MLB Winter Meetings

[mike546 0]

I swear, why can't a pitcher have his first good year without somebody telling him it was a career year?

 

I mean, pitchers do get better. Look at Pavano's 03 playoffs.

Because you are essentially guessing as to whether he has achieved a new level of performance. And when you are considering giving a pitcher $40 Million, you want more information to evaluate than simply a single year.

 

Take a look at Pavano's stats. In 2003 and 2004, he walked and struck out almost exactly the same number of batters. The difference was that Pavano's opposing batting average fell from .265 to .253. Now, I have taken statistics courses. Do you know how ridiculously easy it is for a batting average to take a 12 point variance? Each year, a handful of batters hit .300 due to pure luck.

 

You have no noticeable change in peripherals. That troubles me. There is every likelihood that Pavano becomes a league average pitcher next season. Are you willing to gamble $10 Million a season to hope 2004 is the true level, regardless of the rest of his career?

I see your point, but did the Yankees have any other choice?

 

And do you see Pavanos 03 playoff work as a reason to see he'll be able to stay at this level, or simply a coincidence?

[EVIL~! alkeiper 0]

I swear, why can't a pitcher have his first good year without somebody telling him it was a career year?

 

I mean, pitchers do get better. Look at Pavano's 03 playoffs.

Because you are essentially guessing as to whether he has achieved a new level of performance. And when you are considering giving a pitcher $40 Million, you want more information to evaluate than simply a single year.

 

Take a look at Pavano's stats. In 2003 and 2004, he walked and struck out almost exactly the same number of batters. The difference was that Pavano's opposing batting average fell from .265 to .253. Now, I have taken statistics courses. Do you know how ridiculously easy it is for a batting average to take a 12 point variance? Each year, a handful of batters hit .300 due to pure luck.

 

You have no noticeable change in peripherals. That troubles me. There is every likelihood that Pavano becomes a league average pitcher next season. Are you willing to gamble $10 Million a season to hope 2004 is the true level, regardless of the rest of his career?

I see your point, but did the Yankees have any other choice?

 

And do you see Pavanos 03 playoff work as a reason to see he'll be able to stay at this level, or simply a coincidence?

Given the free agency market, it is hard to say. Usually, it is harmful to overpay for players, regardless of the market. I would say that the Yankees had several options, but not being in Cashman's position, it is difficult to assess their opportunites at what else existed on the market. It may turn out to be a great deal. It just requires understanding that a fair amount of risk is involved.

 

To answer the second question, I think we need to take postseason statistics with a grain of salt. In Pavano's case, he pitched six of eight games in relief. So it is hard to reconcile those results with his success as a starting pitcher. I could see adding them to his career and/or 2003 numbers, but anything else is pure speculation.

[Kahran Ramsus 0]

I'm curious Al. Who would you rather have gone after? Pavano or Clement?

[EVIL~! alkeiper 0]

I'm curious Al. Who would you rather have gone after? Pavano or Clement?

Matt Clement. A pitcher with a higher K rate (assuming a good BB rate) will almost always have a better chance at future success.

[Precious Roy 0]

And surprisingly I don't think I ever saw Clement's name linked to the NYY

[Guest I *Heart* Jeff Weaver]

And speak of the devil. apparently NY radio stations are reporting that the Yankees are looking at Clement

[Kahran Ramsus 0]

I'm curious Al.  Who would you rather have gone after?  Pavano or Clement?

Matt Clement. A pitcher with a higher K rate (assuming a good BB rate) will almost always have a better chance at future success.

That's what I thought, which I find odd since Clement has teams like Cleveland & Toronto as the frontrunners while New York & Boston were chasing Pavano.

[Guest I *Heart* Jeff Weaver]

I'm curious Al.  Who would you rather have gone after?  Pavano or Clement?

Matt Clement. A pitcher with a higher K rate (assuming a good BB rate) will almost always have a better chance at future success.

That's what I thought, which I find odd since Clement has teams like Cleveland & Toronto as the frontrunners while New York & Boston were chasing Pavano.

Clement has kind of flown under the radar for his whole career. Nothing all that new. I believe that alot of teams may have been put off by his neck or whatever injury that was causing him to leave games late last year

[Bruiser Chong 0]

I wonder what Clement's goatee will be asking for from the Yankees.

[Guest OSIcon]

According to the Baltimore Sun, Delgado's initial asking price is 4 years, $64 million. Needless to say, that isn't what the Orioles were expecting (their initial offer to him was 3 years, 30 million), so they've cooled off on him and turned their attention to Sexson. They had a close door meeting with Sexson and his agent today that the article says "went well". The thinking is that even with Sexson's injury issues, he is three years younger than Delgado and hopefully won't have such an outrageous asking price. Even if they do have to over pay for Sexson, he is younger.

 

It'll be interesting to see what Seatle does now also. They had offered Delgado 4 years, 44 million. Still far off of what Delgado wants, but a lot closer than what the O's were offering. One would think that Delgado was just shooting high to start and that a compromise with Seattle might not be too far off.

