Should The Democrats concede?

[Vanhalen 0]

To be honest, even the most optimistic person around would have to admit that Bush seems to have Ohio sown up, even with these provincial ballets, now that Bush has claimed victory, should Kerry concede gracefully, or should they fight on to get the provincial ballets counted?

[franchise632 0]

Keep going until all the votes are counted, thats reason people get to vote. Bush would do the same thing. It's the right thing to do.

[Guest thebigjig]

Every vote should be counted. Bush did not win Ohio by a landslide and though the chances are slim, the possibility of the provincial/absentee ballots making a difference still exists. The election is just too damn close for the Democrats to concede without knowing 100% for sure.

 

And yes, the Republicans would do the exact damn thing, and if the situations were reversed, I'd still argue that all the votes be counted

[Stephen Joseph 0]

Yeah, its close, but its over. We all know it. It's more about staying the course.

[Guest thebigjig]

The Democrats ran on the "every vote must be counted" rhetoric and for them to back down now would be politically foolish

 

Could it be perhaps, a flip-flop if they were to do so?

[Guest MikeSC]

Every vote should be counted. Bush did not win Ohio by a landslide and though the chances are slim, the possibility of the provincial/absentee ballots making a difference still exists. The election is just too damn close for the Democrats to concede without knowing 100% for sure.

 

And yes, the Republicans would do the exact damn thing, and if the situations were reversed, I'd still argue that all the votes be counted

Umm, 140,000 votes is pretty damned dominant.

 

The election is over, and fuck Kerry and the MSM for not proclaiming Bush as President re-elect.

-=Mike

[Guest thebigjig]

Every vote should be counted. Bush did not win Ohio by a landslide and though the chances are slim, the possibility of the provincial/absentee ballots making a difference still exists. The election is just too damn close for the Democrats to concede without knowing 100% for sure.

 

And yes, the Republicans would do the exact damn thing, and if the situations were reversed, I'd still argue that all the votes be counted

Umm, 140,000 votes is pretty damned dominant.

 

The election is over, and fuck Kerry and the MSM for not proclaiming Bush as President re-elect.

-=Mike

140,000 is a razor thin margin and is not substantial, especially when you add in the hundreds of thousands of uncounted voted that COULD (though likely won't) play a role.

 

If the situations were reversed, you would be taking my side.

[Guest MikeSC]

Every vote should be counted. Bush did not win Ohio by a landslide and though the chances are slim, the possibility of the provincial/absentee ballots making a difference still exists. The election is just too damn close for the Democrats to concede without knowing 100% for sure.

 

And yes, the Republicans would do the exact damn thing, and if the situations were reversed, I'd still argue that all the votes be counted

Umm, 140,000 votes is pretty damned dominant.

 

The election is over, and fuck Kerry and the MSM for not proclaiming Bush as President re-elect.

-=Mike

140,000 is a razor thin margin and is not substantial, especially when you add in the hundreds of thousands of uncounted voted that COULD (though likely won't) play a role.

 

If the situations were reversed, you would be taking my side.

2 percentage points is not razor thin. It is mathematically impossible for Kerry to win.

 

Besides, I thought the Dems thought that a candidate needs the popular vote to be a real President.

 

At this point, they're just trying to make the election seem questionable when it is not even close to being so.

-=Mike

[teke184 0]

Every vote should be counted. Bush did not win Ohio by a landslide and though the chances are slim, the possibility of the provincial/absentee ballots making a difference still exists. The election is just too damn close for the Democrats to concede without knowing 100% for sure.

 

And yes, the Republicans would do the exact damn thing, and if the situations were reversed, I'd still argue that all the votes be counted

Umm, 140,000 votes is pretty damned dominant.

 

The election is over, and fuck Kerry and the MSM for not proclaiming Bush as President re-elect.

-=Mike

140,000 is a razor thin margin and is not substantial, especially when you add in the hundreds of thousands of uncounted voted that COULD (though likely won't) play a role.

 

If the situations were reversed, you would be taking my side.

There are reported to be 170,000 provisional ballots and Kerry has a deficit of 140,000.

 

 

Considering that not all provisional ballots will be legal, Kerry has to get damn near all of them in order to win. It is NOT going to happen.

[Guest MikeSC]

Every vote should be counted. Bush did not win Ohio by a landslide and though the chances are slim, the possibility of the provincial/absentee ballots making a difference still exists. The election is just too damn close for the Democrats to concede without knowing 100% for sure.

 

And yes, the Republicans would do the exact damn thing, and if the situations were reversed, I'd still argue that all the votes be counted

Umm, 140,000 votes is pretty damned dominant.

 

The election is over, and fuck Kerry and the MSM for not proclaiming Bush as President re-elect.

