Guest Choken One Report post Posted December 9, 2003 If you feel that the NCCA needs to FINALLY adapt a playoff system, give suggestions on how to execute it. Here's Mine... I'm sure it's FULL OF HOLES. It's 1 am people. ------------- We all know that the B.C.S once again failed to deliver what it promised, to give us a TRUE national champion. If there were to be a Playoff Format... How would you devise it and which teams (using this season) would partake? Personally, I'd take the Big 8 Conference Champions. 8 Wild Cards. I eliminated the INDEPENDENT clause, aka "Get N.D in at ANY cost" rule. The requirements are that You finish above .500 and meet all elgibility requirements. Wild-Cards would be highest placing Non Conf. Title winners. The Big Eight Conferences Big 12 Big Ten Pac 10 SEC Big East ACC M.A.C CUSA So using that set up The teams would be Kansas State(B12) Michigan (B10) USC (P10) LSU (SEC) MIAMI (BE) FSU (ACC) MOH (MAC) So. Miss(CUSA) Eight Wild Cards Oklahoma Ohio State Texas Georgia Tennesee Iowa Florida Washington State The Seeds are based on The Poll Standings order. The Conf. Champions will go 1-8 and the other Slots go to the Wild Card. However, No two teams from the same Conf. shall play each other in the first round...Thus the lower seed team of the two would drop a slot. This year's... USC(1) Vs Florida(16) (Holiday Bowl) So. Miss (8) Vs Oklahoma (9) (SUN) Florida State (5) Vs Georgia (12) (Peach Bowl) Miami (4) Vs Iowa (13) (Tangerine Bowl) Kansas State (6) Vs Ohio State (11) (Alamo Bowl) Michigan (3) Vs Tennessee (14) (Music City Bowl) MOH (7) Vs Texas (10) (Diamond Bowl) LSU (2) VS Washington State (15) (LSU) So then what becomes of the Rose Bowl, Sugar Bowl, Orange Bowl and Fiesta Bowl? They still exist. The National Title Game Finals (Sugar bowl), Semi final #1 (Fiesta), Semi-Final #2 (Orange)... Rose Bowl will be the host for the Consolation game between losers of The Semi-Finals. The Other 12 games will also be Bowl Games... The First Round will have the Conference champions select the Bowl of their choice to play in the first round... The Next big 12 bowls Outback Gator Cotton Capital One Peach Alamo Holiday Tangerine Music City Bowl Diamond Bowl Sun Bowl Independence Bowl Will all host a game. The Quarter finals will be given to the "bigger" bowls...I.E Outback, Gator, Cotton and Capital One. The Conf. Champs will get to select their first round Bowl Game Location...I.E give themselfs ideal Home Field Advantage. Cotton Bowl will host the USC/Florida/SO.MISS/OKLAHOMA game Outback Bowl will Host the FSU/GA/Miami/IOWA game Gator Bowl will host the KSU/OSU/MICHIGAN/TENN game Capital One will host the MOH/TEXAS/LSU/WSU game. Fiesta Bowl and Orange Bowl will agree to which game to Host according to location of the teams remaining. The Rose Bowl will Host the Consolation Game and The National Title Game will be Hosted by Sugar Bowl. Every season they would alternate the BIG FOUR BOWLS as they did with the BCS system. The idea with this system is... We get the playoffs... We get the Bowl Games... It makes NCAA Richer... Allows Mid-Major Teams to compete for Natl. Championship NO CONSTROVERSY ONE TRUE NATIONAL CHAMPION! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
2GOLD 0 Report post Posted December 9, 2003 Actually, that is basically mine as well. At this point, I'd take a four team system over this. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MarvinisaLunatic 0 Report post Posted December 9, 2003 First of all I'd eliminate the Rose Bowl from the BCS. 3 BCS Bowls - Sugar, Orange, Fiesta. 2 of the 3 bowls feature the top 4 teams in the BCS standings. The Orange Bowl will feature 1 vs 4, the Fiesta Bowl 2 vs 3 (this would alternate along with the Championship Bowl game each year just as it does now) Winners play in the Sugar Bowl, or the Championship game. Championship game alternates every year (like it does now, but every 3 years) and is played 2 weeks after the 2 playoff bowls. Oh, and like the XFL, winning school gets all the money from the Championship game instead of splitting it. At least you get a playoff system and things are decided on the field. A larger playoff format will be harder to get and would end up with more games, taking up more time. This effectively has 1 more game played 2 weeks later between 2 schools. I think this type of system could be put in place as soon as next year if they wanted. Of course, Team #5 would feel snubbed or something..but its still better than it is now. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Edwin MacPhisto 0 Report post Posted December 9, 2003 One big problem I see rarely mentioned concerning a Division I playoff is attendance. Seriously. There's a biiiig difference between going to your team's bowl game, and going to FOUR post-season games. It works for the lower divisions because they don't expect much attendance in the first place. If you have the same sixteen teams playing, especially a mid-major team like So. Miss, you're simply not going to sell out every game. A lot of even BCS conference teams are lucky to move 20,000 fans to a single bowl game. You're sure as hell not going to get that many going to every single one of those games. Travel is just too hard and the prospect is just two expensive for all but the most die-hard fans. And when you get down to a quarter-final match-up between Iowa and Southern Miss, you're only going