The One and Only Angel Season 5 Thread

[Anya 0]

I just want to see Emma again, I don't care what the part is. She hasn't done anything besides a movie that's never coming out and Tom Lenk's play.

[Guest Brian]

"Why We Fight"

 

The white room is empty. Has it been empty since "Destiny". And it's a good touch since next ep, we see Gunn's new version of the white room. And Gunn also has his first brush in with his memory fading, as he tries to remember how they are going to reestablish contact.

 

I like Wes pointing out the unreliability of Knox. The tension has been good.

 

Lorne's going to the Skybar. As in Rain of Fire. Apocalyspe Nowish. Beast. Yeah, that fucking Skybar.

 

First mention of the initiative.

 

Spike in the nazi uniform is classic. "Free Virgin Blood Party".

 

Spike and Angel are always gold.

 

And what this season is about: finding your place.

[Mole 0]

Claire will have her baby (a daughter), and someone from Ethan's camp will steal it and jump off into an alternate deminsion using a book in an observatory found on a different part of the island, and Emma will play the daughter all grown up after she comes back

That would actually be awesome.

[Guest Brian]

God, I love "Smile Time". How can a throw-away episode based on a seemingly stupid plot be so full of fun and work so well to progress a big point in the story. Just amazing what they can do.

 

That's kid's face is freaky.

 

Maybe the thing is is that it is the nerdy Wes that Fred loves, not the hardened man he became after "Billy". And that's what hits Wes so hard after "Origin", in addition to all the shit that fell at his feet, that was the key point.

 

Gunn and his brain fading, Angel and Nina.

 

Wes thinking that he missed his chance with Fred and him putting that all on Angel is a great scene for this show.

 

I love everyone's reaction to the puppet, especially Fred. And Angel firing her. "Puppet Cancer."

 

I love the "Self-Esteem" song. My little cousin sings it all the fucking time.

 

SPIKE~!

 

SPIKE

(barges into the office)

Hello, big guy! Need another car. Afraid this last one ended up in the drink...

(stops in mid-thought when he sees puppet Angel sitting at the desk)

 

PUPPET ANGEL

(anxiously)

Spike...

 

SPIKE

(staring)

Look at you.

 

PUPPET ANGEL

(gesturing with his hands)

Just turn around and walk away.

 

SPIKE

(still staring)

You're a—

 

PUPPET ANGEL

Spike!

 

SPIKE

(starts laughing uncontrollably)

You're a bloody puppet!

 

Angel launches from his chair at Spike, knocking them through the office windows and into the lobby.

 

Cut to:

 

12 INT. LOBBY OF WOLFRAM & HART - DAY

Angel attacks Spike, wringing his neck. They fight, rolling around on the floor, while Spike can't stop laughing at him.

 

SPIKE

(laughs)

You're a wee, little puppet man!

(Angel punches Spike in the face)

Ow!

(laughs; Angel punches Spike in the face harder)

Ow! Hey! That's enough.

(pushes puppet Angel off of him, throwing him high into the air)

(Angel lands on his feet, glaring at Spike)

Angel, what the hell happened to you?

(gets to his feet)

You look ridiculous.

 

PUPPET ANGEL

Get out of here, Spike.

 

HARMONY

Oh, my God. Angel, you're a—

 

PUPPET ANGEL

(points at Harmony)

Shut up!

(looks around the lobby, realizes everyone's staring at him)

What are you people looking at? Well?

(the employees back off, frightened)

 

SPIKE

(turns, smirks)

They're looking at the wee, little puppet man.

 

Angel growls and leaps toward Spike again, biting his forearm this time. Spike groans in pain, trying to wriggle his arm free of Angel's grip. Spike bashes Angel into the wall near the elevator, but Angel holds on tightly to Spike's forearm. Spike steps back as he tries in vain to writhe free of Angel's grip, and they stumble into the elevator. They're still wrestling as the elevator doors close on them.

 

PUPPET ANGEL

(heard from inside the elevator)

Stupid limey piece of crap!

(a thud is heard, then the elevator doors open revealing Spike collapsed on the floor)

(walks off the elevator and addresses the crowd of employees that gathered around the elevator)

Yes, I'm a puppet. Doesn't mean you don't have work to do.

(the crowd disperses; Spike stands and watches Angel walk back to his office) Harmony, get my call list.

 

HARMONY

(watches Angel, confused)

Um...

