a damn good match out of it.

Booker-wise, I hate Jarrett. While I think he and Mantel do book a good show, they're both terrible writers, and Jarrett does earn the Triple J moniker more often than not by placing himself as the focus for every non-X-Cup show. If Jarrett were to go back to the chair-swinging heel he was when TNA started, which is actually my favorite incarnation of Jarrett to date, then I'd have no problem with it...as long as he kept himself out of the focus of the show for a while. I have no problem with him being a World title contender, but let other people get the time you do, JJ.

1) You could figure and downright assume that someone was going to be beating Jarrett in that cage match, whoever it was. So they were building it up more and more, and in the past few months, Jarrett has been getting vulnerable enough to the point where you knew this was the time and place they were going to do the switch. So the idea is that everyone wants to see it off Jarrett, right?

Definitely. The booking was leaning too much in favor of Jarrett losing the title for him to not to. However, the fault with this is that Jarrett should have never REGAINED the title last year from Styles, possible Hogan feud or not. He severely hurt Styles' credibility last year when he defeated him, and it was made to look like Styles lost because he didn't have Russo. I wouldn't have even minded if Jarrett won the title back, but not right then. If Styles had won the first Russo-less title defense, and then lost the next time he faced Jarrett, it would have been solid booking. Again, this all comes back to Jarrett being the head-booker for TNA, and Styles having the worst World title run I've seen since Jericho's reign as Undisputed champion.

2) The idea here as well with having a good handful of top tier guys vying for the world title shot in the cage is to still keep them all in the hunt. They even continued this last week after Harris got injured, with them all asking for the shot, etc. Whoever is writing is attempting to keep everyone in the hunt here (likely for months) and I dont get why people can't see that.

No doubt, which is actually a staple of Russo's writing/booking: have many contenders for the titles.

Off of that......Harris is still going to be in the hunt by what happened. That was smart if you ask me, as it will keep him out for awhile, make for a strong return whenever that happens (seeking revenge on Raven and potentially has unfinished business with Jarrett) and in feuding with those two stong, will build him up slow and hopefully right.

It definitely will be smart to have Harris still in the hunt, but even booking him for the cage - regardless of whether or not they were actually going to put him into it - was a bad move, as Harris is only over with the live fans. The IWC (the people that buy the shows) aren't fans of Harris in the World title hunt, as the uproar that occurred when Harris defeated Raven a week prior can show.

Truth is still a contender based on the raw potential they keep harboring on, and I'm sure they are not going to let this rest.

Truth should have ALWAYS been a contender. He's done nothing but improve since joining the TNA locker room in mid 2002, and has enough charisma to make up for his less-than-stellar-but-still-solid ring work.

Abyss seems to be the only one that I've seen take a small step back in the booking, but will be around as needed in a return to a Styles feud (which he would put him over strong I would assume).

I actually, on some plane, was hoping Abyss would be in the cage with Jarrett. It'd be interesting, storyline-wise, to see Abyss break free of Jarrett and go with Psycholocks.

Raven continuously will be in the hunt and now this is the perfect setup to Styles-Raven in a potentially big title match next month or maybe in June. My feelings is this is THE feud to focus on for the time being, as these are the two best talents that people will likely take note of if/when a TV deal comes into the fold. Raven/Jarrett right now would be off since both are legit heels...give that time and I'm sure they will return to it sooner or later when Raven does another face turn.

There's no doubt in my mind that Raven will hold the NWA World title by the end of 2004. Raven vs. Styles has the potential to be a great feud with mind games and solid matches galore, but I only hope that they actually put off the title match as long as possible. Make it so that the actual Raven/Styles match for the NWA World title is scheduled for the 2nd Anniversary show, and then watch the live fans begin paying again, and PPV buyrates climb. Raven should win, honestly, so that when they go on FSN they can have a heel champion that the faces are trying to beat. Plus, Raven's work has never been overly risque (aside from the "Beulah is pregnant" angle in ECW), and the man can make ANY match seem bigger than it is if he's allowed to book enough of it. He'd have no problem putting anybody over, and would make the match seem grander than it would normally seem.

Of course, I'm a mark for Raven, so hey.

The Styles thing.......throughout this contenders deal leading to the cage and even before, he's consistently been screwed over for shots and opportunities (much like Raven was which lead to a heel turn in frustration) left and right. Last one was in the 4 way for the match against Harris. Before that was the stuff with Abyss. The idea here was that realistically, he was the one who truly deserved this the most if you look at the past 6 months, as he was screwed out of the title in the first place. Full circle.

I agree that putting Styles into the cage made sense, and even gave us a solid match with enough drama to it to carry it. And yes, he was the one that deserved it the most storyline-wise. No real arguments here.

