US troops open fire on Iraq wedding

[Guest slacklet]

http://news.bostonherald.com/international...articleid=28538

 

Officials say American aircraft kill more than 40 at wedding party

 

BAGHDAD, Iraq - A U.S. helicopter fired on a wedding party early Wednesday in western Iraq, killing more than 40 people, Iraqi officials said. The U.S. military said it could not confirm the report and was investigating.

 

Lt. Col Ziyad al-Jbouri, deputy police chief of the city of Ramadi, said between 42 and 45 people died in the attack, which took place about 2:45 a.m. in a remote desert area near the border with Syria and Jordan. He said those killed included 15 children and 10 women.

 

Dr. Salah al-Ani, who works at a hospital in Ramadi, put the death toll at 45.

 

Associated Press Television News obtained videotape showing a truck containing bodies of those allegedly killed.

 

About a dozen bodies, one without a head, could be clearly seen. but it appeared that bodies were piled on top of each other and a clear count was not possible.

 

The Dubai-based Al-Arabiya television reported that more than 20 people were killed and 10 injured in the attack.

 

Iraqis interviewed on the videotape said partygoers had fired into the air in a traditional wedding celebration. American troops have sometimes mistaken celebratory gunfire for hostile fire.

 

``I cannot comment on this because we have not received any reports from our units that this has happened nor that any were involved in such a tragedy,'' Lt. Col. Dan Williams, a U.S. military spokesman, wrote in an e-mail in response to a question from The Associated Press.

 

``We take all these requests seriously and we have forwarded this inquiry to the Joint Operations Center for further review and any other information that may be available,'' Williams said.

 

The video footage showed mourners with shovels digging graves. A group of men crouched and wept around one coffin.

 

Al-Ani said people at the wedding fired weapons in the air, and that American troops came to investigate and left. However, al-Ani said, helicopters attacked the area at about 3 a.m. Two houses were destroyed, he said.

 

``This was a wedding and the (U.S.) planes came and attacked the people at a house. Is this the democracy and freedom that (President) Bush has brought us?'' said a man on the videotape, Dahham Harraj. ``There was no reason.''

 

Another man shown on the tape, who refused to give his name, said the victims were at a wedding party ``and the U.S. military planes came... and started killing everyone in the house.''

 

In July 2002, Afghan officials said 48 civilians at a wedding party were killed and 117 wounded by a U.S. airstrike in Afghanistan's Uruzgan province. An investigative report released by the U.S. Central Command said the airstrike was justified because American planes had come under fire.

[Firestarter 0]

Don't. Fire. Weapons. In. A. War. Zone.

 

It's really not that complicated.

[Zorin Industries 0]

Still, its really not the best time for something like this to happen

[Firestarter 0]

Would you like to suggest a better time? I can make a note.

[Stephen Joseph 0]

Firing weapons at a wedding in a warzone

 

Shit, Marney already said it.

[Zorin Industries 0]

Would you like to suggest a better time? I can make a note.

Maybe not the day when you start courtmarshaling troops in Iraq for the prison torture

[Firestarter 0]

Because insignificance reinforces itself?

[Zorin Industries 0]

In the long term, image is all that matters.

The last thing the U.S. needs at the moment is to make itself look worse to people in Iraq.

[C Dubya 04 0]

As horrible it is anytime for innocent people to be killed, I've got to agree with Marney on this one. There is still combat everyday in Iraq, US troops cannot take the time to sort if gunfire is celebratory or not. They have to assume it is an attack, because 9 times out of 10 it is.

[Firestarter 0]

The last thing we need right now is people firing weapons for trivial reasons, and distracting our soldiers from going after terrorists. Image is important but secondary, and frankly, our image amongst Iraqis hasn't been affected very much by the prison abuse. It won't be affected by this either.

[Zorin Industries 0]

Oh, I agree with you on the whole gunfire bit, things like that happen in war, it was just the timing of the incident.

[Firestarter 0]

I know, but honestly, as callous as this sounds, the more people we scare shitless (and hopefully avoid killing) at these ridiculous "celebrations" the better. I remember the exact same thing happened once in Afghanistan a year or so ago; since then I haven't seen any similar stories. With any luck that's because the Afghans realised that firing weapons into the air to celebrate an event, any event at all, is no longer good for their health. (Not that it ever was.) Perhaps after this the Iraqis will have a similarly blinding collective revelation.

 

Hello kids, your culture is stupid. Stop it and play nicely or we'll kill you, thanks.

[Slayer 0]

I say we requote Marney's first post and close this thread down

 

That's all that needs to be said

[Ripper 0]

I mean Americans do it at New years and it would be kinda messed up if they were gunned down for doing it.

