Benoit vs. Triple H on Raw tommorow night

[iggymcfly 0]

RRR, your such a mark for Benoit that it's blinding you to the purpose of the show.

 

Last year, they were trying to build Benoit up as their top star. They gave him clean wins over HHH and HBK, and tried to make him into their top draw. He didn't set the world on fire enough to be given an Austin or Rock level multi-year run as the top face, but he was established as a solid main eventer.

 

This year, they're trying to build up Batista as their top star. Since HHH was beaten so many times by Benoit last year, Benoit actually needs to put over HHH, so that it will be clear who the top guy on the show is when Batista wins at Wrestlemania. Otherwise, even though Batista will be portrayed as the top guy, there will be a feeling that it's the same old thing rather than something new and exciting.

 

The point of the match was to show that HHH had progressed from last year, and now had found a way to counter the sequence that finished him last year. That way Batista gets to beat the real "top guy" on Raw, and not just the #2 guy who happens to be good at EC matches.

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

The one thing they weren't doing with Benoit during his title reign was trying to make him into their top draw.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

RRR, your such a mark for Benoit that it's blinding you to the purpose of the show.

 

I am not arguing what is good or bad for the show, I am arguing what is good or bad for _Benoit_.

 

Last year, they were trying to build Benoit up as their top star. They gave him clean wins over HHH and HBK, and tried to make him into their top draw. He didn't set the world on fire enough to be given an Austin or Rock level multi-year run as the top face, but he was established as a solid main eventer.

 

What the fuck were you watching last year? Are we talking about the same guy who curtain jerked a PPV _as champion_ (Bad Blood)? Who spent the vast majority of his time in the ring with Ric Flair and Batista? They guy who wasn't even the primary character in his own feuds (vs Kane)? The guy who rarely ever got promo time, let alone Rock/Austin promo time? Benoit was a lame duck champion, there is no denying that.

 

This year, they're trying to build up Batista as their top star. Since HHH was beaten so many times by Benoit last year, Benoit actually needs to put over HHH, so that it will be clear who the top guy on the show is when Batista wins at Wrestlemania. Otherwise, even though Batista will be portrayed as the top guy, there will be a feeling that it's the same old thing rather than something new and exciting.

 

Actually, it doesn't. Benoit moving down the card while HHH remains on top pretty much makes it clear who the top guy on the card is.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

First of all, to get the SurSer stuff out of the way; Benoit looked stronger than Jericho in that match. Since your main argument for him being "destroyed" there is that he went out first, and Jericho lasted longer (and yet, in my opinion, looked weaker), it seemed to be a valid point.

 

JERICHO NEVER LOOKS STRONG. It's like saying "Dog Shit smells better than Horse Shit"

 

It IS actually possible to look strong even if you lose. Monday, Benoit looked strong by beating HHH from pillar to post, before losing to dirty tactics because the champ couldn't do it any other way. Thus, it follows that he is as good or better than the champ. Thus, he looks strong. This can't be that hard to grasp?

 

It's not hard to grasp, and in a match like Benoit vs. Angle RR03 or Benoit vs. Lesnar Smackdown, it's true. Not here. At that time, Benoit hadn't been the champion. Here, Benoit already had been and was dropped down the card immediately after he lost the title. Here he wasn't even contender for the title, but rather, being used by Batista to hurt HHH. The "beating" he gave HHH was irrelvant because HHH came out 20 minutes later perfectly fine. Benoit had even failed to be a proper goon. HHH always wins by dirty tactics, and by burying his opponents afterwards and them not winning in the end makes the fact that he had to "cheat to beat them" irrelevant. This is the HHH playbook, grasp it.

 

The problem here seems more to be people confusing "could have looked even stronger" with "looked weak". I'm not in any way arguing that Benoit looked as strong Monday as if he potentially could have. But right now, storyline-wise, Benoit is chasing a title shot,

 

He is? Damn. Really? It really hasn't seemed like it. It seems like he just luckily got thrown into a match that just happened to turn into a #1 contenders match.

 

and HHH is being built up as a strong champ to make a win for Batista mean that much more. That means putting HHH over here is the right booking.

 

Putting over HHH always seems to be the right booking. The problem is, it seems the only way to put HHH over is to kill the rest of the roster in the process. HHH has been continually pushed for SIX FUCKING YEARS. He doesn't need any more build!!

 

That doesn't mean Benoit is suddenly nevermore a threath to HHH. Honestly, if losing a match to the champion means you're not a main eventer, then the number of main eventers would be about, say 1, at any given time (whch, of course, occasionally hasn't been far from the truth in the WWE, but that's another story).

 

Benoit losing points out how far Benoit has fallen. That they gave him the chance to be champion and a year later he is nothing again. What do you think that suggests? Failure.