-=Mike

140,000 is a razor thin margin and is not substantial, especially when you add in the hundreds of thousands of uncounted voted that COULD (though likely won't) play a role.

 

If the situations were reversed, you would be taking my side.

There are reported to be 170,000 provisional ballots and Kerry has a deficit of 140,000.

 

 

Considering that not all provisional ballots will be legal, Kerry has to get damn near all of them in order to win. It is NOT going to happen.

According to CNN, the first 20,000 provisionals broke 66% ---- for Bush.

-=Mike

[Guest thebigjig]

Every vote should be counted. Bush did not win Ohio by a landslide and though the chances are slim, the possibility of the provincial/absentee ballots making a difference still exists. The election is just too damn close for the Democrats to concede without knowing 100% for sure.

 

And yes, the Republicans would do the exact damn thing, and if the situations were reversed, I'd still argue that all the votes be counted

Umm, 140,000 votes is pretty damned dominant.

 

The election is over, and fuck Kerry and the MSM for not proclaiming Bush as President re-elect.

-=Mike

140,000 is a razor thin margin and is not substantial, especially when you add in the hundreds of thousands of uncounted voted that COULD (though likely won't) play a role.

 

If the situations were reversed, you would be taking my side.

There are reported to be 170,000 provisional ballots and Kerry has a deficit of 140,000.

 

 

Considering that not all provisional ballots will be legal, Kerry has to get damn near all of them in order to win. It is NOT going to happen.

And I believed I stated that the numbers were not on Kerry's side -- something I'm not arguing. It's the symbolism and the keeping of the election promise that all votes will be counted. Also, the Florida controversy from 2000 is apparently dominating the decision to not concede since Gore's mistake was doing so before the results were in.

 

And whatever way you want to try and spin it, Ohio is fucking close and so was this election. But I have a strange feeling that that will be spun out of control over the next few weeks here in CE, turning a close win for Bush into a landslide nail in the coffin of the Democratic party... as if they fucking lost 20 seats and have no voice what so ever in anything.

[Guest Agent of Oblivion]

They absolutely should not concede. What've they got to lose by making "everyone's voice heard"?

 

Seriously though. They're votes, they count. Count 'em.

[Guest MikeSC]

And I believed I stated that the numbers were not on Kerry's side -- something I'm not arguing. It's the symbolism and the keeping of the election promise that all votes will be counted. Also, the Florida controversy from 2000 is apparently dominating the decision to not concede since Gore's mistake was doing so before the results were in.

 

And whatever way you want to try and spin it, Ohio is fucking close and so was this election. But I have a strange feeling that that will be spun out of control over the next few weeks here in CE, turning a close win for Bush into a landslide nail in the coffin of the Democratic party... as if they fucking lost 20 seats and have no voice what so ever in anything.

Bush won by about 4M votes nationally and by 140,000 in OH. We picked up Senate and House seats. Yeah, it was a pretty damned dominant Republican win. Bush won the biggest national victory since 1988. And this was in spite of a press very much opposed to him and not afraid to make it obvious.

 

You want spin? Kerry's debate win was spin. This is fact. The Republicans hammered the Dems in every possible way.

-=Mike

...Kerry is aiming to be selected, not elected...

[teke184 0]

And whatever way you want to try and spin it, Ohio is fucking close and so was this election. But I have a strange feeling that that will be spun out of control over the next few weeks here in CE, turning a close win for Bush into a landslide nail in the coffin of the Democratic party... as if they fucking lost 20 seats and have no voice what so ever in anything.

They lost 4 seats in the Senate, including their Minority Leader.

 

That doesn't make them irrelivant in the Senate but it sure cuts down on what they can do to stop Republicans from running the show.

[Guest Salacious Crumb]

The Democrats ran on the "every vote must be counted" rhetoric and for them to back down now would be politically foolish

 

Could it be perhaps, a flip-flop if they were to do so?

No, for them to fight like this is politically foolish. The Democrats have become so near sighted that few of them can see the damage they'll be doing to their party when they act like this.

[Guest thebigjig]

Do you guys have problems reading into what I'm saying? I'm acknowledging your win, but I'm pointing out that the party isn't "dead" which is the gross exaggeration that should be jumped on.

 

Bush won. We know. The Republicans won. We know. I'm simply pointing out that it isn't nearly as bad of a loss as it's being made out to be here. When I see stuff "the democrats are dead! finished!" I think of Reagan/Mondale and a Democratic loss of half of what they occupy in both houses.

[Guest MikeSC]

Do you guys have problems reading into what I'm saying? I'm acknowledging your win, but I'm pointing out that the party isn't "dead" which is the gross exaggeration that should be jumped on.

