Bill Bennett:

[SuperJerk 0]

I'm not the one trying to argue that getting rid of a variable that causes an overall rate to go up would cause the overall rate to go down.

 

Seriously...am I the only motherfucker here who's ever taken sociology classes? We used to argue hypotheticals all the time in those things. At the end of the day, nobody called anyone else a racist for pointing out a simple mathematical model because it involved a minority population.

[Jobber of the Week 0]

**cough**Oprah**cough**

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

"If Bill Gates woke up tomorrow morning and found out he only had Oprah's wealth, he'd jump out the window. He'd be trying to slit his wrists with the glass on the way down." --Chris Rock

 

I still think there should be a better measuring stick for "crime" rather than number of illegal acts committed with no regard for the nature of the crime. It takes a lot of wannabe gangsters to rob as much money as Enron robbed from California.

[Special K 0]

If we're going to discuss whether blue-collar or white-collar crime does more harm in the long run, now THAT'S an interesting topic. Enron might of stolen a lot more money than some career thug, but they don't blow away convenience store owners when they reach for the gun.

 

You know what I think would have a very positive (as in socially, not literally) effect on the crime rate? Raise the fucking national minimum wage. How long has it been? This is the richest country in the world, and you still have people that eke out life working 60 hours a week, no benefits. Republicans argue that people don't work for minimum wage long, I've known a couple guys in their 30's working minimum wage jobs who were good workers. Some people are just plain stupid, and aren't going to get far on the career ladder. If they're willing to work hard, at least TRY to get them a living wage.

 

Also do the best thing Bush has proposed to do (and, to my knowledge hasn't really pushed) and pass tort reform. Get those medical costs cheaper so people and businesses can fucking afford it. Or so we can drive down health care costs so that socialized medicine is actually affordable.

 

P.S. When Conservatives talk about the constitutional right to life with such reverence in opposittion to abortion and euthanasia, they rarely mention some poor bastard dying of hepatitis who can't afford to go to the hospital.

[CheesalaIsGood 0]

If we're going to discuss whether blue-collar or white-collar crime does more harm in the long run, now THAT'S an interesting topic. Enron might of stolen a lot more money than some career thug, but they don't blow away convenience store owners when they reach for the gun.

 

You know what I think would have a very positive (as in socially, not literally) effect on the crime rate? Raise the fucking national minimum wage. How long has it been? This is the richest country in the world, and you still have people that eke out life working 60 hours a week, no benefits. Republicans argue that people don't work for minimum wage long, I've known a couple guys in their 30's working minimum wage jobs who were good workers. Some people are just plain stupid, and aren't going to get far on the career ladder. If they're willing to work hard, at least TRY to get them a living wage.

 

Also do the best thing Bush has proposed to do (and, to my knowledge hasn't really pushed) and pass tort reform. Get those medical costs cheaper so people and businesses can fucking afford it. Or so we can drive down health care costs so that socialized medicine is actually affordable.

 

P.S. When Conservatives talk about the constitutional right to life with such reverence in opposittion to abortion and euthanasia, they rarely mention some poor bastard dying of hepatitis who can't afford to go to the hospital.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Yeah, well that guy should have done better in school.

[Special K 0]

Don't know if you're being sarcastic, to reiterate, motherfucker was just a stupid man.

[Dr. Tyler; Captain America 0]

Also do the best thing Bush has proposed to do (and, to my knowledge hasn't really pushed) and pass tort reform. Get those medical costs cheaper so people and businesses can fucking afford it. Or so we can drive down health care costs so that socialized medicine is actually affordable.

 

Tort reform, to my knowledge (and I admit that it is somewhat limited), would have very little effect on the price of medicine. Thus, medical costs would still be astronomical and health care providers will still have an excuse to hike up the rates. You're removing one of their reasons (malpractice), but they've still got a full deck of them.

[Special K 0]

I bet it would drop health care costs a shitload. And while it may not get it lower it enough to make socialized medicine feasible, isn't a step in the right direction good?