 

Source:

Baltimore Sun

[Guest I *Heart* Jeff Weaver]

They had a close door meeting with Sexson and his agent today that the article says "went well".

Isn't "went well" baseball speak for "probably not"?

[Guest OSIcon]

Isn't "went well" baseball speak for "probably not"?

 

It sure does seem like that more often than not.....

[Brett Favre 0]

And speak of the devil. apparently NY radio stations are reporting that the Yankees are looking at Clement

Maybe we can sign Clement before Milton. Maybe.

[Guest Failed Mascot]

My digestive track didn't want me asleep for very long. Let this be a lesson to all those who eat Mexican food and then think they can go to sleep without making a bowel movement first...anyways...

 

Renteria isn't 100% yet. Regardless of what Theo is saying publicly there are numerous sources and sites saying that if Edgar passes his physical then the deal is done. 4 years and $38mill as previously stated. If negotiations hit a snag though then the Red Sox have a deal in place that would send Doug Mienk(insert tons more letters here) to the Mets for Kaz Matsui. I'm assuming the Mets would be sending cash over too. Red Sox feel that alot of Kaz's problems defensively were because of who was on first for the Mets and where Piazza was sometimes shifting him before pitches.

 

Jarid Wright did pass his second physical as previously posted here(I believe) by somebody. Nothing will change as he still gets 3 years and $21mill.

 

After signing Carl Pavano the Yankees apparently want to see what life would be like with half of the Marlins rotation from last season. They're talking to Florida about sending Vasquez and cash over for A.J. Burnett. Yankees are also still expected to sign Milton and could possibly send Kevin Brown into the middle relief role if they don't find a suitor for him.

 

Speaking of the Fish, they want Odalis Perez to take the final spot in their rotation. If that happens I expect Phillies fans to cry since they have a predominantly left handed line-up. Something tells me Thome, Abreu, Lofton, Utley and others wouldn't enjoy facing Dontrelle, Al Leiter, and Odalis Perez on a consistent basis.

 

Also it appears as though there's a method to Theo's madness when it came to choosing Wells and then aborting the Pavano sweepstakes. Theo wants the financial wiggle room to aquire Ben Sheets if he becomes available sometime in the middle of next season. I think Sheets isn't a FA until after the 06 season but he is arbitration eligible now and if he has another remarkable season then the Brewers simply wouldn't be able to afford to keep him. With Jose Capellan, Cris Capuano, and Jorge De La Rosa in the mix to take 3 out of the 5 rotation slots in the future, Milwaukee could very well look to move Ben Sheets for a future SS and 3B. If the Brewers do this right they could be in contention come 07.

[mike546 0]

Vazquez for Burnett?

 

God no.

[Guest Failed Mascot]

oh, and Moises Alou is close to signing a 2 year deal with the Mets.

[Guest Posada20]

Vazquez for Burnett?

 

God no.

For some reason the Dbacks will take Burnett over Vazquez for Randy Johnson.

[Bruiser Chong 0]

oh, and Moises Alou is close to signing a 2 year deal with the Mets.

Hehe. Those jackasses. We'll see how well a 40-year-old Moises makes the transition going from the Friendl Confines to Shea. He'll still produce, but this deal is pretty nutty. He had 39 homers, but with that, you've got to remember that he had more homers at home than anyone else in the majors last season. IIRC, he was pretty terrible on the road.

[Guest LooneyTune]

Can Alou being signed by the Mets be chalked up as another bone headed move made by them?

[Guest Failed Mascot]

For some reason the Dbacks will take Burnett over Vazquez for Randy Johnson.

Along with cash, a set-up man, and 2 prospects. Yanks don't have enough to land RJ and if he really wants out of Arizona then his options are looking like Anaheim or St. Louis. The Diamondbacks are content on keeping him, showing him they want to win, and then trying to work out a contract extension.

 

Baltimore and Texas may have a deal in place. Nothing blockbuster. Matt Riley for Kevin Mench. Mench would probably take over as their LFer.

 

Tigers think they have a real shot at J.D. Drew. They've offered him a 4 year deal worth around $40mill. He could be their I-Rod of the year; that being a player who flies under the radar due to injury concerns and the large market of corner outfielders.

 

Nobody wants Charles Johnson now since he's demanding a contract extension if he's traded. Rockies are stuck with him. Pirates and Devil Rays were interested.

 

Delgado should be tested for crack since he's seeking $16mill a year. He's said that if the money isn't right then he can retire as he has enough saved up.

 

Cubs interested in Jacque Jones.

 

Detroit and San Fran are talking to Milwaukee about a trade for Scott Posednik. Tigers are expected to non-tender Alex Sanchez.

 

Mike Matheny is most likely headed to the Dodgers or San Fran since the Cards refuse to up their offer from 2 years $4mill. San Fran is looking to move Pierzynski.

