Brian Gewirtz leaves WWE writing team

[razazteca 0]

So who is the next hollywood hack to take charge of the company.....the head writer for the Ellen Show?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Nah, the writer from the A-team.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

He's a bad bad writer.

[Guest Ransome]

Where do people pull this "cycle" stuff from?

 

What Cycle!?

 

Hogan boom .. dead .. Austin boom .. dead

 

That's a cycle!? It's hardly large enough to be a pattern.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

If you go back to the advent of television in the early 1950s, pro-wrestling was very close to the mainstream. Until it was taken off of network TV in 1956, this was a major boom period at least on par with the 1980s boom. Gorgeous George was certainly as much, if not more, of a celebrity as Hulk Hogan. Go back even further and wrestling as sport in the 1920s-30s was booming, particularly with people like Jim Londos. Go back even further to 1910 when wrestling was presented as legitimate (before the fixed match scandals of the 20s), and might well have been bigger than boxing at the time.

 

People need to get out of this mindset that wrestling originated with Hulk Hogan.

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

The ‘cycle’ goes like this:

 

1: Wrestler catches on

2: Promotion pushes wrestler to the moon and business gets hot

3: Promotion pushes wrestler into the ground until he loses all meaning and business tanks

4: Business is the shits

5: Wrestler catches on

 

And the cycle continues like that, and will continue to do so until the end of time because every promoter gets so confident and sure with the pat hand that by the time they finally realize that the pat hand has long since died, business has tanked, which in turn makes it that much harder for a wrestler to catch on, because they’re in a stale environment and they’ve got nothing they can really work off of. Eventually, a star will catch on, but it’s so much more likely to happen when business is up.

 

Vince Russo fixed the business? That's laughable.

Yes, it is, and people who think that are hopeless cases.

[iggymcfly 0]

If Vince Russo had never been born, Austin would never have been a bigger star than Shawn Michaels.

 

Hogan at least came up with most of his ridiculously stupid character by himself. 90% of what made Austin so "cool" came directly from the brain of Vince Russo.

 

(Yes, I know that Austin did the basic outline of his character himself, and got mildly over with it in 1997 and 1998. The reason he got nuclear heat to the point of being the biggest ratings draw in history however, was completely due to the Austin/McMahon storyline.)

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

The boom in professional wrestling in the late 90's came from _WCW_ and the NWO storyline. That is what caught on and allowed the WWE to take it higher with Tyson/Austin/McMahon/Rock. In 2000 they had the opportunity to prolong their boom as they had Chris Jericho reaching high popularity and they buried him. Benoit and Angle were strong supporting characters and they got halted too, right when they needed to be pushed. As HTQ said, it's all about the right stars. Brand Loyalty can take you so far, it's the wrestlers that ultimately make you popular.

 

The WWE did what all promotions do when they're hot, went with what worked and feared change. The top wrestlers wanted to keep their spot and feared they would lose it to the up and comers. So you had the same guys doing the same storylines. When they didn't freshen the product up at the right time the fans got tired of it, and moved on. When most companies get successful, they play it safe and don't keep moving forward. Why change what's been working, right? You might mess it up...

 

In the 80's, the WWE benefited from a healthy wrestling industry and a wealth of talent to steal from. Vince McMahon did not create "Hulkamania", as it was born in the AWA. Again, the wrestling boom in the 80's wasn't _just_ because of the WWE. You had strong regional markets that had a wrestling fanbase to be exploited. Now, guess what? IT'S JUST THE WWE. There isn't a whole lot of wrestling fans to scoop up now. The potential is not there. It's 100x's harder than it was before because the WWE got a ton of exposure and has a stigma attached to it. There aren't many people in the US who don't know what it is so they made the choice to not pay attention. This is not the same environment there was in the late 90's and its certainly not the environment there was in the 80's.

 

While wrestling has experienced ebbs and flows in popularity thoughout the past 100 years, no one promotion has been able to survive through all of it. Therefore, the WWE's popularity is not cyclical. There will always be a desire for guilt-free violence that wrestling provides and there will always be a desire for the sillyness that wrestling provides... but there are other things that can be substituted for wrestling, so it's a matter of the right company attracting the peoples' desires at the right time. The WWE doesn't have their finger on the pulse of what people want, and with the same dumb people running the company, I highly doubt they will be able to see what people want when they want it.

 

Look at it this way: Their response to the decline in popularity is movies. They have no idea how to get out of it. They were just dumb lucky in the late 90's, and now their luck has run out.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

Austin was "mildly over" in 1997 and 1998.

 

You didn't watch the WWE back then, did you?

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

Austin was "mildly over" in 1997 and 1998.

 

You didn't watch the WWE back then, did you?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Who said that?

[bob_barron 0]

iggymcfly.

 

Dude, did you WATCH the WWF in 97 and 98? Austin was like a God.

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

iggymcfly.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Then I'm glad I put it on Ignore a long time ago.

[bob_barron 0]

How are you able to mod the folder with so many people on ignore?

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

Dude, you're missin some gems.

