No Child Left Behind?

[SuperJerk 0]

State lawmakers call for changes in Bush education plan

Task force says innovation no longer allowed

 

Paul Courson

CNN Washington Bureau

 

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- Federal law has forced the nation's children to meet rigid academic performance standards that create "too many ways to fail," a bipartisan panel of state lawmakers who reviewed the No Child Left Behind Act said Wednesday.

 

A report released by the National Conference of State Legislatures includes language such as the word "challenges" to describe problems the law created for local school systems, and calls for "cooperation" between state and federal officials to resolve fundamental questions about the law.

 

"What our task force found is that innovation stopped when No Child Left Behind Act came along, because it was no longer allowed," said panel co-chairman Steve Saland, a Republican state lawmaker from New York, speaking at a news conference.

 

President Bush signed his education plan into law January 8, 2002.

 

In the time since, states have raised constitutional questions, expressed concern about paying for the law's implementation, and suffered confusion created by parts of the Bush law that contradict provisions in another federal education law, the Individuals with Disabilities Education Act.

 

Panel Member Kory Holdaway, a high school special education teacher and a Republican state lawmaker from Utah, told reporters the Bush law "requires that 90 percent of students with disabilities be proficient in their grade level by school year 2013-2014. No Child Left Behind creates benchmarks for students with disabilities that are academically impractical and economically unrealistic."

 

A co-chairman of the No Child Left Behind Task Force, Steve Kelley, a Democratic state lawmaker from Minnesota, said states agree with the goal of improved education, but the federal government is "attempting to do it by meddling in state processes."

 

"With this report we ask the administration and Congress to show true flexibility by approving state accountability plans that meet the spirit of the law, not just the letter," he said.

 

The 75-page report is the result of 10 months' work and meetings across the country with parents, school superintendents, and other state education and legislative officials.

 

Some of the recommendations now being circulated to the U.S. Education Department and congressional staff include:

 

    * Provide more leeway for states to focus on schools and students most in need.

 

    * Measure more than standardized test scores.

 

    * Allow states to set proficiency goals.

 

    * Let states determine consequences to be applied against low-performing schools.

 

    * Consider ability, not grade-based standards, for special-needs students

 

credit: http://www.cnn.com/2005/ALLPOLITICS/02/23/...left/index.html

 

 

I'll go ahead and point out that my biggest problems with the law are the ones I put in bold.

 

Before someone uses the "teachers don't like standardized tests because it makes them do their jobs" argument, let me point out that most states had standardized testing in place decades before Bush took office.

[NoCalMike 0]

Standardized tests are a load of crap anyway.

[EricMM 0]

I agree, standardized tests teach memorization over education.

[NoCalMike 0]

I agree, standardized tests teach memorization over education.

Well not only that but how can you possibly believe a state-wide standard for tests is fair when there is no standard of a level education from town to town, city-to-city. It would just outright silly to demand every school pass the same test when they are all on different level playing fields to begin with.

[kkktookmybabyaway 0]

I think there should be "minimum standards" that each town should have to be able to teach its students. Having worked at a test-scoring facility for several years, this is one of the few things I can comment on that I have some knowledge of regarding the subject matter. Are there problems with testing -- you betcha, but these testing measures, imo, are a necessary evil...

[Guest Agent of Oblivion]

The standards should be even harder, I think.

[kkktookmybabyaway 0]

That decision is up to each state, but believe me, most states (SC, NC, La.) that I worked with did not have their standards set too high, although KY and MN's tests were insane, although I don't think they were high-stakes...

[Guest Agent of Oblivion]

I work with high school graduates who don't know their multiplication tables, and can't spell "Boxes."

[kkktookmybabyaway 0]

Yeah, some cases were real sad. I graded PA 9th grade essays for a few years and you could tell which ones came from urban areas and which ones came from the suburbs. Oddly enough, I graded one essay from a kid that went to the same high school I did and was talking about a teacher I knew when I was a student...