[Dr. Tyler; Captain America 0]

I'm not so sure it will drop health care costs, though. The industry sets the prices, and I doubt they'll drop them just because malpractice cases have ceased. They're find another excuse, like the ever-rising prices of pharmecuteicals (sp? wow, bad spelling day) to keep prices high as ever. And insurance premiums will still be high, etc. It's not gonna make enough of a difference to make it worth it in the long run, I think. It may be good in principle, but it won't make much, if any, difference in costs.

 

Probably.

 

This is, of course, mental exercise since we're predicting the future.

[Big Ol' Smitty 0]

Medical malpractice costs make up about one half of one percent of total health care costs.

[CheesalaIsGood 0]

Medical malpractice costs make up about one half of one percent of total health care costs.

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Yet that is the reason Bush harps about for putting out good doctors.

[Special K 0]

Really? Gotta say, I was completely snookered by that. So I'm assuming it's more for his corporate buddies? No wonder it didn't pass. That would get picked apart.

[SuperJerk 0]

You know what I think would have a very positive (as in socially, not literally) effect on the crime rate? Raise the fucking national minimum wage.

 

Raising the minimum wage spikes the unemployment rate almost ever single time its done.

[Ripper 0]

its a spike now.

[Jobber of the Week 0]

Yet that is the reason Bush harps about for putting out good doctors.

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I believe there's an arguement that malpractice is affecting doctors' bottom lines, not the insurance company's bottom line. The arguement being that doctors go elsewhere where state laws protect them or get out of the field or something.

 

I believe that they tend to leave more for places where they can get more clients at higher rates, myself. I lost two doctors in a short period of time because both of them left our little cow town at the edge of the bay area for San Francisco.

 

Here, well, I'm not sure what the laws are like. CA may have more laws protecting against malpractice than NV, but CA's politicians constantly talk about sticking it to the man and protecting consumer rights and demanding lower fees and all that populist talk. However, in this city everyone with wealth takes a flight to California for their medical care.

 

In fact, many of the hospitals here are notorious for being pretty bad, and if you have to stay over more than one night you may want to fuhgeddaboutit if you've read the horror stories I have. Thankfully, I seem to live close to the best of these not so great hospitals.

[Big Ol' Smitty 0]

The arguement being that doctors go elsewhere where state laws protect them

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There's no correlation between where doctors decide to practice and state liability laws.

[Big Ol' Smitty 0]

You know what I think would have a very positive (as in socially, not literally) effect on the crime rate? Raise the fucking national minimum wage.

 

Raising the minimum wage spikes the unemployment rate almost ever single time its done.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

The last time it was raised we added 11 million jobs over the next 4 years.

 

However, I think stuff like the earned income tax credit is better because the minimum wage puts the entire burden on employers of low skill workers.

[SuperJerk 0]

You know what I think would have a very positive (as in socially, not literally) effect on the crime rate? Raise the fucking national minimum wage.

 

Raising the minimum wage spikes the unemployment rate almost ever single time its done.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

The last time it was raised we added 11 million jobs over the next 4 years.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Improper cause and effect relationship.

 

Raising the minimum wage kills jobs at the bottom of the economic ladder. Whether or not other jobs are created due to growth in other sectors is an unrelated matter.

 

Seriously, who pays the actual federal minimum wage? Market forces have been doing a pretty good job raising entry level pay on its own since the last hike.

[Big Ol' Smitty 0]

Market forces have been doing a pretty good job raising entry level pay on its own since the last hike.

 

Not 'round here. I got people with advanced degrees making $6.50/hr where I'm working.

 

Seriously, who pays the actual federal minimum wage?

 

About 7.3 million people make the minimum wage.

[SuperJerk 0]

Market forces have been doing a pretty good job raising entry level pay on its own since the last hike.

 

Not 'round here. I got people with advanced degrees making $6.50/hr where I'm working.

 

That IS higher than minimum wage, which is my point.

 

And advanced degrees in what exactly? The minimum wage has no effect on oversaturation of certain career field which would lead to people wth advanced degrees being underemployed.

 

About 7.3 million people make the minimum wage.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Source?

[Perfxion 0]

All I know is that around here where the cheapest apartments are like 1100 a month, 5.75 to 8.10 won't help for shit.

