Cruiserweight division problems

[Guest gearhead]

I've gotta say after watching Smackdown the last few weeks I'm infuriated and disgusted by what's going on with the cruiserweight title. It's not even funny anymore but it's degrading and insulting to that belts heritage. WCW made that division famous and it attracted a whole new audience of fans. Do you know what made it work so well? It wasn't booked the way the heavyweight divisions are booked. It was booked differently. Vince relies too much on storylines but he fails to realize that this is a division that doesn't need that same kind of booking. It just needs high flying matches and good circulation of its title.

 

Circulation is the keyword. It needs to be circulated between a variety of cruiserweight wrestlers. These Chavo Guererro storylines are making the title lose image at a fast rate. Chavo has held the title for a long ass time and now he's losing it to people like Jaqueline and his old retired father! Chavo is being booked as if he's the Triple H of the cruiserweight division and this is just wrong. You have an entire roster full of talented cruiserweight wrestlers. Jamie Noble, Billy Kidman, Ultimo Dragon, Paul London, Akio, Hurricane on Raw, Shannon Moore, the list goes on and on. None of these guys are doing anything! Akio has hardly had any matches and he's lost most if not all of them. This guy is such a talented cruiserweight and if you could just watch some of his WCW matches you would be as disgusted as I am by the booking situation on Smackdown regarding the cruiserweights.

 

WCW had a fantastic Cruiserweight Division because they booked it right, hell they even had enough Cruiserweights to have a Cruiserweight Tag Team title. So why is it now that the cruiserweight division is a worthless pile of crap steaming on the show called Smackdown? How should the booking change and what are some new ideas that can be used to help it? All I know is with that amount of talent on one brand, there's no excuse for Chavo vs. Jackie or Chavo vs. Chavo classic.

[Guest Dazed]

Chavo is being booked as if he's the Triple H of the cruiserweight division and this is just wrong.

 

Hasn't he just won one out of three, losing to Jacqueline and Chavo Classic?

 

The problem with the CW division is that they pick out two guys, and have them feud over the title. Then one of them goes back to Velocity or putting over Mordecai, and someone else feuds with the champion. Lather, rinse, repeat.

[Guest Goodear]

The real problem with the cruiserweight division is that the WWE doesn't have the depth in the division to make it work correctly. They have maybe two over cruiserweights at this point in Rey and Tajiri and those two are seemingly so over that they can be used with the regular main eventers with little to no problem. The sad fact is no one is ever going to really care a great deal about Chavo, Noble or Moore and guys like Kidman and Ultimo that were over before are so deminished right now, they aren't really worth pushing either. So we're stuck with a bunch of dreck with maybe an angle or two instead of the multi-man spotfests of doom that WCW used to warm up their crowds so effectively. The people in the division just aren't good enough to pull it off in my opinion.

[Guest Loss]

The key is that heavyweight/cruiserweight rivalries are never even teased and that the matches are given enough time to develop. The cruiserweight belt shouldn't be a normal undercard belt, but rather a chance for the smaller wrestlers to shine.

 

Also, the division needs a heel with mass appeal that the audience can really sink their teeth into and watch fall to his demise. Rey has mass appeal, but he needs a foil.

 

Also, the style shouldn't be so restrictive. I can understand the need to tone down the heavyweight style and focus more on an old style of storytelling, but you're dealing with a lot of workers who physically aren't capable of more offense on top. In the cruiserweight division, you have wrestlers that have the ability to do amazing things and should be allowed to strut their stuff with little hampering their creativity. Yes, they should avoid spotfests and still incorporate mat sequences, and the highspots should have significant build, but they shouldn't be discouraged from flying.

 

I think an annual cruiserweight tournament on a show like Velocity, if promoted properly, might draw a higher-than-expected rating and allow the division to get over as being something truly different, which in itself is the reason it worked in WCW and has failed thus far in WWE. It's hard for Vince to know the right way to handle the style because he's above taking pointers from WCW and his dad didn't like smaller guys, and typically, he doesn't either.