 

Spike walks toward Harmony's desk.

 

PUPPET ANGEL

And Spike needs a car.

 

SPIKE

(to Harmony) You heard the puppet.

 

God, I love the whole damn thing. Especially Puppet Angel laying down the law.

 

I love that Gunn is just totally losing all the legal knowledge.

 

The puppets are great. "Edutainment".

 

Isn't it a strange twist of fate that the girl Angel dates is the one with the monster inside of her rather than the other way around.

 

Gunn finds his way back to the doctor. And signs over the document. He was the one that was corrupted, addicted to power, and in the end sold out his friends. So did the doctor put a fade on the implant, knowing Wolfram and Hart had unintentionally sent him a chance to get Illyria in. Calls him "the ignorant street muscle", really appealing to the guy who never saw his place in the group or the strengths of his character.

 

I love that scene where Knox is looking on as Fred and wes share the drink.

 

Gunn's back with the knowledge and the abilty to research.

 

I love that scene of them walking out, with Puppet Angel in the lead.

 

This fight scene rules as something completely different and fun.

 

Fred with the gun motherfuckers. I love that.

 

This is such a season two moment, with the "You got a little demon in you".

 

And the big kiss at the end, perfectly meshing with the self-esteem song.

 

How did they pull off this motherfucking episode?

[Jericholic82 0]

After watchign smile time on tnt again, I too have that damn self esteem song stuck in my head.

 

But I agree on your points Brian. What a fun and intelligent episode that actually helps to set up the next arc in the last season of Angel.

[LaParkaMarka 0]

It's a brilliant episode. I remember when the rumors of a puppet ep started up, most of the people on this forum (myself included) thought it was going to be a disaster. Amazing that it was pulled off to perfection.

 

Also, I'm surprised no one has been freaking out about how great the evil puppets were. The main one with his mickey, the Hornblower guy, the chick ("Give me those pretty eyes!"). Great stuff.

[Guest Brian]

What about the dog? Edutainment. Edutainment. And getting his head chopped off at the end.

[Jericholic82 0]

What about the dog? Edutainment. Edutainment. And getting his head chopped off at the end.

The dog ruled!!!!!

[Ripper 0]

From why we fight:

 

Angel says something like "I don't want to be trapped at the bottom of the ocean and spike says "Well, I don't want the government experimenting on me."

 

Funny stuff.

[Guest Brian]

From why we fight:

 

Angel says something like "I don't want to be trapped at the bottom of the ocean and spike says "Well, I don't want the government experimenting on me."

 

Funny stuff.

Damn. I missed that.

[Guest Brian]

God, I'm going to be bawling like in "Home". Here we go with "A Hole in the World".

 

I love that scene with Fred's parents. I love her parents.

 

Fred and Wes kissing, having their moment. Please don't do it. Let her live.

 

I love it when the delivery man says the tomb is already signed for.

 

What's up with Gunn singing? I love it. The segue into the rap. The creul joke on Fred and how he takes her away from Wes in reality. God, all the teases are so fucking sad.

 

"A man becomes civilized."

 

Remember how protective Wes was when Gunn and Fred got together? Same kind of vibe here.

 

I love the argument and how it relates to Fred, with the ancient demon (caveman) against her science (astronaut). Cavemen v. Astronaut, Pay Per View, Sunday, Sunday, Sunday.

 

I love that shot of Spike just walking over the chair. Angel trying to get rid of Spike.

 

Lorne gets a chance to do the read on the steps.

 

I love that scene of them all together in the lobby. The desperation. It feels so cold.

 

"I'll say it anyways. Winnifred Burkle."

 

Holy shit. I forgot Wes shot the lawyer. That was fucking col.

 

I love that scene with Gunn and himself in the white room. The conduit disappeared after "Destiny". I love him beating up himself. It's poetic.

 

CONDUIT AS GUNN

This is the part where I need to be clear.

(punches Gunn hard in the chest, sending him across the room)

I am not your friend. I am not your flunky. I am your conduit to the senior partners, and they are tired of your insolence. Oh, yeah. They are not here for your convenience.

 

GUNN

I didn't come for a favor.

(gets to his feet)

We can make a deal.

 

CONDUIT AS GUNN

Deals are for the devil.

 

GUNN

You want someone else—a life for hers—you'll get it. You can have mine.

 

CONDUIT AS GUNN

(laughs)

I already do.

 

Deals are for the devil. He already has his life. This episode is so fucking great right now.

