Guest The Vanilla Midget Posted June 23, 2002 Report Posted June 23, 2002 im not sure of any exact dates anymore, but they were uncannily coincident.
Guest bps "The Truth" 21 Posted June 23, 2002 Report Posted June 23, 2002 "Didn't the Y2J-RVD feud end four days before RAW is HHH when Rock beat Booker T to become #1 contender???" How in the hell did it end? Did I miss the blowoff? Jericho and RVD faced off in a tag match the SD (or thursday) before The HHH return Raw. The announcers were playing up all of there unfinished business...and how RVD had beaten Jericho a bunch of times...blah blah blah. January 7: RVD curtain jerks against.........Test.
Guest AlwaysPissedOff Posted June 23, 2002 Report Posted June 23, 2002 That Smackdown didn't end the feud, it was just a tag match with Angle/Jericho against RVD/Edge and the finish was Jericho pinning Edge for the win.
Guest bps "The Truth" 21 Posted June 23, 2002 Report Posted June 23, 2002 That was my point. The feud never ended...Jericho never got his heat back from constantly losing to RVD...
Guest The Vanilla Midget Posted June 23, 2002 Report Posted June 23, 2002 That was my point. The feud never ended...Jericho never got his heat back from constantly losing to RVD... thats irrelevant in the long run though, because any residual heat jericho had was stolen by steph/hhh anyway, so this is really a null discussion.
Guest JaKyL25 Posted June 23, 2002 Report Posted June 23, 2002 I stand before you a bit humbled and corrected. RVD was not #30 in the Rumble, but #29. Triple H was not the one to technically eliminate him, but rather it WAS Booker T, who basically cleaned up after RVD was KO'ed after a Pedigree from The Game. As I said earlier, I do get carried away with HHHate sometimes, but I do stand by my assertion that HHH going over at Judgment Day and the possibility of him going over at KotR are just plain wrong. Like others, though, I do support the demotion of Russo, no matter who did it, although if HHH was even in the position to have that sort of influence, as seems to be implied by the report, then I disagree with THAT. Back to Russo and anyone still supporting him, I remind you that just a scant 25 months ago, David Arquette was WCW World Champion. WWE is currently promoting his latest movie, "Eight Legged Freaks". Put Russo into the current equation, and we have a recipe for disaster if I ever heard one.
Guest AlwaysPissedOff Posted June 23, 2002 Report Posted June 23, 2002 I'd say it was stolen more by inept booking leading up to No Way Out and the NWOld coming in. After the Austin feud though, I'd blame Steph(and Vince for being an idiot to think all that BS would draw) because the HHH/Jericho feud leading up to WM 18 made them BOTH look bad, IMO.
Guest The Vanilla Midget Posted June 23, 2002 Report Posted June 23, 2002 yeah, but triple h came out on top in the end, which counts for a lot. also, he was at the top of the card for the next month's ppv, while jericho wasnt even on the card. so really, the triple h fued caused the loss of jericho's heat (trips didnt have any to begin with).
Guest AlwaysPissedOff Posted June 23, 2002 Report Posted June 23, 2002 As I said earlier, I do get carried away with HHHate sometimes, but I do stand by my assertion that HHH going over at Judgment Day and the possibility of him going over at KotR are just plain wrong. I think people are getting carried away with the whole "HHH is gonna win at KOTR" scenerio(not saying you are, but it's kinda getting there). What if he KNOWS he jobbing ahead of time(that's probably asking a lot of the current booking team, though) and doesn't have a problem with it? He doesn't strike me at all as the delusional type like Hogan is/was, so I think all of this "he's gonna book himself to win the title again" shit is just that, shit. Of course, if he DID win the title on Sunday, I'd ask what the bookers were snorting/smoking/injecting because it'd be incredibly fucking INSANE to switch the title for the FOURTH TIME in as many months.
Guest The Vanilla Midget Posted June 23, 2002 Report Posted June 23, 2002 also, with trips' ramapage in recent weeks, should he go over clean (and i stress clean), he may give a decent rub to the undertaker. although this may be just my natural cynicism or hhhating roots, but i just cannot see that happening. there is no way that trips will job perfectly clean, it will take the fucking national guard to put him down tomorrow.
Guest AlwaysPissedOff Posted June 23, 2002 Report Posted June 23, 2002 yeah, but triple h came out on top in the end, which counts for a lot. also, he was at the top of the card for the next month's ppv, while jericho wasnt even on the card. so really, the triple h fued caused the loss of jericho's heat (trips didnt have any to begin with). Understandable, but I think Trips was going to win the feud anyway, so why should anybody have expected anything different? Hell, I think they should have held off on the title switch until Backlash just to build up the Jericho/HHH feud by themselves without Steph anywhere near them. Again, I contribute Jericho not being booked on Backlash to be the bookers' fault entirely. Lastly, I always felt that the build-up of Steph being the dominant figure in the feud is what killed Jericho's(and HHH's) heat because SHE was basically the focal point of the entire feud and seemed to want to prove that she was smarter than both of them.