 

Rey should be the undisputed kingpin, and beating him should be a big deal. Rey should never be used in heavyweight matches. If the style remains restrictive, and Rey continues to occasionally hang with the big dogs, it not only makes the rest of the division look weak, but there's no reason to follow them.

[Guest I Got Banned for Sucking]

The cruiserweight division is indeed in shambles at the moment. For starters, Vince has all the cruiserweights held down. The guys that can get over on raw ability, not needing a gimmick.

 

And then, to rub it in, over them, Vince gives the belt to a shitty non-cruiserweight. And then to just a non-cruiserweight. All the while Spike Dudley is the resident cruiserweight jobber.

 

Now, what would be awesome is if all the held-down cruiserweights on SmackDown! started a worked revolt, but I don't think that that would happen. Even if it happened at tapings as a shoot, edited out or not, the Internet would be all over aswell, and it might become too much for Vince to bear.

 

But I would regain some respect for, business-wise, if something like that were in store - it could go down in the annals of wrestling history as one of the greatest angles of all time.

 

But let's be real here.

[Guest Loss]

The problem with that scenario is that it puts too much focus on their size, and they need to do as little to make them look disadvantaged as possible. The whole psychology of promoting the division should be to make it so good that the audience forgets the wrestlers are smaller than the heavies. The less comparisons, stated or implied, the better.

[haVoc 0]

Makes ya wonder how the cruisers today feel when they hear Benoit, Eddie and Jericho complain about the way WCW held them down.

 

WCW may not of pushed the cruisers and mid-carders to the top, but at least they were allowed to show off their talent in the ring.

[Guest Loss]

Rey is a star and WWE has done a tremendous job of keeping him marketable, but they haven't even attempted to make anyone else marketable within the division. There should totally be a tier system in the booking, just as there is within the heavyweight ranks, and there should be at least three cruiser feuds, one of which is a tag, at any given point.

[Guest I Got Banned for Sucking]

But Loss, it can be done so that they're not talking about their size, they're just talking about not getting their shot.

 

I guess that would bring their size to attention a bit, but it would also show that they mean business and can bring it in the ring.

 

As for Rey, I love how he's not forgotten, and it's like that because he is indeed the most marketable and over cruiserweight in WWE today, but yes, that combined with other things hold the cruiserweight division down a great deal. If booked correctly, Rey could be used in the tag team and possibly heavyweight division while the others keep the cruiserweight division fresh and exciting, which could easily be done.

 

And if Rey were pushed so much so into the heavyweight division, Loss, that would give a lot of credibility to the guys fighting for the Cruiserweight Championship.

[Guest Loss]

No, it wouldn't. The cruisers would look like cowards for not trying to hang with the big dogs and instead taking the 'easy road'. If Rey can do it, why are the rest scared to do it? It's too tricky.

 

Such an angle sounds good in theory, but also unites a division that should be divided quite clearly in storyline terms, and also makes the issue a cruisers versus heavies issue, which would be doomed to fail in the end, since neither side could afford to job.

[Mystery Eskimo 0]

The "WWE style" will always turn limit cruisers to the extent that should just give up the division. Let Rey and Chavo hang with the heavyweights, Yang and Ultimo go back to Japan, London and Noble to RoH or TNA, and Kidman can...well, who cares.

[Guest I Got Banned for Sucking]

No, it wouldn't. The cruisers would look like cowards for not trying to hang with the big dogs and instead taking the 'easy road'. If Rey can do it, why are the rest scared to do it? It's too tricky.

 

Such an angle sounds good in theory, but also unites a division that should be divided quite clearly in storyline terms, and also makes the issue a cruisers versus heavies issue, which would be doomed to fail in the end, since neither side could afford to job.

Yeah, I see what you mean.

 

But if Rey stays in the tag team, and possibly still the cruiserweight division, the revolt would work.