 

Lorne throws a punch. What a scene. Lorne is fucking intense. And Eve sings "L.A." And he mentions that her future is not so great, what with Lindsay dying and her mortality. I wonder if he saw what he was going to do; kill Lindsay, and that's why he agreed to the final job.

 

They've used the shell analogy a number of times, both this season and last. It's an awesome look into someone dying from the inside, like angel without a purpose, like Wes wallowing in his own problems.

 

Fred asking to go home to die is the first real emotional scene in this episode. Breaks my heart.

 

Talk of the home country is a nice touch.

 

I like how the segue the story back to England. That scene with Angel and Spike holding hands is so awesome everytime I see it. "St. Petersburg."

 

Knox and the slip of the tongue. They played him so well in this episode. And the smirk with the "whoops".

 

Droggen. Didn't get enough of him, one of my favorite short-term characters, up there with Boone. I just adore how he reacts to Spike and the questions.

 

"I don't mean Angel's going to fail to save her. I mean he's going to let her die." That's a tough one to swallow.

 

"My charges are not few."

 

And the big reveal on Gunn's part in the plot. That is some heavy stuff. And I love how Gunn just fucking turns on him.

 

I'm refraining from commenting on the Fred scenes. Too packed with emotion.

 

 

 

ANGEL

No.

(walks to the edge of the bridge to look down into the well)

 

SPIKE

That's madness.

 

DROGYN

This is a place of madness. I'll prepare the spell. Your choice.

(walks away)

 

Spike looks down from the other side of the bridge.

 

ANGEL

To hell with the world.

(follows Drogyn)

 

The great thing is that reflects just how fed up Angel is with things over the last few years, and after spending Season Three and Four trying to save his "family" and "love", he looks like he's just about willing to let the world slip.

 

SPIKE

This goes all the way through to the other side. So, I figure, there's a bloke somewhere around New Zealand standing on a bridge like this one, looking back down at us. All the way down. There's a hole in the world. Feels like we ought to have known.

 

God, that's deep. And it shows that these guys just don't understand the volume of what they're up against (ie. The Black Thorn). And there's something so empty in the world, that is poetic as well. But that whole thing really resonates.

 

The acting in this episode has been so great. The comedy well-placed, The intesity and the emotion just perfect. I'm still not sure if I can put it up against NFA, but it is pretty damn close.

 

 

 

Fred. 3rd soldier down.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

I loved how they worked in Drogyn. I swear, at the time I was like "did I miss something?" cause the way Angel reacted to him was in a way where there had to be another episode before it that introduced Dr. Dro. It's almost like a parodying character, since its so over-the-top and melodramatic.

 

What's great in this, is that it's the last time you see Wes as Wes. The full Wes. The insecure Wes, the badass Wes, the emotional Wes. Because after that, he was a changed character. Fred died there, but Wes did too.

[Anya 0]

In the commentary they talk about Drogyn. The reason they made such a big deal about him being noble, unable to lie and that he had known Angel in the past was they wanted it to be credible when he said they absolutely could not save Fred without killing others. If just some random flunky had said that you'd wonder why Angel would so easily believe it and give up.

 

The original plan was actually to have Giles appear and play Drogyn's role as the one to tell Spike and Angel there was no other way.

[Guest Brian]

I love Illyria. That is all.

 

Spike and Angel on the plane. Spike drinking away his sorrows. Angel, almost a lost cause.

 

Gunn in his own desperation. Trying to hide his guilt, and yet racked by it. God, Wes should have just shot Knox right there. I like how Gunn just describes this beautiful nature of Fred. Lorne's losing it.

 

It's sorta weird, because in some ways this could have been Gunn losing Fred.

 

That was one hell of a bitch slap.

 

In a lot of ways, this episode is almost as sad as "A Hole in the World". Watching them try so frantically here as well, and the way this ends.

 

Giles not willing to help out Angel.

 

The first slowdown scene is pretty awesome. Pretty intense, not quite Rain of Fire, but pretty intense.

 

I love Gunn's references to Flash.

 

ANGEL

No. I lost Cordelia because some thing violated her. It crawled inside and used her up.

(pulls the dagger out of its scabbard)

No way in hell am I letting that happen again.

 

Angel and Spike are great.

 

HARMONY

(grabs the pry bar and walks toward Wes)

The girl of your dreams loved you. That's more than most people ever get.

