The decline of managers in the WWE

[JoeDirt 0]

After reading tonight's Ring of Honor results, I realized that ROH effectively used four managers on tonight's show: Julius Smokes and Prince Nana, both great heel managers, and the classic Jim Cornette and Bobby Heenan confrontation on the show.

 

Why has the use of managers declined so much? They can be such a huge part in getting characters over. They can be a lot of fun, doing things to help their clients cheat. They can give promos for guys who aren't the best talkers. With great managers in the past like Cornette, Heenan, Jimmy Hart, Gary Hart, Paul Ellering, etc...why has the use of managers declined so much?

 

I've always thought Steven Richards would be a great heel manager when his in-ring time was done. I'm sure there are others out there who would do a great job as well and help get characters over. Heyman has really helped Heidenreich, for example. Wouldn't it be fun to see somebody on the opposite side of the ring, managing and cheating against Heyman?

[Enigma 0]

Richards was basically the manager of the Right To Censor. He barely ever wrestled during the RTC-era.

[JoeDirt 0]

Richards was basically the manager of the Right To Censor. He barely ever wrestled during the RTC-era.

True, though I remember him getting the winning pinfall at Summerslam 2000.

 

I think Stevie would really excel in a manager position again. He can talk, bump, and gets into everything he does. But I think the WWE should use managers in other spots, as well.

[Youth N Asia 0]

they figure for the cost of a manager they can get another set of breasts...and that's how Vince wants it

[ChrisMWaters 0]

Well, there are a few managers that pop up every now and then.

 

Paul Bearer this past year...

 

the new Arab guy.

 

Paul Heyman

 

Rico for a while.

 

I'd personally rather see Spike Dudley as the manager for the Dudley Boyz nowadays...

[Guest Salacious Crumb]

I think it has a lot to do with Vince turning it into a T&A spot more than anything.

[Guest Fook_Theta]

See, but that is the beauty of it. The guys that want to look at some tits can with proper camera angles and the classic "close up of babyface manager getting the crowd/wrestler to fight back" camera angle. Everyone that wants to watch a wrestling match can do that instead.

 

Win-win situation, helps get both talents over a slight margin, helps build feuds.

[teke184 0]

Jim Cornette: "The reason I don't still do this today is that I'm not going to get implants and I look terrible in a bikini."

[AndrewTS 0]

See, but that is the beauty of it.  The guys that want to look at some tits can with proper camera angles and the classic "close up of babyface manager getting the crowd/wrestler to fight back" camera angle.  Everyone that wants to watch a wrestling match can do that instead.

 

Win-win situation, helps get both talents over a slight margin, helps build feuds.

Valets almost never can work the mic, and end up just having their asses put on the line in a "winner gets her as his personal whore" match.

 

WWE hasn't had a non-wrestling chick who could actually talk and work as as a decent manager.

 

Plus, a set of tits that's only a set of tits gets nobody over. Take a look at the Stacy/Test feud, and all of the guys Torrie managed save for Tajiri (who was over by himself anyway).

 

Jackie I'm not sure about, since I haven't really paid much attention during the time that she was managing Rico, but I'd guess the fans were probably paying more attention to Gayda and hoping her funbags would escape again rather than they were on the guys in the ring.

 

So, I don't think it gets guys over, and the angles that result from them are 95% of the time awful.

[razazteca 0]

Stevie was Victoria's man-whore for a short period of time. It was the perfect heel angle early on that was forgotton for whatever reason. Now Victoria is just another boring female employee that shakes her ass to bad techno music.

 

GO GO GO GO GO HEEL, please.

[Guest Phenom]

I'd like to see Chris Nowinski as a manager. He's got the skills, and he can't wrestle. Put 2 and 2 together!

[razazteca 0]

Chris Nowinski could be Eugene's personal teacher or something. I always liked the Nowinski & Regal pairing together they can make Eugene into something more than the savant comic wrestler.