[Guest Loss]

Now THERE'S the way to do it! Occasionally mixing a cruiser in a tag with either another cruiser or a heavyweight and giving him a strong showing is excellent, as long as it's done sparingly and the little guy isn't habitually taking the fall.

[Guest I Got Banned for Sucking]

That's right, because a strong run for Rey in the tag team division wouldn't make others look bad. And a heavyweight push while him staying in the cruiserweight division (at different times of course) and having great matches would elevate Rey for working two styles, as well as other cruiserweights for being able to "hang with him".

[King Cucaracha 0]

A worked revolt just sounds so lame.

 

'We are the Cruiserweights. Admire us. Fear us. Forget the fact that Rey got squashed by JBL three weeks ago and Chavo lost to Jacqueline.'

 

What next...worked crowd riots to get heat on Bradshaw?

[Spaceman Spiff 0]

Akio

Rey

Nunzio

Spike

Knoble

Moore

London

Kidman

Chavo

Ultimo

Helms (no place on Raw)

Funaki

Scotty

Matt Capotelli (sp?)

 

There's no reason they couldn't run a competitive cruiser division to help bolster SD, and provide a match or 2 to help fill out the SD PPV's. They know ratings have been sliding, UPN already renewed the show, so what do they have to lose? Stick the cruisers in the beginning of the show, loosen the restrictions on how they can work, and see what happens. Best case scenario sees them gain some new (younger?) fans drawn in by the athleticism, and worst case ratings stay where they are.

 

After moving Helms to SD, that would give SD 14 guys to use in the cruiser division (I'd move Tajiri back, but he just went to Raw). If they really wanted to go for it, they could tell Ultimo to bring a couple of his Toryumon (sp?) guys over to fill out the division.

 

Of course, this is all just wishful thinking. They already view SD as a "B" show, and aren't really interested in improving the show outside of introducing EXTREME~! gimmicks, but they could do a lot worse than trying out a competitive cruiser division.

[Guest Salacious Crumb]

The reason the division will never work in the WWF is because they make them wrestle like mini-HOSSES. The Cruisers got over in WCW because they were doing fast paced and crazy spots. In the WWF a cruiser match looks exactly like a heavyweight match with maybe one or two big spots.

 

If they took the leashes off the Cruisers, I think they'd see an immediate difference to Smackdown. But Vince thinks Cruisers can't get over so he'll do everything in his power to make his opinion fact.

[Guest I Got Banned for Sucking]

A worked revolt just sounds so lame.

 

'We are the Cruiserweights. Admire us. Fear us. Forget the fact that Rey got squashed by JBL three weeks ago and Chavo lost to Jacqueline.'

 

What next...worked crowd riots to get heat on Bradshaw?

"We're sick and tired of being held-down when we should be getting our shot."

 

That's the gist of it. Use your imagination.

 

You bring up a good point in the Bradshaw/Rey squash, but fans can forget that.

[Guest Loss]

Ok, -iB-, I'm afraid you've lost me now, considering that "we're being held down, notice us" is the most tired perspective in wrestling at this point this side of heel figureheads.

[Guest I Got Banned for Sucking]

Yeah, but how else would they work a revolt angle? Something like that would have to occur to reintroduce the division as serious.

[Guest Loss]

If that's the only motive for doing it, then one shouldn't be done. It's too shooty. I'm all for putting a vein of reality into storylines, as long as it is there to enhance the feud and not carry it. They could just start giving them more time, featuring all clean finishes and pushing new people and concurrent multiple feuds as early as tonight at the Smackdown taping and the division would be looking up within two months.

[haVoc 0]

The reason the division will never work in the WWF is because they make them wrestle like mini-HOSSES. The Cruisers got over in WCW because they were doing fast paced and crazy spots. In the WWF a cruiser match looks exactly like a heavyweight match with maybe one or two big spots.

 

If they took the leashes off the Cruisers, I think they'd see an immediate difference to Smackdown. But Vince thinks Cruisers can't get over so he'll do everything in his power to make his opinion fact.

