Masked Man of Mystery 0 Report post Posted January 19, 2004 Okay, I know that this is a relatively old movie and if I get the Vince's Legdrop treatment, I deserve it, but I just watched this movie and I just wanted to know how close this si to the comics. I've only read the first Essential Daredevil myself, and so I obviously have missed a lot. I know his dad was "Fighting" Joe Murdock, and he got the name because of the kids taunting him, not his dad's boxing nickname, and if memory serves, he got hit with the toxic liquid because of diving after a man, not running from the sight of what his dad did, but after that I can't really say much. They made Foggy a jerk, which I never saw in him, and a lot seems rushed, as if they needed to cut down the movie. I'm posting this here because I'm looking for some help from a comic comparison perspective than a movie perspective. Anyone mind helping me out? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lil' Bitch 0 Report post Posted January 19, 2004 Butterbean should have been The Kingpin and just for being old school, DD should have been in his original yellow spandex. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
EdwardKnoxII 0 Report post Posted January 19, 2004 Butterbean should have been The Kingpin and just for being old school, DD should have been in his original yellow spandex. I think Vader should have played the Kingpin. That would have been fun. "Daredevil I want to fight you in my White Castle Of Fear. Do you have the guts to face me cause it's Kingpin time." Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Steviekick 0 Report post Posted January 19, 2004 The movie was a cheesy rip off of Frank Millers run on Daredevil. I highly reccommend picking up Daredevil Visionaries: Frank Miller Volumes I-III, as it is simply amazing. The movie tries to capture the Daredevil/Elektra relationship, but like you said was rushed. Why? The story was a slow burning, but intense build that took about three years worth of comics to tell. Daredevil was a good film, but not a good film. During this time, Foggy is first presented as being somewhat of a tool. He's a nice guy and DD's best friend, but he does worry about money and their stability. Very practical. Since then, Foggy's been, well, a tool. As far as the origin being changed up, I'm very sure (it's been a while, and I don't have the TPB of it anymore) that occurred in Frank Miller's Daredevil: The Man Without Fear mini-series. Basically what happened was Marvel started to get interested in the whole movie business and started a bunch of initiatives to get their characters onto the big screen (Captain America and Fantastic Four films being the sad result). Whoever was in charge of this had a great idea...why not have the greatest writer in Daredevil's history write the script. And Miller did. It was his version of the origin of DD, and it kicked ass. Unfortunately, it never made it to production and wound up being turned into a comic with great art from John Romita Jr., who conjures up his innermost Miller-influenced work. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Masked Man of Mystery 0 Report post Posted January 20, 2004 The movie was a cheesy rip off of Frank Millers run on Daredevil. I highly reccommend picking up Daredevil Visionaries: Frank Miller Volumes I-III, as it is simply amazing. The movie tries to capture the Daredevil/Elektra relationship, but like you said was rushed. Why? The story was a slow burning, but intense build that took about three years worth of comics to tell. Daredevil was a good film, but not a good film. During this time, Foggy is first presented as being somewhat of a tool. He's a nice guy and DD's best friend, but he does worry about money and their stability. Very practical. Since then, Foggy's been, well, a tool. As far as the origin being changed up, I'm very sure (it's been a while, and I don't have the TPB of it anymore) that occurred in Frank Miller's Daredevil: The Man Without Fear mini-series. Basically what happened was Marvel started to get interested in the whole movie business and started a bunch of initiatives to get their characters onto the big screen (Captain America and Fantastic Four films being the sad result). Whoever was in charge of this had a great idea...why not have the greatest writer in Daredevil's history write the script. And Miller did. It was his version of the origin of DD, and it kicked ass. Unfortunately, it never made it to production and wound up being turned into a comic with great art from John Romita Jr., who conjures up his innermost Miller-influenced work. Thanks, Steviekick. I actually got the first issue of The Man Without Fear in a 3 comics for $1 or something at a convinience store. It looks good. Do you know if they printed it in book form, or will I have to track down individual mags? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Red Baron 0 Report post Posted January 20, 2004 Daredevil > Spiderman Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nighthawk 0 Report post Posted January 20, 2004 The suit really looked like a gay s&m outfit. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