to be getting die-hard team fans, not casual folks in the area. Also, you're still eliminating a ton of revenue, because you're eliminating I believe 10 bowls. It might not seem like a lot since they're the lower ones, but it still pumps a LOT of money into a school and its athletic program, even if it is the Liberty Bowl. You're going to alienate income from the other 36 schools who want to see their teams play a bowl in addition to the tired-out fans of the 16 playoff teams. I think the best you can do is basically something like what Marvin suggested - turn the BCS bowls into a pair of semi-finals and a final, if you want to. I think that's the furthest point you can go without undermining the rest of the bowls. This year, it'd mean that Oklahoma/LSU would play USC/Michigan for the undisputed national title, and I think people could get into that. Travel is still hard for that, though - even if you put two weeks between the semis and the final, that's not much time for fans to put their jobs or school on hold, make travel arrangements, and get out there. Fiscally and in terms of not alienating the fanbase, the bowls sans playoff absolutely remain the best system. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Choken One Report post Posted December 9, 2003 You can keep the small bowls like Liberty, Motor. The National Title will be won via Tournament. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Edwin MacPhisto 0 Report post Posted December 9, 2003 That wouldn't fly. It's all or nothing with a big playoff - if you have the playoff going the smaller bowls look even more meaningless, will get zero publicity, and will basically just be around for shits and giggles, even moreso than they are now. I think you're also going to run into TV problems. College football doesn't have as big a TV audience as the pros, and to get a network to commit to showing the same college teams playing against each other over several weeks while there's still big-league ball going on won't work. Most of the bowls are on ESPN and ESPN2 and scattered throughout the week because the big networks are still showing pro games. As it stands now, bowl games are still a novelty. Under a playoff, you'd just be getting something that parallels the NFL playoffs going up against the real deal. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bored 0 Report post Posted December 9, 2003 Edwin is exactly right. If your going to do a real true playoff, as in 16 teams, the bowls have to be eliminated. I disagree with the t.v. thing though as CBS is paying in the billions to air the college basketball tournament and a football tournament would bring in even more money. Besides they play on Saturday so there isn't any competition. Probably would have to spread a 1st round over two days but could do it on Friday and Saturday. But alas its all a pipe dream and in fact I figure they ever have a playoff they'll just screw that up too. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest BobbyWhioux Report post Posted December 9, 2003 Okay... Step 1: Standardized regular season, starting in the last week of August, running 12 weeks. 11 games, one bye for midterms week or something. Step 2: Make every 1-A conference have two "divisions" and a championship game like the SEC and Big 12 have to have due to their size. This is the Step 3: All independents are assigned to conferences, or are left playoff-ineligible. Step 4: Screw Conference USA. Get rid of it, and disperse the teams to the most geographically logical conference, or left bowl-ineligible if if they wish to remain independant. Step 5: Scrub bowls are played throughout december as usual, awarded to third and fourth place conference teams as they are now. 6. And Here The Playoffs Begin There are 8 conferences: Pac10, Big10, Big12, BigEast, WAC, MAC, ACC, and SEC. The Conference champions are automatically locked into ranking spots 1-8. Within those 8 slots, of course, things are fully subjective and open to debate and controversy, but basically, if you win your conference, at worst you are the #8 team in the country. No Wild Cards; you had your chance in the conference championship. Use the Four Major BCS bowls as the first round of the playoffs, with traditional rivalries preserved, i.e. Pac10 vs Big10 in the Rose Bowl. Four winners, four losers. Winners play each other a week later, and then there were 2. Two weeks later, national championship game, played in that off week between the NFL's confrerence championships and The Super Bowl. PROS New Years Day Bowl Traditional matchups preserved. All Conferences get a equal shot at producing a champion Postseason games/berths kept small and "special" "Arbitrary Rankings" can't fuck people over as much (though still some) CONS New Years Day no longer end of season, might hurt prestige of games. "Traditional matchups" can result in #1 vs #2 in first round of playoffs. Kids are playing a 15 game schedule if they go all the way. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vern Gagne 0 Report post Posted December 9, 2003 We all know that the B.C.S once again failed to deliver what it promised, to give us a TRUE national champion. 1998-Tennessee 1999-Florida St. 2000-Oklahoma 2001-Miami 2002-Ohio St. All teams finished the season undefeated, and where true National Champions. If you're having a playoff you should at least have 10 wins. No one like 8-4 Florida belongs in a tournament. This isn't the same thing has college hoops, has the season is much shorter. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
