Remember when killing 30,000 people was genocide?

[Guest MikeSC]

Care to explain that a little more for those of us who don't follow?

Governments that remove God from the equation place the GOVERNMENT in the role of "Supreme being" --- the entity that CANNOT be questioned, NOR protested against.

-=Mike

...There's always a Supreme being --- I'd rather it be God than some moronic thug...

[EricMM 0]

if the person deciding what God says is a moronic thug, there's no difference.

 

I would merely argue that religion as a whole is irrelevant when considering how "good" a state is.

 

Anyone who says that a religious state is clearly better is as stupid as one that a religious state is clearly worse.

[Kahran Ramsus 0]

Any state in which you don't have a choice is a bad one. Any state in which religion (or atheism) affects state policy is a bad one.

[EricMM 0]

*coughbush'sAmericacough*

[Guest MikeSC]

*coughbush'sAmericacough*

Yes, because your rights have been SO horribly violated over the past 4 years. I mean, you can't, say, post on a wrestling forum, bitching about the President any longer.

-=Mike

...When people exaggerate MINOR problems, it causes people to ignore major ones...

[EricMM 0]

Oh my God. I was responding to Ramsus' post, where he mentioned religion dictating S-T-A-T-E P-O-L-I-C-Y!

 

Not infringing on my rights.

[Guest MikeSC]

Oh my God. I was responding to Ramsus' post, where he mentioned religion dictating S-T-A-T-E P-O-L-I-C-Y!

 

Not infringing on my rights.

And American policy has been altered SO heavily under Bush. Yup, back before Bush, we were fucking PERFECT.

 

EVERYBODY liked us.

 

Now...

-=Mike

...Remember, kids --- God is bad...

[EricMM 0]

Clearly I said that we were perfect before Bush. *rolls*

 

You do raise a good point tho. I can't blame God or Christianity for bush's S.N.A.F.U. term. I can only blame one person, bush. It's bush's faith, not faith in general, that has affected his tenure.

[Guest Olympic Slam]

An example of what he's talking about would be Stalin placing himself as the supreme being to the Soviets. There's no religion, and no reason to strive for personal success, so all energy is supposed to be exerted towards the good of the State, effectively becoming a religion in itself. Communist China even had their own sort of bible, for another example.

 

The common factor is religious extremism, at one end of the spectrum or the other. Extremism to the point where people are killed over it, whether it's disobeying Allah somehow, or not loving Big Brother.

Exactly

[Guest Crazy Dan]

Well I will just say that athiest Countries rulled by Absolute power of one or two leaders are just screaming for abuse. It's just these people think they are the supreme leaders, and therefore their words are law. And of course if you disagree you are off to Siberia or a Work Camp, which Stalin did about 30 million times. He was so corrupt with power that he changed history books to make him a hero of the USSR. And sure his death camps helped Russia catch up, he obviously had no one like God or Devil to scare from the crazy decisions he made. But even if Stalin was religious, he still would have murdered 30 million of his people, only to do it the name of God.

 

I am sure that there have been many leaders who were mass murderers of their people, who used justification to kill those infidels. Heck it goes on in the Middle East many times, like Saudi Arabia. So to say that if you are athiest and a commander in chief, that you are automatically going to kill every religious person.

 

And China is a Communist Country who basically spent many centuries being the bitch of Britain and Japan. Many were abused, hooked on opium, and in the case where Japan invaded, were either killed or sent to work camps. And so once WWII ended, Japan was defeated, China was really split into to factions: Chairman Yao and the leader who fled to Taiwan (sorry my history is off). And despite being outnumbered, Chairman Yao won and changed China Communist, under the believe that all were equal... and being many were farmers, it was not a huge lost. But as one with absolute power shows, Yao lost it. Destroying all culture, his black book was what you got to read, and so forth. And he was not inspired by religion, which is an understood trend, but in China, religion practiced was Buddhist. But Yao banned everything except that book, worked many workers to death as they tried to become modernized. And as the years continued, Yao got more and more corrupt. I missed some details, but many intellectuals, teachers, any one with intelligence were sent to their death so that a Cult of Personality was created. So yeah this is another Athiest Ruler, but even if he was a Christian, China and every other leader mentioned would still have abused their power. Yet China with all of its abuses, still is clawing it's way to Super Power, and being that thier missles will hit California, I am always nervous.

 

Heck, this is a much smaller example, but look at David Koresh, who was the leader of a religious cult, who had power over everyone of his subjects. When he open fired on agents, and refused to surrender. He set fire to the dividend and murder a good quality of people. So even Religious nuts given power can still kill. One more example, look at the Spanish Inquisition. That was a bad case of Relgious leaders abusing the Bible in order to torture and kill. So he didn't rule a country, but he had enough control of people that they were willing to die for him, thinking they were going to Heaven. Bobby Jones in the 70's also was like this. His followers killed Harvey Milk and Marscone in SF. And then he moved his group to South America where he led a mass suicide. All in the name of God. Both were not leaders of a country, but they prove that Religion used to justify anything is just as evil as those who are athiest.

