Ricky Steamboat in WWF

[Guest drdrainoscott]

I was having trouble sleeping the other night, and I started thinking about how whenever someone jumped from NWA/WCW to the WWF, Vince always liked to screw with their established gimmicks (a practice he still likes to, well, practice). After thinking about gimmicks like the Widowmaker, the Narcissit, Sid Justice, the American Dream, etc., how come Steamboat got to keep his Dragon gimmick? Also, besides Ric Flair, were there anyother NWA/WCW jumpers that got to keep their gimmicks in the late 80's, early 90's?

[ChrisMWaters 0]

I was having trouble sleeping the other night, and I started thinking about how whenever someone jumped from NWA/WCW to the WWF, Vince always liked to screw with their established gimmicks (a practice he still likes to, well, practice). After thinking about gimmicks like the Widowmaker, the Narcissit, Sid Justice, the American Dream, etc., how come Steamboat got to keep his Dragon gimmick? Also, besides Ric Flair, were there anyother NWA/WCW jumpers that got to keep their gimmicks in the late 80's, early 90's?

You obviously missed Steamboat's LATER run...

[Zack Malibu 0]

I wouldn't call the Dragon a gimmick, just a nickname. It was only made into a gimmick during the '90's WWF run where he wore that stupid costume and did the fire spitting.

[WrestlingDeacon 0]

And the costume and fire spitting was Vince getting back at Steamer for leaving after Wrestlemania IV. Vince and Steamboat apparetly had heat over the issue of wrestling vs. entertainment and that's why McMahon never liked him too much.

 

On an aside, one of the few people Verne Gagne stole from Vince was Sgt. Slaughter and see what happened to him upon his returun.

[nl5xsk1 0]

I'd say that Steamboat got fucked over both times. Between the two runs we saw his "thrilling" war with Magnificent Muraco/Mr Fuji over who was the best martial-artist from the islands. (the one that included Steamboat dressing like a ninja.) And him wearing fake looking wing-things to the ring while blowing fire in the corner. And him bringing his dragon into the ring to fight with Roberts' snake.

[The Dames 0]

And the costume and fire spitting was Vince getting back at Steamer for leaving after Wrestlemania IV. Vince and Steamboat apparetly had heat over the issue of wrestling vs. entertainment and that's why McMahon never liked him too much.

 

On an aside, one of the few people Verne Gagne stole from Vince was Sgt. Slaughter and see what happened to him upon his returun.

Yeah, he became WWF Champion and had a ton of heat.

 

Dames

[Guest Choken One]

Yeah but was given what was one of the most dangerous Personas ever created in Wrestling History.

[Guest drdrainoscott]

I guess you guys are right about his later run being crappy, but I wouldn't call his first time in the WWF that bad (I mean that feud with Savage makes up for all the mistakes). Also, I wouldn't say that him bringing a dragon to the ring was all Vince's fault, as he had done it in the NWA as well.

 

In a followup question, what was the story behind him jumping from the NWA to the WWF in 1990, then jumping right back a year later? If Vince and him got in an argument the last time he was there, why would he want him back, and why would NWA let such a talent leave after his string of matches with Flair and Luger?

[Guest bort]

steambot didnt really have much of a gimmick in the wwf he did alot of nija stuff, i have this best of ricky steambot tape from the late 80s and hes in this corny segment with mene gene about the 5 rules of being a ninja or somthing like that

[Papacita 0]

In a followup question, what was the story behind him jumping from the NWA to the WWF in 1990, then jumping right back a year later? If Vince and him got in an argument the last time he was there, why would he want him back, and why would NWA let such a talent leave after his string of matches with Flair and Luger?

If I'm not mistaken, the main reason he came over to the WWF was to work a program with Flair (who had either recently jumped or was about to jump from NWA/WCW), but Vince saddled him with the stupid gimmick and never really made an attempt to elevate him so he went back to WCW when his contract expired.

[Guest drdrainoscott]

In a followup question, what was the story behind him jumping from the NWA to the WWF in 1990, then jumping right back a year later? If Vince and him got in an argument the last time he was there, why would he want him back, and why would NWA let such a talent leave after his string of matches with Flair and Luger?

If I'm not mistaken, the main reason he came over to the WWF was to work a program with Flair (who had either recently jumped or was about to jump from NWA/WCW), but Vince saddled him with the stupid gimmick and never really made an attempt to elevate him so he went back to WCW when his contract expired.

Wow. If that's true, then not only did Vince bungle a Flair/Hogan match but also a Flair/Steamboat match. That just adds more evidence to my opinion that Vince was almost as stupid 15 years ago as he is today.

[Guest Dmann2000]

If it's so horrible that Vince made Ricky breath fire in his 1991 run, why did he keep doing it when he came to WCW?

[Papacita 0]

If it's so horrible that Vince made Ricky breath fire in his 1991 run, why did he keep doing it when he came to WCW?

I dunno. I always thought that was cool.

[MillenniumMan831 0]

If it's so horrible that Vince made Ricky breath fire in his 1991 run, why did he keep doing it when he came to WCW?

I've always wondered the same thing. What bothered me though is that the announcers weren't allowed to recognize him as Ricky Steamboat. It was just 'The Dragon.'

[MillenniumMan831 0]

I'd say that Steamboat got fucked over both times. Between the two runs we saw his "thrilling" war with Magnificent Muraco/Mr Fuji over who was the best martial-artist from the islands. (the one that included Steamboat dressing like a ninja.) And him wearing fake looking wing-things to the ring while blowing fire in the corner. And him bringing his dragon into the ring to fight with Roberts' snake.