[SuperJerk 0]

All I know is that around here where the cheapest apartments are like 1100 a month, 5.75 to 8.10 won't help for shit.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

My mortgage is less than that, and I've got a 3 bedroom split-level with a deck and a 2 car garage. People think midwesterners are dumb, but we're not the ones getting hit by earthquakes and hurricanes, and paying half our monthly income for a hole in the wall or paying $3 a gallon for gas.

[Perfxion 0]

I am in CT, where we don't even have to worry about flooding much. Everything is just really pricey. Housing mortgages around here are atleast 2grand a month and most apartments are 1500 a month. But everyone around here is "rich" compared to most states but this town has had 7 homocides in 6 years.

[Ripper 0]

All I know is that around here where the cheapest apartments are like 1100 a month, 5.75 to 8.10 won't help for shit.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

My mortgage is less than that, and I've got a 3 bedroom split-level with a deck and a 2 car garage. People think midwesterners are dumb, but we're not the ones getting hit by earthquakes and hurricanes, and paying half our monthly income for a hole in the wall or paying $3 a gallon for gas.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yeah. But you live in the midwest.

[SuperJerk 0]

Yeah. But you live in the midwest.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Yeah, and its so horrible. Why, just the other day I had to drive through the beautiful countryside to get somewhere. And with traffic as heavy as it was, it took me a whole 20 minutes to go 20 miles! It was awful. I just can't stand it here. How I long to live in an overcrowded costal city with deadly weather and overpriced housing. Please, God, end my life now. I can't stand it anymore.

[Guest Fishyswa]

Yeah and Jesus lives there too.

 

Natural disasters and expensive living keep us on our toes. I'm convinced our regression of civil rights is directly related to your contentment.

[Slayer 0]

Yeah. But you live in the midwest.

 

Yeah, and its so horrible. Why, just the other day I had to drive through the beautiful countryside to get somewhere. And with traffic as heavy as it was, it took me a whole 20 minutes to go 20 miles! It was awful. I just can't stand it here. How I long to live in an overcrowded costal city with deadly weather and overpriced housing. Please, God, end my life now. I can't stand it anymore.

Zing

[Big Ol' Smitty 0]

You know what I think would have a very positive (as in socially, not literally) effect on the crime rate? Raise the fucking national minimum wage.

 

Raising the minimum wage spikes the unemployment rate almost ever single time its done.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

The last time it was raised we added 11 million jobs over the next 4 years.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Improper cause and effect relationship.

 

Raising the minimum wage kills jobs at the bottom of the economic ladder. Whether or not other jobs are created due to growth in other sectors is an unrelated matter.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

via Economic Policy Institute

 

A 1998 EPI study failed to find any systematic, significant job loss associated with the 1996-97 minimum wage increase. In fact, following the most recent increase in the minimum wage in 1996-97, the low-wage labor market performed better than it had in decades (e.g., lower unemployment rates, increased average hourly wages, increased family income, decreased poverty rates).

 

There's an abstract of the study here.

 

Source?

 

This was a mistake. I misread a blurb from ThinkProgress. Raising the minimum wage to $7.25 would affect 7.3 million people directly. So this includes people who make anywhere from minimum wage to $7.25/hr. My bad.

[Guest P-Any]

Bill Bennett is an ASS!

[Guest P-Any]

I am in CT, where we don't even have to worry about flooding much. Everything is just really pricey. Housing mortgages around here are atleast 2grand a month and most apartments are 1500 a month. But everyone around here is "rich" compared to most states but this town has had 7 homocides in 6 years.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

COWBOYS RULE!!! I'm live in Bristol CT but grew up in Meriden. What part of CT you from?

[Skywarp! 0]

Ripper check this out:

 

http://www.shootproject.com/thepit/index.php?showtopic=1066

 

Devil's advocate over there would be to criticize the guy.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Great - four pages of Mike and Marney sucking each other's political dicks. Why would anyone go there?

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That was the first time I ever saw that forum, and it validates my opinion that this one is far better now that they aren't watchdogging every post in every thread in every folder.