 

In Regards to Sudan, this is where I would not mind help and supplies being sent in to help. Obviously these Muslim Groups (once again giving every sane, normal Muslim a bad name) are out of control. And I know we can't play policemen and solve all the worlds problems "coughIraqcough", but when there are many people being slaughtered and because of religion (many of the victims are Christian, I think) then someone needs to step in and help. I am not sure what would be the best way to tackle this, but to avoid another Somalia, we need detailed maps and intelligence and also to learn from Iraq, make sure we have an exit plan. But this is just of the reasons I hate religion being used to justify anything. Which I am sure the Muslim Soldiers are sure they are killing in the name of Allah, and Allah is up their whooping it up. And for those who say this is not our problem, well Iraq was not really our problem, I will believe this till we actually see the WMD's, but we had to take him out, because as the reason changed, Iraq was killing mass people. And well many are getting killed in Sudan and they can't defend themseleves. So we don't need a huge force, but maybe one with many countries helping out.

 

Since the US is locked up in Iraq, our troops are limitited, so this is a definate reason we need more international troops to help. Also, so that with more countries involved, more money is split evenly, give or take. I am against war, but when innocents are being killed, even I believe that we need protection. If we do enter this, it must not be another Somalia, which is why we need good intelligence to fully scope the Muslim army. And our goals should be clear... what ever that may be. But these people need help and protection.

 

I am not a big war guy once again. I believe that talk is the best way to accomplish things. Diplomacy is my choice, but sometimes you are dealing with those who hate you because Allah on the last page of the Koran mentioned kill all infidels, which any non Muslim is. So in this case if forces go in, they go in to stop the Muslim Soldiers, that they are put down once and for all. But only if we are prepared. I really don't want to see another body dragged through the street, but to go into this alone, could be disasatrous. And maybe that is one thing that might hurt the US. I have feeling that if we did go into Sudan, to stop the genocide, we might be at it alone. And some countries are going to puss out, but there are allies who might have helped, but Bush managed to basically piss off every one of our Allies, and since Isreal is a Jewish country, I really doubt that they would be allowed to help in Sudan. So if this is something we do talkle head on, it could be a very lonely battle, but hey once they see us, they will be celebrating in the streets, like the Iraqis did, well at least until they suicide bomb hits. And no I am not really excited when Palau, monkeys from Morocco, and well I think many other's are leaving. So maybe we don't do anything at all. But I will find it funny if all the sudden oil is found in Sudan... can you imagine reinforcements of Chevron, Shell, and 76 deploying all their workers? But for now I hope that Sudan gets some help, becuase killing in the name of God trully goes against what the Bible/Koran teach.

[DerangedHermit 0]

Well I will just say that athiest Countries rulled by Absolute power of one or two leaders are just screaming for abuse. It's just these people think they are the supreme leaders, and therefore their words are law. And of course if you disagree you are off to Siberia or a Work Camp, which Stalin did about 30 million times. He was so corrupt with power that he changed history books to make him a hero of the USSR. And sure his death camps helped Russia catch up, he obviously had no one like God or Devil to scare from the crazy decisions he made. But even if Stalin was religious, he still would have murdered 30 million of his people, only to do it the name of God.

 

I am sure that there have been many leaders who were mass murderers of their people, who used justification to kill those infidels. Heck it goes on in the Middle East many times, like Saudi Arabia. So to say that if you are athiest and a commander in chief, that you are automatically going to kill every religious person.

 

And China is a Communist Country who basically spent many centuries being the bitch of Britain and Japan. Many were abused, hooked on opium, and in the case where Japan invaded, were either killed or sent to work camps. And so once WWII ended, Japan was defeated, China was really split into to factions: Chairman Yao and the leader who fled to Taiwan (sorry my history is off). And despite being outnumbered, Chairman Yao won and changed China Communist, under the believe that all were equal... and being many were farmers, it was not a huge lost. But as one with absolute power shows, Yao lost it. Destroying all culture, his black book was what you got to read, and so forth. And he was not inspired by religion, which is an understood trend, but in China, religion practiced was Buddhist. But Yao banned everything except that book, worked many workers to death as they tried to become modernized. And as the years continued, Yao got more and more corrupt. I missed some details, but many intellectuals, teachers, any one with intelligence were sent to their death so that a Cult of Personality was created. So yeah this is another Athiest Ruler, but even if he was a Christian, China and every other leader mentioned would still have abused their power. Yet China with all of its abuses, still is clawing it's way to Super Power, and being that thier missles will hit California, I am always nervous.