[Guest The Shadow Behind You]

They have a goldmine in Nowinksi and they only use him to say they got a Harvard Grad employed and let him handle the Smackdown Your Vote part of the business.

 

He can't wrestle no more but I'm certain he can still cut a promo (which was amazingly his weakness on TEI and yet he ended up better then Maven once they got the call, Maven got the nod because of his supposed strong mic skills).

 

Steven Richards wrestling career is likely winding down.

 

The only effective Manager in WWE is Paul Heyman and to an extent, Ric Flair.

[JoeDirt 0]

There's just a HUGE part of getting guys over the WWE is missing the boat on here. Not that I'm surprised, really...but a manager starting up his own stable...that's classic stuff, and can help to get guys over who need a mouthpiece or something to get the fan's attention. Look at how Heyman has helped Heidenreich.

 

And Daivari wouldn't even have a job with the WWE as a manager if he couldn't speak a language that sounded somewhat like Arabic. Mark Magnus (Mohammad Hassan) can't do that, so that's why they need Daivari.

[Guest Coffey]

Well, if/when WWE scraps the Women's Division, they'll have a couple of "managers." Trish...whom could actually talk, and Lita, whom would have to be in a role like she used to do with the Hardy Boyz.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

Holy Crap, an angle that has Eugene going back to school would rock. They could steal everything from Billy Madison, where they get one of those shitty DIVA contestants to play Miss Vaughn, and the children who always enter the ring can be his classmates. Regal can be Carl. Nowinski could be Eric. It'd be a surefire hit.

[Slickster 0]

*pictures Regal selling Eugene pissing himself*

 

Of course, that movie already refers to wrestling ("He was supposed to signal to me when he couldn't breathe!"), so you could tie that in too.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

Managers were associated with the 80's, so in the Attitude era when Vince was trying to disassociate himself with everything from the 80's to show how wrestling had changeed, that included getting rid of Managers.

 

Plus there aren't really any good ones out there. People like Cornette and Heenan evolved into managers, and other wrestlers became managers after their careers ended. Those were very-much "old school", territorial things. Todays system doesn't offer that. Wrestlers who gained fame in the 80's, where the fame was much larger than before, don't seem right as managers today (Honky Tonk Man, Hillbilly Jim, Roddy Piper), either because they're being portrayed as bigger than the wrestler they are managing or because they're trying to steal the spotlight out from under them. And there really aren't guys who work in the WWE that can transition into something like a manager - it's all very fixed and structured. The mentality and expectations are also different.

 

Heenan: "Well first off you have to get the character over and to do that you have to have a Mene Gene Okerlund. I think it's really hard to come out and do a 6 minute rap on someone and think you can get anybody over. I think you have to know this man and you can not just start off being a heel or tripping people. I never hit anybody unless it was a finish to the match, otherwise it did not mean nothing. You see, a manager was usually a young kid starting in the business or an old guy on his way out.. no one really wanted to make a career as a manager, but I did cause I knew I could make money off of it and I knew I could work, I knew I could get myself into positions with major promotions and have to get me to the Main Events."

[Guest LooneyTune]

Jim Cornette: "The reason I don't still do this today is that I'm not going to get implants and I look terrible in a bikini."

That has got to be the quote of the century.

 

Managers were need more back in the day for when wrestlers couldn't cut promos, or had gimmicks where they weren't allowed to talk or something. If the manager couldn't get you over, then you were a lost cause.

 

For a mjaority of the last decade, wrestlers must get over with their own skills, in and out of the ring, to get over, and sticking anyone with them will likely not help.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

I think a lot of that has to do with lower standards. What we consider today to be a "good promo" isn't that good at all. Ortons promos, by and large, suck. They sound like promos. They have a very unnatural rhythm, and are very formulaic. But they are enough to get by, because we don't expect a whole lot out of them other than some cheap pops. The Rock can be blamed for this as he popularized this style of "hit your marks, get your pops" promos. Rock can get away with it because he's a charismatic motherfucker that has very few peers on this planet, let alone in the WWE. I am glad to see Benoit move away from this style in recent weeks (well, whenever he gets his promo time), as he doesn't say anything to get pops, he says it to get his point across and show his character. Which is what Cornette and Heenan did.