 

Eric Milton close to signing a 3 year deal with the Yankees for at least $25mill. Atlanta has also come out and said they would take Kevin Brown if the Yanks eat most of the salary. Rotation Yanks fans may be looking to if all this is true next season.

 

Mussina

Pavano

Milton

Vasquez or Burnett

Wright

 

and I think that's all I'm gonna be able to find at 2:30 in the AM. All this was taken from a shitload of newspapers, radio reports, and mole sites.

[Guest Posada20]

Well it doesn't make sense to trade Vazquez for Burnett unless they are getting him so they can deal him.

[Guest Smues]

Atlanta has also come out and said they would take Kevin Brown if the Yanks eat most of the salary.

For who?

[bob_barron 0]

Frigid- gonna need a source on that Brown thing.

 

Surely we aren't that dumb

[Guest Smues]

The only thing I can think of is for Andruw Jones as was rumored awhile ago, plus tell me I'm wrong. Andruw for Kevin Brown would be retarded. Andruw is like 12 years younger, one of the best defensive players in the game, hits 30-35 homeruns every year, and when he focuses can be a great hitter.

[mike546 0]

Vazquez for Burnett?

 

God no.

For some reason the Dbacks will take Burnett over Vazquez for Randy Johnson.

Oh.

 

Then carry on with it.

[bob_barron 0]

The only thing I can think of is for Andruw Jones as was rumored awhile ago, plus tell me I'm wrong. Andruw for Kevin Brown would be retarded. Andruw is like 12 years younger, one of the best defensive players in the game, hits 30-35 homeruns every year, and when he focuses can be a great hitter.

I could see Brown being another Mazzone project and I know they want to move Andruw but surely they can do better.

 

I want Brown to stay on the Yankees just to see his first start at the Stadium

[strummer 0]

I was pondering starting a separate thread for this as Tim Hudson has been traded to the Dodgers.

 

http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews...10398742.htm?1c

[Guest Smues]

Don't suppose you could post it so I don't have to sign up to read it?

[strummer 0]

Don't suppose you could post it so I don't have to sign up to read it?

eport: A's Hudson apparently headed to Dodgers

 

By RICK HURD and JOE RODERICK

 

Contra Costa Times (Walnut Creek, Calif.)

 

ANAHEIM, Calif. - The Tim Hudson sweepstakes apparently came to a conclusion late Saturday night at the Anaheim Marriott. The winner: The Los Angeles Dodgers.

 

Hudson's agent confirmed Saturday that Hudson will be sent to the Dodgers for right-handed pitcher Edwin Jackson and minor-league infielder Antonio Perez. The deal is expected to be announced on Sunday.

 

"I spoke with an executive from another team, and that's what I've heard," agent Paul Cohen said. "Until I hear from the principles, that's where we stand."

 

A's spokesman Jim Young told the Contra Costa Times he wasn't aware that any deal had been made. General manager Billy Beane couldn't be reached.

 

The apparent deal came after a 48-hour period in which several teams fought hard for Hudson, who was perhaps the most attractive trade commodity on the market. Hudson, 29, will earn $6.5 million next season in what will be the final season of his contract. He's expected to command at least $13 million a season if he hits the free-agent market next winter.

 

Whether that happens is still unclear, but Beane re-iterated Saturday that the A's would not make any trade contingent on the opposing club negotiating a contract extension for Hudson.

 

The deal officially will end the 4 1/2-year reign of the A's Three Aces. Hudson was 92-39 with a 3.30 in six seasons with the A's. He was 12-6 with a 3.53 ERA in 27 starts in what proved to be his closing act. His final A's season also was marred by a recurrence of a strained left oblique muscle, an injury that has plagued Hudson over the past three seasons.

 

In Jackson, the A's will receive one of the top pitching prospects in baseball. Jackson, a 21-year-old right-hander, has gone 4-2 in 12 appearances (eight starts) in the majors but is a hard thrower and was highly coveted by the Arizona Diamondbacks at last season's trade deadline. The Dodgers' unwillingness to part with Jackson was reportedly one of the reasons Los Angeles could not make a trade for Diamondbacks left-hander Randy Johnson.

 

The A's also will receive Perez, who hit .296 with 22 homers and 88 RBI at Triple-A Las Vegas last season.

 

With Perez's addition, the future of second baseman Mark Ellis falls into question. Ellis sustained a dislocated right shoulder during spring training last season and missed the season. He is eligible for arbitration, and the A's could now choose not to tender him a contract offer by the Dec. 20 deadline.

 

The Baltimore Orioles and St. Louis Cardinals had been major players for Hudson. The A's reportedly had been pushing hard for left-handed pitcher Erik Bedard, but the Orioles were reluctant to part with him. The O's reportedly also have inquired about lefty Barry Zito, but it's unlikely the A's will trade another starting pitcher.

 

The Cardinals were reportedly offering pitchers Dan Haren and Rick Ankiel.

[Guest Smues]

Thanks.

 

Bah more pitching for the Dodgers.