Conference Championship Prediction Thread

[UseTheSledgehammerUh 0]

It's snowing in Tri-State area now...

 

Expected to snow Sunday in Philly.

 

Thoughts on the weather?

 

Also, I'm seeing a common trend when people talk about teams playing Philly.

 

"Moss will not be stopped."

 

"Vick will run them over."

 

"Favre can lead the team."

 

With every good/average team Philly plays, there's always an argument that one player is going to take them apart.

 

One player will not do this. A good TEAM makes the Super Bowl.

 

Why did Pittsburgh beat Philly? Ignore Westbrook's injury and the old, disorganized defense the Eagles had then...the Steelers were the better TEAM that day.

[EVIL~! alkeiper 0]

They were the better team because they had better players. Otherwise, we could stop paying players millions and give it all to the coaches.

[UseTheSledgehammerUh 0]

I think ya missed the point.

[Guest Smell the ratings!!!]

I'm sticking with Pats-Eagles in the Super Bowl.

[The Man in Blak 0]

Just another side note - there's a lot of banter about Atlanta's chances in Philly because they're a dome team, but everybody seems to forget that Vick & Co. went up to Lambeau a couple of years ago and won against one of the best "cold weather" teams around.

 

The elements will play a part, no doubt, but - if anything - that actually favors the Falcons because, if the snow picks up during the game, both offenses will be neutered, leaving it wide open for the team that gets a good break late in the game (penalty, fumble). It's an equalizer.

[sfaJack 0]

Anyone calling for Reid's firing is a complete idiot, I mean do they REMEMBER Marion Campbell or Richie Kotite?

I gotta say, as a Cowboys fan, I'm all for the Eagles getting rid of Andy Reid and bringing back Rich Kotite.

 

Anyway, my picks for the title games:

 

New England 24

Pittsburgh 16

 

Atlanta 14

Philadelphia 20

(I BADLY want the Falcons to win this game, though)

[Damaramu 0]

Just another side note - there's a lot of banter about Atlanta's chances in Philly because they're a dome team, but everybody seems to forget that Vick & Co. went up to Lambeau a couple of years ago and won against one of the best "cold weather" teams around.

 

The elements will play a part, no doubt, but - if anything - that actually favors the Falcons because, if the snow picks up during the game, both offenses will be neutered, leaving it wide open for the team that gets a good break late in the game (penalty, fumble). It's an equalizer.

Michael Vick won at Lambeau.....yeah? Well so did Dante Culpepper and Byron Leftwich. I don't see anybody hailing them as the second coming of jesus.

[Ripper 0]

Just another side note - there's a lot of banter about Atlanta's chances in Philly because they're a dome team, but everybody seems to forget that Vick & Co. went up to Lambeau a couple of years ago and won against one of the best "cold weather" teams around.

 

The elements will play a part, no doubt, but - if anything - that actually favors the Falcons because, if the snow picks up during the game, both offenses will be neutered, leaving it wide open for the team that gets a good break late in the game (penalty, fumble).  It's an equalizer.

Michael Vick won at Lambeau.....yeah? Well so did Dante Culpepper and Byron Leftwich. I don't see anybody hailing them as the second coming of jesus.

No ones saying Dante Culpepper and Byron Leftwich are going to lose because of the weather this weekend.

 

Jesus dude, just stop it. In his second full year as a starter he is one win away from the super bowl. OF COURSE he has hype around hm as he should. Hell Ben Rothislsligbebuger is getting a HELL of alot of hype, as he should, as does Brady...*sigh* and every other quarterback that get the job done extremely well.

 

Vick does it in a highlight worthy fashion and does things that NO OTHER QB has done...ever. The hype is deserved.

[CanadianChris 0]

Just another side note - there's a lot of banter about Atlanta's chances in Philly because they're a dome team, but everybody seems to forget that Vick & Co. went up to Lambeau a couple of years ago and won against one of the best "cold weather" teams around.

 

The elements will play a part, no doubt, but - if anything - that actually favors the Falcons because, if the snow picks up during the game, both offenses will be neutered, leaving it wide open for the team that gets a good break late in the game (penalty, fumble).  It's an equalizer.

Michael Vick won at Lambeau.....yeah? Well so did Dante Culpepper and Byron Leftwich. I don't see anybody hailing them as the second coming of jesus.

[Damaramu 0]

Well the point is everyone is acting like winnning at Lambeau was the greatest accomplishment of Vick's career when it really isn't that special anymore. The mystique of Lambeau has been drug around and killed the last couple of years. Especially this year when they let a warm weather team from Florida come into below freezing weather and win.