[Special K 0]

Standardized tests aren't necessarily only about memorization, especially in math. There should be less of an emphasis on vocab and more of an emphasis on reading comp, but if you do really badly on a standardized test, you're either just fucking around or stupid. And if you're mentally handicapped, there's a very good chance you're just incapable of meeting NCLB's standards. Which is cool because then they'll take away your funding and give it to those who need it.

[The Czech Republic 0]

If you do really badly on a standardized test, you're either just fucking around or stupid.

I know a kid who was outscored by a monkey on the ACT. He showed up hung over and shoeless. He was almost turned away from the testing site, but he protested and said there was no rule that says you need shoes to take the ACT.

[2GOLD 0]

If you do really badly on a standardized test, you're either just fucking around or stupid.

I know a kid who was outscored by a monkey on the ACT. He showed up hung over and shoeless. He was almost turned away from the testing site, but he protested and said there was no rule that says you need shoes to take the ACT.

 

Apparently there was no rule you need a brain to take it either.

 

As for NO CHILD LEFT BEHIND....I've always felt some kids need to be left behind. For some, it's just a lost cause. If the kid runs into the door for fun, he needs to be left behind.

[NoCalMike 0]

"New Rule: Leave the Children Behind"

 

-Bill Mahr

[2GOLD 0]

If it had been anyone funny, I might have agreed.

Bill Maher hasn't been funny since the 90's.

[NoCalMike 0]

If it had been anyone funny, I might have agreed.

Bill Maher hasn't been funny since the 90's.

I politely disagree

[SuperJerk 0]

The standards should be even harder, I think.

Because EVERYBODY should learn Calculus? Even Special Ed. kids? That's about the only way you could get the standards higher from this point.

 

I work with high school graduates who don't know their multiplication tables, and can't spell "Boxes."

 

Everybody can point to some idiots they knew in high school, or people who've forgotten virtually everything they learned in school. The problem is we expect every kid to be able to perform at the same level, which is a mistake.

 

Standardized tests aren't necessarily only about memorization, especially in math. There should be less of an emphasis on vocab and more of an emphasis on reading comp, but if you do really badly on a standardized test, you're either just fucking around or stupid. And if you're mentally handicapped, there's a very good chance you're just incapable of meeting NCLB's standards. Which is cool because then they'll take away your funding and give it to those who need it.

 

Besides, under the current guidelines, funding will be taken away for the ENTIRE SCHOOL, not just the Sp. Ed department. EVERYONE gets their funding yanked because of the disabilities of a few kids.

 

I'm really shocked by how narrow minded your reply was. There's nothing "cool" about taking away funding for special education.

[Guest Cerebus]

As someone who, you know, WORKS in a state legislature let me give my $.02

 

The main reason states don't like NCLB is because it stresses the relationship between the state and city/municipal gov'ts. Basically, they all have to agree on standards which is not an easy thing to do. Make them too high and the teacher unions, superintendents, PTAs and other assorted education folk scream not to mention all the town councils/mayors. Make them too low and the quality of education in urban districts get worse (the suburban folk are pretty much unaffected though). On paper, the former seems the lesser of two evils but the political problems that it represents are enormous. In Connecticut, for example, with the implemntation of the CMT minority districts are finally starting to crawl out of the dredge they have been stuck in since the "white flight" of the 70s. It has caused an enormous headache for the legislature, though, as the education debates in the legislature are incredibly heated and often lock down with little accomplishment because the NAACP, teachers unions, and parents advocacy groups fight like a group of savage dogs with the legislators in the middle of the fray.

 

On the other hand, all the legislators, Republican and Democrat, I've talked to has, in private, told me that NCLB has, in pratice, been a significant benefit to education. If nothing else, its finally given them a swift kick in the ass when it comes to improving education not to mention more federal money coming in for many special programs (such as charter and magnet schools) which are finally coming to fruition. Its not a perfect law by any means, but if we're going to improve education its a solid base to start from.