The war with Muraco was actually a very good feud. It was only partially based on the martial arts, but their matches featured on Best of WWF Volume 5 and Ricky The Dragon Steamboat's CV had awesome heat and were great matches. Blood, guts, and hatred are what really fueled. Admittedly, the skits were pretty hokey but the matches were anything but.

 

Also, check out Best of WWF Volume 8, Jake the Snake Roberts' CV, SNME 5/86, or The Big Event and say his feud with Roberts 'fucked' him over.

[Papacita 0]

If it's so horrible that Vince made Ricky breath fire in his 1991 run, why did he keep doing it when he came to WCW?

I've always wondered the same thing. What bothered me though is that the announcers weren't allowed to recognize him as Ricky Steamboat. It was just 'The Dragon.'

They started calling him Ricky Steamboat towards the VERY end of his run.

[Guest wayzing]

I guess you guys are right about his later run being crappy, but I wouldn't call his first time in the WWF that bad (I mean that feud with Savage makes up for all the mistakes).  Also, I wouldn't say that him bringing a dragon to the ring was all Vince's fault, as he had done it in the NWA as well. 

 

In a followup question, what was the story behind him jumping from the NWA to the WWF in 1990, then jumping right back a year later?  If Vince and him got in an argument the last time he was there, why would he want him back, and why would NWA let such a talent leave after his string of matches with Flair and Luger?

Steamboats first run was cool. I think most agree there. Most probably agree that the second run was a major disappointment too. But when it comes to the second one I think too much emphasis is being put on how he was presented. The outfit sucked but the fire breathing was great. The problem was that he didn't have anything to do. I can't remember even a hint as to who he was feuding with, title aspirations or anything, which probably explains why he was put in the opening 6-man-tag at SummerSlam'91.

 

As for him leaving NWA in 1989. It probably wasn't due to the matches or the program but NWA's string of very strong PPVs that started with Starrcade 88 and didn't end until Halloween Havoc 89 stopped the streak drew horribly and this period coincides with Flair's run as the booker and Steamboat (and later Terry Funk) as the top talent.

 

NWA were putting some of the best shows ever together and no one knew about it. When Flair and Steamboat did their classic 2/3 falls in the Superdome they could have done it in my apartment and there would still be plenty of space for everybody. That's how many tickets they sold. Check out the buyrates and the attendence numbers for WrestleWar'89. Not much better.

 

This time was such a mess in the NWA and of course Vince fucked with them as often as possible. Flair had to step down from the booker position and a booking committe (Flair might have been part of it) took care of the booking. Jim Crocket Promotion was selling the company to Turner.

 

Anyway, Steamboat only signed a six month contract when he entered the promotion in early 89 and I think he chose not to renew himself.

[Guest wayzing]

Also, besides Ric Flair, were there anyother NWA/WCW jumpers that got to keep their gimmicks in the late 80's, early 90's?

Except for being called The Brainbusters (which was a cool name IMHO) I'd say Arn Anderson and Tully Blanchard didn't have to change anything.

[Guest Choken One]

Lex Luger? Nope

Ron Simmons? Nope

Barry Windham? Nope

 

 

Flair and Anderson+Blanchard were the only ones...

[Guest Dmann2000]

Also, besides Ric Flair, were there anyother NWA/WCW jumpers that got to keep their gimmicks in the late 80's, early 90's?

Except for being called The Brainbusters (which was a cool name IMHO) I'd say Arn Anderson and Tully Blanchard didn't have to change anything.

Yeah, they got a cool name, a great manager, the Tag Titles and swank fueds with The Rockers & Demolition, as Arn said in his shoot the only reason he left is that there were too many dates and he wanted more time with his family.

 

The Brainbusters 1 year in the WWF is one of the best booked runs ever.

[Guest Dmann2000]

I'd rather be called The Widowmaker than The Stalker.

[Guest drdrainoscott]

I'd rather be called The Widowmaker than The Stalker.

really? I always thought that the Stalker could have been made into a cool gimmick. He could have just been a cheap heel that stalked his enemies in the locker room and attacked them at the right time. Unfortunatly, the Barry Windham of 1997 was not a good choice for that gimmick.

[The Czech Republic 0]

"Widowmaker" wasn't much different, I don't think. I thought it was just a nickname that had no effect like Brainbusters.

 

Man, what if Flair, Arn, Tully, and Windham all jumped to WWF at once? THAT would have kicked every ass in the building.

[Guest Dmann2000]

Man, what if Flair, Arn, Tully, and Windham all jumped to WWF at once? THAT would have kicked every ass in the building.

Arn touched upon that in his shoot, pointly out that had they all jumped at the same time Heenan would've been the manager.

[alfdogg 0]

I think the only reason Flair didn't jump at that time was because they gave him the book, right?

[Guest Trivia247]

the NWA Wrestlers got screwed with less than the WCW ones. basically alot of the big name wrestlers from the old WWF came from the likes of NWA and AWA.

 

Only when Turner personalized his WCW as a rival to the WWF is when those Wrestlers who jumped and returnd got more screwed with.

[shlidgn90 0]

the rockers weren't changed much when they went to wwf. neither the steiners or the nasty boys.

[Guest DeputyHawk]

the steiners essentially didn't have their gimmick fucked with, but they did have their ring style neutered. why really was their gimmick, and their wwf run for the most part blew.

[Guest Graham R Tripp]

Ron Simmons was Faarooq for ages when he first came into the WWF however. It was only a few years ago that he changed back to Ron Simmons.

[Guest Graham R Tripp]

Sorry about the Faarooq deal. I misread the previous posts.

 

What about when Dusty Rhodes came in and had to wear the polka dots!!!!! Now that was sad.