[King Cucaracha 0]

What the fuck were you watching last year? Are we talking about the same guy who curtain jerked a PPV _as champion_ (Bad Blood)? Who spent the vast majority of his time in the ring with Ric Flair and Batista? They guy who wasn't even the primary character in his own feuds (vs Kane)? The guy who rarely ever got promo time, let alone Rock/Austin promo time? Benoit was a lame duck champion, there is no denying that.

1) He had two matches. One of them HAD to go on first. And the term 'curtain jerking' doesn't mean jack anymore anyway, since cards are rarely made in the order of card placing. HHH has 'curtain jerked' Raw in the past few months, I'm sure. Ditto for HBK and Orton.

 

2) Who else was he supposed to be in ring with, except Batista and Flair exactly? Anyone lower down the card and you'd have moaned about how Benoit was facing wrestlers who weren't in his league. And the only heels higher were Kane (PPV match), Orton (PPV match) and HHH (PPV match).

 

3) Primary character. Kane's character is more prominant than Benoit's. Admittedly, they did littel to build Benoit's. But still.

 

4) Rock/Austin promo time!?! For BENOIT!?! I'm not one of the people who dismiss Benoit as someone who CAN'T cut a promo, but a Rock or an Austin could carry a 10 minute promo single handedly. Even you can't seriously claim Benoit could do that. Because he couldn't. Not for one week and certainly not night in, night out.

 

5) I'm not denying he was a 'lame duck' champion. I do think you're reading far too much into many things though. You make it sound as if everyone was out to stop Benoit at every turn, which I really doubt.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

1) He had two matches. One of them HAD to go on first. And the term 'curtain jerking' doesn't mean jack anymore anyway, since cards are rarely made in the order of card placing. HHH has 'curtain jerked' Raw in the past few months, I'm sure. Ditto for HBK and Orton.

 

Opening a RAW and opening a PPV are two different things. Card placement, especially in McMahonland, is very important. This begs the question "why was Benoit sidled with the worthless tag titles?"

 

2) Who else was he supposed to be in ring with, except Batista and Flair exactly? Anyone lower down the card and you'd have moaned about how Benoit was facing wrestlers who weren't in his league. And the only heels higher were Kane (PPV match), Orton (PPV match) and HHH (PPV match).

 

They could have *gasp* built people up for him. I forgot, that only happens with HHH. You make it sound like continually facing Batista and Flair was reasonable. It wasn't. It was ridiculous.

 

3) Primary character. Kane's character is more prominant than Benoit's. Admittedly, they did littel to build Benoit's. But still.

 

In the context of the feud, it was Kane vs. Matt Hardy and Lita, where Benoit just happened to interject. Even as world champion, he was not Kanes primary focus. In terms of being important, this made Benoit look like shit.

 

4) Rock/Austin promo time!?! For BENOIT!?! I'm not one of the people who dismiss Benoit as someone who CAN'T cut a promo, but a Rock or an Austin could carry a 10 minute promo single handedly. Even you can't seriously claim Benoit could do that. Because he couldn't. Not for one week and certainly not night in, night out.

 

But the person who I was responding to put it in that context. The point was, how could Benoit get as big as Rock or Austin if he wasn't given the opportunity to? They gave him ONE lengthy promo and it ended up being interuppted by HHH. How can Benoit prove to cut great promos if he doesn't get the opportunity?

 

5) I'm not denying he was a 'lame duck' champion. I do think you're reading far too much into many things though. You make it sound as if everyone was out to stop Benoit at every turn, which I really doubt.

 

There's a difference between "stopping" and "not allowing to succeed". The WWE never had any plans for Benoit to succeed as champion.

[iggymcfly 0]

If Benoit got the kind of reaction to ten second promos that Batista did, he would have plenty of chances to cut longer promos. They knew that promo work wasn't one of his strengths so they tried to use other methods to build him up.

 

And I never said they put the same effort into building Benoit up that they did for Austin or Rock. They didn't even put in the same effort, they did for Batista or Orton.

 

However, the main purpose of the main event of WM XX was to establish Benoit as a top-level draw. Thus, it can be said that establishing Benoit was a main goal last spring. If you want to say curtain-jerking Bad Blood was a stupid business decision because it hurt Benoit, then that's perfectly valid.

 

At this point, establishing Benoit is no longer a major goal. He is established somewhat and has no trouble being taken seriously in a main event, but Benoit is not the center of the program.

 

Since establishing Batista is now the top priority, it makes sense that they do something to differentiate him from Benoit. Even if Benoit's no longer a focus, his "undefeated" record against HHH will take away from the accomplishment of Batista being able to do the same thing. From a business perspective, it makes sense for Benoit to put over HHH before Mania.

[Precious Roy 0]

HHH has been continually pushed for SIX FUCKING YEARS. He doesn't need any more build!!