 

Bush won. We know. The Republicans won. We know. I'm simply pointing out that it isn't nearly as bad of a loss as it's being made out to be here. When I see stuff "the democrats are dead! finished!" I think of Reagan/Mondale and a Democratic loss of half of what they occupy in both houses.

This was a BUTT kicking. Remember how "dominant" Clinton's wins in 1992 and 1996 were?

 

This is a MUCH bigger win.

 

A majority. The Dems have nothing to attack Bush with, but they're trying to continue this "He's illegitimate" bullshit.

-=Mike

[The Czech Republic 0]

Oh Mother, I can feel the soil falling over my head

And as I climb into an empty bed, oh well. Enough said.

I know it's over. Still I cling,

I don't know where else I can go

[Guest thebigjig]

Do you guys have problems reading into what I'm saying? I'm acknowledging your win, but I'm pointing out that the party isn't "dead" which is the gross exaggeration that should be jumped on.

 

Bush won. We know. The Republicans won. We know. I'm simply pointing out that it isn't nearly as bad of a loss as it's being made out to be here. When I see stuff "the democrats are dead! finished!" I think of Reagan/Mondale and a Democratic loss of half of what they occupy in both houses.

This was a BUTT kicking. Remember how "dominant" Clinton's wins in 1992 and 1996 were?

 

This is a MUCH bigger win.

 

A majority. The Dems have nothing to attack Bush with, but they're trying to continue this "He's illegitimate" bullshit.

-=Mike

Electorally? No it wasn't and I haven't heard a single person compare it. It's funny when you hear guys like Sean Hannity call the race extremely close but YOU of all people think Bush beat Kerry by a landslide

 

And I haven't heard a single Democrat call Bush illigitimate as far as this win is concerned

[Kinetic 0]

With all this talk, you'd think Bush won by a landslide or something. There's still a hugely divided electorate out there, and, with the grim notion of four years of know-nothing George W. Bush policies kicked into overdrive without another election to be mindful of, there are plenty of reasons to expect that the Democrats can make up ground.

 

And it's "provisional" ballots, people. I don't know what province these things would represent.

[teke184 0]

And I haven't heard a single Democrat call Bush illigitimate as far as this win is concerned

Partly, that's because I've been cleaning up the folder as some of the Dems around her completely lost it like St. Gabriel of Djibouti.

[Guest Loss]

Absolutely, they should concede. I'm very unhappy with the results, but let's get this election over with.

[Guest MikeSC]

This was a BUTT kicking. Remember how "dominant" Clinton's wins in 1992 and 1996 were?

 

This is a MUCH bigger win.

 

A majority. The Dems have nothing to attack Bush with, but they're trying to continue this "He's illegitimate" bullshit.

-=Mike

Electorally? No it wasn't and I haven't heard a single person compare it. It's funny when you hear guys like Sean Hannity call the race extremely close but YOU of all people think Bush beat Kerry by a landslide

 

And I haven't heard a single Democrat call Bush illigitimate as far as this win is concerned

Electorally is irrelevant. Bush won the EV and that's all he cares about.

 

Popular vote, he won by about 3.5M votes. A high voter turnout election and Bush STILL won handidly (as I said, people were ignoring the GOP GOTV efforts).

 

I don't care what Hannity said. Bush beat the living snot out of Kerry and Kerry is simply being a child.

-=Mike

[Kahran Ramsus 0]

They don't need to concede, yet, but it should happen today. If the provisional ballots show nothing, then Kerry needs to give up for the good of his party. He cannot afford to challenge the decision once all the votes have been counted.

[teke184 0]

Kerry just called Bush to concede according to the AP.

[Guest MikeSC]

YES!

 

AP reports that Kerry concedes!

-=Mike

[Guest whitemilesdavis]

Thank God this wasn't as ugly as 2000. It looks like we have a clear winner, regardless of pending litigation. It didn't go my way, but hey, that's how it goes. The majority of Americans want Bush as their president, so that's how it shall be. Nothing for us to do now but work with what we've got and continually try to make things better.

[The Czech Republic 0]

CBS says Kerry concedes

[Guest MikeSC]

I sincerely hope Kerry's concession speech matches Gore's (which was the best speech he gave in the entire campaign, sadly enough). I also hope he doesn't return in 4 years and ramble psychotically.

 

Also, don't let him gain 80 pounds and a beard.

-=Mike

[Guest thebigjig]

And I haven't heard a single Democrat call Bush illigitimate as far as this win is concerned

Partly, that's because I've been cleaning up the folder as some of the Dems around her completely lost it like St. Gabriel of Djibouti.

That must've been pretty amusing...

 

I didn't take it nearly as hard as I thought I would. I just kind of said a few cuss words under my breath, shook my head when Florida was called for Bush and then... decided I have more important things to worry about.

 

The world will not end now that Bush gets a second term, and in all honesty, I wish him well