And no I'm not going to stop because while yes he is a good QB he is billed as some Superman that is better than everyone else in the league. And that's simply not true. I'd much rather have Donovan McNabb at the helm than Michael Vick. McNabb's a better all around QB. So while yes he is good he isn't the greatest thing on the field like he's hyped to be.

[the pinjockey 0]

Going into Lambeau, at that time, and being a dome team beating the almighty Favre and the Packers was/is/always will be a big deal. Regardless of what has happened to the team since then. And it shows he is not going to fall to pieces in the cold.

 

And I agree MiB, that the snow does help the Falcons more. The Eagles are a timing offense and that will be affected more than the Falcons style. Also, one of the big strengths of the Eagles, is their secondary and defensive backs always end up falling all over the place in the snow as it is harder to react than act.

[Ripper 0]

Well the point is everyone is acting like winnning at Lambeau was the greatest accomplishment of Vick's career when it really isn't that special anymore. The mystique of Lambeau has been drug around and killed the last couple of years. Especially this year when they let a warm weather team from Florida come into below freezing weather and win.

And no I'm not going to stop because while yes he is a good QB he is billed as some Superman that is better than everyone else in the league. And that's simply not true. I'd much rather have Donovan McNabb at the helm than Michael Vick. McNabb's a better all around QB. So while yes he is good he isn't the greatest thing on the field like he's hyped to be.

He was the first one to do it, and did it essentially in his rookie year at the helm. His first ever playoff game was there with freezing temps, and he went in a won. it is something that is remembered because it was a remarkable feat.

 

Thats like saying the Indiana Pacers pushing the 73-9 bulls to a 7 game series was remarkable because the Bulls aren't as good now. You would rather have donavan McNabb...whoppity doo. It doesn't change the fact that vick is one of the best QBs in the game.

[Damaramu 0]

No he's not.

Brady, McNabb, Manning, Culpepper, and Farve are all better than he is.

Hell Trent Green is a better pure QB than Vick.

[CanadianChris 0]

No he's not.

Brady, McNabb, Manning, Culpepper, and Farve are all better than he is.

Hell Trent Green is a better pure QB than Vick.

There are 96 QBs in the league. Even if Vick is right behind all these guys (and Favre is debatable), wouldn't that still make him one of the best?

[Guest The Winter Of My Discontent]

Looks like snow for both games this weekend. Its hard to argue against the Pats in snowy conditions. I'll still hold firm that the Eagles will shut down Vick.

[Guest The Winter Of My Discontent]

No he's not.

Brady, McNabb, Manning, Culpepper, and Farve are all better than he is.

Hell Trent Green is a better pure QB than Vick.

are you saying that because he runs more than a regular QB? Its just like what they say on PTI, people perceive Vick less of a QB and more of an athlete; which is wrong. He's got a stronger arm that ANYONE gives him credit for. I'd say Vick hasn't looked amazing in his passing because he doesn't really have any weapons, outside of Crumpler. Price has amounted to little.

[Ripper 0]

No he's not.

Brady, McNabb, Manning, Culpepper, and Farve are all better than he is.

Hell Trent Green is a better pure QB than Vick.

What are trent green, bret farve, daunte Culpepper and Brett Farve doing this weekend?

 

I could give a flipping fuck about pure. John Stockton was probably a better pure point guard than Magic Johson, but who got the rings.

[Damaramu 0]

There's also the fact that he doesn't have as much accuracy as most fo the QB's I listed.

The reason I say I'd rather have McNabb more is b/c not only can he run(not as good as Vick but he can run better than most) he can throw the ball 10x better than Vick. Maybe he can't throw it a country mile but he can hit his targets right on the numbers.

[sfaJack 0]

Hell Trent Green is a better pure QB than Vick.

No he isn't. If you take Trent Green to quarterback your team over Vick, you're a fool.

[HarleyQuinn 0]

I'd put Brady, Manning, Culpepper, and McNabb ahead of Vick.

 

Favre just seems to make too many dumb mistakes as shown throughout his career(with the exception of 95-97). Favre also has similar YPA and has had 4 seasons with 20+ INT and 4 of the last 5 seasons has seen 16+ INT. Trent Green has the benefit of Priest Holmes which means that the defense has to play the run no matter what because any RB in that system can chew them up with that offensive line.

 

Vick is not a great passer, nobody's arguing that. However he is a decent passing QB(He had 54.1 % in 421 attempts in 2002 and 56.4% in 321 attempts this year). He also had only 8 INT in 2002 and 12 INT this year. He has a shotgun for an arm but with the West Coast Offense, doesn't get a chance to show it off that much. He had a 7.2 YPA this season(Steve Young had a high of 8.7 and a low of 7.2 between 1993 and 1997).