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

How are you able to mod the folder with so many people on ignore?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I don't have that many on ignore, and when it's obvious something has been said that needs attention, I'll view the post.

 

Dude, you're missin some gems.

 

I'm only following my physician's advice. He's told me I'm allergic to drivel, and that I have to minimise my contact with it when at all possible.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

Dude... DUUUUUDE.

 

If Vince Russo had never been born, Austin would never have been a bigger star than Shawn Michaels.

 

Hogan at least came up with most of his ridiculously stupid character by himself. 90% of what made Austin so "cool" came directly from the brain of Vince Russo.

 

(Yes, I know that Austin did the basic outline of his character himself, and got mildly over with it in 1997 and 1998. The reason he got nuclear heat to the point of being the biggest ratings draw in history however, was completely due to the Austin/McMahon storyline.)

 

How can you miss this??!

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

RRR, you just pissed off my physician. Now he's gonna want to pull out that damned rubber glove.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

Russo's biggest, positive, contribution to wrestling was telling the Rock to talk in the third person.

[SuperJerk 0]

I thought The Rock came up with that on The Rock's own.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

"As a matter of fact, Russo stated that if you ever talk to The Rock, The Rock would tell you that Vince Russo gave him the idea of going out and referring to himself in the third person manner that he does now."

 

- A recap of an interview with Russo.

[SuperJerk 0]

So we only have Russo's word for it then?

[zyn081 0]

Why hasn't HHH knocked up Steph yet so she can be out for a few months...and maybe then Vince will see what's up.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

She will still 'write' the WWE, even the day before she gives birth. The only chance you have of somebody else writing shows is if they are behind on a show, when she is actually in labour. Saying that, she could still dictate the show.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

So we only have Russo's word for it then?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

You have a better source to rebuke it with?

 

I don't see why _anyone_ would lie about something so trivial, and on a consistent basis.

[USC Wuz Robbed! 0]

This is the guy who said WWE was doing worse business than when he was "running" things there.

[SuperJerk 0]

So we only have Russo's word for it then?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

You have a better source to rebuke it with?

 

I don't see why _anyone_ would lie about something so trivial, and on a consistent basis.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Because...he's...Russo?

[Karc 0]

The guy owned up to killing WCW, that's good enough for me.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

I think Russo overestimates his worth to professional wrestling, but why would he lay claim to that? Of all things to take credit for, I don't think it would be worth lying about.

 

...this has to be one of the most worthless topics on this board...

 

[Twisted Intestine 0]

If you go back to the advent of television in the early 1950s, pro-wrestling was very close to the mainstream. Until it was taken off of network TV in 1956, this was a major boom period at least on par with the 1980s boom.  Gorgeous George was certainly as much, if not more, of a celebrity as Hulk Hogan. Go back even further and wrestling as sport in the 1920s-30s was booming, particularly with people like Jim Londos. Go back even further to 1910 when wrestling was presented as legitimate (before the fixed match scandals of the 20s), and might well have been bigger than boxing at the time.

 

People need to get out of this mindset that wrestling originated with Hulk Hogan.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Oh. Thank you for informing me.

[iggymcfly 0]

OK, "mildly over" was relative. Sure, he was more over than anyone at the time, and he was probably more over than anyone you'll find on Raw right now.

 

The point is that with just the character, he was a big fish in a small pond. The WWF audience loved him, but he wasn't growing the business, he wasn't bringing in fresh viewers, and he wasn't a big worldwide star. A good comparison would be with Cena on Smackdown. Sure, he was getting bigger pops than anyone in the industry, but the average non-fan didn't know who he was, and the stars of WCW (see Raw with Cena) were still the ones that people paid most attention to.

 

It was only after the Austin/McMahon storyline that the average schmo walking down the street started to give a shit, and that Austin became the most over star in wrestling history. When I said Austin was mildly over in 1997 and 1998, I really meant to say 1996 and 1997.

 

And the measure by which he was "mildly over" during those years was compared tot he thunderous unmatched popularity that the received in 1998 and 1999. That one storyline singlehandedly brought Raw from dreaming of 4.0s to cracking 7.0 on a regular basis. Sure, Austin was the star at the time, but with Russo's writing, Rock or Taker or even HHH could have been the guy nearly as efficiently.

 

Yes, McMahon and Austin fulfilled their roles like hardly anyone had before them, but Russo was the key person that brought Raw to levels that id had never dreamed of reaching previously.

[SuperJerk 0]

That one storyline singlehandedly brought Raw from dreaming of 4.0s to cracking 7.0 on a regular basis. Sure, Austin was the star at the time, but with Russo's writing, Rock or Taker or even HHH could have been the guy nearly as efficiently.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

You're REALLY underestimating how much of himself Austin brought to the table character-wise.

[The Czech Republic 0]

Okay I've been out of the loop since 1NS. Who the hell came up with "Kerwin White">

[zyn081 0]

Okay I've been out of the loop since 1NS. Who the hell came up with "Kerwin White">

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Thank god I didnt watch RAW last week cause I would have puked when I saw that. Really shitty idea.