EVIL~! alkeiper 0 Report post Posted December 9, 2003 The problem is that the BCS and various playoff ideas try too much. The reason people wanted the BCS was so that when two teams went undefeated (i.e. Nebraska-Penn State in '94) they would face each other. I propose a system where if two teams are undefeated, they compete against one another. Simple as that. If not, then revert to the old system of bowls. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Choken One Report post Posted December 9, 2003 We all know that the B.C.S once again failed to deliver what it promised, to give us a TRUE national champion. 1998-Tennessee 1999-Florida St. 2000-Oklahoma 2001-Miami 2002-Ohio St. All teams finished the season undefeated, and where true National Champions. If you're having a playoff you should at least have 10 wins. No one like 8-4 Florida belongs in a tournament. This isn't the same thing has college hoops, has the season is much shorter. yes. Those WERE TRUE champions no question. However, it is not the case this year. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Damaramu 0 Report post Posted December 9, 2003 If USC loses then it saves the BCS's ass because OU/LSU will be undisputed champion. So if you're a BCS fan...root for Michigan. If you hate the BCS root for USC. If you want OU/LSU to be undisputed.....root for Michigan. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Choken One Report post Posted December 9, 2003 The BCS has already been exposed as a joke so I'd don't think by having USC win and forcing the split champion rule will do any good. I'd rather LSU/OU straight up win for the title... So I'm actually gonna to say GO BLUE! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Slayer 0 Report post Posted December 9, 2003 We all know that the B.C.S once again failed to deliver what it promised, to give us a TRUE national champion. 1998-Tennessee 1999-Florida St. 2000-Oklahoma 2001-Miami 2002-Ohio St. All teams finished the season undefeated, and where true National Champions. The BCS lucked out in almost all those years. '99 and '02 weren't big issues, because there were two unbeatens in the title game, but every other year had its controversy. '00 - BCS takes FSU over Miami, even though Miami beat FSU earlier in the year. '01 - BCS takes Nebraska over Oregon, in spite of the Cornfuckers not even making the Big XII title game in the first place, giving up 62 points to eventual conference champ Colorado. This year - Don't even need to get into that '98 - In light of '01 and this year, it's still possible that the BCS could have taken KSU to the title game instead of FSU Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Edwin MacPhisto 0 Report post Posted December 9, 2003 Step 2: Make every 1-A conference have two "divisions" and a championship game like the SEC and Big 12 have to have due to their size. There are 8 conferences: Pac10, Big10, Big12, BigEast, WAC, MAC, ACC, and SEC. The Conference champions are automatically locked into ranking spots 1-8. Within those 8 slots, of course, things are fully subjective and open to debate and controversy, but basically, if you win your conference, at worst you are the #8 team in the country. No Wild Cards; you had your chance in the conference championship. Some more cons: If you're going to do conference championships for every league, you're going to need every conference to be 12 teams in two divisions. If you leave the Pac-10 at 10 teams, a team only has to place higher than 4 teams in its division rather than 5 to have a chance to win. So you force some of the still smaller conferences to take in extra teams, and have to deal with a LOT of individual schools griping about re-alignment. You also still leave out 20-some Division I teams no matter what, so any argument about "opens the playoffs up to everybody" doesn't hold water. You're also making the WAC and the MAC a lot bigger than their britches. I know we saw a lot of good teams and good players in the MAC this year, but also take note that the one time Miami of Ohio, MAC champ, played a big-time BCS team, Iowa whomped them 21-3. Unless there are some major revisions in who's in those conferences, especially now that some MAC teams have left for C-USA and some really crappy squads have moved into the MAC, you're giving two of just eight slots to a team that probably doesn't deserve it. They run up conference wins against a lot of shitty teams who, more often than not, spend most of their non-conference season playing homecoming games for major conference teams. Another thing that a lot of people don't take into account about the bowl system is that hosting a bowl is basically a week-long activity for the host city. The teams show up and spend a week there, the fans show up early and pump a lot of money into local economy, there are pep rallies, parades, galas, parties, and all sorts of events that move a lot of income. When those commercials from the keep-the-bowls people air and say all the bowl games combined move $1 billion into local economies, they're not kidding around. Someone will have to figure out a way to make anything more than 4-team playoff more profitable than the bowls before they change the system, and I don't see that happening anytime soon. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dr. Tom 0 Report post Posted December 9, 2003 1. An 11-game regular-season schedule for all Division I-A teams. 2. At the end of the regular season, the AP Poll and and Coach's Poll will determine the Top 8 teams in the nation. Each team gets points equal to its numerical rank on both polls. Thus, a team 4th in one poll and 5th on the other has 9 points. The 8 lowest teams in the country go to the playoffs. Tiebreakers would be developed (conference record, strength of schedule, etd) in the event of ties. 3. Existing Bowls are used to host the playoff games. The major Bowls (Orange, Sugar, Fiesta, Rose) always host playoff games, and rotate the hosting of the actual championship game. The bracket is easy: 1 and 8 play, 4 and 5 play, and the winners of those two games go to the semifinals. 3 and 6 play, 2 and 7 play, with those two winners moving on. The winners of those games play in the championship, on New Year's Day. 4. Lesser Bowls can still host their usual games, but they have no effect on the championship. 5. The winner of the championship game is obviously the #1 team in the country. Polls will determine the rest. If the 8th-ranked team loses, they should expect to fall in the polls. There are probably some kinks to be worked out, but that's how I'd do it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lomasmoney 0 Report post Posted December 10, 2003 The bowls wont exist in a playoff simple easy simple as that. I say just use the bcs bowls as a tourney. Winners of those games play each other. Make it where at large teams have to be the two highest ranked non conference champions. this would eliminate bitching by the mid major teams. If needed eliminate the conference title games and just use a rotating schedule to make it fair for a team like oklahoma to run the table and lose a conference title game. Make them play an extra team within the conference. This would be fair to the big east, pac-10, big ten who only have 10(11) teams, you can't really make a school add two teams Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Spicy McHaggis 0 Report post Posted December 10, 2003 My system: 1. 10 regular season games (5 home/5 away, no exceptions) 2. 7 conference games/3 non-conference 3. Conference championship game for all 11 conferences- either division winners or the top two from the conference. 4. 11 conference winners get automatic bids/5 at-large bids- 16 total teams. 5. Higher seed hosts 1st Round and Quarterfinals. 6. Rose/Sugar/Fiesta bowls host Semifinals and Finals- alternate each year. 7. Semis on New Year's Day; Finals a week later. 8. Keep the other bowls for non-playoff teams. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
EVIL~! alkeiper 0 Report post Posted December 10, 2003 2. At the end of the regular season, the AP Poll and and Coach's Poll will determine the Top 8 teams in the nation. Each team gets points equal to its numerical rank on both polls. Thus, a team 4th in one poll and 5th on the other has 9 points. The 8 lowest teams in the country go to the playoffs. Tiebreakers would be developed (conference record, strength of schedule, etd) in the event of ties. The problem I see with that system is that you could have the 8th best team in the country winning the national championship. That is more undesirable, IMO, than the current BCS situation. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Slayer 0 Report post Posted December 10, 2003 The problem I see with that system is that you could have the 8th best team in the country winning the national championship. That is more undesirable, IMO, than the current BCS situation. Here's the current BCS top 8 1. Oklahoma 2. LSU 3. Southern Cal 4. Michigan 5. Ohio State 6. Texas 7. Florida State 8. Tennessee So in a standard 1-8 tourney, we'd have it like this OU-UTenn Michigan-OSU USC-UTex LSU-FSU Meaning for UTenn to win the national title, they'd have to beat OU, the winner of Michigan-OSU, and whoever comes up from the lower bracket... if they do that, I think you could call them national champions Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LooseCannon25 0 Report post Posted December 10, 2003 I was so damn pissed in 2000 when BCS took Florida State over Miami even though my team(Canes) beat FSU head-to-head. A travesty. As crazy as it may sound, if LSU beats Oklahoma and Michigan beats USC then MIchigan can actually lay claim to holding a piece of the national championship. I think the playoff system should work like this. 8 Team Tournament.......top 8 ranked teams in the country get invited for national championship tournament. I don't agree with conference champions getting an invute because a team like West Virginia almost won the Big East and they were 8-4 this season. Not good enough to be NAtional Champ The 2 Semi-Final games could be played in the Orange Bowl and Fiesta Bowl......The Final (National Championship) would be played in the Suger Bowl. You can rotate the bowls with the semi-final and final rounds every year. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Damaramu 0 Report post Posted December 10, 2003 I was so damn pissed in 2000 when BCS took Florida State over Miami even though my team(Canes) beat FSU head-to-head. A travesty. As crazy as it may sound, if LSU beats Oklahoma and Michigan beats USC then MIchigan can actually lay claim to holding a piece of the national championship. I think the playoff system should work like this. 8 Team Tournament.......top 8 ranked teams in the country get invited for national championship tournament. I don't agree with conference champions getting an invute because a team like West Virginia almost won the Big East and they were 8-4 this season. Not good enough to be NAtional Champ The 2 Semi-Final games could be played in the Orange Bowl and Fiesta Bowl......The Final (National Championship) would be played in the Suger Bowl. You can rotate the bowls with the semi-final and final rounds every year. Actually Michigan wouldn't really. Because if USC wins and OU or LSU wins we have 2 one loss teams. If USC loses and say LSU loses. Then Oklahoma becomes the sole 1 loss team and is probably voted #1 in the AP poll. The only way Michigan can lay claim is if they spank the shit out of USC so bad and LSU/OU play so shitty that the AP votes them #1. Which I wouldn't argue with...b/c Michigan is my 2nd favorite team. But basically.....it'll take a miracle for Michigan to lay claim to that title. And the Miami/FSU argument again. Yes that was a tough one. But I've heard people actually say that OU didn't deserve that title because of this....suddenly Miami is more deserving? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest BobbyWhioux Report post Posted December 10, 2003 You're also making the WAC and the MAC a lot bigger than their britches. I know we saw a lot of good teams and good players in the MAC this year, but also take note that the one time Miami of Ohio, MAC champ, played a big-time BCS team, Iowa whomped them 21-3. Unless there are some major revisions in who's in those conferences, especially now that some MAC teams have left for C-USA and some really crappy squads have moved into the MAC, you're giving two of just eight slots to a team that probably doesn't deserve it. They run up conference wins against a lot of shitty teams who, more often than not, spend most of their non-conference season playing homecoming games for major conference teams. Another thing that a lot of people don't take into account about the bowl system is that hosting a bowl is basically a week-long activity for the host city. The teams show up and spend a week there, the fans show up early and pump a lot of money into local economy, there are pep rallies, parades, galas, parties, and all sorts of events that move a lot of income. When those commercials from the keep-the-bowls people air and say all the bowl games combined move $1 billion into local economies, they're not kidding around. Someone will have to figure out a way to make anything more than 4-team playoff more profitable than the bowls before they change the system, and I don't see that happening anytime soon. This is true. I noticed this after I posted. My thinking is that sure, the WAC and MAC aren't on par with the other conferences, but that the only to give them a chance to ever get on par with the major conferences is to throw them into the big kids pool and let them learn to swim by way of drowning for the first few years. That was one of my unstated goals: put the WAC and MAC in a position to earn credibility when they're good enough to earn it. Which wouldn't be for several years. (It's either try to bring them up to speed or demote them all to 1-AA) Is it just me or are there a hell of a lot more division 1-A schools than there used to be? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lomasmoney 0 Report post Posted December 10, 2003 Check that, you do it like this. -11 Game Regular Season -Keep the traditional bowls -Use the 4 BCS bowls as a playoff with one change. Use only the top 8 BCS teams. However if a team has not won its conference title and the conference winner is in the BCS top 12 they can be replaced with the conference champions. They could still earn an at large bid. For the games rank the teams accordingly. Avoid title game or regular season rematches if possible for this year it would be Rose Bowl #1 Oklahoma ( At Large) vs #9 Miami (Big East, only due to no other Big East team being in the top 12) Sugar Bowl #2 LSU ( SEC) vs #10 Kansas State (Big XII) Orange Bowl #4 Michigan (Big 10) vs #5 Ohio State( At Large) Fiesta Bowl # 3 USC (PAC-10) vs # 7 Florida State (ACC) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lomasmoney 0 Report post Posted December 10, 2003 The only team that could bitch would be Tennesee, but they didnt win their division or conference and they lost the SEC east on a tiebreaker so they would be SOL Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lomasmoney 0 Report post Posted December 10, 2003 The BCS would still cause controversy amongst who gets the at large bids and due to upsets in conference title games and if the teams will jump enough to get in to the top 12 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lomasmoney 0 Report post Posted December 10, 2003 The MAC and WAC schools play good football, and evidence of it is how many teams the MAC has with wins over major teams. Under my system, Miami of Ohio would be the second team snubbed for a spot in the playoffs Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vern Gagne 0 Report post Posted December 10, 2003 Washington beat Miami in 2000. They had has much right to say they belong in the Orange Bowl. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
