Some Guy

Vince actually did "no sell" that challenge on TV, though. His legal team didn't, but that's another story.

So you call ME dumb and say that you've explained everything CLEARLY? Right. Go on and play now, kid, you're annoying the big people. See this guy is a moron I said I am vague and unclear and he claims I said I am clear. BE CLEAR! I've asked you several times to explain why you want certain matches in certain cards and the best you've done is say that Sid and Vader entertain you. Tell me why you think that Starcade 93 would have been better with Bret/Flair (a match that had been done to death just one year prior) and Sid/Vader (a match that would surely suck) than the classic Flair/Vader match. I wouldn't touch the ME of that show. It was the best thing WCW had done since Wargames 92.

No, you didn't explain it clearly and as a result we didn't understand it. OK, now why would you have liked it? You'd be trading one great match (Vader/Flair) for one great match (Flair/Bret) and one shitty match (Sid/Vader). If you want to see Vader wrestle Sid checked out Buried Alive 96, I'd bet you'll reconsider your choice after doing so. Flair and Bret have had several matches that can befound reasonably easily.

The commercial tape is a good show as it cuts out all of the following matches: # Doug Furnas pinned Dutch Mantel (11:18). # Mike Rotunda pinned The Iron Sheik (6:46). # Brian Pillman pinned Buddy Landell (9:29). # Harley Race pinned Tommy Rich (6:32). There are the two good matches that Mike mentioned as well as a rare WCW PPV appearance for Taker and Vader's WCW debut. Sting's first World Title win probably makes the show worth checking out if you are a completist.

OK, now tell me why you think they fit on a given card and what you would have had them do on that show. Where does Bret fit in on the Starcade 93 card? Taking Bossman's place against Rude? Taking Flair or Vader's spot? Tagging with Scorpio against the Nasty Boyz? A run in? If so in what match and why? Explain your fantasy. Fantasy booking benerally requires imagination and your's seems to be rather limited.

What made it weird? Edge being on the show would have been weird as he had just had spinal fusion surgery like 2 weeks before the show.

I'm trying, dude. Read that post you made and explain to me how it makes sense. Is English a second language for you? What specifically do you not understand about it? First of all, there has been no "controversy" in this thread just confusion and mockery. Secondly you typed "should" in all caps and tagged a ? after it. You've made very little sense and added nothing to the thread that you started and can;t even seem to articulate what it's supposed to be about. Arnold Oldschool seems to be the only one taking this seriously and he is making points backed up with reasoning albeit to a rather foolish topic. Try it.

No, I think the toilet no showed.

I'm trying, dude. Read that post you made and explain to me how it makes sense. Is English a second language for you?

The reason they think Rock was coming out, was a slip rock made during the interview on ellen. They showed this on best week ever on vh1. Rock was going through the same spiel that he has on every showing hyping the movie, talking about being fearless in taking challengeing acting roles. then he said something about playing gay and accidentily slipped and said something (damn i cant remember now) wrong while saying it, implying that he was gay. Rock said that he and the character he played in Be Cool had a lot in common and listed a few of the things including that they were both strong gay men. He then realized what he said and gave the people's eyebrow or something to that effect.

Why was 11 "obscure" but not 8? I think it would be more "obscure" for him to have showed up for a WM when he wasn't under contract than for him to show at one for which he was contracted and had an angle leading up to his match with Taker. But I do think that Lou Thesz should have run in and Thesz Pressed HBK at WM 20 just to teach him a lesson about gimmick infringment and reincarnation.

No Piper did not in fact "no show" Summerslam. He showed up unadvertised and played the bagpipes. You're learning though. This is starting to remind me of the "When in Rome" deal from Anchor Man.

It's not about controversy, it's about trying to figure out what you meant. When you just throw out random things like saying Bundy should have been on WM 8 with no explanation it doesn't make for a very clear and intelligent post. I'll play along with you on this if you provode more reasoning than "I just think he'd fit on the card." What are you talking about? Everybody knows that Yokozuna and his 10 thug friends killed him at RR 94. Back problems? That sounds pretty far fetched.

OK, maybe this would be morbidly entertaining if you would try to explain why you think certain guy should have been on certain shows. I'm dying to hear your booking plans for Bundy at WM 8. Weren't 4 WM matches enough for Bundy? I don't recall any of them being any good, unless you are a big fan of Hogan formula matches.

And what would you propose that King Kong Bundy would have done at WM 8? This is really stupid. Because they mean 2 different things. To "No sell" something (a move or an insult) is to act as though it did not happen. To "no show" an event is to not show up at an event.

SD! Magazine has stories about guys shitting themselves? Interesting.

Superstar Billy Graham was also at the show injecting Hogan with steroids and didn't appear on it. I really can't figure out what this topic is about. How does one no sell a PPV? If you mean "no show", as in guys who were advertised but didn't appear then I could probably come up with more. If you mean guys who were on the roster but not on a given PPV then there are too many to bother listing.