starvenger 0 Report post Posted January 20, 2004 Thanks, Steviekick. I actually got the first issue of The Man Without Fear in a 3 comics for $1 or something at a convinience store. It looks good. Do you know if they printed it in book form, or will I have to track down individual mags? If you look around, you should be able to find a TPB somewhere. Marvel put out a lot of crap in the 90s, but to their credit they did greenlight some great projects, and this was one of them. My thoughts on Daredevil: It's obvious that Mark Johnson is a fan of comics, however in trying to put a comic book into the confines of a movie, I think he lost his focus along the way. From DD's radar sense to the misuse of the Kingpin as a villain to the "romance" between Matt and Elektra, there were just a lot of things that just didn't work out right (although the lack of chemistry between Affleck and Garner may have contributed to my last point). Overall, I have to agree with Steviekick. Daredevil was a good movie, but it could have been so much better. Comparing it to other Marvel movies, I'd put it on the level of the Blade films, below the X-films, Spider-Man and even Hulk (which was another movie that could have been much better, but that's another thread). Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sass 0 Report post Posted January 20, 2004 DD ran into the same problem as Spider-Man: It tried to tell every "great" Bullseye/Elektra/Kingpin all at once and it came off like convoluted non-stop action crap with nothing in-between. This is why I am not a big fan of any of the Marvel movies because except X2 since they actually managed to slow things down and give the characters breathing time in-between the action scenes and give us *good* dialogue that didn't sound like absolute tripe. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Steviekick 0 Report post Posted January 20, 2004 DD ran into the same problem as Spider-Man: It tried to tell every "great" Bullseye/Elektra/Kingpin all at once and it came off like convoluted non-stop action crap with nothing in-between. This is why I am not a big fan of any of the Marvel movies because except X2 since they actually managed to slow things down and give the characters breathing time in-between the action scenes and give us *good* dialogue that didn't sound like absolute tripe. I really liked Spider-Man; I thought it was the best Marvel comic film. The pacing was fine, but since it did need a little explanation of the training of Spidey. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kahran Ramsus 0 Report post Posted January 20, 2004 I really liked Spider-Man; I thought it was the best Marvel comic film. The pacing was fine, but since it did need a little explanation of the training of Spidey. That part of the film was good. The Goblin stuff that they crammed into the second half was not. And I loved Daredevil. I can't really explain it, because when I think about it, I probably should hate the film, but I don't. Hulk was probably the best of the Marvel films, but enjoyed Daredevil more. X2 had numerous good scenes (ex. Nightcrawler opener) and great characters (ex. Pyro, Magneto, Stryker), but the film didn't flow well and the film as a whole was less than the sum of its parts. X-Men 1 had the same problems, but was a lesser film. Spider-Man has a great first half and awful conclusion. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Steviekick 0 Report post Posted January 20, 2004 My biggest gripe was the Power Ranger Green Goblin armor. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Masked Man of Mystery 0 Report post Posted January 20, 2004 I liked Spider-man myself. I haven't gotten around to the X Men films though. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rendclaw 0 Report post Posted January 20, 2004 This movie was horrible, straight up. They tried to bank on actor names instead of getting some who could play the role, though I liked Michael Clarke Duncan as The Kingpin, though the role was no stretch by any means. Affleck is plain vanilla as an actor, and that is the BEST thing I can say about him. Garner was miscast as Elektra, and was not very believable at all. And I am in agreement that there was no chemistry betrween them.... I think the best thing about that movie was Colin Farrell as Bullseye. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Steviekick 0 Report post Posted January 20, 2004 I think the best thing about that movie was Colin Farrell as Bullseye. But he didn't have the cool costume. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pochorenella 0 Report post Posted January 20, 2004 I enjoyed the movie quite a lot, even more after I watched it on DVD with all the commentary and insight. You find out about little details like the lighting for Matt was a certain way (because he's blind and/or sad?) and after he meets Elektra is another way (he's happier now). All the comic book references and cameos. The Bullseye/Elektra fight scene is almost panel-for-panel like Daredevil #181. NOt quite up to par with Spider-Man, X2, or even Hulk, but still a fairly good movie. Affleck was OK, Duncan was very good, Elektra was great, and Farrel rocked the house. I think the best anyone can do to get into DD's origin story in comic-book form is grab a copy of the Man Without Fear TPB, which I have the complete mini-series. It was supposed to be Marvel's movie treatment for DD but somehow went ultra-long (you'll notice in the original mini-series there are no opening splash pages of any sort because it was never designed as a mini-series, rather a long one shot). This one is maybe my favorite of Miller's DD run, barely, just barely, beating his Born Again story (also highly recommended). Also check Frank Miller Visionaries Vol.2 for the entire Elektra Saga. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
starvenger 0 Report post Posted January 20, 2004 My biggest gripe was the Power Ranger Green Goblin armor. Never figured out how that costume was Power Rangerish. Unless they were talking about the villains... Bullseye looked stupid with the target carved into his forehead. But then again having it on a cowl wouldn't be much better. Farrell definitely made the part his own though. Was definitely the MVP of the film. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Steviekick 0 Report post Posted January 20, 2004 My biggest gripe was the Power Ranger Green Goblin armor. Never figured out how that costume was Power Rangerish. Unless they were talking about the villains... I was just seeing Power Rangerishness from it, especially the mask which had the mouth on it that didn't move when he was talking, so Dafoe just wound up shaking his head more to illustrate that he was talking like on Power Rangers. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