 

The thing that makes Vick rank up there among the top QB's is the fact that he can run. You can admonish his passing all you want, but the guy can flat out beat a team with his feet. That's a huge advantage considering that a defense can just focus on stopping the running game or the passing game. Instead, they also have to be aware that Vick can run at any moment and burn them for 20-40 yards.

[nl5xsk1 0]

I'd say Vick hasn't looked amazing in his passing because he doesn't really have any weapons, outside of Crumpler.  Price has amounted to little.

He doesn't have many weapons because his immediate reaction is to run ... the guy just NEVER looks to throw an out pattern to a wideout, it's either a dump pass to a back or a pass in the middle to Crumpler. And if those options aren't there, he runs. So don't blame Price; you can't catch the ball when it's not thrown your way.

 

Don't get me wrong, I think that Vick is an amazing athlete, and his team has a good chance of winning this weekend. I just think that a QB that can't or won't use all of his weapons, and instead just runs, is not a great QB.

[the pinjockey 0]

He also had only 8 INT in 2002 and 12 INT this year.

Look at his attempts and his Int% before saying he "only" had x amount of interceptions. His interception rate is around 3.7% compared to the elite which are around 1.8%.

[Guest Vitamin X]

I'd put Brady, Manning, Culpepper, and McNabb ahead of Vick.

 

Favre just seems to make too many dumb mistakes as shown throughout his career(with the exception of 95-97). Favre also has similar YPA and has had 4 seasons with 20+ INT and 4 of the last 5 seasons has seen 16+ INT. Trent Green has the benefit of Priest Holmes which means that the defense has to play the run no matter what because any RB in that system can chew them up with that offensive line.

Favre doesn't make dumb mistakes as often as so many people seem to believe, he throws risky passes too often, and there is a major, major difference. With all the INT's he throws, he also has put the ball in the endzone more times, and more consistently than any other quarterback in the last decade. YPA is a pointless stat when it comes to the passing game, since it could vary wildly depending on the offense (of which Favre has had to deal with at least 5 different systems during his tenure). He's thrown over 3000 yards and 25 TD's every year, his worst year statistically came in 1999 without his top two weapons of the time (Levens and Freeman) and with Ray Rhodes as head coach, which, as many Eagles fans can testify to, must be impossible to generate wins and stats. The Packers still went 8-8 and barely missed the playoffs.

 

I'm going to go with a slight defense of Vick the same I would Favre, and that's that you can't argue with wins. You can throw out all the stats you want, and Vick doesn't throw the ball as much as he should (and if he did, he'd be quite possibly even more dangerous and his career would last longer), but both of them are winners and leaders for their team. I'd still put Brady (the new Montana), Culpepper (the new Elway), and Manning (the new Marino) ahead of them at the moment, though.

[Ripper 0]

I'd say Vick hasn't looked amazing in his passing because he doesn't really have any weapons, outside of Crumpler.  Price has amounted to little.

He doesn't have many weapons because his immediate reaction is to run ... the guy just NEVER looks to throw an out pattern to a wideout, it's either a dump pass to a back or a pass in the middle to Crumpler. And if those options aren't there, he runs. So don't blame Price; you can't catch the ball when it's not thrown your way.

 

Don't get me wrong, I think that Vick is an amazing athlete, and his team has a good chance of winning this weekend. I just think that a QB that can't or won't use all of his weapons, and instead just runs, is not a great QB.

Except thats bs. If he just "took off and ran" he certainly wouldn't be getting sacked at the rate that he gets sacked.

 

 

Why doesn't he throw outs? Because, defenses man up against the falcons and put 7-8 in the box. An out in man coverage can also be known as "I wonder what dance the CB is going to do after he scores"

 

You don't throw outs on man coverage. Even if you have never played the game, any self respecting video game player knows that.

 

The problem with his Wideouts is that they don't get open. if their initial route is jumped, they simple stop trying. You hardly see them sit down, or come back to the ball or break off their route....except for Alge Crumplier and Brian Finnerman..and looky at who his major weapons are. When Vick gets out of the pocket, his recievers should be looking to get open. They simply don't do it.

[Guest pinnacleofallthingsmanly]

Tom Brady is considered an elite QB but has never been to a Pro Bowl. Why is he considered one of the best? Because he wins. Vick does the same thing. He WINS. He's technically only in his second season and he's a game away from the Super Bowl. He may not check off his second and third receiver all the time. He might not have a high QB rating, but he makes plays for his team and he wins.