[NoCalMike 0]

The problem is it is hard to argue that there should be one standard for an entire state, when finances, budgets and resources for schooles varies so very much between schools mere miles apart.

[SuperJerk 0]

On the other hand, all the legislators, Republican and Democrat, I've talked to has, in private, told me that NCLB has, in pratice, been a significant benefit to education. If nothing else, its finally given them a swift kick in the ass when it comes to improving education...

No argument here.

 

Its not a perfect law by any means, but if we're going to improve education its a solid base to start from.

 

I'd just like some changes made so that the majority of the students aren't punished for the poor performance of the few (little but enough to cause a school to not meet annual yearly progress).

[Guest Cerebus]

NoCal,

 

What you have to understand is that NCLB is a lot more than just forcing states to test kids. There is a lot of money devoted to special programs and setting up charter and magnet schools in poorer areas which, in Connecticut at least, have been a solid success so far. Also, the "report cards" for schools DO take in account achievement gaps between students who are economically disadvantaged, from racial and ethnic minority groups, have disabilities, or have limited English proficienc. None of this exists in a bubble, everyone takes in close account where the school is and how much funding they get.

 

Also, the actual implementation of the law isn't "Your test scores are down we're not giving you any more money" its a lot more complicated then that. This is a long term thing, if the AYP (Annual Yearly Progress) is not met for one year the school is identified and brought to the attention of the state. After 2 years they are forced to offer supplemental services. This is how many of the magnet and charter schools were, and in the future probably will be, formed. After that the penalties get stiffer each consecutive year the school fails to mach its AYP all the way to 6 conseutive years and the entire school is forced to be overhauled by the state. This "schools that fail to make the grade get dumped" is hogwash. Everything is carefully analyzed and nothing is automatic and schools have time, help, and federal money to help improve before time runs out.

 

Edit: Note, that I'm only talking about implementation of NCLB in Connecticut, I don't know how its done in other states but I imagine many of the same political problems it introduces are just as bad if not worse.

[Vampiro69 0]

There is another big problem with the NCLB. I am from North Dakota and we will have 65% of our teachers reaching the point of retirement in the next 10 years. The Education department says that to teach high school you have to have a major in the field you teach. In North Dakota that is deadly for us due to fact that is hard for us to get teachers here. We have some science teachers that have a major in Chemistry and a minor in biology that teach at the school.

 

According to the new law the teacher could only teach Chemistry and the school would have to hire a teacher to come in to do biology. Where are the states going to get the money to pay for the new teachers in these schools? The budgets are stretched already! Recently the education dept said that 3,000 of our elementary teachers were underqualified. The state got pissed and protested and eventually reversed the decision.

 

The strangest thing is that ND is one of the highest rated states according to student scores yet we are getting dissected by NCLB.

[SuperJerk 0]

This is a long term thing, if the AYP (Annual Yearly Progress) is not met for one year the school is identified and brought to the attention of the state. After 2 years they are forced to offer supplemental services. This is how many of the magnet and charter schools were, and in the future probably will be, formed. After that the penalties get stiffer each consecutive year the school fails to mach its AYP all the way to 6 conseutive years and the entire school is forced to be overhauled by the state.

AYP basically says that if a school doesn't improve by an arbitrary percentage each year, its not good enough.

 

There are many suburban school districts which are in danger of not making AYP since there's not as much room for them to improve as some less fortunate districts.

 

 

After 2 years they are forced to offer supplemental services. This is how many of the magnet and charter schools were, and in the future probably will be, formed.

 

Charter schools run by for-profit companies run the risk of putting profits ahead of good practices. Allegations of gross financial mismanagement are also not unusual.

 

Also, the "report cards" for schools DO take in account achievement gaps between students who are economically disadvantaged, from racial and ethnic minority groups, have disabilities, or have limited English proficienc.

 

As I already stated, a school can fail to make AYP on account of Special Education or ESOL kids. NCLB is incompatible with provisions of IDEA.