(hands the pry bar to Wes)

 

WESLEY

(softly)

I know. But it isn't enough.

 

I love Wes desperate plea for more. I love how Wes doesn't accept the way things are.

 

WESLEY

(glaring)

Is there something you'd like to tell me, Charles?

 

Wes fucking rules it. There's a real role reversal here in a way from when Wes took Connor. And Wes talking about not wanting to go back, about not wanting to be who they are was so mind blowing. Think about it. It blows my fucking mind. Everything is changed, nothing is as it should be. It's all been changed, and they can't bring it back. Wes tries in "Origin".

 

Spike got to play some torture. This Wes and Angel scene is great. Angel must know the cost of his decision, and what it did to Fred. This stuff works so well with "Origin".

 

Harmony is pretty good in this episode.

 

GUNN

Because I was weak.

(scoffs)

Because I wanted to be somebody that I wasn't.

(shakes his head)

Because I don't know where I fit. Because I never did. Because a thousand other reasons that don't mean a damn 'cause she's gone.

(crying)

She's gone... and she's not coming back because of me.

(nods)

I did this, and I'm sorry.

(sobs)

I'm sorry.

 

Watching Gunn fall apart is horrible. I feel so bad for him.

 

I love the little confrontation. I love Angel delivering the speech and the shot ringing out, and Angel's reaction to what Wes did. Watching wes kill Knox was so great. I love the fight. Illyria is so badass. The time freezing sequence and Angel getting the punch in was SWANK~! Wes jumping through the portal was awesome. I'm running out of ways to describe how I love this episode.

 

Illyria's reaction to her fallen kingdom is just priceless, especially with Wes walking up and cocking his hammer.

 

ILLYRIA

It can't be.

(panting, crushed)

It's gone.

(falls to her knees, runs her hands through the sand)

My world is gone.

 

WESLEY

(walks up behind her; cocks his handgun as he points it at her head)

Now you know how I feel.

 

And Spike's staying. I love it. Realizing he wants to stay is a good moment. Spike realizing that there is a lot more to what Angel's done, a bigger backlash.

 

The convo between Wes and Illyria speaks for itself:

 

ILLYRIA

(standing in the doorway)

You grieve still... for a single life.

 

WESLEY

(without turning to look at her, shuts his eyes tight and speaks through gritted teeth)

Why are you here?

 

ILLYRIA

I... I'm uncertain.

(looks around)

This place... was part of the shell.

 

WESLEY

(snaps)

Don't call her—

(breathes deeply)

The woman you killed had a name.

 

ILLYRIA

This is important to you. Things have names. The shell... Winifred Burkle... She can't return to you.

 

WESLEY

(packing her things, tearfully)

I know.

 

ILLYRIA

Yet there are fragments. When her brain collapsed, electrical spasms channeled into my function system... memories.

(holds up her fingers, making a gap between her thumb and index finger where an electrical spark forms)

(as Fred) Please...Wesley, why can't I stay?

 

WESLEY

(turns away, nearly sick, crying)

No.

(looks out the window)

Leave.

 

ILLYRIA

I've nowhere to go. My kingdom is long dead.

(softly)

Long dead. There's so much I don't understand. I've become overwhelmed. I'm unsure of my place.

 

WESLEY

(turns to her, angrily)

Your place is with the rest of your people: Dead and turned to ash.

 

ILLYRIA

Perhaps... but I exist here. I must learn to walk in this world.

(slowly approaches Wes)

I'll need your help... Wesley.

 

WESLEY

(frowning, choking back tears)

If I were to help you find your way... you have to learn to change. You mustn't kill.

 

ILLYRIA

You killed the Qwa'ha Xahn in defiance of your leader.

 

WESLEY

(shakes his head, then looks at her)

He murdered the woman I love.

 

ILLYRIA

And that made it just.

 

WESLEY

No. It wasn't just.

(sighs, puts his hands on his hips)

I'm probably the last man in the world to teach you what's right.

 

ILLYRIA

But you will. If I abide, you will help me.

 

WESLEY

(softly)

Yes.

 

ILLYRIA

Because I look like her?

 

WESLEY

(looks at her with tears in his eyes, whispers)

Yes.

 

ILLYRIA

(stands beside Wes, looks out the window to the lab below where her sarcophagus lies)

We cling to what is gone. Is there anything in this life but grief?