Guest Prince Paul Posted June 23, 2002 Report Posted June 23, 2002 As I said earlier, I do get carried away with HHHate sometimes, but I do stand by my assertion that HHH going over at Judgment Day and the possibility of him going over at KotR are just plain wrong. I think people are getting carried away with the whole "HHH is gonna win at KOTR" scenerio(not saying you are, but it's kinda getting there). What if he KNOWS he jobbing ahead of time(that's probably asking a lot of the current booking team, though) and doesn't have a problem with it? He doesn't strike me at all as the delusional type like Hogan is/was, so I think all of this "he's gonna book himself to win the title again" shit is just that, shit. Of course, if he DID win the title on Sunday, I'd ask what the bookers were snorting/smoking/injecting because it'd be incredibly fucking INSANE to switch the title for the FOURTH TIME in as many months. Exactly. The title does not need to change hands and Taker is doing more of an entertaining job right now than HHH could ever dream of. HHH needs time off to rehab or rethink the rest of his career at this point.
Guest AlwaysPissedOff Posted June 23, 2002 Report Posted June 23, 2002 There's hasn't been a face who's jobbed cleanly once this year or even last year excluding MAYBE Austin at No Way Out last year.
Guest bps "The Truth" 21 Posted June 23, 2002 Report Posted June 23, 2002 If someone is going to win a feud...they shouldnt make their opponent look like crap...vome out and tell him that he isn't in his league...and all the rest.
Guest JaKyL25 Posted June 23, 2002 Report Posted June 23, 2002 Of course, if he DID win the title on Sunday, I'd ask what the bookers were snorting/smoking/injecting because it'd be incredibly fucking INSANE to switch the title for the FOURTH TIME in as many months. That's exactly what I'm saying. If HHH jobs on Sunday, then I got no beef with him at all, and I take back everything mean I said with the exception of going over Jericho at JD.
Guest The Vanilla Midget Posted June 23, 2002 Report Posted June 23, 2002 yeah, but triple h came out on top in the end, which counts for a lot. also, he was at the top of the card for the next month's ppv, while jericho wasnt even on the card. so really, the triple h fued caused the loss of jericho's heat (trips didnt have any to begin with). Understandable, but I think Trips was going to win the feud anyway, so why should anybody have expected anything different? Hell, I think they should have held off on the title switch until Backlash just to build up the Jericho/HHH feud by themselves without Steph anywhere near them. Again, I contribute Jericho not being booked on Backlash to be the bookers' fault entirely. Lastly, I always felt that the build-up of Steph being the dominant figure in the feud is what killed Jericho's(and HHH's) heat because SHE was basically the focal point of the entire feud and seemed to want to prove that she was smarter than both of them. yeah, trips was always gonna come out on top in that fued, and it was the smart thing to do. however, during that fued, neither trips or steph put jericho over in any way, shape or form. but as you said, that is largely steph's fault. but when you look at it, even though steph was jericho's manager, which team was she rooting for??? (haha, subtle innuendo!)
Guest bps "The Truth" 21 Posted June 23, 2002 Report Posted June 23, 2002 RVD is a pretty high face...and he has jobbed clean when hes lost. Although...in the current state of the company I consider Eddy putting his feet on the ropes to be clean as a whistle...but thats just me.
Guest AlwaysPissedOff Posted June 23, 2002 Report Posted June 23, 2002 If someone is going to win a feud...they shouldnt make their opponent look like crap...vome out and tell him that he isn't in his league...and all the rest. Rock did that to Jericho last year.
Guest The Vanilla Midget Posted June 23, 2002 Report Posted June 23, 2002 If someone is going to win a feud...they shouldnt make their opponent look like crap...vome out and tell him that he isn't in his league...and all the rest. Rock did that to Jericho last year. i know this sounds like hypocrisy, but that is the rock. that is his gimmick, that absolutely nobody is in his league. trips on the other hand is not the rock, and also isnt really over enough to make such a statement. also, iirc angle jobbed the title clean back to austin on raw last year didnt he?
Guest JaKyL25 Posted June 23, 2002 Report Posted June 23, 2002 QUOTE (bps21 @ Jun 23 2002, 05:10 AM) If someone is going to win a feud...they shouldnt make their opponent look like crap...vome out and tell him that he isn't in his league...and all the rest. Rock did that to Jericho last year. I think the difference is that Jericho went out and proved the Rock wrong by beating him 3 times 1-on-1. The Vengeance win was even clean, with the exception of McMahon distraction. (No physical interference = Clean to me)
Guest AlwaysPissedOff Posted June 23, 2002 Report Posted June 23, 2002 Of course, if he DID win the title on Sunday, I'd ask what the bookers were snorting/smoking/injecting because it'd be incredibly fucking INSANE to switch the title for the FOURTH TIME in as many months. That's exactly what I'm saying. If HHH jobs on Sunday, then I got no beef with him at all, and I take back everything mean I said with the exception of going over Jericho at JD. Well, if he DID win at KOTR, I'd still blame Vince and the booking committee because THEY should be able to think logically. Hell, even *I* thought Jericho jobbing at JD was bullshit(check the Crossface of the PPV reactions). I'm not saying Trips is completely innocent because I really don't know all the facts, BUT, he CAN suggest things like most of the other main eventers can and that's where I really blame the bookers because they should be able to logically think through these outcomes and see what could probably work best. Okay... I think I went a lil off track there... In short, if Trips DOES win, sure, he SHOULD get a little muck slung his way, but it's all the fault of the bookers and Vince for letting it happen in the first place.