[Ripper 0]

He also had only 8 INT in 2002 and 12 INT this year.

Look at his attempts and his Int% before saying he "only" had x amount of interceptions. His interception rate is around 3.7% compared to the elite which are around 1.8%.

So are you saying he was a elite QB in 2002 because he only had 8 picks to 421 attempts. that put him somewhere around about 1.85. the attempts went down this year because of the play calling.

[the pinjockey 0]

Yes, he was a very good/borderline elite QB that year as he did not turn it over and had the passing stats to complement the running game.

 

I see Vick as McNabb from a couple of years ago. He has the same problems with completion percentage that McNabb did, he has the same ability to take over the game with his feet that McNabb did, and he has shown he is capable of taking care of the ball (but he needs to get back to that, whether it was the new system or not there was too high of an Int%). I think he can end up much better than McNabb, because McNabb has this mindset that he does not want to be seen as a running QB, so that holds him back somewhat. Vick does not appear to have this same attitude, so once he develops the passing game he may end up far beyond McNabb.

[The Man in Blak 0]

Look, when I brought it up, I wasn't meaning to open up a whole new chapter in the litany of "Vick is GAWD! Nuh uh! Uh huh" arguments that we've had here.

 

All that I was saying is that:

 

1. Vick and the Falcons have won in the cold before, so it's useless for everybody to chirp about the Falcons as though they were playing their games in a sensory deprivation tank all year.

2. Because it's snowing in the Philly area and could continue snowing through the game, the conditions are going to be crappy, which is effectively going to drag down the offenses of both teams. This affects the Falcons less because they have less of a passing game in the first place. Westbrook is a great back, but his primary strengths are his speed and his versatility, both of which are going to be hampered by the slow track and the inclimate conditions. The same can be said of Warrick Dunn as well, but the Falcons can grind down the field with T.J. Duckett, who is a better option for Atlanta than Dorsey Levens is for Philly.

 

This is a game where the better team (the Eagles) can easily lose, just with a bad break. A bad snap in the snow leads to an Akers miss. The ball slips out of Vick's hands on a handoff. A kick returner falls in the snow and fumbles, leading to the only score the game. There's an inherent element of chaos in any football game, but the crappy weather just amplifies the possibility for anything to happen, which always favors the lesser team.

[nl5xsk1 0]

I'd say Vick hasn't looked amazing in his passing because he doesn't really have any weapons, outside of Crumpler.  Price has amounted to little.

He doesn't have many weapons because his immediate reaction is to run ... the guy just NEVER looks to throw an out pattern to a wideout, it's either a dump pass to a back or a pass in the middle to Crumpler. And if those options aren't there, he runs. So don't blame Price; you can't catch the ball when it's not thrown your way.

 

Don't get me wrong, I think that Vick is an amazing athlete, and his team has a good chance of winning this weekend. I just think that a QB that can't or won't use all of his weapons, and instead just runs, is not a great QB.

Except thats bs. If he just "took off and ran" he certainly wouldn't be getting sacked at the rate that he gets sacked.

 

 

Why doesn't he throw outs? Because, defenses man up against the falcons and put 7-8 in the box. An out in man coverage can also be known as "I wonder what dance the CB is going to do after he scores"

 

You don't throw outs on man coverage. Even if you have never played the game, any self respecting video game player knows that.

 

The problem with his Wideouts is that they don't get open. if their initial route is jumped, they simple stop trying. You hardly see them sit down, or come back to the ball or break off their route....except for Alge Crumplier and Brian Finnerman..and looky at who his major weapons are. When Vick gets out of the pocket, his recievers should be looking to get open. They simply don't do it.

Are you denying that he doesn't take off and run too quickly? It's one thing to use your speed & elusiveness to buy time for your receivers ... it's another to just tuck the ball and run.

 

And I probably shouldn't have referenced out patterns ... I meant just throwing outside to the wideouts. Which is something that most QBs throw game in and game out without throwing pickoffs. Vick does NOT throw to his WRs nearly enough, and it makes it easier on the defense. (and, as embarrassing as it is to admit, I'm not a self-respecting video game player ... the last football game that I bought was NCAA 1998).

 

I won't deny that his WRs could be doing more to get open ... but after a while of busting balls to get open only to find out that Vick's already tucked and ran, it would make sense that they'd start slacking a bit.

[2GOLD 0]

I see Michael Vick as nothing more than Randall Cunningham. He's not bad, he's not great, but he is decent enough. I'm just tired of him being heralded as the greatest. He is a decent enough quarterback but he doesn't deserve the acclaim he gets yet.

 

For now, he's Randall and that isn't exactly the most horrible thing in the world.