HHH vs. Batista: What I think will happen - Batista wins after Flair messes up on an interferance attempt with the Demonbomb in about 15-20 minutes. What I want to happen - Batista wins in less than 5 minutes because HHH tears his quad again. I don't at all like Batista but I'm so fucking sick of HHH that I just want him gone. JBL vs. Cena: What I think will happen - Cena will win in a shitty match with the FU after fighting off the whole Cabinet in about 15 minutes. What I want to happen - What I think will happen. Angle vs. HBK: What I think will happen - HBK goes over in a 30 minute long 4+ star affair that half the board will pan because Shawn's shoelace was untied for the last 3 minutes of the match. What I want to happen - The result doesn't matter, neither guy has anything to gain or lose here as long as they deliver what they promised, a great match. Money in the Bank Ladder Match: What I think will happen - Shelton goes over in an underwhelming spotfest. What I want to happen - Shelton goes over in a great spotfest. The only problem is that he's a face so he'll have to hold off on using the title shot until HHH takes the belt back, unless they waste it on Raw in a face/face match. Undertaker vs. Randy Orton: What I think will happen: Taker goes over clean with the Tombstone after a decent match. What I want(ed) to happen - Orton goes over clean with the RKO after kickignout of the Tombstone. Orton is apparently going to have shoulder surgery so putting him doesn't make any sense now. Rey vs Eddie: What I think will happen - A very good match that will pale in comparison to their Halloween havoc match. Eddy will go heel even though he shouldn't. Eddy wins with the Frog Splach after cheating. What I want to happen - Eddy goes over clean with the Frog Splash in a 5 star match. With no bullshit and just Eddy's normal heelish stuff. Trish vs. Christy: What I think will happen - I think Trish wins this one. Christy's Playboy thing is already over and she's not. A heel needs to win on this show somewhere. What I want to happen - Trish to come to my house and felate me through out the show. The Big Show vs. Akebono: What I think will happen - Big Show wins in a really stupid match consisting of two guys I have no interest in seeing. What I want to happen - This match to be canceled in order to give Rey/Eddy and Angle/HBK more time. Piper's Pit: Hassaan interupts and lays out both guys leading to a Hassaan/Austin match at Backlash.

Yeah he did say it and it turned out to be brilliant. I have a feeling that he just did it on his own because he's a macho jock and has been a huge mark for himself since the day he entered the business and it was WCW, I doubt that they had plans like that for a new rookie, when they couldn't do anything else right (outside of the build to Sting/Hogan) at that point. That and winning the belt meant he also had to lose it, which they weren't going to have him do.

That was awesome. Kurt Angle is a funny dude. I thought HBK's line about Sherri not looking good was funny and well delivered, which is sort of out of the norm for Shawn these days. He seems to be going back to being a bigger dick in his promos which is a good thing. And we go from a really good segment to Dawn Marie vs. some chick. Couldn't Kurt have just kept singing?

If he's going to be out several months then I'll stop and say that Taker might as well win. Any heat that Orton would get for betaign Taker would be goen after several months off TV.

Most over guy in the company? Eh, well, in the absence of anybody with the presence of a Rock or Austin, I think possible although I have my doubts. Rock and Austin aren't around. If the Orton/HHH feud went the way it should have then he would be the most over heel in the company, or at least on Raw. Take a cocky young punk and put him in a postition where he talks shit and backs it up and you have a guy who is easy to hate and not one who you'd hate to see. I know it wouldn't have happened and it obviously didn't. Orton is a 24 year old kid who is probably a mark for having young girls pop for him. He doesn't know any better. If the company was being run by people who wanted it to suceed then they would have told him that turning face at that point would hurt him. Wouldn't suprise me in the least. Everybody and their sister knew that HHH should have been the one to turn face and battle with an Orton led Evolution. But HHH knows that he's not a good babyface, as evidenced by him being eclisped by a 50 year old man the last time he tried it. Yes it would have and the board was right on that one. Metal Maniac: So, you hated Rock until he got better, which he did while being pushed into the ME. The same thing will happen with Orton. Because there aren't hundreds of workers good enough to ME and at this point there are probably about 6 in the whole company who are close to credible as ME guys, because so many people have been buried. Batista got over because people perceived him as a threat to HHH. As soon as they realize that he isn't they'll stop caring. Orton was over enough by the time he won the title that he was getting face pops in Canada against Chris Benoit as a heel. To rehash this again, when they turned him face and jobbed him to HHH instead of the other way around they killed his heat. I agree with you. But, they have already pushed this kid a lot, the fans know that he is capable of getting back there and would believe in him again is he was booked properly. Why flush this kid down the shitter when so much time has already been spent in the past to get him over and he proved that with the right booking he is capable of getting over? He's a talent, whether you like him or not. I;m not saying he is all that great, but he is at a point where he could potentially draw money for the company. Why not let him? WTF? You must be watching a different WWE then I am. The guys looks like a douche, has about 4 moves (two of which are chinlocks) and cuts half-decent promos. If that qualifies for top ten, then the fed is in much sadder shape then I thought. Name ten guys who have a better workrate, mic skills, and look in WWE right now (I mean individual who have that combon of those skills, not ten guy who are better workers, ten guys with better mic skill, etc..). He's not a great worker by any stretch, he's not great promo guy, and he doesn't have the best look. But he has enough of each to be a total package and has improved enough in the last few years to make me think that he will continue to et better. He's 24, he'll get better. Unless, of course, as others have pointed out, it leads to nothing but a fan backlash on Orton. Orton has HAD his pushes, he's HAD his chance to get over. You can't put all your eggs in one basket - if he can't get over on what he's had, then why give him the streak? The streak, if done right, could put someone who's never had a strong push over HUGE and cement them in the main event. Why spend it on the guy who you've already pushed harder then hell, and still isn't that over? What push has he recieved outside of the last 3 weeks since turning face? Jobbing cleanly to HHH does not constitute a push in my book. I'm not putting al my eggs in one basket. Having Taker lose a match is not putting eggs in one basket, it is an attempt to create a superstar. If the fans shit on it then they shit on and you move on. Refusing to push someone because there is a possibility that the fans might shit on it would paralyze the company and no one would get pushed. That is how it actually is working right now. Why would you put a guy who hasn't been pushed over Taker? That would get shit on. If they threw Chris Masters or any other unpushed guy in the match and put him over Taker people would hate it.