Guest Prince Paul Posted June 23, 2002 Report Posted June 23, 2002 The Rock acted out in character, his thoughts that Jericho wasn't in his league. HHH, actually spoke about it out of character the week leading up to Wrestlemania.
Guest The Vanilla Midget Posted June 23, 2002 Report Posted June 23, 2002 after all, you cant blame trips for wanting to be number 1. though you can call him a hypocrite for continuing to make himself no. 1 when he clearly isnt, in spite of his "love for the business." however, the bookers deserve a heap of blame for lacking even a shread of objectivity, and vince needs to bite the bullet and either fire steph from the writing team, or at least remove her from the head position. (haha, more innuendo!) her relationship with trips *is* unprofessional given their respective positions, and really i cant see how an astute businessman can let the two mix. steph should either resign as booker and keep trips (i wonder how long he would stay with her then), or dump trips or remain booker. the two roles are so conflicting that it is ludicrous.
Guest JaKyL25 Posted June 23, 2002 Report Posted June 23, 2002 Exactly. HHH should get some blame, at LEAST for not realizing and suggesting that his going over would be a bad idea, but the ultimate blame lies with Vince for allowing it to happen. Dammit, though, this is a Vince Russo thread. You guys are right, HHHate DOES take over everything. Back on Topic: People say that Russo would help by "Pushing new talent". I feel that even if that were the case (which in past it has been), it wouldn't really matter, because they'd get a lot less match time to showcase their talent. Bottom Line: Russo = Shorter Matches = Bad for everyone, talent or not.
Guest bps "The Truth" 21 Posted June 23, 2002 Report Posted June 23, 2002 As someone said...the difference is that Jericho won that feud. Telling someone they aren't as good...then beating them is entirely different then telling someone they aren't as good and having them prove you wrong.
Guest AlwaysPissedOff Posted June 23, 2002 Report Posted June 23, 2002 i know this sounds like hypocrisy, but that is the rock. that is his gimmick, that absolutely nobody is in his league. trips on the other hand is not the rock, and also isnt really over enough to make such a statement. also, iirc angle jobbed the title clean back to austin on raw last year didnt he? True, but Triple H's entire gimmick is like the maniacal, cold, calculating son of a bitch who's as tough as nails and it would take a hell of a lot to take him down. At least, that's what he was like with Foley in 2000(and up until his injury last year). Really, his gimmick didn't change when he came back because he still believed(gimmick-wise) that he was still one of the toughest bastards out there and that no one was on his level. Really, I think all the main event faces, save for Angle last year, always thought they were better than their challengers. As far as the Austin/Angle match last year, Regal hit Angle with a beltshot and then Austin Stunnered him for the win.
Guest AlwaysPissedOff Posted June 23, 2002 Report Posted June 23, 2002 I think the difference is that Jericho went out and proved the Rock wrong by beating him 3 times 1-on-1. The Vengeance win was even clean, with the exception of McMahon distraction. (No physical interference = Clean to me) Booker ran in on that match and hit Austin with the belt.
Guest The Vanilla Midget Posted June 23, 2002 Report Posted June 23, 2002 thanks, it all got a little hazy there. but trips' "student of the game gimmick" would really lead him to underestimate nobody... but alas i am rambling and this is pointless. trips and stephanie are both unprofessional, and jericho is fucked as a result. is there anything i missed?
Guest AlwaysPissedOff Posted June 23, 2002 Report Posted June 23, 2002 As someone said...the difference is that Jericho won that feud. Telling someone they aren't as good...then beating them is entirely different then telling someone they aren't as good and having them prove you wrong. Yeah, but there's a difference between those feuds regardless, though. Then, Jericho was an underdog face who had never won the "big one" and NEEDED to beat Rock to prove himself. NOW, Jericho is the rat bastard heel who'd beaten both Rock and Austin numerous times while HHH was just coming back and needed to prove himself(yeah, I know...).
Guest JaKyL25 Posted June 23, 2002 Report Posted June 23, 2002 QUOTE (JaKyL25 @ Jun 23 2002, 05:14 AM) I think the difference is that Jericho went out and proved the Rock wrong by beating him 3 times 1-on-1. The Vengeance win was even clean, with the exception of McMahon distraction. (No physical interference = Clean to me) Booker ran in on that match and hit Austin with the belt. I was talking about the Rock vs. Jericho match that preceded the Austin match.
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