 

 

But at the same time maybe firing a gun in the air because Jimmy passed his math test or Fi Fi finally became potty trained probably isn't the best action.

 

*finishes post*

 

 

*Fires gun in the air to celebrate*

[Guest Cerebus]

Luckily we don't live in a warzone so I'll be sure to make sure anyone who can bring a loaded weapon to my wedding not only does so, but fires it off.

 

-=Cerebus

*firing weapons off at inappropriate times since 1987*

[Guest Agent of Oblivion]

We're also not an active war zone over here, with planes and helicopters with missiles flying overhead looking for people shooting guns into the air.

 

Edit: beat me to it.

[muzz 0]

Can't really say anything else. Wrong place, wrong time.

 

Still, how long does it take to verify your target.

[Guest thebigjig]

I know, but honestly, as callous as this sounds, the more people we scare shitless (and hopefully avoid killing) at these ridiculous "celebrations" the better. I remember the exact same thing happened once in Afghanistan a year or so ago; since then I haven't seen any similar stories. With any luck that's because the Afghans realised that firing weapons into the air to celebrate an event, any event at all, is no longer good for their health. (Not that it ever was.) Perhaps after this the Iraqis will have a similarly blinding collective revelation.

 

Hello kids, your culture is stupid. Stop it and play nicely or we'll kill you, thanks.

Yes kids, this person is actually working on a doctorite, though not likely in foreign policy/relations thank god...

 

anyway, I told myself I wouldn't even PARTIALLY agree with anything this psycho says, but I kind of do somewhat on the whole 'they shouldnt have been firing weapons' argument...

 

christ... I feel so dirty now

[Guest Cerebus]

I have to call up some buddies of mine to verify this, but how low does a bird have to be flying before it even notices small-arms fire?

[Firestarter 0]

Also, it isn't part of the mainstream culture over here, even if it's part of some subculture I've never heard of. I've lived in several different parts of the United States (East and West Coast, Northeast, South, and Midwest included) and I've never seen a single instance of anything like this. No one brings guns to a celebration - in fact it's against the law in most states to even carry a firearm anywhere where alcohol is being served, as well as in any place of worship.

[nl5xsk1 0]

Lt. Col Ziyad al-Jbouri, deputy police chief of the city of Ramadi, said between 42 and 45 people died in the attack, which took place about 2:45 a.m. in a remote desert area near the border with Syria and Jordan. He said those killed included 15 children and 10 women.

Is that 2:45 am local time, or 2:45 am EDT (since this was quoted from a Boston based paper)? If it's local time, why are 15 kids still out partying? Not that it makes their loss any less tragic, but put the kids to bed before shooting your guns in the air. Common sense.

[Guest Agent of Oblivion]

I shoot guns every year on New Years. People actually do that some times. I have a really funny story about it, as a matter of fact.

[Firestarter 0]

Yes kids, this person is actually working on a doctorite, though not likely in foreign policy

It's called a doctorate, you illiterate twit. And it's in psychology and military tactics.

 

If you want to randomly flame me rather than taking issue with anything I've actually said, take it to NHB. This isn't the place. Am I clear?

[Slayer 0]

*Fires gun in the air to celebrate*

Careful, someone might open fire on this thread

[Guest thebigjig]

Yes kids, this person is actually working on a doctorite, though not likely in foreign policy

It's called a doctorate, you illiterate twit. And it's in psychology and military tactics.

 

If you want to randomly flame me rather than taking issue with anything I've actually said, take it to NHB. This isn't the place. Am I clear?

have I told you that you are REALLY sexy when you get an attitude?

[Firestarter 0]

No, but I knew that already.

[Ripper 0]

Yes kids, this person is actually working on a doctorite, though not likely in foreign policy

It's called a doctorate, you illiterate twit. And it's in psychology and military tactics.

 

If you want to randomly flame me rather than taking issue with anything I've actually said, take it to NHB. This isn't the place. Am I clear?

add bitch at the end. That hammers the point home.

[Slayer 0]

If you want to randomly flame me rather than taking issue with anything I've actually said, take it to NHB. This isn't the place.

Isn't this folder already NHB-Lite?

[Highland 0]

I can't say I'm overly surprised this happened, with the celebrants firing guns in the air and all, not to mention the occasional habit soldiers have of firing on their own troops....

 

And no I'm not going to look for a source. we all know friendly fire happens.

Edited May 19, 2004 by Naibus

[Highland 0]

double post

Edited May 19, 2004 by Naibus