Eddy & Rey have a lot of charisma, but a lot of their appeal is also based on their in-ring ability. I don't think their charisma alone is better than Batista's, certainly not Rey anyways. Eddy maybe. Eddy is incredibly charimatic. He's made that stupid "Latino Heat" gimmick work based soley on his charisma, his ring work doen't get people to pop for his promos. I'll give you the fact that a lot of Rey's charisma is based on his reing work but he gets better reactions during his matches and was until very recently (because he's not at all beign pushed) getting better pops than Batista. HHH has more charisma than Batista. Because he isn't showing it as of late doesn't mean it isn't there. If they put Flair in the ring for a promo that didn't consist soley of him saying "You're the best, Champ!" he'd be tearing down the house. Once again not shoeing doesn't mean it he doesn't have it. Watch the Raw match from Monday and tell me that Shawn doesn't still have charisma. The crowd was going crazy for him during a squash match. Booker T has a ton of charisma, he wouldn't still be over after being buried for 4 years if he didn't. I should have mentioned both he and RVD, as Canadian Chick pointed out. It was just an oversight on my part. Cena is was over based solely on the fact that he has tremendous charisma and mic skills. Would the "general fanbase" be you or the people who go to SD! shows and give him the biggest pop of the night? I don't see Batista as having "instant badass" charisma. I see a guy who got over to a rather small degree because people thought he might be a threat to HHH and looked cool in a suit. Wait until after WM when he's won the title and the fans realize that he sucks and shit on him, they are already starting to realize that he's not what they wanted him to be, the pops are waning every week. What has he ever really done to even be considered a bad ass? I think his goofy WBF posing on the ramp before his matches make him look more like a queer than a bad ass. On Raw this week when he was doing his pose and lookign at HHH it look more like he wanted to fuck HHH than beat him up. He was posing while gazing longingly into HHH's eyes with a smirk on his face. And he certainly doesn't wrestle like a bad ass. Bad asses kick people's ass. Batista throws a few weak looking punches, a spinebuster (which everybody in the fucking company uses), and a sitout powerbomb, that he can't even do right. Ausin had bad ass charisma, Goldberg had bad ass charisma, Scott Steiner had bad ass charisma. I still can't figure out why people like this guy and delude themselves into thinking he is the second coming. The only reasoning I've heard is that he did a couple of cool vignettes and looks good in a suit. No one has been able to come up with anything else.

My favorite part is when he says that Batista could beat both Cena and JBL at the same time but not HHH one on one. I love how he buries the SD! guys by making it clear that he would have no trouble beating a guy who could easily take out both of them. What a great company man.

I can't see Orton ever being half as good as the Rock. When Rocky still really, really sucked, he was only as high as the Intercontinental Title. Orton is a lot better than Rock was then, but Rock was consistently a hell of a lot more entertaining by the time he'd won his first WWF Title than Orton had been. Whether or not you agree with it, you're trying to use Rock as the one exception while ignoring all the other failures. However, the reason Orton's career resembles Rock's so much is that they *deliberately* tried to follow the same course as Rock, thinking that it was their own brilliant booking that got Rock over, and excepted that same accident to occur again. No, I used the Rock as an example because he go this job in WWF the same way as you claim Orton did. I think Orton may have even trained outside of WWF territory for a while before, which the Rock really didn't (besides some workouts with his dad) before getting signed and shipped to Memphis. I know that they used the same mold to book Orton and it has worked to the extent that it can with someone who doesn't have Rock's charisma, which is absolutely out of this world. Orton is in roughly the same spot on the card as Rock was at this point in there careers, I outlined that in my previous post, which went up at the same time as your's. EDIT: By "the look" I meant that he has a body that stands out from the rest of the pack and is a good looking kid, as evidenced by him banging Stacy Kiebler. Being white has nothing to do with it. I think he should probably wear long tights as that might make him look a little thicker and not as lanky. He has a similar body to Rick Rude, minus about 15 lbs of roided on muscle, which is not to say that orton himself isn't on the juice. He probably is.