You also have the big shots in the company like Triple H, Taker, Flair and Austin when he was still there saying the flippy floppy stuff doesn't draw and that's not "working" in the ring. Those guys aren't wrestlers.

 

So Vince & Co. tell the cruisers, agents and trainers to make the cruiser matches different from what it should be.

[Guest Loss]

It's not the job of the cruisers to draw anyway. That's the job of the main eventers. If the top guys don't like the cruiser style, that's great, they're not working it and WWE isn't depending on it to sell the next PPV. Sounds like a no-brainer to me.

[nl5xsk1 0]

The easiest thing to do is to give them one of the secondary, weekend shows and have it be cruiser-only. Maybe give the big feud a match on Smackdown, but otherwise keep the two separate (except on PPV, the cruisers would get a match or 2, maybe 3, on a PPV). People that want to watch the cruisers can, but people that don't want to watch them can skip that show.

[Guest Loss]

I'd rather them do that with the Divas than the cruisers to be honest.

[Guest croweater]

I'm pretty sure few people would watch a Divas only show. The King promoting it all over RAW would be as annoying as hell aswell.

[AndrewTS 0]

They have maybe two over cruiserweights at this point in Rey and Tajiri and those two are seemingly so over that they can be used with the regular main eventers with little to no problem. The sad fact is no one is ever going to really care a great deal about Chavo, Noble or Moore and guys like Kidman and Ultimo that were over before are so deminished right now, they aren't really worth pushing either. So we're stuck with a bunch of dreck with maybe an angle or two instead of the multi-man spotfests of doom that WCW used to warm up their crowds so effectively. The people in the division just aren't good enough to pull it off in my opinion.

 

Tajiri isn't even on SD anymore--I don't blame you for forgetting that, though. Plus they should have never moved Helms to Raw. Most of the other Cruisers are too bland and only two of them ever really get focused on at one time.

 

Ultimo is the pits right now, so I don't blame WWE totally for his burial. Kidman is terrible in every way, Moore's decent as a wrestler but has no mic skills. London would be great for the division but is wasted.

 

Aside from Rey, the division has no star power, and Rey is regularly considered ABOVE the division, anyway.

[Guest Dynamite Kido]

Here is the major problem with the CW division. IT'S NOT A DIVISION!!!!!! If they would take the leashes off the cruisers and let them go out and put on matches we know they could and eventually everything would fall into place. Fans would get into it if they put on showstopping matches EVERY week. This is EXACTLY what WCW did when first bringing in the CW's and they had NO name value whatsoever to the WCW fans. They eventually won over the crowds with the stellar ring performances. Even though wrestling has changed since then(as in their moves aren't as fresh as they were when WCW started bringing them in) people still respond to strong matchups.

[KingPK 0]

I'm pretty sure few people would watch a Divas only show. The King promoting it all over RAW would be as annoying as hell aswell.

I think they actually tried a Divas show in 2002 on UPN, and it bombed.

[Scroby 0]

Here's the main differance between WCW Cruiserweight divison and the WWE's.

 

WCW: Promoted every cruiserweight they had and had more than 2 matches involving Cruisers on a single show. WCW would also talk about how each crusier weight was working his way up to the title.

 

WWE: Two or three cruiserweights are in a angle surrounding the title while the rest are just used on Velocity and when two crusierweights are just in a normal match, the title is only mentioned in the other feud.

 

I don't mind Chavo Classic being the champion only because I don't see Chavo Classic as a joke. I just see him as a vetern and he really hasn't had a horrible match and has been decent in all that we have seen him. As far as the Mordeci squash goes, I didn't mind that so much mainly because a wrestler will be squshed one time or another, its part of the job that you do. I mean honestly even if it wasn't a cruiserweight we'd still bitch about how Mordeci just walked on through him. WWE's main problem is they haven't had a great cruiserweight match since No Way Out, there's been good ones on Velocity, but no where great. I think WWE logic is Rey Mysterio is the best one they have to offer, so when he's in the title hunt thats when the belt will be popular with the office again.