thuganomics 0 Report post Posted January 20, 2004 Essential Daredevil reading is as follows: Visionairies: Frank Miller TPB's, Daredevil: Man Without Fear TPB, Daredevil: Guardian Devil TPB, Daredevil (original series) 240-260 (this is Ann Nocenti's follow up to Miller's second run, featuring Typhoid Mary, great stuff), Karl Kesel and Joe Kelly also had pretty decent runs on the title before it became Marvel Knights, and Bendis' current stories are pretty decent. As to the movie, Daredevil is one of Marvel's best releases, right up there with X2 and Spider-Man. They took some liberties with the character, but they serve to make a more streamlined story for a 2 hr movie. I think Elektra may have been downplayed a little too much, but as she has a movie in the works as a spin off I can't complain too much. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kahran Ramsus 0 Report post Posted January 20, 2004 Bullseye looked stupid with the target carved into his forehead. But then again having it on a cowl wouldn't be much better. Farrell definitely made the part his own though. Was definitely the MVP of the film. Jon Favreau gave a great performance too. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Steviekick 0 Report post Posted January 20, 2004 Essential Daredevil reading is as follows: Visionairies: Frank Miller TPB's, Daredevil: Man Without Fear TPB, Daredevil: Guardian Devil TPB, Daredevil (original series) 240-260 (this is Ann Nocenti's follow up to Miller's second run, featuring Typhoid Mary, great stuff), Karl Kesel and Joe Kelly also had pretty decent runs on the title before it became Marvel Knights, and Bendis' current stories are pretty decent. As to the movie, Daredevil is one of Marvel's best releases, right up there with X2 and Spider-Man. They took some liberties with the character, but they serve to make a more streamlined story for a 2 hr movie. I think Elektra may have been downplayed a little too much, but as she has a movie in the works as a spin off I can't complain too much. Since Marvel is planning on trilogies for its movies, they should have broken up Miller's stories like this: Part 1: DD's origin, remeets Elektra and they fight off the Hand and Bullseye. THe film would end with Elektra getting the job as Kingpin's chief assasin. Part 2: DD vs. Elektra, with Bullseye killing her. Part 3: Elektra's return. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Masked Man of Mystery 0 Report post Posted January 24, 2004 Excuse my stupidity, but they show in the comics(at least in the documentary on the DVD) that she got run through, whihc the movie does exactly, to the point of it not going through the backj of her shirt. HOW in the name of God can she come back? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lil' Bitch 0 Report post Posted January 24, 2004 My biggest gripe was the Power Ranger Green Goblin armor. I think a lot of fans wanted him in the classic purple trunks instead. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Boner Kawanger 0 Report post Posted January 24, 2004 Nevermind, Steviekick does better. || || \/ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Steviekick 0 Report post Posted January 24, 2004 Excuse my stupidity, but they show in the comics(at least in the documentary on the DVD) that she got run through, whihc the movie does exactly, to the point of it not going through the backj of her shirt. HOW in the name of God can she come back? This is how Elektra came back. DD thought she was still alive and using some sort of ninja breathing technique/self induced trance to appear dead; however, him being the blind freak that he is digs her up to find up that she's just a corpse. Anyway, remember that ninja group I mentioned before, the Hand? They are all into resurrection and stuff, and they attempted to ressurrect her/control her earthly body. DD and Black Widow found out, stopped them, and then DD goes nuts and tries to ressurrect her himself. He thought he failed, but it worked thanks to the fact that he did love her and her soul was purified. She left not to be heard for a while and returned to her assassin ways. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kahran Ramsus 0 Report post Posted January 25, 2004 HOW in the name of God can she come back? Because whiny fanboys bitched to Marvel enough that they brought her back. It makes no sense and it cheapens any further deaths. Marvel does it all the time and it is their biggest flaw. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Steviekick 0 Report post Posted January 25, 2004 My biggest gripe was the way they brought back Elektra with all the mysticism and stuff. It just doesn't go with the Daredevil character. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
starvenger 0 Report post Posted January 25, 2004 HOW in the name of God can she come back? First Law of Comics: Only Bucky stays dead. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
EdwardKnoxII 0 Report post Posted January 25, 2004 HOW in the name of God can she come back? First Law of Comics: Only Bucky stays dead. I thought the rule was only Bucky, Uncle Ben, Gwen Stacy (clones don't count), and Jason Todd stay dead. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rendclaw 0 Report post Posted January 27, 2004 Death is a relative term with comics in general. Marvel is not the only company that is guilty of that, not by a long shot. I don't mind resurrections as long as they make some kind of sense. I liked what they did way back when with Madeline Pryor. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