 

Heck, this is a much smaller example, but look at David Koresh, who was the leader of a religious cult, who had power over everyone of his subjects. When he open fired on agents, and refused to surrender. He set fire to the dividend and murder a good quality of people. So even Religious nuts given power can still kill. One more example, look at the Spanish Inquisition. That was a bad case of Relgious leaders abusing the Bible in order to torture and kill. So he didn't rule a country, but he had enough control of people that they were willing to die for him, thinking they were going to Heaven. Bobby Jones in the 70's also was like this. His followers killed Harvey Milk and Marscone in SF. And then he moved his group to South America where he led a mass suicide. All in the name of God. Both were not leaders of a country, but they prove that Religion used to justify anything is just as evil as those who are athiest.

 

In Regards to Sudan, this is where I would not mind help and supplies being sent in to help. Obviously these Muslim Groups (once again giving every sane, normal Muslim a bad name) are out of control. And I know we can't play policemen and solve all the worlds problems "coughIraqcough", but when there are many people being slaughtered and because of religion (many of the victims are Christian, I think) then someone needs to step in and help. I am not sure what would be the best way to tackle this, but to avoid another Somalia, we need detailed maps and intelligence and also to learn from Iraq, make sure we have an exit plan. But this is just of the reasons I hate religion being used to justify anything. Which I am sure the Muslim Soldiers are sure they are killing in the name of Allah, and Allah is up their whooping it up. And for those who say this is not our problem, well Iraq was not really our problem, I will believe this till we actually see the WMD's, but we had to take him out, because as the reason changed, Iraq was killing mass people. And well many are getting killed in Sudan and they can't defend themseleves. So we don't need a huge force, but maybe one with many countries helping out.

 

Since the US is locked up in Iraq, our troops are limitited, so this is a definate reason we need more international troops to help. Also, so that with more countries involved, more money is split evenly, give or take. I am against war, but when innocents are being killed, even I believe that we need protection. If we do enter this, it must not be another Somalia, which is why we need good intelligence to fully scope the Muslim army. And our goals should be clear... what ever that may be. But these people need help and protection.

 

I am not a big war guy once again. I believe that talk is the best way to accomplish things. Diplomacy is my choice, but sometimes you are dealing with those who hate you because Allah on the last page of the Koran mentioned kill all infidels, which any non Muslim is. So in this case if forces go in, they go in to stop the Muslim Soldiers, that they are put down once and for all. But only if we are prepared. I really don't want to see another body dragged through the street, but to go into this alone, could be disasatrous. And maybe that is one thing that might hurt the US. I have feeling that if we did go into Sudan, to stop the genocide, we might be at it alone. And some countries are going to puss out, but there are allies who might have helped, but Bush managed to basically piss off every one of our Allies, and since Isreal is a Jewish country, I really doubt that they would be allowed to help in Sudan. So if this is something we do talkle head on, it could be a very lonely battle, but hey once they see us, they will be celebrating in the streets, like the Iraqis did, well at least until they suicide bomb hits. And no I am not really excited when Palau, monkeys from Morocco, and well I think many other's are leaving. So maybe we don't do anything at all. But I will find it funny if all the sudden oil is found in Sudan... can you imagine reinforcements of Chevron, Shell, and 76 deploying all their workers? But for now I hope that Sudan gets some help, becuase killing in the name of God trully goes against what the Bible/Koran teach.

tl;dr

 

Nah, but seriously, you're too good for this board.

[Guest Agent of Oblivion]

Any state in which you don't have a choice is a bad one. Any state in which religion (or atheism) affects state policy is a bad one.

I vote based on that^

[Highland 0]

Ditto.

[kkktookmybabyaway 0]

Nah, but seriously, you're too good for this board.

Christ, don't encourage him...

 

tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr tl;dr

[Highland 0]

Someone explain tl;dr to me?

[kkktookmybabyaway 0]

Yeah, me too.

 

Since I typed it several dozen times (well, it was copy and paste, but you get the idea...)

[Jobber of the Week 0]

I hearby proclaim this "unknown initials morning" in Current Events!

 

tdsfsdlfk!sdfsdflg...ereiifiigh?

[Guest Cerebus]

Any state in which you don't have a choice is a bad one. Any state in which religion (or atheism) affects state policy is a bad one.

 

Bah. I have heard that used I don't know how many times to make sure that anyone who is Catholic and goes to church OR someone who is Catholic AND doesn't (GASP!) believe that abortion is morally acceptable never takes public office. The judiciary should have a "Catholics Need Not Apply" sign nowadays.

[DerangedHermit 0]

Someone explain tl;dr to me?

Too long; didn't read.