 

WESLEY

(looks out at the lab)

There's love. There's hope...for some. There's hope that you'll find something worthy... that your life will lead you to some joy... that after everything... you can still be surprised.

 

ILLYRIA

Is that enough?

(looks at Wes)

Is that enough to live on?

 

Wes trying to attach himself to something of Fred, trying to get that last little breath of life within himself. And the last two lines are so many shades of awesome. My favorite with the "Home Office" speech from "Reprise".

 

The collage and song are just perfect. It just re-emphasizes, drives home that they don't really have a place.

 

I think this episode is every bit as good as "A Hole in the World". Blasphemous ye say. But I feel like it stands up and says, I'm here. It doesn't have the same emotional impact, the immense sadness of watching Fred die before your eyes, but it has some of it owns. It also resonates really strongly, delivering more of a finality to that story, and also just really leaving you thinking. That Illyria-Wes dialogue was just so perfect. The fight sequence were better. There was a lot more intensity, and just as much desperation in the characters. Gunn's character takes such a great turn, just as Lorne, Wes, Fred/Illyria, Spike, and Angel. If it didn't come right after "A Hole in the World", I think people would have a much higher opinion of it.

[BorneAgain 0]

Brian, I haven't posted in this all that much, but I just wanted to say I love the DVD club write-ups you've done. They've given me some insight on a lot of episodes, and helped me pick up a great deal of things in the series. Just wanted to say thanks for putting the time and effort in these.

 

If anybody's interested I'll be willing to go back and put these together in one big word document.

[SuperJerk 0]

I just want to see Emma again, I don't care what the part is. She hasn't done anything besides a movie that's never coming out and Tom Lenk's play.

I know I would mind seeing in person some night when my wife's away...

[Ravenbomb 0]

Why didn't they just bring Fred to the tree, THEN bring the coffin to the tree, THEN do whatever spell? There wouldn't be thousands of people for Illyria to latch onto in between Fred and the well

[Anya 0]

They had no time. She died just minutes after Drogyn told them about the spell.

[Jingus 0]

I just want to see Emma again, I don't care what the part is. She hasn't done anything besides a movie that's never coming out and Tom Lenk's play.

She was the leading lady in Darkness Falls, but that's almost worse than nothing since it was the type of crappy horror movie that the Buffyverse exists to mock.

 

I found a Blockbuster that has all the Buffy and Angel DVD sets for rent, and have thus been listening to an obscene amount of filmmakers' commentaries recently. The general rule for commentaries is thus: if it's Joss or any of the actors doing it, it's probably insightful and entertaining; if it's some random people off the production crew, it's probably boring as hell and less fun than just the episode by itself. And generally the later the season is, the better the special features are, though there are exceptions.

[Crowe 0]

Brian, I haven't posted in this all that much, but I just wanted to say I love the DVD club write-ups you've done. They've given me some insight on a lot of episodes, and helped me pick up a great deal of things in the series. Just wanted to say thanks for putting the time and effort in these.

 

If anybody's interested I'll be willing to go back and put these together in one big word document.

I agree, Brian's writeups are what keep me coming back to read this thread. Good reads, every single one of 'em.

[Anya 0]

She was the leading lady in Darkness Falls, but that's almost worse than nothing since it was the type of crappy horror movie that the Buffyverse exists to mock.

Yeah, I have it on DVD.

[Guest Brian]

"Underneath"

 

Beautiful little episode. I can't say enough about the Spike/Angel interplay. The scoobies and Angel's Avengers. Spike breaks open the beer during the meeting. Angel still taking the burden of losing Fred. still wallowing, without direction.

 

The whole build-up to Hamilton is great. I love his first entrance.

 

Lorne at the bar, falling apart. This is Angel falling off to a much further extreme, because he's not strong in the same way, because Lorne never fits in. They all don't. But Lorne also doesn't have his place in the fight, which is what draws everyone together.

 

Gunn's reading from an entertainment magazine, like in the first episode of the season in the doctor's office.

 

At least Angel isn't choking Gunn with a pillow. I love that they gave Gunn this depth of atonement, because the sister thing was too weak.

 

Wes is just full of the hallucination, the want, the need.

 

WESLEY

(deadpan)

This world must be a terrible disappointment to you.

 

ILLYRIA

Grievous.

 

WESLEY

I'm not too impressed with it myself.

(takes another swig of whiskey)

 

ILLYRIA

Why don't you leave?

 

Foreshadowing his death.