3) The actual swerve on Wednesday was served to pull an unpredictabily factor into the show, something that has been missing for awhile. They knew ahead of time what they were doing, and it probably didnt hurt that Harris getting the title shot initially didnt wow most of anyone. I think a title shot for Harris in 3 or 4 months might though. So they might have lost a few viewers last week who didnt bother getting it not knowing it was going to be Styles-JJ, but when they pull a swerve like that, the idea in theory is the typical "don't miss any certain week because you never know what could happen." With that said I think they turned a potentially damaging move in giving the title to Harris OR having Jarrett keep the belt after all this buildup into something good in putting a complete surprise and having Styles regain the title - something I thought a lot of you here wanted to see in the first place, but now that it's happened just want to bitch about the logistics of it. Styles and Jarrett have already have more than a few singles matches that were hyped up weeks in advance, does it have to happen again.....what's so wrong with pulling a surprise once in awhile? If anyone is pissed that they missed it or something, just get the freaking replay before next week's show. Jeez

The problem with the swerve was that they work on free TV so that people will either tune in mid-show and find out something happened, so they keep watching, not knowing what will happen next. TNA is on PPV. Nobody is going to order a PPV for $10 if they don't think the show will be worth watching. Swerves should not happen often on PPV, and if anything, I think Raven/Harris should have occurred earlier in last week's show, with Raven injuring Harris that same show and sending him to the hospital, and Russo state that he'd need a new contender for Jarrett this week. It's still shoddy booking, but better than a bait-and-switch on a PPV.

As for the the show itself, the thing with the tag belts is lame. Between all the stripping of those titles that they do and stupid booking like this, they really seem to devalue those belts alot. I'm not sure what the answer is other than probably having a really solid team hold them. The tag scene itself is a big issue here, as there isnt any good teams, just singles guys they are pairing up.

I still think Kash should have chosen Kevin Northcutt over Dallas, since Northcutt was starting to show signs of being a good worker in the ring, and the Redshirts grew into a solid tag team before they split. Of course, I have no idea what happened to Northcutt, but hey.

Putting the belts on D'Lo and Apolo in the first place was a terrible move. D'Lo is rarely in the States, and Apolo is shit. Kash at least can work his ass off, and Dallas has a decent enough moveset...but Apolo? Shit.

Desire returned, which should put some purpose of keeping Trinity around finally.

Meh. Never cared for Desire in the first place, and I'm still not caring for the Simon/Swinger feud...SINCE JOHNNY SWINGER FUCKING SUCKS.

Shane and Daniels had a surprisingly good match. Daniels on the Team NWA is fine by me. Interesting booking in that Shane Douglas looks to be tried as a face now.

Surprisingly good? Why? Michael Shane has been consistantly better since Ultimate X 2, and Christopher Daniels is great. And Douglas as a face will be bad, because it only worked in ECW due to Douglas being so over in ECW...and still being able to have a good match then.

Opening deal was pretty good, as was the angle afterwards. Sabu and Raven will likely feud when the time is right......the fact that they are building that up longterm here will hopefully make the payoff decent enough.

Agreed. Sabu has been decent enough since coming back to TNA, and Monty Brown isn't too bad either. Abyss, however, is being wasted by just being the masked monster. Give him an angle, guys. If need be, put him with Raven, and reform a Flock-like stable. I know that's always something that's brought up with Raven, a reformation of the Flock, but I really think it could work if he brought in workers that needed direction, just like in WCW and ECW.

Main event itself was about a *** match, but I dont get where people are saying that was a nondesicive finish or not clean?

I don't think the finish was decisive at all. It looked like a fluke win is all, and like I said in the Lazarush, I think Jarrett should have kicked out of the crucifix, then hit the Stroke, and AJ kicks out of that, Styles hits the Styles Clash but JJ kicks out, and then a Spiral Tap (which AJ hasn't done in FOREVER) puts it all away. The pop would have been so much bigger, and the match would have probably been a little better with the uber-hot finish.

Very interested to see what the weeks hold here going into May and June. If they can keep up the momentum on things and if this World X Cup works, we might see a clear shift in card quality down the road. I dont know whats being done differently other than maybe Russo being allowed to work more in writing, but still being controlled enough in that things still make sense and his ideas are implimented correctly.

Perhaps. But I just hope the X-Division gets used properly, and it's not all Frankie Kazarian and Sonjay Dutt.

X-Cup 4 looks pretty good, but Petey Williams, Abismo Negro, and Heavy Metal may stick out like sore thumbs. I'm heavily looking forward to Jerry Lynn being in matches on TV again, though. Ditto Chris Sabin.

[TNABaddboi 0]

Again, this all comes back to Jarrett being the head-booker for TNA, and Styles having the worst World title run I've seen since Jericho's reign as Undisputed champion.

 

This all goes back to the way Styles won the title in the first place. He never should have been booked as heel at that time. As TNA's biggest "homegrown" talent, his first time winning the gold should have been as a face. So his run was doomed from the start because the fans wanted to cheer him, so to try to stop that, they tried to stand Russo next to him at all times. He didn't really get any real heat as a heel until the end of the D'Lo feud, but that was more because D'Lo was over at the time too. Styles can work the heel style though, evidenced by the feud with Lynn and the first Jarrett match.