 

Cornette and Heenan, they didn't sound rehearsed (Cornettes would have if he didn't prove time-and-time again to be a wonderful speaker). They didn't "wait" for the crowd to react and didn't use nearly as much cheap heat as they do today. And this ultimately goes back to Vince McMahon being a mark for the pop. Which is a (THE) fundamental problem the WWE has right now. There is too much focus on getting a reaction and not enough on getting an investment. The objective for wrestlers today isn't to get the fans to care, it's to get them to pop. So when there is a promo, fans aren't _listening_, they are waiting to _react_. They are waiting for the "right here in NEW YORK CITAY!"; they are waiting for their cue to pop or boo. And that is a HUGE stumbling block, because then that causes some confusion - when there is a promo that tries to do both (pop a crowd and get them interested), it tends to fall flat.

 

I think this also may be caused by the writers, who typically come from a sitcom writing background and whom write promos with these "marks" in mind. That's how sitcoms are, you have to make/hit your beats. They structure the promos to ellicit laughs, or cheers, or heat, rather than furthering an angle or developing character. Which isn't what wrestling is about. Wrestling is about making money, and it isn't the "Do you like... PIE?" that gets people to pay to see a match, it's the promos that make you say "Oh SHIT, there is something big about to happen!"

[Guest The Shadow Behind You]

I can't remember the last money promo WWE did. The last that comes to mind is Jericho's Not a Joke promo.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

Foley's promos against Orton got me interested. But the most notable promo had to be Heymans Survivor Series anti-vince promo.

[Guest Coffey]

EDIT: ^ True that.

 

That's because that is most likely the last serious promo that they actually had.

 

I liked the promo that Foley cut saying that if you didn't have a title something was wrong with you as well.

[Guest Phenom]

Do you like... PIE?

Oh shi, I likes pie! WOOOOOOO!

[Guest The Shadow Behind You]

Heyman is true. I forgot about that since it wasn't a wrestler hitting it. It disapoints me they waited til the angle DIED to do this promo when if they did it early, the fans would have been more into it.

[JoeDirt 0]

Foley's promos against Orton got me interested. But the most notable promo had to be Heymans Survivor Series anti-vince promo.

And Foley's promo on Orton where he was bleeding and got spit on was not a "typical" promo. The crowd was pretty much dead silent for it, but it told a great story and was part of a very good feud with Orton. I agree with what Rudo said above...it's all about the pop, which gives us promos that feel like promos. It's like if you watched a movie and the whole time watching you were annoyed because the actors sounded like they were ACTING, and not like it was REAL. Same deal here.

[Papacita 0]

I can't remember the last money promo WWE did. The last that comes to mind is Jericho's Not a Joke promo.

I liked Eddie's pre-No Way Out stuff from earlier this year.

[JoeDirt 0]

I can't remember the last money promo WWE did. The last that comes to mind is Jericho's Not a Joke promo.

I liked Eddie's pre-No Way Out stuff from earlier this year.

The best promos are ones with real emotion involved in them. It's not so much "acting" then.

[Guest LooneyTune]

Flair's bleeding virgins promo was pretty funny...in a bad way of course. It had nothing to do with anything just about, and was him rambling on and on...

 

The last promo I've actually enjoyed was the Regal/HHH confrontation where they teased us for a match, but HHH just beat the piss out of Regal with his hammer instead.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

Yeah, Regals "I know I'm a bad person, but what I see in that kid out there is something good" promo was unreal. Fuck them for not capitalizing on it.

 

I wonder if the WWE movies will be the same as their promos..

 

Cena: "I'm gonna kill em all"

 

(looks into the camera and waits for 10 seconds)