 

We get a little bit of that insight into what Lindsay was doing. Hiding, picking up on the Senior Partner's, hating Angel.

 

I love how they do the reveal on "hell". And I love Gunn's take on it later on.

 

Spike talking about "Nightrider" was great.

 

"This isn't hell. It's the burbs. Close enough."

 

Wesley is juggling here. He wants to keep whatever of Fred he can, but on the other hand he sees the person that murdered the woman he love. It's a conflicting position, especially for her strength.

 

Gunn opening the door and Spike and Angel's reaction was great.

 

"This whole life is a lie." That goes deep, far past Lindsay's holding cell.

 

The whole punching_through_the_stomach was over the top.

 

I love lindsay's reaction to getting back his memory. The wife with the machine gun, the kid with the gun, the mailman, the ice cream man. It was over the top too, but it was crazy-funny in that sense. It's nice that Gunn knows exactly what he's looking for, in the door to the cellar and picking up the necklace.

 

I did like Hamilton's tossing of Harmony and complete no-selling. I think that did more to put him over.

 

Lindsay and his hearts.

 

Gunn goes straight to look at the torture device Hamilton points out to him next episode.

 

This guys was a beast. Not the Beast, but he got to beat up Spike and Angel together, which is quite the feat.

 

Angel loses another. The pieces are falling quickly.

 

"This is where I belong." Interesting that Gunn says that. It's what makes an episode like "Not Fade Away" work.

 

Angel's got one hell of a motor pool.

 

I like Spike's reaction to Hamilton pulling out the pen.

 

God, Wes is like a fucking watcher on the rooftop with Illyria.

 

Interesting that Illyria has no place anymore either.

 

ILLYRIA

I reek of humanity.

 

WESLEY

Don't flatter yourself.

 

And...

 

WESLEY

There are things worse than walls. Terrible... and beautiful. If we look at them for too long they will burn right through us. Truths we couldn't bear. Not every day.

 

ILLYRIA

(sighs)

We are so weak.

 

WESLEY

Yes. Yes, we are.

 

You know that's about next episode. And also about Wes looking at Illyria and seeing Fred. Which is what I love about it.

 

I love Lindsay's speech. He's a straight-shooter. This comes straight from "Reprise" with Holland Manners telling Angel what it is all about. The parallels with Season Two have been great.

 

LINDSAY

...

The war's here, Angel. And you're already 2 soldiers down.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

Shells and AHITW are, really, the same episode in the way it was structured and how it begins and ends with Younger Fred.

[Guest Brian]

I'm thinking about going back and doing the "Connor" scripts at some point, but I can't remember the mood I was shooting for or the direction the characters were headed. I'd like to at some point, since I sat in on an intro to screen writing class last quarter, and I've been inspired as of late with my relaxed schedule.

[LaParkaMarka 0]

I just rewatched the 2nd ep of season 5. Good stuff, it's fun to notice things you missed the first time. Like Spike saying he doesn't give a bollucks about destiny, or Lorne saying that selling a story about a Vampire Slayer loving and losing two Vampires would sell in a heartbeart ("I see Depp and Bloom [playing Angel and Spike]"). Good stuff.

[Guest Brian]

I caught "Sacrifice" again, and I wanted to pitch in some stuff I noticed that I missed.

 

Gunn's loyalties are questioned by Angel, which is great. I love Gunn as the outsider looking in, who doesn't understand why he is a part of something.

 

Also, there's a scene about rats. Both Gunn and Angel say they wouldn't want to be eating them. Great stuff, with Gunn's one fear and Angel playing off the fact that Orpheus was just a few episodes earlier.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

IT IS MIIIIIIIIIINE!!!!!!!!

 

...bout fuckin damn time.

 

Mmmm..excessive packaging.

[Guest Brian]

You want to join me in the last five episodes, starting with "Origin"?

[Guest Brian]

The great thing about "A Hole in the World" is that emptiness in the middle of the world parallels every main character, and how their existence has been empty. I never understood that parallel before, never realized it.

 

And does anyone see Jasmine as a rant on Christianity, in some odd way, or religion in general? The idea of giving up everything, escaping repsonsibility, is almost like the death of ourselves. Fuck, it is the death of ourselves. And the whole thing about saving somme, and down to the use of violence if mis-directed. More on this later.

[Youth N Asia 0]

As much as I enjoyed Angel, even more so than Buffy near the end...shouldn't this thread have died years ago?