 

 

There's no doubt in my mind that Raven will hold the NWA World title by the end of 2004. Raven vs. Styles has the potential to be a great feud with mind games and solid matches galore, but I only hope that they actually put off the title match as long as possible. Make it so that the actual Raven/Styles match for the NWA World title is scheduled for the 2nd Anniversary show, and then watch the live fans begin paying again, and PPV buyrates climb. Raven should win, honestly, so that when they go on FSN they can have a heel champion that the faces are trying to beat.

 

I agree that this should main event the anniversary show and they should not meet in an one-on-one situations until then (maybe a tag encounter here and there to build anticipation, with Raven trying all kinds of despicable means to soften Styles up). They should announce it as the main at least a month out, like they did with Raven/Jarrett to give it an added sense of importance. BUT, I don't think Raven should win. I think Styles needs to hold the belt through the summer, so I'd have him go over here. Maybe Raven can win a rematch in say September, or if Abyss is ready, have him take the belt from Styles, but not in June.

[Guest MikeSC]

1) You could figure and downright assume that someone was going to be beating Jarrett in that cage match, whoever it was. So they were building it up more and more, and in the past few months, Jarrett has been getting vulnerable enough to the point where you knew this was the time and place they were going to do the switch. So the idea is that everyone wants to see it off Jarrett, right?

The beef isn't that Jeff lost. That was MONTHS overdue. The beef was HOW THEY WENT ABOUT IT.

Off of that......Harris is still going to be in the hunt by what happened. That was smart if you ask me, as it will keep him out for awhile, make for a strong return whenever that happens (seeking revenge on Raven and potentially has unfinished business with Jarrett) and in feuding with those two stong, will build him up slow and hopefully right.

Are they willing to turn Harris heel to have him challenge AJ? And Chris has yet to show that he truly deserves his spot.

Truth is still a contender based on the raw potential they keep harboring on, and I'm sure they are not going to let this rest.

This is the same company that BURIED him after he dropped the strap for no discernible reason.

Abyss seems to be the only one that I've seen take a small step back in the booking, but will be around as needed in a return to a Styles feud (which he would put him over strong I would assume).

Again --- having Russo stand up to Abyss was idiotic. It's Shane v Kane level idiocy --- actually worse, since Shane, at least, can bump a little.

Raven continuously will be in the hunt and now this is the perfect setup to Styles-Raven in a potentially big title match next month or maybe in June. My feelings is this is THE feud to focus on for the time being, as these are the two best talents that people will likely take note of if/when a TV deal comes into the fold. Raven/Jarrett right now would be off since both are legit heels...give that time and I'm sure they will return to it sooner or later when Raven does another face turn.

Unless Raven rediscovers his working shoes, he shouldn't be given the World Title. His work has been no better than Jarrett's.

3) The actual swerve on Wednesday was served to pull an unpredictabily factor into the show, something that has been missing for awhile. They knew ahead of time what they were doing, and it probably didnt hurt that Harris getting the title shot initially didnt wow most of anyone. I think a title shot for Harris in 3 or 4 months might though. So they might have lost a few viewers last week who didnt bother getting it not knowing it was going to be Styles-JJ, but when they pull a swerve like that, the idea in theory is the typical "don't miss any certain week because you never know what could happen." With that said I think they turned a potentially damaging move in giving the title to Harris OR having Jarrett keep the belt after all this buildup into something good in putting a complete surprise and having Styles regain the title - something I thought a lot of you here wanted to see in the first place, but now that it's happened just want to bitch about the logistics of it. Styles and Jarrett have already have more than a few singles matches that were hyped up weeks in advance, does it have to happen again.....what's so wrong with pulling a surprise once in awhile? If anyone is pissed that they missed it or something, just get the freaking replay before next week's show. Jeez

Swerves on FREE TV are fine.

 

But, if somebody is putting down $10 to see Chris Harris v JJ, why would they be happy to see AJ v JJ instead?

 

If WWE promoted Steve Austin challenging Eddy Guerrero for Judgment Day, would you not mention the obvious problem?

Shane and Daniels had a surprisingly good match. Daniels on the Team NWA is fine by me. Interesting booking in that Shane Douglas looks to be tried as a face now.

The end of the Franchise storyline could not possibly have been more ripped off from Christian/Jericho/Trish than it was.

 

And, while the match was decent --- I defy anybody to attempt to argue that the X Division has not been toned down.

Opening deal was pretty good, as was the angle afterwards. Sabu and Raven will likely feud when the time is right......the fact that they are building that up longterm here will hopefully make the payoff decent enough.

Opening match was BAD. It was nothing but punch-kick. And for a guy who looks like he'd work stiff, Monty's punches could have been thrown from ringside and not looked much worse.

Main event itself was about a *** match, but I dont get where people are saying that was a nondesicive finish or not clean?

Interference = not clean. Hardly a stretch.

 

It was clean as Eddy v Brock --- and Eddy v Brock wasn't a clean finish, either.

-=Mike